Porsche - Call it a Day?

[GT-1]

In their time Porsche had a well thought out design, aesthetically pleasing, slick etc., unfortunately their time is no longer? Is this due to the fact times have changed with Porsche staying in the past, or have other vehicles produced to a similar specification gone too far in terms of looks? Not all of their production vehicles have looked the same, some of the early Porsche generations were fairly unique in comparison but gone are those days.

 

Porsche hired a new design chief not so long ago, but what can we expect? They want you to recognise their vehicles as Porsche's, and they certainly pulled that off and continue to do so. The problem is the majority look the same, whatever happened to variation in automotive design? I'd say the Cayenne proves exactly that the best; What are the competitors to the Cayenne? Others 4x4's? No, its off-road ability is useless, it would be most appropriate to compare it to a sport saloon because that's all it is (A Porsche with higher suspension). You can still make comparison with the Porsche 356 and some of today's as with the 550 and the new Panamera (coming 2008) seems to be looking much the same.

 

Porsche had a good reputation amongst other car heads, but this seems to have been wavering in the last decade, with the last few years proving to be the worst. They used to have that star quality, people wanted to have one like people wanted to have an Alfa Romeo back in their day. These days they seems to be becoming just another car company, I'd put a lot down to their stiffness on design in a rapidly changing market.

 

The problem they have is; if Porsche changed their design they might aswell put another name to their company. They have come so far with one base design which have evolved over the years into a great design (which I believe is now exhausted) that changing their appearance would kill their reputation. There are very few Porsche's that I see these days that have any appeal at all; 928 S4, 04 911 GT3 mk1/RS, '87 944 and a few more.

 

In conclusion Porsche have had some great designs, but I'm tired of seeing the same design exhausted to the point where I've come to dislike most Porsche's I see on a daily basis. Each to their own I guess.

 

Keep in mind this discussion only concerns Porsche, and not any other affiliated automotive companies. This is also based on their appearance, and not what is under the exterior. Call it a day Porsche.

 

One point, if you're a Porsche fanboy and you want to post in this topic, get some actual facts to state your argument. If your going to post in here because your dad owns a Porsche, then I'll merrily lock it up.

[Suction Testicle Man]

Interesting stuff; I haven't really considered the fact that the classic Porsche design is all they ever use - I've always thought of them as the supercar division of Volkswagen (yes I know it's more the other way around, but I mean in terms of development and cooperation between them). What we're really talking about is the shoehorn shape, with armrests on the bonnet leading to the circular lights. I have to say I still think that basic design is beautiful, and my opinion simply differs in that I wouldn't say it's exhausted. But this is for two real reasons. The first is that any idiot with enough money will buy one for the badge, regardless of what it looks like (never could understand why the 996 sold with headlights like that - but thankfully they fixed this on the 997). Second is that there should be room for expansion - and no I can't elaborate, I haven't thought about this enough. However, I do plan to utilise my modelling skills to come up with a new design that's Porsche and new. Also going to do a classic Beetle facelift that doesn't look like a dishwasher tablet at some point.

 

Where I do agree however is that Porsche don't seem aware of how they can develop the look further. As far as I saw it, they made cars that looked like the 997 up until the 996, and then they changed the headlights slightly. Eventually that headlight design became the recognised standard for a new Porsche, until they re-introduced the old look that really worked again on the 997 in an attempt to wow the consumer. Ultimately it was a case of making a great design, people getting bored, making a worse design, then slapping back the old one later to fabricate an 'improvement'.

 

So yes, if Porsche don't do something quick people will latch on and sales will suffer. Though saying that, I'd still sell my mother for a 997.

[EvilPenguin]

Actually the Cayanne and the Toureg ride on the same platform. And share some drivetrain options.

 

In regards to new design - seeing as Porsche remains the most profitable car company in the world, I don't think they'll perceive a need to make any major changes in their design philosophy. Every Porsche they make looks like a Porsche. Which means they'll sell them.

[Cran.]

I have to agree, Porsches look all the same, and god knows where they can go with the next 911. The Boxster and Cockster look awkward and the Cayenne is a sin against nature. 911 is nice, but the same as every other 911. That said, I do love the GT3.

 

Most cars go through revolutions. The 911 has slowly evolved into what it is today.

[JGJONES]

I do agree. Their designs are all the same these days. Whats the diffrence between a Boxster and a 911 Convertible? Price and speed. Also minor diffrences eg. Bumper, rims and the Boxster is slightly more curvy and smaller.

 

911 Cabrio:

 

Boxster:

[EvilPenguin]

The big difference is underneath - which is where it matters. The Boxter is a sprightly little bugger - mid engined and with enough power to be eager, but not overwhelming.

 

The 911's performance models are sledgehammers in the automotive world. The gold standard for performance excellence - and all that with a fundamentally flawed design.

[Dup]

Porsche still can't get away from that design! LOL

[DEATH OF THE SKY]

I've always liked the 959 but I lean towards a Ruf RT-12

http://www.rsportscars.com/foto/09/rufrt1205_04.jpg

http://www.carpw.com/pictures/porsche/RUF_RT_12_2005_1.jpg

sorry but I think the ruf relates to this forum but I am sorry if I am wrong

[Picolini]

Well I do agree that it's pretty lame how the main stylings of most of their cars are very similar. Although it does look nice, I myself have a hard time telling certain cars apart, at least the first few times seeing the. As far as I know, all the car's are 911's

 

They do need a fresh look, and they could still keep some styling cues to let people know it is a Porsche, they'd just have to be clever about it. Some of you said it's what's under the body that counts, and while it does, a lot of what people go on when they buy a car is looks. They need to freshen it up and bring out that inner performance part so when you look at it with out knowing what's under the hood (or trunk, lol) you think "God damn that thing must be fast". Of course current ones are very sleek and quite stylish, but compare that too the look of a Ferrari or some other super car, and it looks like a nicer looking mid-range coupe, not a six-digit AWD turbo racer.

[*gta star*]

I'm sick of seeing Porsche's looking the same, I mean, can't they come up with something more original, change the character of their cars more ?

 

The same as Picolini said above, I find it hard to distinguish their cars because they all look practically the bloody same.

[Kaj.]

I say the make a new 924/944. I quite like that particular design.

 

A 944, I believe.

 

[ViceDog]

Offtopic, did my post just magically disappear from this topic?

[GT-1]

Offtopic, did my post just magically disappear from this topic?

Unfortunately it was a good indication of what the Vehicle Talk forum has become, precisely what I said not to post to be honest. I held this exact topic in the Feroci private forum, and got 20 worthwhile in-depth arguments from both sides, yet here I get fanboysim with posts like yours.

 

 

[.59 Reverse]

this again?

 

you never took me up on the offer either..

 

you reeeeeally dont like porsches, huh?

 

it just wouldnt make sense to radically change what makes a porsche a porsche.. BMW's STILL getting back up from the hit that gave them..

 

besides, if it isnt malfunctioning, there's no need to attempt servicing it.. porsches are still selling pretty well, i'm betting.. so i dont hink they're going to try to be new and exciting for people that arent even buying porsches at the risk of screwing up their cashflow from people that are already buying the stuff they produce.

[Wheelman]

The problem with Porsche can be summarised by that god awful, heap of sh*t Cayenne. There's no such thing as a sports SUV, no matter what Porsche and BMW claim. Whichever Porsche executive signed off that concept as a future direction for Porsche should be fired. It completely misses the point of what a company like Porsche should be (and used to be) all about.

 

Which is sportscars.

 

I've no doubt that the sportscars they currently make are fine, superb machines. I've every expectation that they can make the hairs stand up on the back of your neck and make your palms damp with sweat as you sweep along a winding road with the howl of the flat six behind you.

 

But by god, they're boring as product concepts and are bought by the wrong people. There's no flair, ambition or innovation in their design, and imho this is reflected in the majority people who now buy Porsches - not people who are interested in cars or driving, but people who want them as status symbols.

 

Which explains the depressing, but predictable, success of the piece of sh*t Cayenne.

[ViceDog]

 

Offtopic, did my post just magically disappear from this topic? 

Unfortunately it was a good indication of what the Vehicle Talk forum has become, precisely what I said not to post to be honest. I held this exact topic in the Feroci private forum, and got 20 worthwhile in-depth arguments from both sides, yet here I get fanboysim with posts like yours.

Well I'm sorry, but if you took the time to read my post I clearly stated that I in no way intended to sound like a fan boy, and on top of that I am in fact no a fan boy when it comes to Porsche. I have to admit that it might have been a bit too much when i posted a sh*tload of pictures of our visit to the Porsche dealer. There was a reason for that though, I was still very hyped about the fact that we visited a 'supercar' dealer and I wanted to share it.

 

When it comes to automobiles I try to stay as neutral as possible. Yes, there are car firms which I prefer to others, there is no denying that but I in no way intended to sound like a Porsche 'fan boy'.

 

Back to the topic at hand.

 

The Porsche Cayenne has been a controversial issue ever since it was first released to the general public. Some people loved it, and the majority hated it. The Porsche Cayenne is a very big step from their traditional 911 (which more or less made the company what it is). However, looks set aside the performance for such a car is quite a feat and whether you like it or not it still is a Porsche.

 

Edit: And i just read what you wrote at the end of your first post. My dad does not own a Porsche, thank you very much. He drives a Volvo and proud of it.

[*gta star*]

Manufacturing an SUV, I don't think it was a good idea. Porsche are renown for their sports cars, but to build something that is totally different, alot bigger and wider etc and a Porsche aswell just doesn't fit the scene.

 

Porsche are supposed to be for sport, not for making SUV's. Why the hell didn't they spend their money making some of the newer models that they'll release lookdifferent, instead of them looking the same, or similar?

 

How anyone could think a Sports car company to make an SUV would be a good idea is beyond belief.

 

[AZAZEL]

 

Porsche are supposed to be for sport, not for making SUV's. Why the hell didn't they spend their money making some of the newer models that they'll release lookdifferent, instead of them looking the same, or similar?

 

How anyone could think a Sports car company to make an SUV would be a good idea is beyond belief.

 

First you complain that all Porsches look alike, and then get upset when they try something different?

 

As mentioned, Porsche is one of the most profitable car companies in the world, if not the most profitable - that's no indication that their products are anything special, could just be good marketing, but in my opinion the design still works.

[Wheelman]

 

Porsche is one of the most profitable car companies in the world, if not the most profitable

 

Somehow I have a gut feeling that Toyota puts more cash in the piggy bank each year than the Porsche family can even dream about.

 

Although the premise of what you're saying is right - Porsche is doing well, so therefore why fix what isn't broken?

 

To counter that, how long can the Porsche brand retain it's exclusivity, desirability, prestige and reputation whilst simply cashing in on that current prestige without bringing anything new to the table?

[EvilPenguin]

In regards to the Cayenne: While I agree that as a matter of principle, its a travesty. Sales make it a brilliant vehicle for Porsche. They can't stop selling them. And seeing as the SUV was co-developed with VW, there was so little riding on it for Porsche.

 

In regards to Porsche profitability: Porsche makes more money per car than any other auto manufacturer in the world. And is now the preferred vehicle of wealthy America.

 

 

To counter that, how long can the Porsche brand retain it's exclusivity, desirability, prestige and reputation whilst simply cashing in on that current prestige without bringing anything new to the table?

 

Because their products have never become stagnant. Porsche will always deliver a quality product, and since half the world see the car as a statement of, "There, I've made it in life and I now own a Porsche. Bow before me," they'll keep buying the car for the image. And enthusiasts will keep buying Porsche's because they really are that good to drive.

Edited April 18, 2007 by EvilPenguin

[Cran.]

 

As mentioned, Porsche is one of the most profitable car companies in the world, if not the most profitable

They make an average of 40,000 euros (or close to that ) on per car sold.

 

But Toyota probably makes more because they sell a sh*tload more.

 

Actually, i'd like to see a modern day 944.

Edited April 19, 2007 by Cran.

[BCspeed34]

Porsche has to stay around so rich guys can get girls!

 

 

You see, men are hunters, and the car is the bait! You see this chick walking down the road and she's like mmnn... nice Porsche..GOTCHA BITCH!

 

But as for being on topic, it is really weird seeing the cheap Boxter from the front and then later that day think you see another one just to find out it's an $80k plus model. And also, I had no idea Porsche made that much profit. Rich bastards!

[Cran.]

They've been making the same car for 40 years, so the manufacturing costs have gone down, go figure!

[silvermanblue]

I think one of porche's main problems is that VW who owns porche is getting lazy. I mean look at it this way VW has been buying up car companies in europe like madmen and with that they can slack off on new and revoulutionary designs because there is less competition. I mean VW bought Lamborghini and I think bently or rolls or both. But right now there is way to much brand enginering going on in volkswagen these days.

[EvilPenguin]

 

I think one of porche's main problems is that VW who owns porche is getting lazy. I mean look at it this way VW has been buying up car companies in europe like madmen and with that they can slack off on new and revoulutionary designs because there is less competition. I mean VW bought Lamborghini and I think bently or rolls or both. But right now there is way to much brand enginering going on in volkswagen these days.

 

You've got it backwards. Porsche pushes VW's buttons and rumors abound of them buying the company outright or taking a more controlling stake in it.

 

And VW has been anything but lazy recently. From the collective Uterus of VW has sprung a myriad of amazing automobiles recently. From the the new generation Golf and GTI, to the Bugatti Veyron, various massively profitable Bentley models, to the Audi R8 and Lamborghini Gallardo. Vee-Dub group has been incredibly busy of late.

 

I love 'dem Germans. Ich mag Deutschland.

[silvermanblue]

Well yes I am also a big Veedub fan and yes they are making some great cars, Its just all the platform sharing is whats got me worried. Opps did I just contradict myself, whoops. Oh well lets just hope they breath some new life into the Porche name.

[Dup]

Lets come up with a new Porsche concept.

[Picolini]

You see, men are hunters, and the car is the bait! You see this chick walking down the road and she's like mmnn... nice Porsche..GOTCHA BITCH!

Hah, that stuff was hilarious!

 

@Dup, are you serious about that?

[Kaj.]

You see, men are hunters, and the car is the bait! You see this chick walking down the road and she's like mmnn... nice Porsche..GOTCHA BITCH!

Hah, that stuff was hilarious!

 

@Dup, are you serious about that?

He's dead serious.

[Cran.]

Lets come up with a new Porsche concept.

A really ugly van which actually works really well as a van. Along with a sh*t fast twin turbo version.

 

Porsche could borrow one of VW's vans..