Beating the system

[Struff Bunstridge]

 

Respect System

 

The gang system is GTA San Andreas has changed slightly from it's predecessors. You are now able to recruit members to your gang, the amount you can recruit is based upon the respect you have earned during the game. Below is a list detailing the actions that can increase and decrease your total respect. Statistics are according to the Brady Games Strategy Guide.

 

Respect Type              Respect Total Contribution

Running Respect          40%

Mission Progression      36%

Territory under control  6%

Money                          6%

Fitness                          4%

Girlfriend Progress        4%

Clothes                        4%

 

 

Action                         

Territory Gained                            + 30.0%

Killing a gang member                    + 0.5

Killing a dealer                              + 0.005%

Killing a member of your gang        - 0.005%

A member of your gang gets killed  - 2.0%

Territory Lost                                  - 3.0%

 

 

As mentioned before the amount of gang members you can recruit depends upon the total amount of respect you have. The table below shows you the information.

 

Respect No. of Gang Members

> 1%  2

> 10% 3

> 20% 4

> 40% 5

> 60% 6

> 80% 7

 

 

I was happily bimbling round Grove Street shooting up coppers last night, and, when of my homies got in the way, I shot and killed him. I was initially astonished to see a pop-up to show that my overall Respect rating had gone down slightly. Then, I thought, "Hang on, I've just gunned down one of my own; surely it should decrease a lot more?"

 

So, I did some research; turns out the Respect system is all fugged up. According to these figures (I'm aware there problems with the Brady Guide, but I've no idea what), GSF consider someone else killing a homie much worse for CJ's rep than if CJ himself actually did it. Also, as far as the Respect system is concerned, killing one of your own gang in cold clood can be smoothed over by simply bumping off a local drug pusher. And why does CJ's physical fitness play a part in his rep, when half of GSF are either fat bastards or built like crack whores?

 

Also, with territories, you gain 30% by taking one over, but lose 3% when you lose it. Could you quickly max out your Respect stat by repeatedly losing and re-taking a territory early in the game?

 

If this is already well known, then sorry, but I thought it was interesting. Any thoughts?

 

[mostwanted468]

if the stuff youre saying is true the respect sytems F****ed up the fact that a recruited gang member killed lowers more respect than killing him yourself what was R thinking

[adam 11]

Respect System

 

The gang system is GTA San Andreas has changed slightly from it's predecessors. You are now able to recruit members to your gang, the amount you can recruit is based upon the respect you have earned during the game. Below is a list detailing the actions that can increase and decrease your total respect. Statistics are according to the Brady Games Strategy Guide.

 

Respect Type              Respect Total Contribution

Running Respect          40%

Mission Progression      36%

Territory under control  6%

Money                          6%

Fitness                          4%

Girlfriend Progress        4%

Clothes                        4%

 

 

Action                         

Territory Gained                            + 30.0%

Killing a gang member                    + 0.5

Killing a dealer                              + 0.005%

Killing a member of your gang        - 0.005%

A member of your gang gets killed  - 2.0%

Territory Lost                                  - 3.0%

 

 

As mentioned before the amount of gang members you can recruit depends upon the total amount of respect you have. The table below shows you the information.

 

Respect No. of Gang Members

> 1%  2

> 10% 3

> 20% 4

> 40% 5

> 60% 6

> 80% 7

 

 

I was happily bimbling round Grove Street shooting up coppers last night, and, when of my homies got in the way, I shot and killed him. I was initially astonished to see a pop-up to show that my overall Respect rating had gone down slightly. Then, I thought, "Hang on, I've just gunned down one of my own; surely it should decrease a lot more?"

 

So, I did some research; turns out the Respect system is all fugged up. According to these figures (I'm aware there problems with the Brady Guide, but I've no idea what), GSF consider someone else killing a homie much worse for CJ's rep than if CJ himself actually did it. Also, as far as the Respect system is concerned, killing one of your own gang in cold clood can be smoothed over by simply bumping off a local drug pusher. And why does CJ's physical fitness play a part in his rep, when half of GSF are either fat bastards or built like crack whores?

 

Also, with territories, you gain 30% by taking one over, but lose 3% when you lose it. Could you quickly max out your Respect stat by repeatedly losing and re-taking a territory early in the game?

 

If this is already well known, then sorry, but I thought it was interesting. Any thoughts?

i couldnt be arsed 2 read it just type in the max respect cheat

[Usherber]

Once I killed so many cops that my green line got off the bar! I said: " Holy Sh!t!!

[16 Roses]

I never understood those figures, because they don't seem to make any real logistical sense.

 

It says kill a gang member is +0.5%, so surely killing 200 gang members should max your respect?

Or simply taking over 4 territories should give you max respect, I suppose these are part of running respect, but even then it doesn't make much sense.

 

Taking over territory = 30%.....of 40%

40/100 * 30 = 12

So each territory gives you 12% in total respect

100/12 = 8.3 >(rounding) >9

 

So taking over 9 territories should give you max respect?

 

With Gang members

40/100 * 0.5 = 0.2

Each gang member killed gives you 0.2% respect

So you would have to kill 500 gang members to get full respect

 

I just checked my new game save file (at los sepulcros) and that's got 325 enemy gang kills, only '200 are needed' for 40%, and yet my bar is no where near there. I've only lost 6 recruited gang members, which should leave me at 36%, but it isn't near there either..

 

 

 

Also, is it possible to gain negative respect?

I've heard the bar can go out of the designated respect if you keep earning after the max, so what if you spent your time losing territory, and killing gang members? Could the bar begin facing the other way:P?

 

 

 

[Steve Crook]

Once I killed so many cops that my green line got off the bar! I said: " Holy Sh!t!!

I see that happening quite often. Usually when I'm clearing out the other gangs

 

Steve

 

[Usherber]

Once I killed so many cops that my green line got off the bar! I said: " Holy Sh!t!!

That was what I'm saying onm my post.

Yeah I know. can't I say it?

[pdescobar]

In order for a strategy guide to be profitable it has to be in stores the same day the game is released. This guarantees that they are working with prerelease copies of the game and also cuts into their ability to find and fix errors in the text. As a result, no strategy guide is ever completely accurate and they often are glaringly wrong. Treat everything you read in such guides with heavy skepticism until you can verify it for yourself. Unfortunately, in the race to be "first" with advice for gamers, many sites take the word of the strategy guide as gospel, repost it with minimal verification, and then forget about updating it later if better information comes along.

 

In terms of the respect system, the Brady Guide isn't too far off on the overall picture but most of the details are wrong and they make one huge glaring error: trying to use percentages in a situation that does not warrant them. The "running respect" statistic has no cap and therefore the "total respect" statistic has no cap. Trying to claim that something gives you X% when there is no practical maximum makes no sense at all. Additionally, the percentages listed for running respect are actually percentages of percentages when talking about total respect; that is 10% of one does not equal 10% of the other even if they both had true maximum values.

 

How Respect Really Works

 

Total Respect (stat 64) is the number which is displayed on the TAB/L1 stats box and is the statistic used to determine how many people you can recruit. The recruit levels are as follows; values taken from statdisp.dat.

 

Tot Respect	Recruits
0 - 9	0
10 - 59	2
60 - 159	3
160 - 329	4
330 - 539	5
540 - 799	6
800 +	7

Total Respect is made up of 8 components. They are listed below along with how many total respect points they contribute. All this data was accumulated through monitoring the internal stat values while experimenting within the game.

1. Mission Respect (360 max) -- any time you pass a mission and it says "Respect +" there has been a gain in this component but the actual amount is hidden from you. I'm gonna ignore the details for this post but to get the maximum you will have to finish both the main storyline and "Breaking the Bank"
2. Territory Held (50 max) -- this calculation is highly strange and I don't come anywhere near understanding it. Luckily it doesn't count that much in the total respect stat.
3. Money (50 max) -- Basically you get 1 point for every $200,000 in your pocket. If you have at least $10,000,000 then you'll have all 50 points.
4. Muscle (30 max) -- It's a simple percentage: no muscle = no points, max muscle = 30 points.
5. Girlfriends (30 max) -- Every girl has an internal "girlfriend respect value" from 200-700 and if the values of your current girlfriends total 1000 then you'll have the max 30 points. More complicated than it needs to be and I'm ignoring the minutiae again.
6. Clothes (30 max) -- Clothing, tattoos, and haircuts have internal respect values. This component is basically the sum of those values (100 max) times 0.3
7. Tags (50 max) -- you get half a point for every tag sprayed.
8. Running Respect (no practical maximum) -- While you would expect 400 max points here to give a total of 1000, there is no cap on running respect and therefore no cap on total respect. This is why you can get the respect bar stretching all the way across the screen. Running Respect adjustments are listed below along with their equivalent total respect adjustment:

   Total Respect	Running Respect	Activity
   +0.6	+1.5	Kill any drug dealer or law enforcement officer
   +0.3	+0.75	Kill any non-GSF gang member
   -2	-5	Kill any GSF gang member
   -0.8	-2	A recruited GSF member dies by someone else's hand
   +18	+45	Take over a gang territory
   -12	-30	Fail to defend a gang territory

The fact that running respect is not capped means that you can actually reach the 800 total respect level (and beyond) before doing a single mission simply by methodically killing drug dealers & cops (and other gangsters too although the bonus is smaller.)

 

I shall be quoting these numbers through the rest of my post.

 

 

[brady Quote removed]

I was happily bimbling round Grove Street shooting up coppers last night, and, when of my homies got in the way, I shot and killed him. I was initially astonished to see a pop-up to show that my overall Respect rating had gone down slightly. Then, I thought, "Hang on, I've just gunned down one of my own; surely it should decrease a lot more?"

 

So, I did some research; turns out the Respect system is all fugged up. According to these figures (I'm aware there problems with the Brady Guide, but I've no idea what), GSF consider someone else killing a homie much worse for CJ's rep than if CJ himself actually did it.

That is a Brady Guide error. If CJ himself kills any GSF (recruited or not) it causes a 5 point loss in "running respect;" if someone else kills a GSF it is a 2 point loss if that guy is one of your recruits and no loss at all if he is unrecruited.

 

 

Also, as far as the Respect system is concerned, killing one of your own gang in cold clood can be smoothed over by simply bumping off a local drug pusher.

Killing off one of your own gang (-5) requires killing at least 4 drug dealers and/or cops (+1.5 each) to offset the respect loss. This is a situation where gameplay balance ought to outweigh realism and I'm glad it does.

 

 

And why does CJ's physical fitness play a part in his rep, when half of GSF are either fat bastards or built like crack whores?

Who would you be more willing to follow into a street fight -- a guy built like a young Arnold Schwarzenegger or a guy built like a young Chris Farley? Anyhow, in the released game how fat you are doesn't matter. The only physical attribute that counts is muscle -- the more you have, the bigger your respect which seems pretty reasonable to me.

 

 

Also, with territories, you gain 30% by taking one over, but lose 3% when you lose it. Could you quickly max out your Respect stat by repeatedly losing and re-taking a territory early in the game?

Those numbers are way off. You gain 45 "running respect" points for taking an a territory and you lose 30 points if you lose a territory. In terms of "total respect" this translates into +18 and -12 points respectively. Since you need 800 total respect points to have 7 recruits you'd have to lose and retake that same territory more than 100 times which is pretty damn tedious; this is especially true if you consider the randomness of people attacking your territories.

 

================================

 

 

I never understood those figures, because they don't seem to make any real logistical sense.

 

It says kill a gang member is +0.5%, so surely killing 200 gang members should max your respect?

Or simply taking over 4 territories should give you max respect, I suppose these are part of running respect, but even then it doesn't make much sense.

[rest deleted]

This is why I have always hated the Brady Guide respect numbers. Half of the confusion could have been alleviated by simply using the raw values instead of percentages; of course you still would be dealing with inaccuracies there but that part's forgivable...

 

 

Also, is it possible to gain negative respect?

I've heard the bar can go out of the designated respect if you keep earning after the max, so what if you spent your time losing territory, and killing gang members? Could the bar begin facing the other way:P?

I don't think the total respect number can drop below 0 but it has been a while since I tested this stuff.

 

[16 Roses]

I always knew the working with beta/pre-release was why the guide has inaccuries, it becomes galringly obvious when you see names of places are wrong (I.E. Clowns Pocket, in the guide is called the Ring Master)

 

It's good to see the actual figure though

[Spider-Vice]

I always knew the working with beta/pre-release was why the guide has inaccuries, it becomes galringly obvious when you see names of places are wrong (I.E. Clowns Pocket, in the guide is called the Ring Master)

 

It's good to see the actual figure though

That guide was maked when R* was already on BETA. That's because that guide haves BETA tips, ect.

[Struff Bunstridge]

I see.

 

Thanks pdescobar for clearing that up. I thought the calculations were odd. btw, biggest post I've seen outside of a pinned topic I love that someone actually quoted the whole thing.

 

Oh, and to whoever suggested I just cheated to gain respect: sort of defeats the whole point, really, hmm?

Edited January 14, 2008 by Struff Bunstridge