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gamesguru

The Grain Filter In Action!

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gamesguru

I was just watching the debut trailer again over on the new L&D website. The videos being as detailed as they are, a first play through is quite choppy on my computer, so it gave me time to analyse the trailer. As some of you may know, recent previews have revealed that a grain effect is used in the DLC (R* have yet to decide if it stays in). Well, there is one shot in the trailer that clearly shows this of:

 

user posted image

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kieranxp5

Good find man

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gamesguru

The same shot is near the start of Billy's trailer on the L&D website, but this time it seems the filter has been taken off (pic coming).

 

EDIT:

user posted image

There are obvious differences when comparing the two shots next to each other.

Edited by gamesguru

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kieranxp5

Cool, good update on this.

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.:Alex:.

I wonder if it's a toggable option?

 

It certainly adds something to the atmosphere and theme of the episode. I don't think it will be as annoying as people suggest, unless of course it's a much stronger effect than what we have seen suggests.

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gamesguru

I found another two more with it in (in fact I think most, if not all, of the first trailer is shot with the filter on):

user posted image

user posted image

 

EDIT: Yes, the whole trailer has the filter, but the intensity of it varies.

EDIT 2: The same applies for the Billy and Malc trailers.

 

Edited by gamesguru

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Magic_Al

I hope it can be toggled. Something you're interacting with in real time shouldn't look like it's shot on analog film. There's no such thing as "live" film, obviously. Makes no sense.

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AnotherDave

In a way it makes sense. R* have intentionally gone for a cinematic feel to the game, maybe they think that bringing out the filmic quality of The Lost and Damned takes preference to whatever you would call the realism/interaction quality.

 

I should imagine it'll be toggleable but if R* are determined that's how this story should be told then it'll probably be fixed.

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Magic_Al

The thing about film grain is that psychologically it detaches you from what you're seeing. It's a visual cue that tells your brain that what you're seeing happened in the past. Photographic film has to be developed and printed before you can see the recorded images. Anything on motion picture film must be at least hours old. Film as an entire medium is also increasingly old-fashioned looking in a digital world.

 

By making live simulation look like film, what is Rockstar trying to make the player feel and does it make sense? Film grain is emotionally contradictory with the sense of immersion and immediacy most games try for. If Rockstar wants the player to feel detached from the images, then film grain helps with that. If it's just an affectation of "cinematic style" then maybe they should rethink it.

 

I suppose it's possible the film grain is not an addition, but actually a replacement for the "paint" effect in GTA IV. Rockstar needs something to blur the image so you can't see the seam where near-detail transitions to far-detail. In that case I may be overthinking the artistic intent.

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AnotherDave

Don't get me wrong, if the film grain effect is in the game I want to be able to turn it off. Personally I think it's not the best choice, but Rockstar do sometimes make some peculiar choices. I would imagine, if they chose to use the effect and not let the player turn it off, they will have a reason beyond the superficial. Whether that is covering the cracks in the technology-limited graphical shortcomings of the game or not I don't know.

 

It's possible that you (and to an extent, I) are overthinking the artistic intent but it seems, to me at least, that this is something Rockstar are much more concious of at this stage in the series. I would guess that whatever choice they make has some serious thought behind it, even if it is peculiar choice.

 

As far as immersion and immediacy go, immersion is vitally important to a game for obvious reasons but I can see the merits of going in a direction that doesn't feel quite so in the present. I don't think that would be the right thing to do here though. As the timelines of both storylines run parallel, giving the impression of them taking place at a different time, no matter how implicit, doesn't seem to fit.

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Shaunr

Holy crap. the filter sucks. why would rockstar even consider having that in the game?

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JOSEPH X
Holy crap. the filter sucks. why would rockstar even consider having that in the game?

To refresh the stale air in the clubhouse, I would think.

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gamesguru

 

Holy crap. the filter sucks. why would rockstar even consider having that in the game?

Yet, your reaction points me to believe you've just realised that it's even there. I'd say that was quite the overreaction, and that the filter would hardly ruin the gaming experience nor the graphics (seeing as you didn't notice it in the first place).

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Shaunr
The thing about film grain is that psychologically it detaches you from what you're seeing. It's a visual cue that tells your brain that what you're seeing happened in the past. Photographic film has to be developed and printed before you can see the recorded images. Anything on motion picture film must be at least hours old. Film as an entire medium is also increasingly old-fashioned looking in a digital world.

 

By making live simulation look like film, what is Rockstar trying to make the player feel and does it make sense? Film grain is emotionally contradictory with the sense of immersion and immediacy most games try for. If Rockstar wants the player to feel detached from the images, then film grain helps with that. If it's just an affectation of "cinematic style" then maybe they should rethink it.

 

I suppose it's possible the film grain is not an addition, but actually a replacement for the "paint" effect in GTA IV. Rockstar needs something to blur the image so you can't see the seam where near-detail transitions to far-detail. In that case I may be overthinking the artistic intent.

oh. well when you put it that way.

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FiendishDog

I personally don't like the filter. I mean why bother making such detailed characters and environments if your going to blur it out with a filter.

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[GTA Man]cycon77foamy[GTA Man]

The grainy filter ON TOP OF THE oil painting filter!

 

JOY! confused.gif

 

 

*goes off to buy some glasses*

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Nitty Don

If it is only in cut scenes and not game play it shouldn't effect us too much, maybe the effect was added to try and make us feel as though we were looking at past events after completing Niko's story confused.gif

Edited by Nitty Don

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OysterBarron
Holy crap. the filter sucks. why would rockstar even consider having that in the game?

Yet, your reaction points me to believe you've just realised that it's even there. I'd say that was quite the overreaction, and that the filter would hardly ruin the gaming experience nor the graphics (seeing as you didn't notice it in the first place).

i see you played mass effect for a couple of hours, the filter effect in that sucks ass like i have said before when it was first mentioned in reviews, it was that bad i thought My bulb in my LG DLP projection TV was just on its way out i was glad to be able to turn it off.

 

This isnt a film its a game and games this year have managed to become the best selling medium. They do not need to immitate films to be succesful.

 

whats the point in console manufactures giving these developers powerfulish hardware only to cover there pin stripe models and textures up with a sh*ty filter.

 

Actually i would prefer to view the LAD on a black and white TV rather than play it using this filter.

 

Rockstar you better make the togglable.

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KGBeast

People are kinda overreacting about this. North used a grain/ static filter in Manhunt, and it did nothing but add to the ambiance and environment of the game. I'm sure they've used it amazingly here as well.

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OysterBarron

all im saying is that it needs to be sorted so it can be on or off, i hate all filters that just get pasted over a perfectly good image, GTAIV's filter effect pissed me off a bit but it wasnt that noticable because it only affected the Distant views and not whats right infront of you.

 

the new filter will affect everything including vivid colors.

 

 

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gamesguru

 

i see you played mass effect for a couple of hours, the filter effect in that sucks ass like i have said before when it was first mentioned in reviews, it was that bad i thought My bulb in my LG DLP projection TV was just on its way out i was glad to be able to turn it off.

A bit off-topic, but yeah I had Mass Effect, I didn't like the game; not really into RPGs (hence why it's only a 'couple' of hours). But I didn't really notice the grain effect to the point that it bugged me. Yeah, I knew it was there, but only after a while.

 

^What about the filter in my sig?

Oh, and you're a stalker too tounge2.gif .

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OysterBarron
i see you played mass effect for a couple of hours, the filter effect in that sucks ass like i have said before when it was first mentioned in reviews, it was that bad i thought My bulb in my LG DLP projection TV was just on its way out i was glad to be able to turn it off.

A bit off-topic, but yeah I had Mass Effect, I didn't like the game; not really into RPGs (hence why it's only a 'couple' of hours). But I didn't really notice the grain effect to the point that it bugged me. Yeah, I knew it was there, but only after a while.

 

^What about the filter in my sig?

Oh, and you're a stalker too tounge2.gif .

as you can probably tell its the first thing i noticed and i hated it.

 

Dont get me started on the filter in your sig, or il have to find my noose.

 

im stalking you lol (just saved myself a question if i compared achivements)

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AnotherDave

I can see your point oysterbarron, I'd like to be able to toggle it if the filter ends up in the final release, but I didn't mind it in Mass Effect. I don't really think it added anything to the game though. As long as TL&D's filter is less severe than ME's then I won't mind it too much.

 

Guru's sig on the other hand... Well, I'm a graphic designer so, uh, you can probably guess what I think... can I borrow that noose when your done with it?

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WillE

I don't think it will be that big of a deal, but after comparing I think I would rather not have the grain filter.

 

Should be left up to the player (on/off option)

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