Mapping Los Santos! Building/landmark analysis

[GTAKiwi]

Here is my new and more accurate map. There are still plenty of errors on it though. The worst issue

is the scale of the mountains/lake being to big, or to small. There is also still some small sight

line issues.

 

It can be quite tricky to tell exactly how big something should be, when all the pictures have different

height, zoom, angle, FOV, etc.

 

So while my new map is still nowhere near being 100% accurate, at least it should give you a good idea

of how the countryside fits together.

 

The map kinda has a 3D look to it, but it is actually a top on map. It looks 3D due to me drawing the

ridge of each mountain to help you know which mountain you're looking at.

 

On the sight line map, anything with a ? next to it means I'm not sure if it's correct or not.

 

Click for huge map.

 

Click for huge sightline map.

[J-B]

Seriously, that looks like it took a lot of effort man. Great job Kiwi.

Edited April 7, 2013 by J-B

[lxr]

 

Click for huge sightline map.

This is very impressive. Great job!

 

The best thing about it is probably that your map hasn't changed much, i.e. that is was, overall, correct months ago. But I guess it's all in the details... I quite like the mountain shapes, they're actually recognizable, and so the new map gives a good idea about the northeastern edge of the known territory, too.

 

A couple of old and new mysteries:

 

- The area behind the Observatory. Is there a larger unknown area, or not? I once thought there was, then wasn't convinced anymore. I think your map leaves both options... it has that unknown triangle, but then maybe you can also just cut it out and connect its two edges.

 

- Grapeseed (24). Does this postcard show the same universe? While there may be enough space where you put it, the angle of the Vinewood Hills suggests it's much closer to the Alamo River (10) and Mt. Boot. The vegetation would match, but is there enough space there?

 

- The new, elevated highway (15). I remember jbte once had the idea of an elevated highway around there... and here it is. It may originate in East LS, but where does it lead to? Isn't it too close to the other freeway, wouldn't it have to intersect with it? But we haven't seen any trace of that, and a highway interchange is usually rather massive. Otherwise, do we expect it to bend right (to the east) soon after the spot shown in the new screen?

 

- The motorcyclists near the highway bridge (19). The way the river bends (see 6), I think this should take place north of the river, not south of it. Or do you think this shot is looking across the gorge?

 

- The area between Vinewood Hill and the dam. Your markup of mountains in (7) suggests you agree with Fido, and the shot shows that gap. Even though both of you may be right, I still don't find it easy to reconcile that perspective with what we see in (1) and (24).

 

- And finally (17), H or E, still a mystery. I still think E, given these two shots, which, to my eyes, show the same mountain as (17).

Edited April 7, 2013 by lxr

[lxr]

And a few more questions about the newest screenshots:

 

In A, what's the highrise in the foreground, at the very left edge? We're east of the LS river, right?

 

In B, assuming this is 4th Street Bridge, then where are we looking, and what's the mountain in the background?

 

In C, have we seen the mountain(s) between the motorcycle and the car before, in any other unrelated shot?

 

A

 

B

 

C

[Threepwood]

anyone have a clue what this could be? (maybe just some texture issues/bug?)

 

[big image]

In my opinion thats the Grapeseed/Vineyards.

[Ferocious Banger]

GTAKiwi and all the mappers: Is this is? Is there going to be anything else further north?

[lxr]

GTAKiwi and all the mappers: Is this is? Is there going to be anything else further north?

As mentioned quite a few times: There's a train tunnel leading north -- so yes, there's more territory there. Same for the eastern edge of the map: the game doesn't end there.

[Irrational]

The size of Los Santos on it's own is about 1 liberty city and a halve!!!

 

^If you mean this Liberty City, then I agree.

 

If you mean the Liberty City from the 3D and HD Era, then you are completely wrong.

[EnviousBird]

The size of Los Santos on it's own is about 1 liberty city and a halve!!!

 

^If you mean this Liberty City, then I agree.

 

If you mean the Liberty City from the 3D and HD Era, then you are completely wrong.

Maybe YOU are completely wrong.

 

it's obvious that LS is going to be bigger than twice the LC from GTA III era, we'll see how it compares to LC from IV

[kesta195]

The size of Los Santos on it's own is about 1 liberty city and a halve!!!

 

^If you mean this Liberty City, then I agree.

 

If you mean the Liberty City from the 3D and HD Era, then you are completely wrong.

I'm afraid YOU are more wrong. LS in GTAV > LC in GTAIV. Confirmed by R*. Thank you, come again.

[Choco Taco]

The size of Los Santos on it's own is about 1 liberty city and a halve!!!

 

^If you mean this Liberty City, then I agree.

 

If you mean the Liberty City from the 3D and HD Era, then you are completely wrong.

I'm afraid YOU are more wrong. LS in GTAV > LC in GTAIV. Confirmed by R*. Thank you, come again.

Nothing's really been confirmed. It's all too vague at this point. For instance, they didn't mention exactly which areas are included in the measurements. Is the dam part of Los Santos? Is there a sparsely-populated area north of the observatory that's considered Los Santos? Are they measuring the water or just the land in IV?

 

At this point, what we've been shown of Los Santos could definitely be smaller than Liberty City.

[kesta195]

The size of Los Santos on it's own is about 1 liberty city and a halve!!!

 

^If you mean this Liberty City, then I agree.

 

If you mean the Liberty City from the 3D and HD Era, then you are completely wrong.

I'm afraid YOU are more wrong. LS in GTAV > LC in GTAIV. Confirmed by R*. Thank you, come again.

Nothing's really been confirmed. It's all too vague at this point. For instance, they didn't mention exactly which areas are included in the measurements. Is the dam part of Los Santos? Is there a sparsely-populated area north of the observatory that's considered Los Santos? Are they measuring the water or just the land in IV?

 

At this point, what we've been shown of Los Santos could definitely be smaller than Liberty City.

The same could be said for LC, in terms of where they are measuring from. They did say that 'LS covers more square-footing', which is enough for me.

[WolfbackGames]

GTAKiwi and all the mappers: Is this is? Is there going to be anything else further north?

Yes there most likely is. We haven't seen the military base yet (which is confirmed to exist). I'm assuming there is a decent chunk north of what we've seen yet to be shown.

[artificialguy]

GTAKiwi and all the mappers: Is this is? Is there going to be anything else further north?

As mentioned quite a few times: There's a train tunnel leading north -- so yes, there's more territory there. Same for the eastern edge of the map: the game doesn't end there.

But on the other side train can go along coastline and then take a loop and go south back to the city. We don't know what's behind the mountain.

However, I'm pretty sure Rockstar haven't showed us everything and there is still more to discover.

[cannabinos]

Los Santos size = Liberty City GTA IV size

[dyz]

Los Santos size = Liberty City GTA IV size

Yeah your right! But los santos in GTA 5 might be slightly bigger because if the game is red dead, san andreas and gta 4 combined, it must have at least halve the size of red dead in the city alone, (Red dead is the size of gta 4 roughly). For the people who think that the city is small are wrong because you haven't played the game and the camera angle that show the game in the pictures make it look small!

[GTAKiwi]

 

Seriously, that looks like it took a lot of effort man. Great job Kiwi.

Thanks, and it did take a good few hours to make.

 

 

This is very impressive. Great job!

 

The best thing about it is probably that your map hasn't changed much, i.e. that is was, overall, correct months ago. But I guess it's all in the details... I quite like the mountain shapes, they're actually recognizable, and so the new map gives a good idea about the northeastern edge of the known territory, too.

 

A couple of old and new mysteries:

 

- The area behind the Observatory. Is there a larger unknown area, or not? I once thought there was, then wasn't convinced anymore. I think your map leaves both options... it has that unknown triangle, but then maybe you can also just cut it out and connect its two edges.

 

- Grapeseed (24). Does this postcard show the same universe? While there may be enough space where you put it, the angle of the Vinewood Hills suggests it's much closer to the Alamo River (10) and Mt. Boot. The vegetation would match, but is there enough space there?

 

- The new, elevated highway (15). I remember jbte once had the idea of an elevated highway around there... and here it is. It may originate in East LS, but where does it lead to? Isn't it too close to the other freeway, wouldn't it have to intersect with it? But we haven't seen any trace of that, and a highway interchange is usually rather massive. Otherwise, do we expect it to bend right (to the east) soon after the spot shown in the new screen?

 

- The motorcyclists near the highway bridge (19). The way the river bends (see 6), I think this should take place north of the river, not south of it. Or do you think this shot is looking across the gorge?

 

- The area between Vinewood Hill and the dam. Your markup of mountains in (7) suggests you agree with Fido, and the shot shows that gap. Even though both of you may be right, I still don't find it easy to reconcile that perspective with what we see in (1) and (24).

 

- And finally (17), H or E, still a mystery. I still think E, given these two shots, which, to my eyes, show the same mountain as (17).

Thanks.

Yeah my old map was still correct, I just wanted to make a more accurate map.

 

Now to answer your questions,

- My old map had a smaller mountain range there, but making this new map has made me think there might be larger mountain range to the west of the Observatory.

There is some guess work with the mountain directly behind the Observatory, as there are not very many pictures looking at that area, and the pictures that do

show that area are all from a distance.

 

- Looking at the Grapeseed location again, I probably put it a bit to far to the east. I should have put it somewhere near the base of the 'I' mountain.

 

- Picture 15 is a guess, that's why I have the ? next to it. Also that area is probably bigger than than I have it on my map. It's probably my bad scaling that makes

it look so close to the other highway.

 

- That motorbike race location was on the north side of the river in my old map, but looking at the way that bridge is heading in picture 6, and then in the picture 19,

it doesn't really look like it can be on the north side of the river, due to the way the bridge is heading in the background. It's just that to me it looks like it's impossible

to get that view(pic 19) of the bridge from the north side of the river when you look at it in picture 6. I could be wrong though.

 

- I actually had my locations marked up before I saw Fido's thoughts on those mountains. If you look at picture 11 and see the way it's looking at the T, S, and R,

hills from Vinewood hill, I'm not so sure the Vinewood hill could be 'P' in picture 7. But again, I could be wrong.

 

- I have no idea if it's E of H, hence the ? next to it. But going by my map, it looks like the sight line would line up with H, which is why I put H there. But I could have

the location of the hills north of the city incorrectly positioned. Or it could just be due to the scale of everything being off that is making it looking like H instead of E.

Or maybe those two pictures you said about are looking at a different angle to the picture I have in my map.

[Choco Taco]

- Looking at the Grapeseed location again, I probably put it a bit to far to the east. I should have put it somewhere near the base of the 'I' mountain.

 

 

I think Grapeseed is up in the mountains and that it's probably in the same area as the cropduster scene in trailer 1.

 

http://i.imgur.com/OCp1Fm3.jpg

 

It would have to be elevated or you'd be able to see the T,S, and R hills on your map in the Grapeseed picture.

 

 

[HOW'S ANNIE?]

To the multiple mappers- where exactly is the vineyard seen in trailer 1 in comparison to the rest of the map?

[Choco Taco]

To the multiple mappers- where exactly is the vineyard seen in trailer 1 in comparison to the rest of the map?

In case you didn't see my post above yours since you posted just 3 minutes after me...

 

I think it would be in the same area as Grapeseed. It could be anywhere in the red box below:

 

 

It's not in the ocean. I just extended it because there could be more land up there. It's just about impossible to determine how far away it could be.

[iiConTr0v3rSYx]

And to think, we haven't even seen the military base/most of the Grapeseed areas yet.

[KidAmnesiac42]

 

This.

Mt. Chilliad will be apart of a snowy mountain range that will extend to the north portions of the map. You'll be able to ski/snowboard in places like Big Bear (and other snow towns). Any thoughts on this?

[jbte]

To the multiple mappers- where exactly is the vineyard seen in trailer 1 in comparison to the rest of the map?

In case you didn't see my post above yours since you posted just 3 minutes after me...

 

I think it would be in the same area as Grapeseed. It could be anywhere in the red box below:

 

It's not in the ocean. I just extended it because there could be more land up there. It's just about impossible to determine how far away it could be.

How about grapeseed around the green circle?

 

Looks like it's inclined to the other side...

I've studied this and your other quote, again, my Mt. Zancudo in my map is wrong... there seems to be an open valley between LS and Mt. Zancudo where the farming area should be...

[jbte]

Map updated according to latest statement...

[Choco Taco]

How about grapeseed around the green circle?

 

I had thought about putting it to the west of Mt. Zancudo and this image suggests that it could be on that side:

 

 

 

I think it would have to be farther away though. If it is on that side, could the mountain marked below be Mt. Zancudo?

 

 

 

And if it is, could Grapeseed and the vineyard scene in trailer 1 be in the hills here...

 

 

 

It's really hard to tell and I would say either side of Mt. Zancudo is possible. I think it's more likely on the east side though. This mapping stuff is hard!

[GrandMaster Smith]

 

At this point, what we've been shown of Los Santos could definitely be smaller than Liberty City.

I really don't think so.. look at this image at the very far left, lthe city spans as far as you can see, same going right as well. I think it's going to be atleast as large as LC if not larger if it spans into the hills.

 

[Choco Taco]

jbte,

 

I was looking at some more pics and I'm pretty sure that Grapeseed has to be east of Mt. Zancudo. In the image below, the gap in the first 2 pictures can't be seen in the bottom one. Therefore, I'm pretty sure it can't be to the west.

 

 

 

 

 

At this point, what we've been shown of Los Santos could definitely be smaller than Liberty City.

I really don't think so.. look at this image at the very far left, lthe city spans as far as you can see, same going right as well. I think it's going to be atleast as large as LC if not larger if it spans into the hills.

 

http://media.rockstargames.com/rockstargames/img/global/news/upload/actual_1364387839.jpg

 

Let me start with this - If you take 2 pictures from different perspectives and there are similar sized objects in both pictures, and you re-size them to get the objects the same height, then the horizontal distances along the base will be the same.

 

For example - http://i.imgur.com/pzjMb.jpg

 

In the image below, the buildings with the arrow are based on buildings that are the same height (U.S. Bank Tower & Chrysler Building). I made them roughly the same height, so the red lines should be similar distances.

 

 

 

I used that method to size the city on my map. Here's the picture - http://i.imgur.com/P0Ptt1h.jpg

 

It's not an exact science, but it's helpful. These other pictures I took suggest that Los Santos is smaller than Liberty City:

 

http://i.imgur.com/8M29E.jpg

 

http://i.imgur.com/HjJoe.jpg

 

http://i.imgur.com/7TRas.jpg

 

 

They haven't posted one picture of Los Santos that shows it's larger than Liberty City.

 

 

[GTAaLEX117]

Well take a look at these:

- http://www.igta5.com/images/gta-5-trailer-...-los-santos.jpg. This is to the right of the city.

- http://www.igta5.com/images/trailer-2-chas...helicopters.jpg. This is to the left of the city.

Tell me this isn't bigger than LC. Also note that there are no rivers separating the city like in LC, the rivers and stretches between the islands made up a large part of the map.

[Choco Taco]

Well take a look at these:

- http://www.igta5.com/images/gta-5-trailer-...-los-santos.jpg. This is to the right of the city.

- http://www.igta5.com/images/trailer-2-chas...helicopters.jpg. This is to the left of the city.

Tell me this isn't bigger than LC. Also note that there are no rivers separating the city like in LC, the rivers and stretches between the islands made up a large part of the map.

The first picture is heading west and it's too foggy to see anything in the distance. If it was clear, you'd see the ocean and it would look pretty close. The second picture shows the east side of the city which looks to be the same size as the west side. Where the lights end is where the mountain begins.

 

 

You're right, there is no water separating the areas. There will probably be more land area in Los Santos, but the distance across looks smaller than Liberty City.

[GKP]

GTA - Choco has it right im afraid and ever since the first trailer has shown that LS is quite small.

 

Don't look at panoramic nightime shots as proof as LS is large - you can do that with LC In IV. The city is BARELY the size of the land area of LC ..if were lucky.

 

It is frustrating as there is no clear reason why R* could not of make a larger LS city. A few decent sized suburbs etc.