carlweathersarm Posted February 9, 2009 Share Posted February 9, 2009 TV and Movies are a different medium than videogames. The SAG (Screen Actors Guild) was created to help actors get royalties for previous works because their performances were detrimental to the sale of the movies and shows. Actors and actresses are solely what drives the industry and without them movies and TV as we know them would not be possible. I buy movies because they have certain actors or actresses in them and I know their performances will be compelling. That's why I feel it's fair that they get royalties for each ticket or movie sold. Videogames on the other hand had existed without actors for years. The first professional actor I can remember in a videogame is David Hayter from Metal Gear Solid. People play videogames because of the work of programmers not actors. I have never bought a videogame because it has an actor or actress in it, I probably never will. I buy them because of the programmers hard work to make a solid product. In that respect, why should an actor get royalties for something that will sell the same regardless of who is playing the character. Nobody bought GTA4 because the main character was played by Hollick. If something like the SAG is created for the videogame industry then every actor and actress in the game would get royalties from it. With a game like GTA that has as many actors and actresses in it then something would have to give. Either the price of games would go up even more, the number of actors and actresses would have to be reduced, or the number of programmers would be reduced which would result in a less polished game. The bottom line is that actors and actresses are supplimental to the videogame industry but they do not drive it the way they do in TV and movies. It's a great launching pad for unknown actors and actresses that are struggling getting their foot in the door at Hollywood and need money to pay the rent. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
chngdman Posted February 9, 2009 Share Posted February 9, 2009 I agree to an extent, dude, really good points you make there. The gaming industry, we all should note, is more like the music industry than movies or TV. That taken into account, it is totally normal for people to do guitar work on a CD, get paid $150.00 for the riff, and get told to take a hike when it goes platinum - it was in a contract, both parties agreed upon it, the man got paid, his guitar riff does not belong to him. Just the same as Niko Bellic does not belong to Mike Hollick - he was just commissioned for the job, and then he complained. The messed up part is that if he wasn't a prick about it, he probably would have received all kinds of extras from Rockstar. Instead, he put himself on blast thinking, perhaps, that the controversy would help him out - big mistake. His contract allowed him one lump sum. He's entitled to nothing more except any shame he warrants with this behavior. This was a long time ago too, I could have sworn.. .I mean, didn't I read him complaining online months ago? Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Slamman Posted February 9, 2009 Share Posted February 9, 2009 Who is voicing Johnny Klebitz ? Do you think he will act the same as Hollick ?I wonder how much the guy who voiced CJ in San Andreas (or even Tommy in Vice City) was paid and how he haves reacted, in comparaison. I guess the guy who voiced Claude in GTA III didn't get any money from his work, ho ho. I hope the career of Hollick is not dead after that, because he is a pretty talented actor, after all. I agree with the poster above : "Until conditions for actors in video games improve, it is impossible to expect Rockstar to give him more money than they feel they have to." Haha, actually, this was exactly what happened with Ray Liotta after Vice City came out. OT: Inconcievable! Only difference is Ray is awesome and they should have paid him a little more. But wasn't Ray Liotta actualy paid that extra cash? I mean R* complained that Ray Liotta kept wanting more money, so didn't R* inevitably pay him up since Ray finally did the voice for Tommy? As I recollect Sam Houser "whined" about that, he was soured by the experience, whatever the outcome, however, here we see the same scenario with an actor who is relatively unknown,... I missed anything he did on TV! hahaha Either way, games DO benefit from the voice talant and I feel even with big name stars. DAMMIT, get Burt Reynolds back in the game! He'll do it for scale! hahaha With regard to him knowing the popularity, as I said in my post, I don't feel he did know the level GTA has with recognition and success in the game-world. One need just look at Iggy Pop's comments posted here, or 'comedian' Ricky Garvais. Did they know this was a major franchise? Hell no! haha If one was following the economic news (with anxiety rising!!) You may have heard that Games sales in 08/09 at the time, for the latter half of the year (IIRC) surpassed DVD sales. This in a slowing economy also happened for the first time in history... it was a surprise to me, but shifts attention in the industry to issues such as this. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
mr_bungle Posted February 9, 2009 Share Posted February 9, 2009 f*ck YOU ROCKSTAR STUPID GREEDY MOTHER f*ckERS that just proves they just want money Quite the opposite. Its prooves Hollick just wants money. Don't you listen? Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Magic_Al Posted February 9, 2009 Share Posted February 9, 2009 In a production there are people who get paid a set amount no matter whether the product is a hit or a bomb, and then there are people who get to ride on the success of a hit. What should determine who gets to be one of the people who gets a percentage? It seems like if you want better than average work you need to promise a better than average reward. Acting will get more important as games get more detailed. Games used to have no acting, then they had voices, then body capture, now facial capture. The actor is definitely getting more involved. How far off is it, that there might be live actors performing in an MMO, with live motion and facial capture, so you get an interactive live performance between major story characters and players? Far-fetched? Maybe, maybe not. I'm not going to dismiss what actors do now because they're probably going to be doing a lot more. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Mafioso86 Posted February 9, 2009 Share Posted February 9, 2009 ehh.... I'm sure he signed a contract or something agreeing to it, so I don't feel to much sympathy. Funny tho how this is like the same thing that happened with Ray Liotta. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
junkpile Posted February 9, 2009 Share Posted February 9, 2009 http://videogames.yahoo.com/events/playbac...back-31/1287413 Unbelievable! why unbelieveable? i think 100,000 dollars are really okay. he says he doesn't blame rockstar, but his management, well, then he should change it. even though he says he isn't mad at rockstar, but makes this turmoil, talking to newspapers and it happens to be somehow bad news for rockstar. i understand why they say "hell no." his voice really fitted niko, but i think he isn't that unique and also replaceable. look at scarface, they found someone sounding quite similar. (if not, they put claude back in the scene and won't have to pay for a protagonist-voice-actor ) Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Gta Guy 108 Posted February 9, 2009 Share Posted February 9, 2009 considering how much the game made, what hollick got was nothing, i think he deserved to get a little bit more than what he did. I agree. Niko is my favorite character from the gta series, and I really like Michael and I think he really should get more than what he got. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
UrbanTheEmcee Posted February 9, 2009 Share Posted February 9, 2009 I don't feel like he should get royalties, but I do think the price up front should be higher. ($250k) I mean $250k compared to R*s gross profit on this game is very reasonable, and very respectable. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Moss27 Posted February 9, 2009 Share Posted February 9, 2009 I don't really get what is happening. Don't you think that a company like Rockstar would have made it mandatory for Hollick to come back and record new lines for the DLC if it was necessary? Weren't the scripts/stories for the DLC written at the same time as GTA IV? Maybe they had no intention of bringing Niko back in the first place. They signed him, and got what they needed from him. He has an issue with the union. Not with Rockstar. If they felt that they would need him for the DLC packs, these guys would have ensure that he'd be doing it. Rockstar isn't some 3rd rate company. They knew they were doing DLC. If they needed him and didn't have a clause in his contract to do it, I'd be shocked. Think about it though...he likely plays a very minor role in LAD, and probably the same in the 2nd DLC. They may not even need his voice for the 3-5 cutscenes that he would be a part of. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Royal55 Posted February 10, 2009 Share Posted February 10, 2009 Posted this same thing a few weeks back. here Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Slamman Posted February 10, 2009 Share Posted February 10, 2009 You forget, perhaps, Rockstar shunned signing big name talant, cost and Ray Liotta's attitude made Sam Houser regret the idea, and back away from it. He stated with GTA4 in this regard, the idea was to get no-name people so the attention was squarely focused on the game story. I feel he's wrong about this, but that's what he's said in the press. I also think with the success of Niko, and his wonderful performance (Michael Hollick), that they should consider him returning. If the fame comes about from the game, it's not out of the question to still have these issues to deal with. Looking at film for a clear example of how this hurts the product... Recall Back To The Future? The sequels were started up during production of the last movie...not unlike the Lord of the Rings films. In the case of getting the idea going, the actors were all asked to reprise their roles. After the success of the original, sadly, Crispin Glover, ever the out-sider, demanded that he make as much money as Michael J. Fox. This did not sit well, and still is a sore point I believe, to the producers this day. He got the idea that his level of acting and importance was on par. Surely it's important in a sequel context I feel. But the producers can't be paying whatever the actors want...it has to be within budget and everything balanced out among all the things that are costly in the production. In other words, someone demanding a large fee is hurting other expense areas of the thing being worked on. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Wanted Assailant Posted February 10, 2009 Share Posted February 10, 2009 Hollick was perfect with his work with Niko. No too mention the handfuls of alternative dialogue in the game of 92 missions that are worth hearing. 100K is a bit lower than something capable. I guess we're done with Niko's story, no cameo like Claude in GTAneXts. But eh, shouldn't of bitched and he would of gotten the extra he wanted. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Slamman Posted February 11, 2009 Share Posted February 11, 2009 ^ You should edit all those typos, dude (don't forget "too"^) I had in mind that any additional downloads exploiting LC would not be with Niko in the picture but the other cast of characters, along with new ones, so far that looks about on the money I'd say. I do think they will break away from LC and GTA4 to make a Fifth one. I think they are happy with the formula and it's got a rather wide fan base. GTA ain't goin' no where....so to speak. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Slamman Posted February 14, 2009 Share Posted February 14, 2009 (edited) Bumping... ....this ^ In happier times...months ago! I added that shot of Michael standing at the foot of the famed NYC bridge in LC/GTA4 to my photos on PhotoBucket, and I'll link that here. Any updates should be added in this thread so don't lock it, mods! Edited February 14, 2009 by Slamman Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Magic_Al Posted February 14, 2009 Share Posted February 14, 2009 Michael Hollick brought a lot of attention to the business of video game acting. Hollick didn't talk to some gaming website, he talked to the New York Times, the same place superpowers go to sell their next war. The people who get the money don't want a lot of pressure to share, and that was a lot of pressure. I wonder how Rockstar will deal with the lead actor of the next major GTA. The professional actors who starred in VC and IV both did great work, but both ended up making noise about money. Rockstar can't count on making a lucky discovery like they did for the lead role of SA, they need to expect they'll need professional actors again. There will be a showdown between actors unions and the videogame industry. Actors can make a good case that, if you want professionals who are well trained and well prepared, they have to be able to make a comfortable, full-time living from acting, as long as audiences want to pay to see it. Technology has become a labor-reducer in acting, as it has in other industries. For centuries you couldn't see acting without a live actor before your eyes. With technology, performances can be recorded once, then replayed to many audiences with no more work from the actor. Movie actors still do a lot of repetition so each scene can be filmed from different angles. That work is eliminated with facial scanning and motion-capture animation because one 3D recording can be rendered from any viewpoint. So is it like replacing factory workers with robots? Should actors be paid by the hour without any adjustment for repetition-eliminating technology? We shouldn't want actors to quit and earn livings elsewhere if we want acting expertise. If a theater producer respects what a live actor does each night, a game producer should respect the actor's part in each sale of a recording. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
sputz mcenzie Posted February 19, 2009 Share Posted February 19, 2009 how did they make the dlc Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
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