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ablestar

Abortions

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ablestar

I abortions are a disgusting way of ending a life. You dont give that fetus a chance to become a human being, just kill it off. It makes me very sad and angry!. Just becasue of your stupid carelessness (not using a condom), a child who will never be given the gift of life ever again. The only time i would agree with a abortion is if there is something detected pre-hand like a mental problem (autism ect.) it is sick and disgusting AARHHHHH. I know that i am not in control of ppl's wombs but it is just not fair!.

 

Be against abortions! (I am not trying to post propaganda or anything!)

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Pat.

Ending a life? When the abortion is performed, that thing is still just sperm. I hate how people call it "murder".

 

Next time you wank off, you're basically doing the same thing that happens in an abortion. Keeping sperm from becoming a child.

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Luke

 

Ending a life? When the abortion is performed, that thing is still just sperm. I hate how people call it "murder".

 

Next time you wank off, you're basically doing the same thing that happens in an abortion. Keeping sperm from becoming a child.

That's really not true, abortion happens after conception - so in theory the foetus has every chance of growing to a full person, whereas sperm alone can never create a person. That said, I still wouldn't class it as murder, at least not for a few weeks into the pregnancy (here in the UK I believe the time restriction on abortion is too long, the cut-off should be sooner).

 

Complicated subject though, you'll never get people to agree on it. I don't agree with an abortion unless it has a very good reason or is done very early on in pregnancy.

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Otter

Honestly, I don't think a life begins until the child has left the womb. I'm not advocating third trimester abortions, but that's just where I'm coming from.

 

Let's throw around a few standbys, shall we? A child developing without, say, a brain. Or a rape victim. Or how about incest?

 

Now where is the line drawn between the extreme examples and, for instance, a 14 year old girl who was knocked up by her asshole boyfriend who should have known better?

 

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TubbyJ

What a woman does with her own body is her own right and business, especially in cases like rape and just a single, careless mistake (like not wearing a condom). But, I don't agree with third trimester abortions, at that stage the child is almost capable of supporting life itself. Not only that, but the person already had six other months to decide on an abortion, it's too late.

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saltinespike

 

I abortions are a disgusting way of ending a life. You dont give that fetus a chance to become a human being, just kill it off. It makes me very sad and angry!. Just becasue of your stupid carelessness (not using a condom), a child who will never be given the gift of life ever again. The only time i would agree with a abortion is if there is something detected pre-hand like a mental problem (autism ect.) it is sick and disgusting AARHHHHH. I know that i am not in control of ppl's wombs but it is just not fair!.

 

Be against abortions! (I am not trying to post propaganda or anything!)

Well, sorry to say, but even if you were using propaganda, it would have failed miserably.

 

How about rape? Are you going to force a 12-year-old girl to go through the 9 months of torture after she already went through a whole night of torture? A fetus is not yet a human, basically only an organ. Forcing a woman to go through pregnancy is slavery.

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norniron
I abortions are a disgusting way of ending a life. You dont give that fetus a chance to become a human being, just kill it off. It makes me very sad and angry!. Just becasue of your stupid carelessness (not using a condom), a child who will never be given the gift of life ever again. The only time i would agree with a abortion is if there is something detected pre-hand like a mental problem (autism ect.) it is sick and disgusting AARHHHHH. I know that i am not in control of ppl's wombs but it is just not fair!.

 

Be against abortions! (I am not trying to post propaganda or anything!)

Well, sorry to say, but even if you were using propaganda, it would have failed miserably.

 

How about rape? Are you going to force a 12-year-old girl to go through the 9 months of torture after she already went through a whole night of torture? A fetus is not yet a human, basically only an organ. Forcing a woman to go through pregnancy is slavery.

I second the part about rape.

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ablestar

well rape is obviously an exception. I cant beleve ppl didnt deduce that from my post instead of ranting on!

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saltinespike
well rape is obviously an exception. I cant beleve ppl didnt deduce that from my post instead of ranting on!

We can't read minds. Anti-abortion rants such as yours don't give any exceptions, many times. What distinguishes yours?

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LT.Diablo

 

well rape is obviously an exception. I cant beleve ppl didnt deduce that from my post instead of ranting on!

We can't read minds.

Exactly. Stop thinking we know what your talking about, and lay your argument out in full.

 

Personally, I, like a few others agree that it isn't murder, it's a fetus. Surely, it's wrong to make the person go through 9 months of pregnancy if they just didn't wear a condom and the child would effectively be unwanted, because it wasn't planned. What I'm trying to say is that if two people want a child, they have sex and get pregnant, now if two people are very horny and "in the moment" and forget to put on a condom, a baby could be conceived where it isn't wanted. Basically, the child wasn't planned and would be a "accident" and if the mother is, say, 17 having a baby unplanned could ruin her life, and also the babies. Surely, it's more humane to "remove" the fetus before it develops, than have that child grow up in an unloving environment? I know this isn't always the case, and I know for a fact that I myself was an accident, but in some situations this could be the case.

 

I'm not sure if this post makes sense, but what I'm trying to get at is that if a child is planned they will be loved, because the parents wanted them, but if the child is an accident then they may not receive the same love, and the parent may even resent them. Ahh, like others have said, abortion is a touchy subject, but at the end of the day people always have their free will and if they feel it's right to terminate a pregnancy then we can't legally do anything to stop them.

Edited by LT.Diablo

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Cypress Hill

 

Honestly, I don't think a life begins until the child has left the womb.  I'm not advocating third trimester abortions, but that's just where I'm coming from.

 

I think that's a pretty bad definition of when a life begins. Nothing about the baby changes once the doctor pulls it out of the vagina that could mean the difference between living and not living. I'm not sure how you can really argue that a fetuses aren't alive, especially since they exhibit brain activity from about eight weeks into the pregnancy.

 

Of course, if a fetus is the product of rape or might injure the mother if it is not aborted, then the abortion could be justified.

 

 

Personally, I, like a few others agree that it isn't murder, it's a fetus. Surely, it's wrong to make the person go through 9 months of pregnancy if they just didn't wear a condom and the child would effectively be unwanted, because it wasn't planned.

If a baby is concieved accidentally, it doesn't make it any less alive, so I don't really see that as a valid reason for killing it. If you think its okay to abort fetuses for convenience, then why not allow people to kill their already born children as well if they might hinder the parent(s)' lives.

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saltinespike
Honestly, I don't think a life begins until the child has left the womb.  I'm not advocating third trimester abortions, but that's just where I'm coming from.

 

I think that's a pretty bad definition of when a life begins. Nothing about the baby changes once the doctor pulls it out of the vagina that could mean the difference between living and not living. I'm not sure how you can really argue that a fetuses aren't alive, especially since they exhibit brain activity from about eight weeks into the pregnancy.

 

Of course, if a fetus is the product of rape or might injure the mother if it is not aborted, then the abortion could be justified.

 

 

Personally, I, like a few others agree that it isn't murder, it's a fetus. Surely, it's wrong to make the person go through 9 months of pregnancy if they just didn't wear a condom and the child would effectively be unwanted, because it wasn't planned.

If a baby is concieved accidentally, it doesn't make it any less alive, so I don't really see that as a valid reason for killing it. If you think its okay to abort fetuses for convenience, then why not allow people to kill their already born children as well if they might hinder the parent(s)' lives.

Your kidney is alive in the same sense a fetus is. Sure, a fetus is unique and can grow into a human, but for 9 months, it is a developing organ that is a part of a woman. Forcing a woman to keep that organ is just like forcing a woman to keep a kidney, or better yet, locked up in solitary confinement. I know you will poke holes by pointing out the difference, but it's only an analogy. Forcing a woman (or man, for that matter) to do anything against their will for no matter how long is slavery. And I'm pretty sure that we abolished that.

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Mortukai

Actually, that whole slavery thing doesn't really fly. "Forcing someone to keep their baby" is actually, forcing them into inaction. You're not forcing them to do anything, you're forcing them to NOT do something.

 

Like, forcing someone to NOT commit suicide.

 

Or forcing someone to NOT kill someone else.

 

In these cases, by taking no coercive action, the result is that you allow someone to do something harmful. Like kill themselves, or someone else, or their unborn child.

 

I think any claim that this is in any way "oppressive" or "slavery" is... specious... at best.

 

___

 

 

Another point worth noting is that having a baby isn't like owning a pet or buying a car or having any other possession which requires upkeep.

 

Having a baby is like, reproduction. As in, the single most important and fundamental aspect of all life on earth. It's the whole reason we're here. There is no other reason. We're not here to become CEOs of companies, or own mansions, or play playstations, or pimp our rides, or eat fast food or buy fancy clothes or get drunk or whatever. We're here to make more of us. Everything else is inconsequential. If we stop making more of us, bam, we're gone. Nothing. Humanity ends. If we stop doing anything else, like partying or playing video games or going to work.... well we're still making babies so who cares?

 

So claiming that abortion is just like throwing away an unwanted liability is just f*cking dumb and myopic.

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Im Rick James B**ch!

 

Just becasue of your stupid carelessness (not using a condom)

 

Condoms aren't 100% effective.

 

 

a child who will never be given the gift of life ever again

How is it a child?

 

What i really hate about your post is how your insult women who have had to go through an abortion. Abortions are emotionally stressful and are considered deeply beforehand. Women have a biological instinct to help their progeny to survive. If a women is defying this instinct it is because it is contradicted by another instinct. By denying women the right to abortion you are disregarding the very biological foundations which life is founded upon.

 

 

 

 

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ablestar
Just becasue of your stupid carelessness (not using a condom)

 

Condoms aren't 100% effective.

 

 

a child who will never be given the gift of life ever again

How is it a child?

 

What i really hate about your post is how your insult women who have had to go through an abortion. Abortions are emotionally stressful and are considered deeply beforehand. Women have a biological instinct to help their progeny to survive. If a women is defying this instinct it is because it is contradicted by another instinct. By denying women the right to abortion you are disregarding the very biological foundations which life is founded upon.

erm...no. You talk about the biological foundations of life, but depriving a unborn child of a life is just that isn't it. dozingoff.gif

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Im Rick James B**ch!
Just becasue of your stupid carelessness (not using a condom)

 

Condoms aren't 100% effective.

 

 

a child who will never be given the gift of life ever again

How is it a child?

 

What i really hate about your post is how your insult women who have had to go through an abortion. Abortions are emotionally stressful and are considered deeply beforehand. Women have a biological instinct to help their progeny to survive. If a women is defying this instinct it is because it is contradicted by another instinct. By denying women the right to abortion you are disregarding the very biological foundations which life is founded upon.

erm...no. You talk about the biological foundations of life, but depriving a unborn child of a life is just that isn't it. dozingoff.gif

No, it was the parents biological instincts which i was recognizing. Killing in certain situations is instinct, so how does my post defy biological foundation?

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Cypress Hill

 

Honestly, I don't think a life begins until the child has left the womb.  I'm not advocating third trimester abortions, but that's just where I'm coming from.

 

I think that's a pretty bad definition of when a life begins. Nothing about the baby changes once the doctor pulls it out of the vagina that could mean the difference between living and not living. I'm not sure how you can really argue that a fetuses aren't alive, especially since they exhibit brain activity from about eight weeks into the pregnancy.

 

Of course, if a fetus is the product of rape or might injure the mother if it is not aborted, then the abortion could be justified.

 

 

Personally, I, like a few others agree that it isn't murder, it's a fetus. Surely, it's wrong to make the person go through 9 months of pregnancy if they just didn't wear a condom and the child would effectively be unwanted, because it wasn't planned.

If a baby is concieved accidentally, it doesn't make it any less alive, so I don't really see that as a valid reason for killing it. If you think its okay to abort fetuses for convenience, then why not allow people to kill their already born children as well if they might hinder the parent(s)' lives.

Your kidney is alive in the same sense a fetus is. Sure, a fetus is unique and can grow into a human, but for 9 months, it is a developing organ that is a part of a woman. Forcing a woman to keep that organ is just like forcing a woman to keep a kidney, or better yet, locked up in solitary confinement. I know you will poke holes by pointing out the difference, but it's only an analogy. Forcing a woman (or man, for that matter) to do anything against their will for no matter how long is slavery. And I'm pretty sure that we abolished that.

Your'e kidney doesn't have a functional brain and cannot do anything independently. Everything a kidney does happens because the brain of the organism it is a part of tells it to do so. Fetuses, on the other hand, can move around on their own and have their own functional organs and brain. This would imply that the fetus is a living organism independent from its mother, not just an appendage of her, and merely relies on its mother for nutrients.

 

You say that forcing a women to bear her baby is slavery? Then isn't it also slavery to force a mother to spend her precious time, money, and energy on feeding and raising her kids? If a woman decides at some point that she's tired of her kids and doesn't want to deal with them anymore or wants to do something else with her life, should she have the right to kill her kids? Please, tell me what is so different about a fetus the minute after it is born and the minute before it is born that makes it a living human being, because I don't think there is a difference.

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agincourtsalute

 

Ending a life? When the abortion is performed, that thing is still just sperm. I hate how people call it "murder".

 

Next time you wank off, you're basically doing the same thing that happens in an abortion. Keeping sperm from becoming a child.

icon14.gif you took the words right out of my mouth there mate, people who are against abortion are just totalitarians trying to force their religous beliefs on others.

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saltinespike
Your'e kidney doesn't have a functional brain and cannot do anything independently. Everything a kidney does happens because the brain of the organism it is a part of tells it to do so. Fetuses, on the other hand, can move around on their own and have their own functional organs and brain. This would imply that the fetus is a living organism independent from its mother, not just an appendage of her, and merely relies on its mother for nutrients.

 

You say that forcing a women to bear her baby is slavery? Then isn't it also slavery to force a mother to spend her precious time, money, and energy on feeding and raising her kids? If a woman decides at some point that she's tired of her kids and doesn't want to deal with them anymore or wants to do something else with her life, should she have the right to kill her kids? Please, tell me what is so different about a fetus the minute after it is born and the minute before it is born that makes it a living human being, because I don't think there is a difference.

But the fetus is dependent on the mother, and therefore cannot do anything independently. Sure they can develop and eventually do everything on their own. But for nine months, they are a part of the mother's body, and practically just a developing organ.

 

I am not trying to advocate killing the fetus. Yes, it is a sorry side effect, but you treat the matter as if I want to kill fetuses. No, I just want to give a woman the choice to preserve her bodily sovereignty. Your "raising kids" argument is irrelevant, since they can simply rid of them by adoption at that very moment. If there becomes a way to save the fetus and get an abortion, I will definitely strive for that and try to abolish abortion, but until then, a woman should not be forced to bear a child.

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Hope

I'm all for abortions. If you're upset about lives being killed by abortions, which isn't even true, since it's so early, you might as well stop masturbating since those are a lot of potential lives there too...

 

Edit - I didn't realize other people thought of my same point, the point of masturbating, oh well...

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Cypress Hill
Your'e kidney doesn't have a functional brain and cannot do anything independently. Everything a kidney does happens because the brain of the organism it is a part of tells it to do so. Fetuses, on the other hand, can move around on their own and have their own functional organs and brain. This would imply that the fetus is a living organism independent from its mother, not just an appendage of her, and merely relies on its mother for nutrients.

 

You say that forcing a women to bear her baby is slavery? Then isn't it also slavery to force a mother to spend her precious time, money, and energy on feeding and raising her kids? If a woman decides at some point that she's tired of her kids and doesn't want to deal with them anymore or wants to do something else with her life, should she have the right to kill her kids? Please, tell me what  is so different about a fetus the minute after it is born and the minute before it is born that makes it a living human being, because I don't think there is a difference.

But the fetus is dependent on the mother, and therefore cannot do anything independently. Sure they can develop and eventually do everything on their own. But for nine months, they are a part of the mother's body, and practically just a developing organ.

 

I am not trying to advocate killing the fetus. Yes, it is a sorry side effect, but you treat the matter as if I want to kill fetuses. No, I just want to give a woman the choice to preserve her bodily sovereignty. Your "raising kids" argument is irrelevant, since they can simply rid of them by adoption at that very moment. If there becomes a way to save the fetus and get an abortion, I will definitely strive for that and try to abolish abortion, but until then, a woman should not be forced to bear a child.

The fetus is dependent on the mother for nutrients. However, it is not part of the mother's body. A fetus has its own body, and the mother does not control the fetus's movements or actions, just it's food supply. It displays all signs of vitality, so it should be considered a living organism, not an organ.

 

I don't really think its important whether or not you want to kill fetueses, but rather that you want women to have the right to abort their fetuses. At its root, the abortion debate has nothing to do with women's rights or religion or whatever. It has to do with whether or not a fetus is a living human being. And so far, I have yet to see a good reason for why a person isn't considered alive until they come out of their mother's vagina.

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Otter

That was my argument, and I don't see why you'd expect others to argue for it.

 

I, personally, equate human life to identity - there can't be one without the other. It's a personal philosophy.

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saltinespike

 

The fetus is dependent on the mother for nutrients. However, it is not part of the mother's body. A fetus has its own body, and the mother does not control the fetus's movements or actions, just it's food supply. It displays all signs of vitality, so it should be considered a living organism, not an organ.

 

I don't really think its important whether or not you want to kill fetueses, but rather that you want women to have the right to abort their fetuses. At its root, the abortion debate has nothing to do with women's rights or religion or whatever. It has to do with whether or not a fetus is a living human being. And so far, I have yet to see a good reason for why a person isn't considered alive until they come out of their mother's vagina.

Nonetheless, the mother is greatly affected. She gains weight, slaves to a strict diet, and then must go through hours of labor and giving birth. If you do not wish to recognize the fetus as a part of the mother, fine, but the fetus inside her greatly affects her.

 

To be honest, I don't care when life starts, because clashing views doesn't change the fact that a fetus is developing inside a host, the mother. For me, it's all about protecting rights, so saying that does not matter, you are simply ranting on, while dismissing all of my claims. I don't care when a baby's alive. Try actually disputing my claims instead of saying they do not matter, try actually debating.

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Cypress Hill

 

To be honest, I don't care when life starts, because clashing views doesn't change the fact that a fetus is developing inside a host, the mother. For me, it's all about protecting rights, so saying that does not matter, you are simply ranting on, while dismissing all of my claims. I don't care when a baby's alive. Try actually disputing my claims instead of saying they do not matter, try actually debating.

 

And what about the rights of the fetus? If it's a living human being, does it not have rights just as the mother does? And the mother is the one who made the choice or mistake of getting pregnant. She should've known that even with protection, there was a slight chance of getting pregnant (with the exception of rape). So if anyone is to blame for the sh*tty time a woman has during pregnance, it's her. A fetus can't really be blamed for coming into existence, so why should it have to pay with it's life for its mother's choices. The consecuence of carrying throught with a pregnancy is the drastic change one person's life. The consequence of abortion is the ending of another human's life. I would say the latter is worse than the former.

 

If a fetus is indeed a living human being, then it deserves its human rights (among them being the right to live). What makes fetus's life so much less important then its mother's rights.

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silvermanblue

I am against abortion except for 2 exceptions. One if the child is a product of incest. Or the child is a result of a rape. Only then I think a abortion is justified. But I wont go and call women murderers for having one, if they feel its the only solution than who am i to judge?

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saltinespike
To be honest, I don't care when life starts, because clashing views doesn't change the fact that a fetus is developing inside a host, the mother. For me, it's all about protecting rights, so saying that does not matter, you are simply ranting on, while dismissing all of my claims. I don't care when a baby's alive. Try actually disputing my claims instead of saying they do not matter, try actually debating.

 

And what about the rights of the fetus? If it's a living human being, does it not have rights just as the mother does? And the mother is the one who made the choice or mistake of getting pregnant. She should've known that even with protection, there was a slight chance of getting pregnant (with the exception of rape). So if anyone is to blame for the sh*tty time a woman has during pregnance, it's her. A fetus can't really be blamed for coming into existence, so why should it have to pay with it's life for its mother's choices. The consecuence of carrying throught with a pregnancy is the drastic change one person's life. The consequence of abortion is the ending of another human's life. I would say the latter is worse than the former.

 

If a fetus is indeed a living human being, then it deserves its human rights (among them being the right to live). What makes fetus's life so much less important then its mother's rights.

Because in pregnancy, a mother gives, gives, gives and the fetus takes, takes, takes. It is dependent on the mother, while the mother must follow a strict lifestyle. Drastic change for the worse, possibly some health problems, loss of bodily sovereignty, the whole 9 yards. To give birth to a baby that is unwanted.

 

It's a pretty reasonable murder. Do you at least see the sense in it (you don't have to agree to see the sense in it)?

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Mortukai

 

Because in pregnancy, a mother gives, gives, gives and the fetus takes, takes, takes. It is dependent on the mother, while the mother must follow a strict lifestyle. Drastic change for the worse, possibly some health problems, loss of bodily sovereignty, the whole 9 yards. To give birth to a baby that is unwanted.

 

It's a pretty reasonable murder. Do you at least see the sense in it (you don't have to agree to see the sense in it)?

How much does a 5 month old baby "give" to its mother? How much does a 1 year old baby give to its mother? How much does a mother have to give up to raise a newborn baby?

 

Well, according to your argument, that makes it perfectly ok to kill a baby even after it has been born.

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saltinespike
Because in pregnancy, a mother gives, gives, gives and the fetus takes, takes, takes. It is dependent on the mother, while the mother must follow a strict lifestyle. Drastic change for the worse, possibly some health problems, loss of bodily sovereignty, the whole 9 yards. To give birth to a baby that is unwanted.

 

It's a pretty reasonable murder. Do you at least see the sense in it (you don't have to agree to see the sense in it)?

How much does a 5 month old baby "give" to its mother? How much does a 1 year old baby give to its mother? How much does a mother have to give up to raise a newborn baby?

 

Well, according to your argument, that makes it perfectly ok to kill a baby even after it has been born.

Did you bother reading my previous posts? Obviously not. You can rid of a baby after it's been born by not killing it. You can easily put it up for adoption. You can't rid of a fetus without killing it. It's a sorry side effect, but if that's what it takes, then so be it. Once we find a way around killing the fetus but still getting an abortion, then I'll be all for that. But until then, that sucks.

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Cypress Hill
Because in pregnancy, a mother gives, gives, gives and the fetus takes, takes, takes. It is dependent on the mother, while the mother must follow a strict lifestyle. Drastic change for the worse, possibly some health problems, loss of bodily sovereignty, the whole 9 yards. To give birth to a baby that is unwanted.

 

It's a pretty reasonable murder. Do you at least see the sense in it (you don't have to agree to see the sense in it)?

How much does a 5 month old baby "give" to its mother? How much does a 1 year old baby give to its mother? How much does a mother have to give up to raise a newborn baby?

 

Well, according to your argument, that makes it perfectly ok to kill a baby even after it has been born.

Did you bother reading my previous posts? Obviously not. You can rid of a baby after it's been born by not killing it. You can easily put it up for adoption. You can't rid of a fetus without killing it. It's a sorry side effect, but if that's what it takes, then so be it. Once we find a way around killing the fetus but still getting an abortion, then I'll be all for that. But until then, that sucks.

So you're basically saying that the mother's right not to have to go through pregnancy outweighs the futus's right to live? This is what I disagree with. To me, abortion (except for a few exceptions like rape pregnancies) is essentially killing one person to make another person's life less difficult. This doesn't seem fair to the one being killed, especially when its the mother of the fetus who is primarily responsible for the whole situation.

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Otter

If that's your standpoint, why is it ok in the case of rape? How do you reconcile that with your position that the child has a right to live?

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