Quantcast
Jump to content
Search In
  • More options...
Find results that contain...
Find results in...
    1. Welcome to GTAForums!

    1. GTANet.com

    1. GTA Online

      1. The Cayo Perico Heist
      2. The Diamond Casino Heist
      3. Find Lobbies & Players
      4. Guides & Strategies
      5. Vehicles
      6. Content Creator
      7. Help & Support
    2. Red Dead Online

      1. Frontier Pursuits
      2. Find Lobbies & Outlaws
      3. Help & Support
    3. Crews

    1. Red Dead Redemption 2

      1. PC
      2. Help & Support
    2. Red Dead Redemption

    1. Grand Theft Auto Series

    2. GTA VI

      1. St. Andrews Cathedral
    3. GTA V

      1. Guides & Strategies
      2. Help & Support
    4. GTA IV

      1. The Lost and Damned
      2. The Ballad of Gay Tony
      3. Guides & Strategies
      4. Help & Support
    5. GTA San Andreas

      1. Guides & Strategies
      2. Help & Support
    6. GTA Vice City

      1. Guides & Strategies
      2. Help & Support
    7. GTA III

      1. Guides & Strategies
      2. Help & Support
    8. Portable Games

      1. GTA Chinatown Wars
      2. GTA Vice City Stories
      3. GTA Liberty City Stories
    9. Top-Down Games

      1. GTA Advance
      2. GTA 2
      3. GTA
    1. GTA Mods

      1. GTA V
      2. GTA IV
      3. GTA III, VC & SA
      4. Tutorials
    2. Red Dead Mods

      1. Documentation
    3. Mod Showroom

      1. Scripts & Plugins
      2. Maps
      3. Total Conversions
      4. Vehicles
      5. Textures
      6. Characters
      7. Tools
      8. Other
      9. Workshop
    4. Featured Mods

      1. Design Your Own Mission
      2. OpenIV
      3. GTA: Underground
      4. GTA: Liberty City
      5. GTA: State of Liberty
    1. Rockstar Games

    2. Rockstar Collectors

    1. Off-Topic

      1. General Chat
      2. Gaming
      3. Technology
      4. Movies & TV
      5. Music
      6. Sports
      7. Vehicles
    2. Expression

      1. Graphics / Visual Arts
      2. GFX Requests & Tutorials
      3. Writers' Discussion
      4. Debates & Discussion
    3. Gangs

    1. Announcements

    2. Support

    3. Suggestions

Sign in to follow this  
Dingdongs

Ground Zero Mosque

Recommended Posts

nerner
I think the objection of building this mosque shows the complete ignorance of people in this country. Sure the perpetrators of the attacks would love this, but the bigger loss would be the denial of religious freedom because someone doesn't know the difference between Muslim and terrorist.

People don't like to be reminded of bad things that have happened in their lives, that is pretty much a fact. If you had just been raped would you want a sex offender clinic to be built opposite your house? That is basically how these people feel.

 

I don't think that the main cause of objection is the fact that all muslims are bad. I think that it is just that looking at that mosque when you are at Ground Zero would feel like a massive kick in the teeth to those who had lost their relatives.

 

 

Let the muslims build it, anyone who disagrees hates the constitution and is unamerican.

Can't tell if you are trolling or not here, but I certainly am "unamerican" since I am British. wink.gif

 

 

But New York isn't a holy city?

Yeah that was a bad example, but my point about Riyadh still stands.

 

Share this post


Link to post
Share on other sites
Vercetti27

so if we bomb mecca, 9 years later we can build a church there?

 

f*cking sick idea. build it, by all means, but not there. al quaeda must be loving this.

Share this post


Link to post
Share on other sites
darthYENIK
I think the objection of building this mosque shows the complete ignorance of people in this country.  Sure the perpetrators of the attacks would love this, but the bigger loss would be the denial of religious freedom because someone doesn't know the difference between Muslim and terrorist.

People don't like to be reminded of bad things that have happened in their lives, that is pretty much a fact. If you had just been raped would you want a sex offender clinic to be built opposite your house? That is basically how these people feel.

 

I don't think that the main cause of objection is the fact that all muslims are bad. I think that it is just that looking at that mosque when you are at Ground Zero would feel like a massive kick in the teeth to those who had lost their relatives.

 

 

Let the muslims build it, anyone who disagrees hates the constitution and is unamerican.

Can't tell if you are trolling or not here, but I certainly am "unamerican" since I am British. wink.gif

 

 

But New York isn't a holy city?

Yeah that was a bad example, but my point about Riyadh still stands.

That's what I'm talking about, you can't differentiate between Muslim and terrorist. You see a mosque, and instead of thinking about just another church, you think about terrorists. That's a very prejudicial.

Share this post


Link to post
Share on other sites
Captain Crunch
so if we bomb mecca, 9 years later we can build a church there?

 

f*cking sick idea. build it, by all means, but not there. al quaeda must be loving this.

Since when has New York been a holy city?

Share this post


Link to post
Share on other sites
Vercetti27
so if we bomb mecca, 9 years later we can build a church there?

 

f*cking sick idea. build it, by all means, but not there. al quaeda must be loving this.

Since when has New York been a holy city?

 

 

ok, if america bombed Riyahd or Tehran

Share this post


Link to post
Share on other sites
The-King
so if we bomb mecca, 9 years later we can build a church there?

 

f*cking sick idea. build it, by all means, but not there. al quaeda must be loving this.

Since when has New York been a holy city?

 

 

ok, if america bombed Riyahd or Tehran

Thanks for proving our point that the only real reasoning behind the argument against building the mosque is blind ignorance and worthless prejudice.

 

Appreciate it.

 

IE: The bombers were Muslims + Mosques are where Muslims congregate = The terrorists win

 

Get real.

Share this post


Link to post
Share on other sites
Tyler

Alright, so I understand that both sides can't understand each other. That is fine. But to be honest, in the end neither 'side' is going to be compensated for the amount of grief and hate they are either generating, or receiving.

 

Here's the fact, if it is built there, conservatives against free religion will be angered, as will stubborn Americans. But, Left-wing liberals for freedom and constitutional rights will be extremely happy, as will terrorist groups for the decimation of Christianity.

 

In the end, that is the simplest outcome. We could go into more specific endings, but that is the sole reason why there is so much debate.

Share this post


Link to post
Share on other sites
General Goose

This is the reason I am annoyed they brought this idea up in the first place. Sure, I guess the reasoning was it could be a pretty powerful message in terms of equality and showing we in the West are a lot more tolerant and less judgmental than Al-Qaeda (a message that kinda doesn't need to be made), but right now all it's doing is stirring up a lot of hatred and becoming a massive political argument, with the liberals and conservatives vying for a victory.

Share this post


Link to post
Share on other sites
Captain Crunch
so if we bomb mecca, 9 years later we can build a church there?

 

f*cking sick idea. build it, by all means, but not there. al quaeda must be loving this.

Since when has New York been a holy city?

 

 

ok, if america bombed Riyahd or Tehran

And? What difference does that make? Al-Queda has no country of residence. Their leader is an Saudi Arabian who is either dead or living in Pakistan where his group is fighting the government. So a better comparison would to blow up a mountain and build a church there, which I think most people wouldn't really care much about.

 

Also, some of you are forgetting this isn't a mosque. It's an Islam community center (or whatever the f*ck that is) with a mosque located in it. It also has a swimming pool and a basketball court. Damn anti-western Muslims.

Share this post


Link to post
Share on other sites
Saggy

Is this supposed to be a mosque inside of the WTC, or in the same neighborhood as Ground Zero?

 

Personally when I heard about it I thought they were trying to make a mosque inside of the new WTC, and I would see that as wrong considering that it's not freedom of religion the constitution gives us, it's separation of church and state. So to have a mosque, a synagogue or a church inside of a federal institution would be unconstitutional.

 

On the other hand, if they just want to make a mosque in the general neighborhood, I don't really see how people can make a big deal about this, but I do think that it can still come down to a democratic decision to have the mosque built elsewhere. If people in the community don't want it at the site that it's proposed they always have the power to not allow that property to be zoned for religious purposes. The only problem I see is that, would they do that if it were a church and not a mosque?

 

I think that the people building the mosque should be more sensitive to the events that took place there. I mean, you basically have a religion that was scapegoated as the cause of 9/11, and so I don't think that putting an artifact of said religion in close proximity to the event speaks volumes of the amount of consideration they put into how it would effect the community.

 

Either way though I don't really see it being a big deal and it seems kind of obnoxious. One side seems to think they have a "right" to build their mosque wherever they want, the other side seems to think that they should be more concerned about the feelings and emotions of people that might associate that religion with terrorism, and in the end the simple solution would be for both sides to just shut up and deal with it. Instead you have some kind of stupid argument about how has a right to do what.

 

The thing that I wonder about is what kind of message this would send to the extremists. I mean, on the one hand, building a symbol of their religion next to the buildings they knocked down in their "jihad" might seem to solidify victory or inspire them more. On the other hand, if we could build a mosque right next to the part they destroyed in an attempt to destroy us, wouldn't we be showing them that we're so powerful and life is so great here that we can co-exist and understand each other to the point where we would allow a group of people to build this religious symbol in this area? To me it says, "It doesn't really matter if you knocked these buildings down, we're a nation of free people and we'll do whatever we want without concern for what you think," rather than, "You knocked these buildings down, now nothing of your religion can be associated with that or it will hurt our feelings."

 

Bottom line to me is that as soon as we start dictating who can celebrate their religion where because of how it makes the other Americans feel, the closer we get to becoming more extreme in our own religious views. How long does, "No, their shouldn't be a mosque here because it offends the victims of 9/11," take to turn into, "No, we shouldn't allow muslims to walk freely on the street while there is a jihad declared on us."

 

The separation of church and state has always worked with a varied success rate though. No matter how much the government decides not to give credence to any religion so it doesn't have to pick and choose, there are still various people who believe that their religion is being disenfranchised and that this isn't the case, or that another religion is getting special benefits, etc. Given all of that, it seems to me that the entire area around the WTC is too federal to really be zoned for any religious institutions and so I don't believe there should be a church, mosque or synagogue there, beacuse it will eventually just lead to what we have no where people with different religious beliefs are worried about one's religious being given special treatment by the government--good or bad.

Share this post


Link to post
Share on other sites
darthYENIK

From what I read, the site they want to build the community center at is a couple blocks away from ground zero. And the state or whoever want it moved to an unspecified piece of state-owned land. Considering I believe that separation of church and state is a two way street, this seems like the state trying muck with religion.

 

Now, I'm not sure who owns the proposed land near the WTC, but if it's privately owned, they do have the right to build whatever they want (within the law).

Share this post


Link to post
Share on other sites
bobgtafan

 

Can't tell if you are trolling or not here, but I certainly am "unamerican" since I am British.

Well you're british...so you can be unamerican I could care less honestly. I was speaking of Americans who say "We love the constitution" but then say "f*ck the first amendment!"

Share this post


Link to post
Share on other sites
Vercetti27

I'm not f*cking ignorant or prejudice I just think if they actually allow a mosque to be built there then Al Quaeda has won. Theres already plenty of mosques in NY, why build one there? talk about bad taste

Share this post


Link to post
Share on other sites
Captain Crunch
I'm not f*cking ignorant or prejudice I just think if they actually allow a mosque to be built there then Al Quaeda has won. Theres already plenty of mosques in NY, why build one there? talk about bad taste

Because all the rest of the mosques are overcrowded, and the guy who wants to build the Islam community center just happens to own the property.

 

And you still think all Muslims are extremists.

Share this post


Link to post
Share on other sites
Emhyr
I'm not f*cking ignorant or prejudice I just think if they actually allow a mosque to be built there then Al Quaeda has won. Theres already plenty of mosques in NY, why build one there? talk about bad taste

Why would Al Quaeda won? What will they get if this mosque be built there?

Wtf Al Quaeda have with Islam anyway?

Share this post


Link to post
Share on other sites
Vercetti27
I'm not f*cking ignorant or prejudice I just think if they actually allow a mosque to be built there then Al Quaeda has won. Theres already plenty of mosques in NY, why build one there? talk about bad taste

Because all the rest of the mosques are overcrowded, and the guy who wants to build the Islam community center just happens to own the property.

 

And you still think all Muslims are extremists.

when did I say that? And if you don't know what Al Quaeda have to do with Islam your an ignorant dick. Al Quaeda are muslim extremists who planned the 9/11 attack. Mostly Afghans. I'm just saying it seems sick to put the religious temple of Islam on the site of the 9/11 attack . And whether or not all islamic people are extremists is obviously unimportant . It's like putting a statue of hitler in a synagogue .

 

 

Share this post


Link to post
Share on other sites
Ari Gold

It's not the same, it's about two blocks away. Plus, an Islamic cultural centre where people go to learn about how Islam can be integrated into the community (plus where Muslims can go to pray to God, not Usamah bin Ladin) is quite different from a tangible statue representing a tyrant who brutally ordered the killings of more than six million Jews.

 

Plus, how have Al-Qaidah won? Their original motives weren't to destroy the US anyway, it was to create an Islamic Caliphate in the Middle East where Muslims can live in a

"pure Islamic state", and they felt that America's actions in the Gulf War and their presence in Saudi Arabia (the holy land of the Islamic religion) were highly offensive and enraged them. Not to mention their continual support for "Zionist" Israel, and their so-called support for "un-Islamic" governments in the region. Plus, the invasions of Afghanistan and Iraq haven't really helped their opinions of the Americans greatly.

 

Before calling others out on their ignorance, make sure yours is in check first, buddy.

Share this post


Link to post
Share on other sites
Vercetti27

hmmm, I'm pretty sure if you said to a relative of a victim of 9/11 that in 9 years a mosque will be there they would be more than pissed.

 

And this thread isn't about Al Quaeda its about Ground Zero, and IMO having a mosque there is bad taste . If they need a new mosque so badly they can build it someplace else, or better still, go to a mosque in the middle east.

 

seriously , if I proposed to build a church in Kabul or some place I'd be stoned. stoned out of my head to be stupid enough to do it and literally stoned to death for suggesting it.

And I'm not "ignorant". judging by the sh*t thats been posted in this thread I'm probably one of the least ignorant people here.

 

I'm not coming back to this thread seeing as how they'll probably be some pathetic response to this suggesting I think all muslims are extremists , which I don't. If anything thats the view in america .

 

Have fun discussing this .

Share this post


Link to post
Share on other sites
General Goose
hmmm, I'm pretty sure if you said to a relative of a victim of 9/11 that in 9 years a mosque will be there they would be more than pissed.

 

And this thread isn't about Al Quaeda its about Ground Zero, and IMO having a mosque there is bad taste . If they need a new mosque so badly they can build it someplace else, or better still, go to a mosque in the middle east.

 

seriously , if I proposed to build a church in Kabul or some place I'd be stoned. stoned out of my head to be stupid enough to do it and literally stoned to death for suggesting it.

And I'm not "ignorant". judging by the sh*t thats been posted in this thread I'm probably one of the least ignorant people here.

 

I'm not coming back to this thread seeing as how they'll probably be some pathetic response to this suggesting I think all muslims are extremists , which I don't. If anything thats the view in america .

 

Have fun discussing this .

Wut.

 

Your post started off fine, then you got to the point about going to a mosque in the Middle East. What the f*ck? So New York Muslims should just go to the Middle East to pray now, that's what you seem to want. Should Catholics have to go to the Vatican to the pray?

 

Secondly, the point about building a church in Kabul is stupid. A whole Afghan city =/= the site of a major terrorist attack.

 

 

Share this post


Link to post
Share on other sites
Jesus'En'Hitler420

 

Secondly, the point about building a church in Kabul is stupid. A whole Afghan city =/= the site of a major terrorist attack.

 

I think his point is that some people in Kabul might not exactly be as tolerant of other religions like we are, or have a constitution that says the Federal government can not offend the right of freedom of religion... but we can see that these sort of technicalities escape you...

 

Yes, they do have the right to have an institution built... but, it's not the choice of the owner of the institution as to where it is built. What is interesting is that for as many New Yorkers that saw what happened on that day, the Port Authority of NY which any of us would figure would be made up of locals, would give the go ahead to demolish a whole 'nother building, and give the go ahead for a nine story Mosque/community center to be built with the head of it all being a guy that will not agree with the sentiment that the groups Hezbollah and Hamas are made up of "terrorists".

 

This whole thing is going to be fought out in NY, chances are it's not going to be built there because most people do not exactly want a terror loving Imam slapping them in the face figuratively on a daily basis. I wouldn't be suprised if it's blown to smitherines the first day it opens. Then maybe Hamas will counterattack!

Share this post


Link to post
Share on other sites
Captain Crunch

 

I'm not f*cking ignorant or prejudice I just think if they actually allow a mosque to be built there then Al Quaeda has won. Theres already plenty of mosques in NY, why build one there? talk about bad taste

Because all the rest of the mosques are overcrowded, and the guy who wants to build the Islam community center just happens to own the property.

 

And you still think all Muslims are extremists.

when did I say that? And if you don't know what Al Quaeda have to do with Islam your an ignorant dick. Al Quaeda are muslim extremists who planned the 9/11 attack. Mostly Afghans. I'm just saying it seems sick to put the religious temple of Islam on the site of the 9/11 attack . And whether or not all islamic people are extremists is obviously unimportant . It's like putting a statue of hitler in a synagogue .

Al -Qaeda have nothing to do with this. It would be like building a church and claiming the KKK won. It's extremely stupid and ignorant.

 

And this thread isn't about Al Quaeda its about Ground Zero, and IMO having a mosque there is bad taste . If they need a new mosque so badly they can build it someplace else, or better still, go to a mosque in the middle east.

Because they own that peice of land. They have a right to build whatever they want.

 

Edited by Captain Crunch

Share this post


Link to post
Share on other sites
Canofceleri

Ground zero mosque... the thing is gonna be two blocks and around the corner and out of vision of the site. It's a ridiculous scandal.

Share this post


Link to post
Share on other sites
Dingdongs

 

I think the objection of building this mosque shows the complete ignorance of people in this country.  Sure the perpetrators of the attacks would love this, but the bigger loss would be the denial of religious freedom because someone doesn't know the difference between Muslim and terrorist.

People don't like to be reminded of bad things that have happened in their lives, that is pretty much a fact. If you had just been raped would you want a sex offender clinic to be built opposite your house? That is basically how these people feel.

 

I don't think that the main cause of objection is the fact that all muslims are bad. I think that it is just that looking at that mosque when you are at Ground Zero would feel like a massive kick in the teeth to those who had lost their relatives.

 

 

Let the muslims build it, anyone who disagrees hates the constitution and is unamerican.

Can't tell if you are trolling or not here, but I certainly am "unamerican" since I am British. wink.gif

 

 

But New York isn't a holy city?

Yeah that was a bad example, but my point about Riyadh still stands.

But what you don't get, darthyenik, is that I live in New York, everyone I know lives in New York, and none of us have a problem with this. It's people in other states, other parts of the country, and even people not from this country, who has a problem with this.

 

Oh, and furthermore, to the f*cking jackass who is sitting here saying al-Queda has won... you are a complete idiot. It's not like we are canceling the memorial and sticking a mosque there. Get over it. And furthermore, I have a friend who's father died in the attacks (he was a worker in the WTC) and he and his family can care less about this mosque. I was over his house the other day for dinner and they were talking about it on the news and all of them had nothing more to say than "It wasn't the muslim community that did this, it was al-Queda".

 

 

Edited by Irviding

Share this post


Link to post
Share on other sites
darthYENIK

But I agree with you. It's the same thing with all this illegal immigration stuff in Arizona, except in this instance the conservatives are upset. In both cases the loudest opposition isn't involved in any way. It's people from other places that see it on the news, and want to stick their big noses in other people's business, and then give their unwanted opinions. But in this case, even if New Yorkers were opposed to the building and lining the streets with torches and pitchforks, there's nothing they could do about it, because it's all perfectly legal.

Share this post


Link to post
Share on other sites
Jesus'En'Hitler420

Well, they can do something about it, but it will probably be with nitroglycerin or some other highly explosive material over pitchforks and torches.

Share this post


Link to post
Share on other sites
Rown

And then in their fear of terrorists, they'd make themselves terrorists. Oh irony.

 

Rown rampage_ani.gif

Share this post


Link to post
Share on other sites
Akavari

Is it wrong to build it? Not really, but I'd rather see something productive built like a library or something.

Share this post


Link to post
Share on other sites
Maxim

Wow, this is just plain old stupid.

 

How can people be so ignorant? A community center is being built on PRIVATE PROPERTY 2 blocks away from WTC.

Oh No! It's sooooooooooo offensive!

 

Do you guys realize that Muslims also died on 9/11?

Do you guys realize that there are already 100 mosques in NYC?

Is it too close to Ground Zero? Since when has Ground Zero become a district??!

It's really surprising to me that people are so xenophobic.

 

In reality, what this comes down to is upholding the constitution. You know that old thing that was written a few hundred years back.. I'm sure you don't remember.

Building a Community Center near Ground Zero should be no more offensive then building a Japanese Cultural Center near Pearl Harbor( there actually is one there!) or a christian church in Nagasaki (there are tons of them there).

Share this post


Link to post
Share on other sites
mrpain

Alright, I'm a fellow Muslim so what I say cant be offensive to my own religion.

 

Yes we Muslims have the rights to build it there but honestly, at Ground Zero? Couldnt have they build it somewhere else and not cause an uproar? Its like we're causing the hate by ourselves.

Share this post


Link to post
Share on other sites
Sanjeem
I also have nothing against it being built there, but I would like to see who are the actual financiers of this project. The fact that it's kept a secret seems very suspicious to me, the location might be chosen to be a some sort of provocation to escalate the conflict between americans and the Muslim word.

I saw a poll about a week ago which said most Muslims are actually against it being built there for the same reasons, I can't seem to remember where it was... perhaps on RT.

Obama's support for it is not a surprise to me, knowing that he himself is a secular Muslim and his masters are all for the conflict being escalated.

Obama isn't a muslim, i know alot of americans still think he is but he has claimed himself a Devout christian, if he was a devout muslim denieing his real religeon would be a sin.

Share this post


Link to post
Share on other sites

Join the conversation

You can post now and register later. If you have an account, sign in now to post with your account.

Guest
Reply to this topic...

×   Pasted as rich text.   Paste as plain text instead

  Only 75 emoji are allowed.

×   Your link has been automatically embedded.   Display as a link instead

×   Your previous content has been restored.   Clear editor

×   You cannot paste images directly. Upload or insert images from URL.

Sign in to follow this  

  • 1 User Currently Viewing
    0 members, 0 Anonymous, 1 Guest

×
×
  • Create New...

Important Information

By using GTAForums.com, you agree to our Terms of Use and Privacy Policy.