CharmingCharlie Posted October 16, 2009 Share Posted October 16, 2009 That's why it's hilarious that people are over-simplifying it by saying it's a loan because it's not. It may have loan-like properties but this isn't a guy going into a bank to start a business. This is a deal worked out by two corporate entities and all the people who seize on the word "loan" and act like the episodes will be available elsewhere when the "debts are settled" are in for a rude awakening. The only person over simplifying the deal here is you. Your version is Rockstar went cap in hand, handed over all rights to the DLC and Microsoft gave em 50 million for it. You couldn't get more damn simplistic than that. People bring up the timed exclusives on past GTA games and people try to act like $50 million isn't a huge sum of money for either party and people can't wrap their heads around the fact that Rockstar chose this deal rather than choosing to take their money but guess what? This deal is unprecedented and as such the broad strokes of the deal alone are enough to convince any unbiased and rational person that Microsoft has this content secured. Rockstar have a past history of screaming "exclusive" when their titles were timed exclusive. This is an IMPORTANT detail to remember especially when thinking about this deal. Rockstar have a history of doing timed exclusives but all of a sudden they decided to stop that and just make this deal with MS and give up all rights to their work....... I don't think so. This deal is a loan, that is why it has "loan like properties" because it was a loan. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
GuruAskew Posted October 16, 2009 Share Posted October 16, 2009 The only person over simplifying the deal here is you. Your version is Rockstar went cap in hand, handed over all rights to the DLC and Microsoft gave em 50 million for it. You couldn't get more damn simplistic than that. Your whole belief is based on two huge flaws: Your belief is based on the whole "loan" tangent which is not supported by any official source. If anything it's highly suspect because Michael f*cking Pachter is the one who first suggested it was a loan and he's worthless. Secondly, you can't see the forest for the trees. I object to over-simplification if the whole thing is based on rumor in the first place (again, the "loan" thing) but when I simplify things it's based on things we know. We KNOW that Microsoft gave Take-Two a huge amount of money and as such most of us KNOW that they didn't get some chump-change timed exclusive out of it. Look, I know you like to pretend that you're an "insider" to the point where you lied to me via Private Message about how you have access to terms of the deal due to your role as mod on an online message board* but face it, you're just manipulating the reality of the situation to create a fantasy in which you're gonna play the content on what you already own. That's the ultimate disadvantage PS3 and PC owners have in this debate. I have nothing to lose by the content being released on other consoles. At the very least I will have played both episodes months and months before PS3 and PC owners but it's not like they can take them away from me. PS3 and PC owners, however, have everything to gain by believing they'll get the content eventually and what you CAN'T deny is that gives one side a huge credibility problem. *the private messages in question: From CharmingCharlie: this is literally the most pathetic and saddest thing I've ever read online: Mod Note :- real classy posting private messages - cc My response: Do you want an honest answer? Cuz I don't think you do. You're getting it anyway. Not on any level do I think that, there's not even a little voice in the back of my head saying "well, maybe..." I absolutely do not believe for one second that you know any more about this deal than everyone else. To be honest I think you know less. So yeah, with CharmingCharlie you're dealing with a guy who lives in an absolute fantasy land. BUT HE HAS SUPER MOD POWERS! Mod Note :- the user was banned for 2 weeks (hey how about that for super mod powers) resorting to personal attacks and posting private messages from staff members is never an intelligent thing to do - cc Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
shinsta312 Posted October 16, 2009 Share Posted October 16, 2009 Guru, seriously...give it up. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Versityle Posted October 16, 2009 Share Posted October 16, 2009 Speaking objectively, I don't think that Grand Theft Auto was ever meant to be exclusive to anything. Out of the 14 games produced, only two are an exception to my theory for perfectly legitimate reasons. London 1961 - Back when the Playstation was still new, before Ps2 and when GTA was still primarily a PC targeted game which would later be ported to the Playstation, Dreamcast, GameCube and I think some handheld systems as well. This game however remained exclusive to the PC as an expansion much like The Lost and Damned and The Ballad of Gay Tony. But lets remember that GTA IV isn't (or not supposed to be) an Xbox targeted game. Plus I don't think the Playstation supported DLC's at the time. Grand Theft Auto Advanced - This was actually supposed to be a GBA version of GTA III, but because the machanics were so big they decided to make it it's own individual game where its story would take place a year before the events of Claude Speed in Old Liberty (I like to call it that). So being made soley for the purpose of a handheld GTA experience it's understandable that it wouldn't be ported to anything else. Any other GTA title that has been exclusive at one point or another had eventually turned up on another system: Grand Theft Auto GTA London 1969 GTA 2 GTA III GTA Vice City GTA San Andreas GTA Liberty City Stories GTA Vice City Stories GTA Chinatown Wars (I was sure surprised at this one because I thought the gameplay was specifically made for the DS' touch screen) _________________ <-(It wouldn't be strange to see at least Episodes from Liberty City on this list) In fact I think GTA IV is the only GTA game to come out simultaneously for two systems, but there's still the PC delay. The only thing that trumps my theory is this whole thing with the 50 mil that Microsoft coughed up, or the lack of currency that Sony didn't provide. Of course none of us can be too sure of this and you never know, Rockstar might find a way to bring it onto the other two systems. Just a note on the "Stories" games before someone brings it up. Many think that these two DLC's are a payback because these two games never came out for the original XBox. But here's my theory on it. - Xbox was still a new system at the time and wasn't really placed on the map like the much improved 360. This is probably no excuse but I thought I'd mention it anyway. - The stories were meant to bring GTA to the PsP, nothing wrong there, Xbox doesn't have a handheld system. - Because Ps2 and PsP share pretty much the same graphic engine it made perfect sense for those who don't own a PsP to bring it on the Ps2 and for those who wished to see it on the big screen. It was an easy port, in fact there were no changes made to it in LCS and very little change in VCS. To me it makes sense because it was an exclusive game to an exclusive Sony system. You can't say the same for the DLC's can you. For any Xbox owners at the time, if they REALLY wanted to play the stories they would just have to get a PsP, which is an overall better experience than the Ps2 version for its online play and of course is much better than having to get a whole other console in general. If the PsN didn't support DLC's or if Sony wasn't a huge marketer for GTA then this exclusivity would have made perfect sense. But there is nothing holding it back to coming on either PC or PS3 except for this deal with Microsoft. So like many have said, we're just gonna have to wait and see. ^ ^ ^ I never got any feedback when I wrote this, don't mean to be pushy but I really wanted to know if people agreed with me or not. When I look at all the other XBox 360 exclusives: Halo, Gears of War, Mass Effect, I just can't see any Grand Theft Auto game being part of that list it just doesn't seem right and not very Rockstar, despite any deal that was made. I think Rockstar is one game company (among others) that contributes to why the game industry is becoming so massively big and trumping the quality of Music, Movies and TV. It's game like GTA that does the job and I have high hopes for The Ballad, Red Dead Redemption, L.A. Noire, and Agent. Take-Two and Rockstar have always known how to say "no", they did when EA tried to buy them, or when a GTA movie was pitched. I can't vouch for all their decisions obviously but I trust Rockstar as a game company and I wouldn't think they're likely to sell out. They've done it with virtually every other GTA game, make it exclusive and bring it to more systems, and they would HAVE to do it this time seeing how the story is SO closely related the original game. It's not a prequel, it's not a sequel it's a DLC! It's half the experience of the game smack middle of the events of GTA IV! That would be my justification anyway. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
owl95 Posted October 16, 2009 Share Posted October 16, 2009 I am going to be totally honest with this (You can call me a fanboy, I really don't care as this is my very own opinion). You PS3 owners are whining too much. I mean, come on. You guys have two, TWO full-games from Rockstar announced exclusively for your platform, and you guys are freaking whining about two DLE's. Seriously, if I was a PS3 owner, I would be totally happy about Agent and LA Noire being exclusive. I really haven't seen this much whining about exclusives since Metal Gear Solid 4 came out. I mean, seriously. Let Rockstar do their thing. When Agent and LA Noire come out, I will be crying blood because they're exclusives. Then again, I might invade some forums and make some threads about Rockstar being totally unfair for not giving me and MILLIONS of Rockstar fans two games. (You know what I mean) Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Mainland Marauder Posted October 16, 2009 Share Posted October 16, 2009 I really haven't seen this much whining about exclusives since Metal Gear Solid 4 came out. Seriously. Things even out. So what if one company or the other strikes a deal for some exclusive DLC? Big whoop. Having come of age in the 16-bit era I can't remember so many people getting so butthurt over, say, Mario or Sonic or Final Fantasy being exclusive to one platform or the other. Then again, that was before everybody and their kid brother hung out on the Internet all day waving their fanboy flags. "You tell me exactly what you want, and I'll explain to you very carefully why it cannot be." Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
owl95 Posted October 16, 2009 Share Posted October 16, 2009 So what if one company or the other strikes a deal for some exclusive DLC? Big whoop. Exactly my point. Although I totally agree with PC gamers. They should get the DLEs. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
agincourtsalute Posted October 16, 2009 Share Posted October 16, 2009 So what if one company or the other strikes a deal for some exclusive DLC? Big whoop. Exactly my point. Although I totally agree with PC gamers. They should get the DLEs. Thats very fair of you, that you agree with PC gamers but what about PS3 gamers? I suppose they don't matter because they don't hand over their money to M$? Maybe you should explain your sympathy for PC gamers and not others. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Mainland Marauder Posted October 16, 2009 Share Posted October 16, 2009 Maybe you should explain your sympathy for PC gamers and not others. This is exactly what's wrong. People take it as a complete personal slight and a dire hardship that one thing might not be available on all consoles/platforms. For f*ck's sake it's just a video game. Now when you tell me you have incurable cancer or you were born with three heads and everyone looks at you funny, then it might be time to throw around words like "sympathy." Get over it, or if you really want to play it that much, get a 360 so you can play anything on either console. For disclosure purposes, I've never owned an XBox (original or 360), never even played a game on one until about a year ago and have been pretty much Sony all the way since the first PlayStation. Although I actually got a Sega Saturn first before a PSX. Where was my "sympathy" for that? "You tell me exactly what you want, and I'll explain to you very carefully why it cannot be." Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
agincourtsalute Posted October 16, 2009 Share Posted October 16, 2009 Maybe you should explain your sympathy for PC gamers and not others. This is exactly what's wrong. People take it as a complete personal slight and a dire hardship that one thing might not be available on all consoles/platforms. For f*ck's sake it's just a video game. Now when you tell me you have incurable cancer or you were born with three heads and everyone looks at you funny, then it might be time to throw around words like "sympathy." Get over it, or if you really want to play it that much, get a 360 so you can play anything on either console. For disclosure purposes, I've never owned an XBox (original or 360), never even played a game on one until about a year ago and have been pretty much Sony all the way since the first PlayStation. Although I actually got a Sega Saturn first before a PSX. Where was my "sympathy" for that? Yes its just a video game and I bought my PS3 thinking that the 360 DLC was probably a forever deal and if it is BOGT was the only episode that has got my attention anyway. But recently thought, that there was a good reason to doubt it. Not to mention the fact that this thread is filled with "people that personal slight and dire hardship that one thing might" "be available on other consoles/platforms". Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Mainland Marauder Posted October 16, 2009 Share Posted October 16, 2009 Not to mention the fact that this thread is filled with "people that personal slight and dire hardship that one thing might" "be available on other consoles/platforms". I know. That's why I posted that. Wasn't in any way directed at you solely. "You tell me exactly what you want, and I'll explain to you very carefully why it cannot be." Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
agincourtsalute Posted October 16, 2009 Share Posted October 16, 2009 Not to mention the fact that this thread is filled with "people that personal slight and dire hardship that one thing might" "be available on other consoles/platforms". I know. That's why I posted that. Wasn't in any way directed at you solely. lol I might have a problem with that. Its not the first time thats happened in the few days I've been back on GTAF, sorry about that. Mabye I'm paranoid Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Nightwing 0613 Posted October 17, 2009 Share Posted October 17, 2009 Back in the III area, they were at first classed as 'exclusive to the PS2.'We'll all just have to wait and see That's only because there was no other platform at that time. Xbox wasn't around yet and what were R* gonna do? release it on Nintendo? Use your head bro. It was exclusive to PS2 because there was no other console around other than Nintendo Gamecube. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
CharmingCharlie Posted October 17, 2009 Share Posted October 17, 2009 That's only because there was no other platform at that time. Xbox wasn't around yet and what were R* gonna do? release it on Nintendo? Use your head bro. It was exclusive to PS2 because there was no other console around other than Nintendo Gamecube. Erm the PC waves hello to you, the PC has been around a very long time and GTA 3 came to the PC. So it was a load of bull that GTA 3 was exclusive to the PS2 because 6/7 months later they brought it to the PC. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Mainland Marauder Posted October 17, 2009 Share Posted October 17, 2009 Back in the III area, they were at first classed as 'exclusive to the PS2.'We'll all just have to wait and see That's only because there was no other platform at that time. Xbox wasn't around yet and what were R* gonna do? release it on Nintendo? Use your head bro. It was exclusive to PS2 because there was no other console around other than Nintendo Gamecube. I don't remember legions of GameCube owners pissing their pants over it though. Also, the release date for the XBox in North America was November 15, 2001, just a month after GTA3. "You tell me exactly what you want, and I'll explain to you very carefully why it cannot be." Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Ash_735 Posted October 17, 2009 Share Posted October 17, 2009 Back in the III area, they were at first classed as 'exclusive to the PS2.'We'll all just have to wait and see That's only because there was no other platform at that time. Xbox wasn't around yet and what were R* gonna do? release it on Nintendo? Use your head bro. It was exclusive to PS2 because there was no other console around other than Nintendo Gamecube. Xbox and Gamecube came out around the same time just a few months apart. Still, I can't believe this silly argument is going on, you know what, we can all say Wait And See, and bring up past deals, but the thing is, here's the shocker for all you guys telling lies and false information, We don't actually know Jack sh*t, so this thread is beyond a joke, would you fanboys stop trying to make yourselves look smart by spouting these petty comments. We wait, if it comes, then yay, if not, then oh well, another platform contract held up, time to move on. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
kgrogfefji82 Posted October 17, 2009 Share Posted October 17, 2009 These episodes will never see the light of day on the ps3. Just face this people and you'll be a happier person.. It's not happening.. I'd personally think it'd be sweet if it did happen since I have a friend with a ps3 that really loves GTA IV.. But it won't happen Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
owl95 Posted October 17, 2009 Share Posted October 17, 2009 (edited) Maybe you should explain your sympathy for PC gamers and not others. Well, for one, I don't see PC gamers whining that much about the DLEs (At least not as much as the PS3 owners anyway). And that said, I wouldn't mind PC gamers getting the DLE's. There's no love from Rockstar for the PC this generation. And if the episodes are re-released on another platform, it's the PC, since Games for Windows is owned by Microsoft. And still, I really wouldn't mind if the content found it's way to the PS3. It's the whining that's really p*ssing me off. I never whined about any exclusive. I just let things flow. Edited October 17, 2009 by owl95 Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
WhiteRex Posted October 17, 2009 Share Posted October 17, 2009 Balld of gay tony on PC would be great, but I dont care much, GTA4 will be always fun. I think R* will get money, then later when they got money, will make PS3 and maybe PC, also I heard Lost and damned could be for PS3 and PC, is that true? Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Garfield 2 Posted October 17, 2009 Share Posted October 17, 2009 What if R* made a separate episode for PS3 owners? I would be definitely willing to pay for that! Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Slamman Posted October 17, 2009 Share Posted October 17, 2009 Sam Houser stated, as I keep refreshing your memory, that his idea was to support GTA4 after it's release for years, more then one, more then two? Not so sure, but Dan Houser commented on the finalizing of Episode 2, under MS contract, however, there is outcry, there will be disenchantment, it goes without saying. IF, and only if, Rockstar North opt to end all further exploration with just two episodes under Xb360. I think too much has been made of MS's involvement, and what RN's evolving stance is, that is where we must focus via any information they put forth. Like a musician or sports personality saying they'll retire, then decide not to, well, we all know a few of them!! Rockstar is an ever evolving entity and they challenge the conventions of gaming, so I don't think they'll be closing doors on what ideas they had to exploit Liberty City, that does not mean drawing all development to GTA4 exclusively versus another new GTA, however, I suspect they'd needed added staff for such workloads Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
PretendWereDead Posted October 17, 2009 Share Posted October 17, 2009 What if R* made a separate episode for PS3 owners? I would be definitely willing to pay for that! Looking at other Xbox exclusives that were ported to the PS3, that's is exactly what is going to happen (in my opinion). Sony won't accept just a copy of the DLC/Episodes from Liberty City for the PS3 but will force R* to put in (lot's of) extra stuff or hopefully even new episodes. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Slamman Posted October 17, 2009 Share Posted October 17, 2009 Sony is not that gung ho, on a flip of the coin, stop/reverse. I doubt they just became as fanatical about GTA as we have. GTA has been good for Sony during the PS2 years, it sold heaps for longer then most games. However, Sony I feel got stifled or bored with looking at GTA as their ace in the hole. They had pressing issues within their own software and Network development. At least from what we did hear them talk about, that's the vibe and story they were putting out. Rockstar can choose to put forth something unique to PS3, and basically did that, eschewing the GTA4 guise. We can't ultimately say what they WILL do for PS3 and GTA right now, it's still a long road out Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Leo Colt Posted October 17, 2009 Share Posted October 17, 2009 What if R* made a separate episode for PS3 owners? I would be definitely willing to pay for that! No chance in hell of that happening, unless Sony coughs up the dough. And seeing as Rockstar want to move on to something else now, Sony would have to offer a pretty hefty incentive for them to come back to work on GTA IV again. I seriously doubt this will ever happen. Maybe they'll try to get their foot in the door for the next game. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Atiba420 Posted October 17, 2009 Share Posted October 17, 2009 Stop being cheap, buy a 360 instead of posting here for years to come. YOU CAN WAIT FOR SONY TO PAY 50 MILLION OR YOU CAN PAY 250 BUCKS. WHICH HAS A BETTER CHANCE OF HAPPENING FIRST? HMMMMM I WONDER................... Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
CookPassBabtridge Posted October 17, 2009 Share Posted October 17, 2009 ^ Those are the basic options, however there is a recession on. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
buffalosoulj4h20 Posted October 17, 2009 Share Posted October 17, 2009 They can get a job, most of them are living under parent's roof, hell even Slamman who last said that he wasn't employed got an xbox or two USED! I came out of a group home in NY and got a job. Mow a lawn, sell your things, sell yourself for f*cks sake. If you live in the suburbs especially there shouldn't really be a problem. Recession is sometimes an excuse of not having a job now-a-days. I agree that this thread should be open for speculation, but there shouldn't be a problem to buy an xbox unless you have a lazy cheap fanboy problem. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
CookPassBabtridge Posted October 17, 2009 Share Posted October 17, 2009 ^ Its not some global need that everyone blows 250 on a console just to play two DLCs, thats not the real world. And recession is the very reason why people dont have jobs, nevermind an excuse. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
buffalosoulj4h20 Posted October 17, 2009 Share Posted October 17, 2009 Like I said, it can be done by getting a fast food job and/or selling your things. If you do not want to do that then I don't see why you are complaining. I know the recession is part of the problem why people do not have jobs, duh, but the majority of people on the forums being underage and living under mommy's roof, it's easy to save up when you don't have to pay the rent. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
CookPassBabtridge Posted October 17, 2009 Share Posted October 17, 2009 Im already fixed up with an Xbox etc, what im 'complaining about' is this attitude of people being told to go buy a new console. Theres countless circumstances why people arent able to, but the biggest is basically why should they? If it wasnt for these tit-for-tat exclusivity deals, people would pay their 40 notes and have the same content from the start. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
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