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Breaking Bohan

Universal Healthcare

Recommended Posts

spaceeinstein

If another person's technique works better than yours, is it good to copy it or at least learn something from it? I thought the heathcare system in other countries is proven to be more effective than America's system. As the days pass by, I'm getting less optimistic about this option. More people aren't supporting this.

Edited by spaceeinstein

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Mike Tequeli
If another person's technique works better than yours, is it good to copy it or at least learn something from it? I thought the heathcare system in other countries is proven to be more effective than America's system. As the days pass by, I'm getting less optimistic about this option. More people aren't supporting this.

But what country are you going to emulate? According to the WHO Canada and Britain aren't much better then the US with their single payer health care. The best systems we've seen so far are those with a somewhat deregulated private health market payed in part by the government.

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Clem Fandango
So IS the opposition to Obamacare exclusively based on a despair that healthcare for the middle and upper-classes would be included? Then, may I welcome you to Australia. You earn over this amount (a trifle), you MUST pay for private health insurance or get double-taxed an already-compulsory medicare levy used to subsidise healthcare. So, the operation itself will be mostly paid for by medicare, but your care will come out of insurance (kinda... it's more complex than that). While it's not perfect, it aims to strike a fairer balance between the needs of the poorer and the rest of us.

I'll just stop you right here: I live in Australia, and everyone I know is covered by the government. Most people I know can afford it easily. I'm refering only to people earning very low sums of money, people who can't pay for it themselves.

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aragond

 

I'll just stop you right here: I live in Australia

Well stop having the Gadsden flag as your flag! sigh.gif

 

 

and everyone I know is covered by the government.

By Medicare, yes, but you MUST have private insurance if you earn over blah-blah dollars or you get hit with a double-hit of the medicare surcharge.

 

 

Most people I know can afford it easily.

Afford what? Medicare? Or private insurance?

Of course everyone can afford medicare, it's just another percent-n-half tax.

Afford Insurance, yeah, the threshhold is designed to make the additional medicare levy roughly the same as the insurance costs based on the lowest limits. So, pay the medicare levy or pay the insurance, either way, it's the same. I guess that's one way of making it affordable.

 

 

I'm refering only to people earning very low sums of money, people who can't pay for it themselves.

Alright, so your objection is why should Obamacare cover those people who can afford health insurance? Right?

Well, my understanding -- and there are, like, six bills floating about -- is that it wouldn't, but it is one option.

 

BUT, remember, the reforms are not just about putting the poor into a scheme, it's about regulating the insurance companies. In Oz, health insurers cannot kick you out. They HAVE to wear the cost of you becoming a liability. If you can afford their premiums, they MUST cover your $90,000 cancer treatment bill according to their coverage rules and after Medicare covers the first $65,000. In the US, that is not currently the case.

 

Secondly, in the US, most people get their insurance through their employer, but a lot of small employers cannot afford it no more since premiums -- afaik -- have been skyrocketing into unaffordability land (next point). Which means a lot of middle-class people have no insurance, especially if they've recently lost their jobs.

 

Finally, affordability. If, afaik, insurance premiums have been skyward rocketing, in Oz, the costs are regulated. The insurers go begging to the government to increase premiums. Premiums are typically $1-2,000. (I have no idea about in the US, but I hear tell of twice or more than that.) Remember, when medicare here pays the first chunk of the cost, that means the insurance firms don't hafta, which means premiums are much lower.

 

In summary, the middle-class here are a LOT better off than those in the US, in some respects, particularly when it comes to health insurance. And that's our medicare and govt regulation doing its job. But, fine, kick the middle and upper classes out of Obamacare. I won't object if there's still regulation.

 

My 10c. My 2c is free.

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Mike Tequeli

It isn't a matter of regulation, I think the Australian system is alright, much better then anything here. But regulation isn't what makes it great, naturally more regulation would eventually just mean single payer nationalized like the NHS and I'm willing to guess you like your medicare more then you'd like the NHS. Regulation is part of the problem in America, it is very hard to get a good private policy because the private companies run like monopolies. You have one or two health care providers per state and if I remember correctly you cannot easily buy coverage across state lines. The government and this current bill are just going to prop up these companies and the employer policy further, a fully free market health care system would allow people to purchase a policy they like and not use their employer system. As for what to do with the underclass, maybe vouchers to get affordable insurance with all the money you could save cutting billions from medicaid and medicare and using that system instead.

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