Something strange

[Vasilyrud]

So some time ago, I got a new monitor and connected it my "new" comp. Since I had an old comp lying around, I decided to connect the "old" monitor to that old comp. I used it for about a week, connected internet to both, and everything worked fine.

 

Approximate computer specs:

Intel Celeron

512 Mb memory "sticks"

75 Gb memory

Some GeForce 2 card

Yeah, its very old.

 

So now, that I was using it, it suddenly restarted (I didn't press anything), and when it was starting up, during the "black-screen-with-text" (BIOS? ), it said that there is an error with the keyboards, or it is not connected. It didn't go past the screen. I checked the cords and everything was well connected. I tried restarting, and still got the same result.

 

Right away, I tried checking my working computer: I turned it off, plugged out the keyboard, and turned it back on. No keyboard error displayed, and the startup worked fine. Then I tried unplugging the keyboard on my old computer, and I still got the error message.

 

Then, I tried getting the keyboard from my "new" computer, and plugging it into the old computer. It started up with no error, and worked fine. Then I tried restarting with the old computer's keyboard, and it worked fine, like always before, as if nothing happened.

 

So my question is: what is that happened, when my computer restarted, and didn't want to start up, cause my keyboard "wasn't there" (when it was)?

 

[Graphix14]

Um, did you have a driver for that keyboard? Any type of cd that came with it?

 

Otherwise, get a new keyboard.

[Vasilyrud]

Well, that could be a thought. The keyboard I'm using is about 10 years old, and I was planning to get a new one.

 

But still, I think its not something with the keyboard, since it started working eventually. Plus, when I plugged out keyboard and restarted on "old computer" it didn't want to load past the error message. When I plugged out keyboard and restarted on "new computer", it loaded without any error messages at all.

 

EDIT to come, I will test some things out...

[Slamman]

75 GB is not very old for memory, in fact, it's way ahead of it's time, me thinks

Oh, for VGA, in Windows, start with the OS loading just default vid driver, it will then look at the monitor. When you have issues in that capacity, try the various defaults, in some cases I got SVGA to work in the Windows drivers, allowing you to expand the video settings beyond 16bit.

In Windows XP, the default driver is more robust. What I'm getting at is the PC's video driver needs to be working in some regard before the monitor is looked at by the OS.

 

The text of bootup mode, that's called POST, not BIOS, they are not the same, but are both firmware, built into the computer, Firmware in the BIOS variety is a chip often cases, or EEPROM style, one that can be flash upgraded. the POST is to read all the hardware into the computer memory prior to the OS, and it does determine mouse and keyboard to assign IRQ as the BIOS warrants

Edited November 28, 2009 by Slamman

[Star-Lord]

Your keyboard is on it's way out. Buy a replacement.

[Slamman]

Just a tip from USED GEAR guy, I've spotted plenty of keyboards at the Goodwill here, the USA thrift store, however, at the local MicroCenter, I got my mini USB keyboard for $7, they nearly liquidated all the ones they had at that price, and typically that's as low as they get.. $5 for a used keyboard, my used Dell Bluetooth was picked up for that price, and I think it's awesome!

[Wolf68k]

@Vasilyrud

When you said that you checked the cable before on the old computer and you still got an error, what exactly did you do?

Did you just make sure it was plugged in or did you unplug it and then plug it back in?

If all you did just make sure it's plugged in, then that's not really much of a check. I'll bet had you just unplugged it the first time and plugged it back in it would have worked.

As for why it's doing that, could be any number of reasons.

 

BTW is this a PS/2 or USB keyboard.

 

 

@Graphix14

Drivers aren't going to any good while you're still in start up. Not until you get into the OS are the drivers activated and brought into play. Also most keyboards don't need drivers, even a high end multimedia keyboard for just the basic keys to work. Usually you can plug in any USB or PS/2 keyboard and get normal functions without installing any extra drivers. It's when you want to use those multimedia keys and whatever extra buttons will the drivers really matter.

 

 

 

@Slamman

Dear lord how you do ramble about nothing. You make 2 replies in here and not a single thing was useful to the topic.

I would really love to get into this with you and show you wrong you already are about what is POST and what is BIOS, never mind your more than useless info about...well everything else.

I will just say this. You made POST and BIOS sound like they are 2 separate things and 2 separate pieces of firmware. Short answer, you're wrong. POST (Power-On Self Test) is something that is performed by the BIOS and is displayed to show you what is going on and if there are any errors. In other words POST is, for the sack of your simple mind, is a program within the firmware.

[Pico]

I'm assuming it's an old keyboard, right? A PS/2 (purple, sometimes red I think) connector, not a USB? The pins on it could be really sh*tty, bent up and stuff.

 

Funny you mention hooking up that PC, I got one from a friend a while back to fix it, it wouldn't start at all. When I started having my PC problems I bought another PSU. Hooked it up to my friends PC and it started right up. As I expected it was the PSU, but I told him it'd be pointless to pay to fix it.

It'd been nearly 6 months since I got it and he already had a new PC so he said junk his old one. I plan on using it as a download and DVD burning station

 

The funny thing is, it's got basically the same specs except it's got an AMD 2800+ single core at 2.0Ghz or so. Those damn, old slow computers

It struggles playing Youtube HD videos, lol. Good luck playing any kind of video in WMP...

[leik oh em jeez!]

 

The text of bootup mode, that's called POST, not BIOS, they are not the same, but are both firmware, built into the computer, Firmware in the BIOS variety is a chip often cases, or EEPROM style, one that can be flash upgraded. the POST is to read all the hardware into the computer memory prior to the OS, and it does determine mouse and keyboard to assign IRQ as the BIOS warrants

 

 

@Slamman

Dear lord how you do ramble about nothing. You make 2 replies in here and not a single thing was useful to the topic.

I would really love to get into this with you and show you wrong you already are about what is POST and what is BIOS, never mind your more than useless info about...well everything else.

I will just say this. You made POST and BIOS sound like they are 2 separate things and 2 separate pieces of firmware. Short answer, you're wrong. POST (Power-On Self Test) is something that is performed by the BIOS and is displayed to show you what is going on and if there are any errors. In other words POST is, for the sack of your simple mind, is a program within the firmware.

 

He was actually right. You explained it differently, but get at the same thing.

 

The text at the start up is the POST, will report any error messages, and allows you to enter the BIOS settings. It is software within the firmware, making it a part of the firmware, and slamman right in calling it firmware. The POST and BIOS are two different things. The BIOS works alot like a low-level OS that the POST runs on. The POST can sometimes be disabled in the BIOS. So saying that the BIOS and POST aren't different pieces of firmware is like saying that Windows and IE aren't different pieces of software.

 

I was able to understand what he was saying, and I'm sure that other people could too. Just because the post could be interpreted in one of two ways doesn't mean he's wrong. Even the wrong interpretation would be mostly right.

Edited November 29, 2009 by leik oh em jeez!

[Democrab]

The text of bootup mode, that's called POST, not BIOS, they are not the same, but are both firmware, built into the computer, Firmware in the BIOS variety is a chip often cases, or EEPROM style, one that can be flash upgraded. the POST is to read all the hardware into the computer memory prior to the OS, and it does determine mouse and keyboard to assign IRQ as the BIOS warrants

No, the text is the CMOS, the code you can't see is the BIOS and the POST is part of the BIOS' code, that checks to see if it gets a proper reply from everything plugged in do it knows that the computer should work and otherwise, through beeps or the LEDs you get on some boards, shows us whats wrong and not working.

 

The only text the POST has is if you've got a motherboard with the two LED numbers/letters display and it then has a certain combo so you can look it up.

 

And saying the BIOS and POST are different things doesn't work like Windows and IE, the POST isn't a program its part of the BIOS, so a better analogy would be saying it's like Explorer.exe in Windows.

[Slamman]

Ok, Addendum then, if the computer gets to the text and manufacturer ID during boot then it is said to POST, so that's what I'm getting at.

 

In terms of two firmware within the PC/laptop, I'm of that mind basically because the POSTing or initial display is not related directly to BIOS, in my words, I mean they can't mean the same thing because they aren't CMOS entails the BIOS and RTC or Real Time Clock, where a battery is keeping memory active. I'm having issue with a locked BIOS on the Acer Aspire, having removed the RTC power source, I am still with an EEPROM style password retaining issue. I've effectively flashed and updated the BIOS too, if you've followed along on my postings about that.

Just covering one area of confusion, and I may have stated it incorrectly, but not entirely. Sorry for any confusion of course, I'm not trying to do that, it's just calling things wrong is a pet-peeve of mine.

 

Getting back to the keyboard, as we've veering off on BIOS, but one other note I feel, BIOS is the adjusting of the computer's boot up and motherboard capability, each mobo maker retools their BIOS as supplied from the makers of BIOS software, I believe the OEM has control over the POST, which would not be Phoenix, or other BIOS suppliers. But within BIOS' menu sections there is sometimes stored error messages one can "mark as read" or delete, and view, of course, any errors of mouse and keyboard are stored in there, errors as a result of memory increase or decrease are also duly noted there.

 

You execute a keyboard sequence to gain access to BIOS, obviously, w/o keyboard, you can't do it very effectively.

Hense the codes Joe mentioned, or LEDs, inside or outside and beeps on some boards.

Edited November 29, 2009 by Slamman

[Democrab]

No, you never gain access to the BIOS without ripping whats on the chip and opening it in something to edit HEX values, etc, the BIOS is code ONLY, the CMOS is what appears when you boot up or press Delete at start up, the POST is the thing BEFORE the bios even starts properly to make sure nothing gets fried by starting up when its unstable and the BIOS is the basic code that the hardware talks to, etc.

[leik oh em jeez!]

 

No, you never gain access to the BIOS without ripping whats on the chip and opening it in something to edit HEX values, etc, the BIOS is code ONLY, the CMOS is what appears when you boot up or press Delete at start up, the POST is the thing BEFORE the bios even starts properly to make sure nothing gets fried by starting up when its unstable and the BIOS is the basic code that the hardware talks to, etc.

The BIOS is the Basic Input/Output System, and needs to be running for either the "setup" or the POST. The CMOS (Complementary Metal-Oxide Semiconductor) is the the chip (hardware) the basic functions are stored and run on.

 

The "setup" screen is the stored (editable or not) settings for the BIOS, POST, and manufacturer's splash screen.

Edited November 29, 2009 by leik oh em jeez!

[Democrab]

No, you never gain access to the BIOS without ripping whats on the chip and opening it in something to edit HEX values, etc, the BIOS is code ONLY, the CMOS is what appears when you boot up or press Delete at start up, the POST is the thing BEFORE the bios even starts properly to make sure nothing gets fried by starting up when its unstable and the BIOS is the basic code that the hardware talks to, etc.

The BIOS is the Basic Input/Output System, and needs to be running for either the "setup" or the POST. The CMOS (Complementary Metal-Oxide Semiconductor) is the the chip (hardware) the basic functions are stored and run on.

 

The "setup" screen is the stored (editable or not) settings for the BIOS, POST, and manufacturer's splash screen.

There's more than one meaning to CMOS.

 

The BIOS is the code, POST is part of it and runs just before the BIOS' code actually starts, like how Windows tests everything as it starts.

[Wolf68k]

Good lord Slamman has done it again. Just by making one post, he has derailed yet another topic. Hell I've seen him do it in his own topics.

 

Shut up about what the hell BIOS, POST and CMOS are and aren't and get back to the topic at hand.

Which is/was someone asking why his keyboard didn't work at one point then basically after unplugging and plugging it back in it suddenly starts to work again. Anyone else remember that?

And the answer in the simplest of terms is: a glitch, it just happens. Maybe something hit the cable just right. But then again it could be the keyboard or cable with a physical problem and it needs to be replaced. Or it could be something wrong with the board itself. Whatever it is or isn't when it happens once or twice and it fixes itself, and be it a one time deal or the next time it happens is months from now; the answer there is a glitch. Nothing to worry about.

If it happens no matter what you do with THAT keyboard but not with another keyboard plugged into the same port; then the keyboard is at fault. If it happens no matter what keyboard you use in that same port, then it's a motherboard issue.

[Vasilyrud]

I'll try addressing all the posts...

 

What I mean by "checking how its plugged in", is that at first I just checked without plugging in/out. I tried pressing F1 to continue, it didn't. Then I restarted the computer, and the same error message appeared. I unplugged the keyboard, and plugged it back in. Pressed F1, doesn't continue.. [Oh, forgot, my keyboard is a PS/2 slot (the one in purple)] Then I plugged in the newer keyboard, and it worked fine. Then tried plugging in the older keyboard again, and it worked fine, too.

 

So the main question remains: why did the computer restart by itself?

 

Later, while using the computer, I noticed a process taking up most of the memory. It was a stub.exe, which occurred to by spyware/virus, after I checked it on the internet. (it later disappeared) I downloaded AVG, and made a scan in normal mode. Nothing found. I tried entering safe mode, but AVG didn't load in it. Later I deleted AVG, cause it took up almost 100% of my CPU. I also had to delete AVG on my newer computer, cause it did the same thing. (It worked fine before)

 

What free anti-virus would you recommend?

 

 

P.S.1: Yeah, its a pain in the ass to watch youtube videos.

P.S.2: I am now having problems with my newer computer. Should I make a new topic for those?

[Wolf68k]

Ok the reason the computer restarted by itself is because it got a BSOD (blue screen of death) but M$ has a setting that just makes it restart instead of letting you see it like in the pre-XP days.

 

So go to; Start->Control Panel->System->Advanced->Startup and Recovery->Settings

Uncheck - Automatically restart

Click OK until you're out and restart for the changes to take effect.

 

Next time you get a BSOD write down everything. Take a look at this pic http://i50.tinypic.com/fcqql0.jpg (I didn't want to inline the image because of it's size)

The areas in red you really need to write down. Sometimes you may or may not get the green area and that's ok.

Then come back, make a new topic, and let us know what the BSOD says.

 

 

//edit

Sorry forgot about the last part.

AVG sucks ever since version8. Try AntiVir. It's only downside, to me, is the nag screen that comes up once a day when it gets updates. Some people don't like that the free version doesn't check the emails as they come in, but then that's what you get for using Outlook.

 

Get Spybot and Ad-Aware (Google will help you there) and let them have a go at it.

Spybot is also good because it has an Immunize system that will block out most bad websites.

 

As for your new PC having an issue; since it's not related to the original topic I would create a new topic dealing with the new problem and since both old and new have what you seem to say is more or less the same problem then one topic for both should be fine.

Edited November 29, 2009 by Wolf68k

[Vasilyrud]

 

Sorry forgot about the last part.

AVG sucks ever since version8. Try AntiVir. It's only downside, to me, is the nag screen that comes up once a day when it gets updates. Some people don't like that the free version doesn't check the emails as they come in, but then that's what you get for using Outlook.

 

Get Spybot and Ad-Aware (Google will help you there) and let them have a go at it.

Spybot is also good because it has an Immunize system that will block out most bad websites.

Whooa!

So many AV programs will definitely quickly fill up my 512Mb of RAM.

 

Also, comparing Avast and Avira, can somebody experienced enough please introduce me with the cons and pros of both?

 

 

As for your new PC having an issue; since it's not related to the original topic I would create a new topic dealing with the new problem and since both old and new have what you seem to say is more or less the same problem then one topic for both should be fine.

The "new" PC's problem is unrelated to my old PC. Also, I posted the problem at theRandom Questions Topic. You can help me out there!

[Vasilyrud]

So go to; Start->Control Panel->System->Advanced->Startup and Recovery->Settings

Uncheck - Automatically restart

Click OK until you're out and restart for the changes to take effect.

 

 

Ok... This is strange... It is unchecked.

 

Now we're back at the start...

 

[Star-Lord]

 

So go to; Start->Control Panel->System->Advanced->Startup and Recovery->Settings

Uncheck - Automatically restart

Click OK until you're out and restart for the changes to take effect.

 

 

Ok... This is strange... It is unchecked.

 

Now we're back at the start...

 

See if you can find any boot up errors with the Event Viewer?

Click Start, and then click Control Panel. Click Performance and Maintenance, then click Administrative Tools, and then double-click Computer Management. Or, open the MMC containing the Event Viewer snap-in. In the console tree, click Event Viewer.

In the console tree, expand Event Viewer, and then click the log that contains the event that you want to view. In the details pane, double-click the event that you want to view.

 

The Event Properties dialog box containing header information and a description of the event is displayed.

To copy the details of the event, click the Copy button, then open a new document in the program in which you want to paste the event (for example, Microsoft Word up ), and then click Paste on the Edit menu. Post it here when done.

[SanAndreasManiac]

Approximate computer specs:

Intel Celeron

512 Mb memory "sticks"

75 Gb memory

Some GeForce 2 card

Yeah, its very old.

Oh, crap!! it's better than mine!!!