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agent17

Georgia attacks South Ossetia

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Hart

Just chill... war is just politics employing disposable heroes...

 

 

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TFatseas

 

If Georgia has no airpower to defend themselves I'm guessing that they're in for a real pounding, no?

 

Georgia has a still operating Airforce, and plenty of SAM's.

 

 

Just reported on NBC:  Georgia to now withdraw 1000 troops from Iraq to fight at home!  The coalition is falling apart!

 

Ok then Chicken Little.

 

http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/The_Sky_Is_Falling_

 

And anyways, Georgia has 2000 in Iraq.

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poopskin

Call leisure suit larry! he'll stop dr. nonookee!

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Saggy

I read a couple of weeks ago as trouble was developing between Russia and Georgia, that Bush promised financial aid to Georgia if conflict should arise. I wonder if it will escelate past that, if it even makes it to that point. Why hasn't there been any news on that? Is the whole world busy with the Olympics or something?

 

 

Anyway, does anybody have any articles from independent news sources? CNN likes to report it as if Russia was the instagator, and I can't help but get the feeling I'm getting less than genuine reporting because Georgia is an American ally.

 

 

 

Oh, and this is not going to start WW3, because WW1 and WW2 never really stopped, just for certain countries. I seriously doubt that anybody is going to reflect upon the military conflict in the world today as "WW3", but think about what defined the last two, and think about the world today... What's the real difference? If this is going to be considered WW3, it probably won't be so until it's in the history books.

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TFatseas

 

Anyway, does anybody have any articles from independent news sources?  CNN likes to report it as if Russia was the instagator, and I can't help but get the feeling I'm getting less than genuine reporting because Georgia is an American ally.

 

 

AP good enough?

 

Link

 

 

Georgia says Russian aircraft bombed its air bases

 

By MUSA SADULAYEV – 34 minutes ago

 

DZHAVA, Georgia (AP) — Russia sent columns of tanks and reportedly bombed Georgian air bases Friday after Georgia launched a major military offensive Friday to retake the breakaway province of South Ossetia, threatening to ignite a broader conflict.

 

Hundreds of civilians were reported dead in the worst outbreak of hostilities since the province won defacto independence in a war against Georgia that ended in 1992. Witnesses said the South Ossetian capital of Tskhinvali was devastated.

 

"I saw bodies lying on the streets, around ruined buildings, in cars," said Lyudmila Ostayeva, 50, who had fled with her family to Dzhava, a village near the border with Russia. "It's impossible to count them now. There is hardly a single building left undamaged."

 

The fighting broke out as much of the world's attention was focused on the start of the Olympic Games and many leaders, including Russia's Prime Minister Vladimir Putin and President Bush, were in Beijing.

 

The timing suggests Georgian President Mikhail Saakashvili may have been counting on surprise to fulfill his longtime pledge to wrest back control of South Ossetia — a key to his hold on power.

 

Saakashvili agreed the timing was not coincidental, but accused Russia of being the aggressor. "Most decision makers have gone for the holidays," he said in an interview with CNN. "Brilliant moment to attack a small country."

 

The United States was sending an envoy to the region on Friday to meet with the parties involved to try to end hostilities.

 

"We support Georgia's territorial integrity," State Department spokesman Gonzalo Gallegos told reporters. "We are working on mediation efforts to secure a cease-fire."

 

South Ossetian separatist leader Eduard Kokoity claimed hundreds of civilians had been killed.

 

Ten Russian peacekeepers were killed and 30 wounded when their barracks were hit in Georgian shelling, said Russian Ground Forces spokesman Col. Igor Konashenkov. Russia has soldiers in South Ossetia as peacekeeping forces but Georgia alleges they back the separatists.

 

Georgia, which borders the Black Sea between Turkey and Russia, was ruled by Moscow for most of the two centuries preceding the breakup of the Soviet Union. Georgia, a staunch U.S. ally, has angered Russia by seeking NATO membership — a bid Moscow regards as part of a Western effort to weaken its influence in the region.

 

Speaking earlier on Georgian television, Saakashvili accused Russia of sending aircraft to bomb Georgian territory, which Russia denied.

 

Russia's Defense Ministry said it was sending reinforcements for its peacekeepers, and Russian state television and Georgian officials reported a convoy of tanks had crossed the border. The convoy was expected to reach the provincial capital, Tskhinvali, by evening, Channel One television said.

 

Georgian State Minister for Reintegration Temur Yakobashvili said government troops were now in full control of the city.

 

"We are facing Russian aggression," said Georgia's Security Council chief Kakha Lomaya. "They have sent in their troops and weapons and they are bombing our towns."

 

Putin has warned that the Georgian attack will draw retaliation and the Defense Ministry pledged to protect South Ossetians, most of whom have Russian citizenship.

 

Chairing a session of his Security Council in the Kremlin, Russian President Dmitry Medvedev also vowed that Moscow will protect Russian citizens.

 

"In accordance with the constitution and federal law, I, as president of Russia, am obliged to protect lives and dignity of Russian citizens wherever they are located," Medvedev said, according to Russian news reports. "We won't allow the death of our compatriots go unpunished."

 

An AP reporter saw tanks and other heavy weapons concentrating on the Russian side of the border with South Ossetia — supporting the Russian TV reports of an incursion. Some villagers were fleeing into Russia.

 

"I saw them (the Georgians) shelling my village," said Maria, who gave only her first name. She said she and other villagers spent the night in a field and then fled toward the Russian border as the fighting escalated.

 

Yakobashvili said Georgian forces have shot down four Russian combat planes over Georgian territory. He gave no details. Russia's Defense Ministry denied an earlier Georgia report about one Russian plane downed and has had no immediate comment on the latest claim.

 

Yakobashvili said that one Russian plane had dropped a bomb on the Vaziani military base near the Georgian capital, but no one was hurt.

 

More than 1,000 U.S. Marines and soldiers were at the base last month to teach combat skills to Georgian troops. Georgia has about 2,000 troops in Iraq, making it the third-largest contributor to coalition forces after the U.S. and Britain.

 

South Ossetia officials said Georgia attacked with aircraft, armor and heavy artillery. Georgian troops fired missiles at Tskhinvali, an official said, and many buildings were on fire.

 

Georgia's president said Russian aircraft bombed several Georgian villages and other civilian facilities.

 

"A full-scale aggression has been launched against Georgia," Saakashvili said in a televised statement. He also announced a full military mobilization with reservists being called into action.

 

A senior Russian diplomat in charge of the South Ossetian conflict, Yuri Popov, dismissed the Georgian claims of Russian bombings as misinformation, the RIA-Novosti news agency reported.

 

Russia's Defense Ministry denounced the Georgian attack as a "dirty adventure." "Blood shed in South Ossetia will weigh on their conscience," the ministry said in a statement posted on its Web site.

 

Russia's President Dmitry Medvedev later chaired a session of his Security Council in the Kremlin, vowing that Moscow will protect Russian citizens.

 

"In accordance with the constitution and federal law, I, as president of Russia, am obliged to protect lives and dignity of Russian citizens wherever they are located," Medvedev said, according to Russian news reports. "We won't allow the death of our compatriots go unpunished."

 

Saakashvili long has pledged to restore Tbilisi's rule over South Ossetia and another breakaway province, Abkhazia. Both regions have run their own affairs without international recognition since splitting from Georgia in the early 1990s and built up ties with Moscow.

 

Relations between Georgia and Russia worsened notably this year as Georgia pushed to join NATO and Russia dispatched additional peacekeeper forces to Abkhazia.

 

The Georgian attack came just hours after Saakashvili announced a unilateral cease-fire in a television broadcast late Thursday in which he also urged South Ossetian separatist leaders to enter talks on resolving the conflict.

 

Georgian officials later blamed South Ossetian separatists for thwarting the cease-fire by shelling Georgian villages in the area.

 

Associated Press writers Misha Dzhindzhikhashvili in Tbilisi, Vladimir Isachenkov in Moscow and John Heilprin at the United Nations contributed to this report.

 

 

Edited by TFatseas

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Breaking Bohan

CNN has the worst programming ever! A war breaks out and they spend all day covering "Sexiest Dad on Earth" and other crap ... it's starting to make me ill. I read Russian troops were just outside the capital of S. Ossettia. Although the war is on one would think oil prices would go very high, but it's down like 4$! The dollar is getting rock hard against the Euro/Yen/Pound.

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Hart

 

"Sexiest Dad on Earth"

Damn, I missed it!

 

EDIT: OT, nothing good or bad going to come from this, it will be resolved inevitably (sp?)

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Otter

Wow. I hope none of you are nearby.

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okei
The South will rise again!

 

It's been a long time coming.

2001 maniacs happy.gif

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brz59

 

CNN has the worst programming ever!  A war breaks out and they spend all day covering "Sexiest Dad on Earth"

/OT

icon14.gif

user posted image

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Saggy
AP good enough?

Indeed, I usually try to find articles with the AP as the sources. They just typically seem to be the most concise, and filled with the least amount of bullsh*t from what I've seen.

 

 

In any case, it gives a better idea of what happened. I don't have a good concept of geography for that area, so I figured the Russians had sent a military convoy South that got bombed, and that was that. Georgia is actually invading though? confused.gif

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agent17
I hope Georgia wins and I heard the US and other NATO countries will support Georgia.

That is correct. We could potentially be looking at second cold war, providing that this doesn't count as a "hot war" already.

 

 

I have been over seeing this current News story to the best of my ability, however I have been very busy over the past week.

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TFatseas

 

 

In any case, it gives a better idea of what happened.  I don't have a good concept of geography for that area, so I figured the Russians had sent a military convoy South that got bombed, and that was that.  Georgia is actually invading though?  confused.gif

No, on Thursday Ossetian separatists shelled Georgian positions in Georgia. Georgia responded in kind by their own barrage and offensive.

 

Russia's actions are suspicious to say the least. In April they shot down a Georgian UAV here They also massed troops on the border of Georgia in so called 'exercises'. It looks as this is no more as an attack under the guise of 'peacekeeping.' It's an excuse really.

 

Well thats my thoughts.

Edited by TFatseas

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Pavlov

Honestly it's all bullsh*t.

I'm working now in a "place" that is closely related to what's going on there, that's all i can say because we still didn't pull out an official statement.

We are facing typical positions that both countries hold for few years but this time with the use of military.

Russia used the pretext of minorities to enter Georgian "de jure" territory. Both countries have nothing to do in S. Ossetia, Saakashvili wanted to take the control over the "de facto" South Ossetian territory.

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Lioshenka

WOW I got up open the news site and got shocked by whats going on. I would never expect anybody start a war on the Olympics day, especially Georgia, that's just sick.

 

And what is more surprising, is that Georgia thinks it can defeat Russia. Now when its only military aiport is down, 30 armoured vehicles and damn lots of helicopters burned to the ground I find it rather mad continue what they are doing, especially after NATO has said it is not going to get involved in the event.

 

Go South Osetia! ph34r.gif

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agent17
CNN has the worst programming ever! A war breaks out and they spend all day covering "Sexiest Dad on Earth" and other crap ... it's starting to make me ill. I read Russian troops were just outside the capital of S. Ossettia. Although the war is on one would think oil prices would go very high, but it's down like 4$! The dollar is getting rock hard against the Euro/Yen/Pound.

I could not agree more. I have yet to see any Television news coverage at all yet. The media makes me sick, why is it that every news station intends to cover the stories of least concern or relevance?

 

In any case it is an act of military confrontation, and should be handled accordingly.

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[CTD]LaBan

Georgia has been accused by Russian politicians for not giving up, but Russians are invading into Georgia and why aren't they allowed to protect their country??

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Breaking Bohan
LaBan' date='Aug 8 2008, 18:52'] Georgia has been accused by Russian politicians for not giving up, but Russians are invading into Georgia and why aren't they allowed to protect their country??

Good question ... maybe it's because Georgia couldn't really win a war with Russia, so to keep fighting would just cause lots of death and destruction, and because of this Russia may think that Georgia should just give up.

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Jesus'En'Hitler420

The two countries should fight it out at the Olympics, tanks and all.

 

Olympics might actually get some viewers in the USA.

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Breaking Bohan
The two countries should fight it out at the Olympics, tanks and all.

 

Olympics might actually get some viewers in the USA.

That may help somewhat, but let's face it, the ratings would still be terrible.

 

You know, since there's nothing about this on CNN maybe it really didn't happen ....

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[CTD]LaBan
You know, since there's nothing about this on CNN maybe it really didn't happen ....

You know, CNN might be too ignorant in such topics.

 

look at here

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Lt. Dan

CNN and Fox are going on about Edwards' affair atm.

 

 

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D- Ice
did you know that some nerdy historians have done some research and foun out that in

these 2000 years there have been only 7 years in total when there were no wars on this planet of ours.

 

humanity=wars

 

isnt there like 3 wars in africa right now? if not.. then.. well.. ive been missinformed.. and..icon14.gif

Hahaha, really just 7 years? Thats f*cked up! Another war is exactly what this world needs right now, so thanks a f*cking million politicians!

 

I'm no expert, but didn't S. Ossetia originally belong to Georgia? Why are the Russians present there in the first place - even if it is humanitarian, without authorisation or even knowlege of Georgia? It seems from here to be trying to get the old Soviet union back - this is further evident from it's anger and involvement with Georgia entering NATO. I mean it's a soveriegn nation, it's no-one's business except Georgia and it's people!

 

And it's just even more great our great government is taking sides in yet another conflict - this time we are supporting Georgia. I can't but feel suspicious from the motives of our lying bastard of a government. Also US-Russia tensions are at a high right now with those missile-shields in Eastern Europe, and taking the opposite side to Russia really isn't going to help calm those tensions now. We really need Russia as an allie, so hopefully we can persuade them to stop doing arms deals with Iran, which are finding their ways immediately into the hands of Iranian-backed terrorists who have, and are massacring people in Iraq I know.

 

I really hope this can be solved diplomatically.

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Hart

 

did you know that some nerdy historians have done some research and foun out that in

these 2000 years there have been only 7 years in total when there were no wars on this planet of ours.

 

humanity=wars

 

isnt there like 3 wars in africa right now? if not.. then.. well..  ive been missinformed.. and..icon14.gif

 

 

 

More like Humanity=paranoia=betrayal=inevitable war

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TFatseas

 

I'm no expert, but didn't S. Ossetia originally belong to Georgia?

 

Yes, technically it still does. (Well at least of the opinions of the UN)

 

 

Why are the Russians present there in the first place - even if it is humanitarian, without authorisation or even knowlege of Georgia?

 

Support the separatists.

 

 

It seems from here to be trying to get the old Soviet union back - this is further evident from it's anger and involvement with Georgia entering NATO.

 

Yes they are. It is their "restoration policy".

 

 

And it's just even more great our great government is taking sides in yet another conflict - this time we are supporting Georgia.

 

We've been supporting them for a while now, weapons, troops etc. It is not a recent thing.

 

 

We really need Russia as an allie,

 

The west isolated Russia back in the mid nineties with our actions during the breakup of Yugoslavia, and more currently Kosovo.

 

Russia's looking out for their own interests.

Edited by TFatseas

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D- Ice
I'm no expert, but didn't S. Ossetia originally belong to Georgia?

 

Yes, technically it still does. (Well at least of the opinions of the UN)

 

 

Why are the Russians present there in the first place - even if it is humanitarian, without authorisation or even knowlege of Georgia?

 

Support the separatists.

 

 

It seems from here to be trying to get the old Soviet union back - this is further evident from it's anger and involvement with Georgia entering NATO.

 

Yes they are. It is their "restoration policy".

 

 

And it's just even more great our great government is taking sides in yet another conflict - this time we are supporting Georgia.

 

We've been supporting them for a while now, weapons, troops etc. It is not a recent thing.

 

 

We really need Russia as an allie,

 

The west isolated Russia back in the mid nineties with our actions during the breakup of Yugoslavia, and more currently Kosovo.

 

Russia's looking out for their own interests.

Very true man, and thanks for answering my questions, I agree totally with what you said.

 

I just think that now maybe we need to increase relations with them, and stop isolating them - otherwise they'll just turn to our enemies like Iran for support. NATO should take a more reconciliatory role, rather than taking sides.

 

Though from [CTD]LaBan's links, the sh*t looks serious with tanks, and this vid, I hope it can be solved through diplomatic means.

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Breaking Bohan

I wonder if Obama will condemn Russia's behavior ... and if he doesn't why not?! I mean is he a big man or a little man?

Edited by Breaking Bohan

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Taste Of Chaos

Havn't a clue what any of this is about really, I don't watch the news.

 

Saw this a while back, pretty awesome footage, dunno if it has anything to do with it....

 

 

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tommy vs. claude
I wonder if Obama will condemn Russia's behavior ... and if he doesn't why not?! I mean is he a big man or a big pussy?

How does Obama involve this?

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Breaking Bohan
I wonder if Obama will condemn Russia's behavior ...  and if he doesn't why not?!  I mean is he a big man or a big pussy?

How does Obama involve this?

Well of course he isn't directly involved, but when has that stopped politicians from commenting on all sorts of crap and talking out of their asses. It seems to me that if he commands the respect of the world, and especially sneaky hardasses like the Ruskies, that he should make his intentions clear (i.e., "If I were Pres. and Russia invaded ....").

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