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Many atheists don't seem sympathetic to poor.


mt774

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Many atheists don't seem sympathetic to poor.

 

Why so many atheists come from high-class background and schooling; and hardly any are from poor or inner-city environments???

 

I noticed that all the atheist public speakers that debate with religious figures all seem to be from good income background. I am speaking of the likes of Christopher Hitchens, Richard Dawkins and Daniel Dennet...

 

Also, did you guys notice that those people living in deprived areas are always religious, hardly any atheist in the poorest areas of UK and US cities....

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In this thread the typical

 

"OMG U NO CHRISTIAN? U R BAD PERSON"

 

Religion=/=morals.

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It's true tho. You never see athiest soup kitchens. I'm an athiest. I care about the poor, but not enough to man a soup kitchen at night in the cold in a dangerous city. I think we should make society so we don't need soup kitchens/charity etc.

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Most public speakers are upper-middle class. Period.

 

There's also the idea of "religion is the opiate of the masses", even though I believe that holds less true today than when it was first said. It was evident in the slave communities of the 1800s and early 20th century, when you live in a hopeless and distressing world it's much easier to believe in something bigger and the idea that all your suffering will pay off eventually and everything will be okay. When everything's already pretty good, there's less need for a god figure who'll ensure that you're looked after.

 

Like I said though, I don't think that holds true too much these days, at least in the developed world. I come from a very working class area and I don't know anyone who's devoutly religious (i.e. ever goes to church or consciously lives by the word of a religious scripture/belief structure). But on a global scale I'd say it holds true: you're much more likely to find religious communities in impoverished African nations than Europe for example.

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It's true tho. You never see athiest soup kitchens. I'm an athiest. I care about the poor, but not enough to man a soup kitchen at night in the cold in a dangerous city. I think we should make society so we don't need soup kitchens/charity etc.

That will never happen I'm afraid. In our consumerist society, someone always has to be at the bottom. I guess its just luck as to what family your born in too. I think this might be better placed in the Debates & Discussion area of the forum. I can already smell the viscous arguments, I mean friendly debates moto_whistle.gif

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I don´t give a f*ck about the common religions (*), nevertheless I´m pretty moral and I speak with "God". He´s inside my head and nowhere else, maybe in yours too, who knows.

 

You have to differ between an atheist and an asshole (same principe with other orientations).

 

On the other hand beeing religious doesn´t mean that you´re automatically cool. Look at those child rapers, calling themselves priests or whatever.

 

(*) I´m interested in that but I don´t use them.

Edited by NaidRaida
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I am not Christian or too much religious at all, but the area i live has high concentration of poor people and such, and all of these people are religious, especially the old people.

 

I have heard people saying that they have nothing to look forward to but disappointment, but they ALWAYS PRAY and talk to god for better.

 

Most atheist seem from comfortable background and never from the hood, never struggling.

 

I mean all rappers are religious and are from poor background. Most atheist went harvard and cambridge.

 

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I mean all rappers are religious and are from poor background. Most atheist went harvard and cambridge.

Neither of these statements are true. Just going to throw that out there.

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I don't understand what argument you are trying to make, but I can tell you already that it's completely wrong. Religion doesn't equal or equate to morality.

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Maybe they don't care because they realise that they should take pride in themselves rather than feeling shame for their superiority.

I am a Christian but I f*cking hate the way we're expected to care for those less fortunate.

Since when did selflessness get anyone anywhere? Did anyone ever give me a free ride in life? Or any of you, for that matter? Rather than convincing ourselves that self-interest is bad, maybe we should consider the logic in it.

All people care for themselves and want to improve and excel. Charity, whilst noble in concept, is simply a way for the strong to express their own futile self loathing.

 

Don't hate yourself for being better. You probably deserve everything you get.

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Pride and vanity are tools of the DEVIL, Typhus, you guys may think that Devil is cool, and the Hell will be like Party Town for you all, but think again, the Devil doesn't make friends, he is the personification of evil, so if you chose to be Evil, expect eternal torment.

 

Just a thought, don't expect Damnation is a party devil.gif

 

(typos galore, ignore, that quote below)

Edited by Slamman
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Pride and vanity are tools of the DEVIL, Typhus, you guys may think the Devil is cool and the Hell will be like Party Town for you all, but think again, the Devil doesn't make friends, he is the personification of evil, so if you chose to be Evil, expect eternal torment.

At first I thought this was serious. Then I saw it was Slamman.

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It's true tho. You never see athiest soup kitchens. I'm an athiest. I care about the poor, but not enough to man a soup kitchen at night in the cold in a dangerous city. I think we should make society so we don't need soup kitchens/charity etc.

That will never happen I'm afraid. In our consumerist society, someone always has to be at the bottom. I guess its just luck as to what family your born in too. I think this might be better placed in the Debates & Discussion area of the forum. I can already smell the viscous arguments, I mean friendly debates moto_whistle.gif

Athiests Helping The Homeless

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Well, many rappers are rich and in high-class society now but they still keep their religious roots from when they were living in the hood.

 

I mean they are not maniacal religiously but still believeing in god and asking for his forgiveness when praying...

 

If you go into nearly all old people houses in the poor areas you will see religious symbols and pictures, and especially elderly black ladies....

 

How many pertinent atheists do you guys know who were raised in poverty, or even in low-income family?

 

 

Also, when i go outside i see those stickers such as "Jesus loves all" stuck to lampposts and walls in the poor, low-income neighborhoods but not in upper class areas, why?

 

 

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I'm raised Christian, so yeah, my beliefs are what I hold on to.

That and VCR parts.

 

 

 

Just in case.

 

 

@mt774, now I think you're just making sh*t up.

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Pride and vanity are tools of the DEVIL, Typhus, you guys may think that Devil is cool, and the Hell will be like Party Town for you all, but think again, the Devil doesn't make friends, he is the personification of evil, so if you chose to be Evil, expect eternal torment.

 

Just a thought, don't expect Damnation devil.gif

Pride and ambition sent man to the moon. Pride for ones species helped us estroy smallpox. Pride is the driving force behind every great man.

More and more I grow tired of this glorification of submission that Christianity teaches, this love for humility and grovelling. Abiding by those rules gets you nothing. A man has to be proud of his superior qualities, not curse himself that so many others are lacking.

 

We feel pity for the less fortunate because we are socialised to do so. Because we are supposed to lament the comfort our parents worked hard to provide us with. Because we should detest the luxury that is paid for by the sweat from our own brow.

So much of Christianity is masochistic. We beg to be punished for the crime of human endeavour. I couldn't stand that idea as a child and I can't now.

 

They used to tell me in Sunday School that Satan was speaking through me, maybe I should take it as a compliment. Because I'm finding more agreeable in Hell than Heaven.

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How many pertinent atheists do you guys know who were raised in poverty, or even in low-income family?

None, in the UK. The only people in the UK in predominantly low-income areas who hold strong religious beliefs are generally from Southern and South-East Asia. Oh, and the elderly. If someone were to stereotype a British, low-income family, it would be religiously ignorant, if not anti-religious.

 

Rappers are a poor benchmark for analysing the rest of society. They're also not exactly notorious for giving their wealth to the poor and needy- unless that's in the form of drug money or funding organised crime.

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WF the Hobgoblin

Maybe because atheists aren't throwing their money away by giving it to "god". That mofo always seems to need mula.

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How many pertinent atheists do you guys know who were raised in poverty, or even in low-income family?

None, in the UK. The only people in the UK in predominantly low-income areas who hold strong religious beliefs are generally from Southern and South-East Asia. Oh, and the elderly. If someone were to stereotype a British, low-income family, it would be religiously ignorant, if not anti-religious.

 

Rappers are a poor benchmark for analysing the rest of society. They're also not exactly notorious for giving their wealth to the poor and needy- unless that's in the form of drug money or funding organised crime.

Really??? I think you must not have lived in predominantly black poor areas in UK then, if you go past a church on Sunday in those areas you will see it very full. If you notice anytime a black family looses somebody to a death; a member of that family will always come out in an interview and say something like "he's in a better place now" "the lord is looking after him".

 

When 50 Cent survived his shooting, he credited god with his survival, and of course he comes from a family with very religious grandparents.

 

and i just feel like atheists can't understand that feeling for religion in those environments, how can somebody like Dawkins relate, if he has never been from those same struggles?

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I found this poignant piece for those who are mortal yet still don't grasp Religious Faith. At least have a funny bone. Love the KISS reference in here

 

 

While I think if you are Christian or other person of Faith, you can still deal with the problem of money and wealth in a healthy way, and giving to those less fortunate is a great way to show caring, really. No one is asking for support beyond being decent to fellow human beings, life is not how you play GTA, that's what I believe and everyone should believe who has a brain to use in their head. It doesn't matter that there's no proof of God, it's living with a caring heart that matters most

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I found this poignant piece for those who are mortal yet still don't grasp Religious Faith. At least have a funny bone. Love the KISS reference in here

eKmh-0E5BjU

 

I actually found that video quite funny. icon14.gif

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and i just feel like atheists can't understand that feeling for religion in those environments, how can somebody like Dawkins relate, if he has never been from those same struggles?

I come from a single parent family where my mother had to work numerous jobs with long hours to properly take care of me and my sister when we were younger. My sister had to take care of me a lot of the time because my mam was working so much. Thankfully, that all changed when she (my mother) got her degree and got into higher level local government jobs, earning enough to help both me and my sister go to university. I do not thank god for doing that, I thank her for being a fantastic mother.

 

I have never lived in poverty, but my family was on a low income for a significant amount of time. Don't assume everything about a group of people because of the figure heads. Figure heads who, like Dawkins, detract from the image of the group as a whole a lot of the time, by being intolerant assholes.

Edited by Robinski
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There are perfectly rational atheists out there, and perfectly rational religious types. Meanwhile there are also completly irrational ones on both sides. Its just bad form to make broad generalizations like one side comming from class or any other generalizations you come up with.

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Thankfully, that all changed when she (my mother) got her degree and got into higher level local government jobs, earning enough to help both me and my sister go to university. I do not thank god for doing that, I thank her for being a fantastic mother.

You see? Humans need to take pride in what they do and stop hating their success.

Am I alone here? Does no one else find something deeply unhealthy about this obsession with singlehandedly trying to drag the poor up from the gutters?

 

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Thankfully, that all changed when she (my mother) got her degree and got into higher level local government jobs, earning enough to help both me and my sister go to university. I do not thank god for doing that, I thank her for being a fantastic mother.

You see? Humans need to take pride in what they do and stop hating their success.

Am I alone here? Does no one else find something deeply unhealthy about this obsession with singlehandedly trying to drag the poor up from the gutters?

You're not alone Typhus. I agree with you. However as soon as you say anything like that in real life people call you a heartless bastard. Maybe I am... oh well.

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Thankfully, that all changed when she (my mother) got her degree and got into higher level local government jobs, earning enough to help both me and my sister go to university. I do not thank god for doing that, I thank her for being a fantastic mother.

You see? Humans need to take pride in what they do and stop hating their success.

Am I alone here? Does no one else find something deeply unhealthy about this obsession with singlehandedly trying to drag the poor up from the gutters?

You're not alone Typhus. I agree with you. However as soon as you say anything like that in real life people call you a heartless bastard. Maybe I am... oh well.

Ah, but I'm far from heartless. If I see a beggar who is not insane, I'll give them some drink and food. I am all in favour of showing pity and charity to those less fortunate, we're not beasts after all.

But it's the motives, it all boils down to the motives. Why do I help a beggar? Easy. Because first of all, I fear God. And secondly, because it makes me feel good. Both very base, selfish reasons, I'm sure you'd agree.

 

But I would take selfishness any day. I'd take anything over self-loathing and guilt. The idea disgusts me, I've tried to explain this to other Christians but all they do is stare at me with the unmistakable glazed expression of a lobotomised rat.

 

How can anyone live a happy life when they are convinced that their every victory should be attributed to God rather than their own strength of will? It boggles the mind.

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Thankfully, that all changed when she (my mother) got her degree and got into higher level local government jobs, earning enough to help both me and my sister go to university. I do not thank god for doing that, I thank her for being a fantastic mother.

You see? Humans need to take pride in what they do and stop hating their success.

Am I alone here? Does no one else find something deeply unhealthy about this obsession with singlehandedly trying to drag the poor up from the gutters?

No, because even if i made a billion dollars i would still give back to my community and help out those kids who have not much chance to do much but end up in jail. Why i do this? Well, because i will understand what it's like having come from that background myself.

 

I will explain:

 

most of those who help out or relate to people from poor backgrounds after becoming successful and moving away are religious most of the times. Maybe not like a religious nut or bible-basher but they still believe in god.

 

Dawkins and Hitchens can't understand that need for hope because they have come from comfortable life and are in privilege position.

 

How can a well-educated, well-spoken intellectual understand the pain of that person in the ghetto who suffers from mostly let-downs and hardship.

 

a religious person might be from upper-class background too, but at least they seem more accessib;e in the community. I always see atheist in trendy dinners and fine-dining settings but at least preachers are in the ghettos.

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I'm an atheist and I am definitely not rich - if anything I'd say I'm working class. So your point is not valid, unless you're arguing only those who have enough money for a better education become atheist? Intelligence is not the preserve of the rich or 'cultured', but if you are caught in desperate poverty (I am not) then perhaps you find yourself placing your faith in a higher being. I don't know; there might be a correlation.

 

But I do care for those poorer than me, I have morals and I am not religious.

U R B A N I T A S

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