Tookie Williams

[Snares]

He was executed this morning at 12AM WCT. But should he really have been executed? My personal thought is he was accused and sentenced of the murders so he was off the street. His clemency was denied, even after in most people's eyes he has proved himself innocent and has redeemed himself through anti-gang books and literature. 24 years on death row is unacceptable in my eyes, the US Supreme Court must have had some considerations if he was kept alive for so long. The execution itself was supposedly a disaster, Tookie was said to look up several times and talk to his executors, with look of "Why is this taking so long?" on his face. It took 35 minutes to kill him the moment the poison was injected.

[Saggy]

I believe that what was done was right, and that the appeal for clemency was a fiasco that shouldn't have been able to happen. The man was convicted of killing four innocent people, and as many pointed out, in his 25 years on death-row, no one found any evidence that would lead them to over-turn this verdict. Many people want to dispute that the all-white jury (although there were two Hispanics) gave a biased verdict, but the fact is that this trial was more of a proxy for other murders that he surely committed. People forget that he was the leader and co-creator of one of the most violent street gangs of all time. These four people that he more than likely killed, were not his only victims.

 

Writing children books about not joining gangs does not earn you redemption from killing people. Not only that, but those books he wrote, probably do a minimal good. Afterall, if you're a teen-ager in South Central LA, living in poverty, which are you more apt to do: Buy a $20 children's book, or join the Crips, a gang Tookie created.

 

The man is responsible for a lot more than what he was convicted for, and it really angers me that people are acting in such a way. Nothing about this man screams to me that he deserved to live after what he's done with his life. The man is directly responsible for the deaths of at least four people, and indirectly responsible for who knows how many more through the Creation of the Crips. That astounding amount of bad, just can't be corrected by writing a few children's books, no matter how many Hollywood celebrities want to climb on and say it does for publicity.

 

I know that someone is going to quote my post, and try to paint a picture that I'm some death-mongering, right-wing fool for supporting the execution of this man, but he was undeniably guilty for more than he was tried for, and in my eyes cannot redeem himself by writing books that more-than-likely didn't even reach his target audience. This will most likely be my only post in this debate, as I can see an onslaught of character attacks coming from those who don't understand my stance, but I've explained it to the best of my ability in an elaborate way. In simpler terms, though, the man simply did more wrong than good.

 

[ATK]

It dosent matter if he wrote books and got prizes and everything. He did what he did and he had to be punished. Although I think that execution was to extreme for his situation. He should have just seved a long jail time not death.

[BrassKnuckles]

Here's my position. I'll keep it brief:

 

Stanley "Tookie" Williams was convicted of four coldblood murders and should be given appropriate punishment. That punishment should not be the death penalty, because we are a civilized society that should not submit to savage and uncivilized urges. That death penalty that was implemented should have been commuted to a life sentence without possibility for parole because of Tookie Williams' anti-gang activism and behavior change. I would also like to point out that "Gang Creation" is not a capital offense and should not be considered in Williams' sentencing, especially considering his current stance on gangs. And I'd like to point out also that Williams didn't write any "children's books."

 

I think I'm missing some stuff.

[Monoxide]

Cant we just leave this topic in general chat? I mean I understand you are trying to make this a 'debate' but it pretty much will result in the exact same thing as the other topic.

[Snares]

Actually, his books have been making impact. From the late 80s till present, the amount of young adults joining gangs has decreased by almost 20%. What happened to Tookie should be against human rights. Keeping him on deathrow for almost 25 YEARS, must have meant that the courts and officials were having considerations about wether he should be executed. His murders were never fully proven, though I must admit, he has most surely murdered others, though they will most likely be gang members, so white Ameri... I mean the US government wouldn't care. It's delicate situation. The EU completely abolishes the capital punishment, the UN should take note.

[Eviscero]

The death penalty has been statistically proven to be an ineffective deterrent for crime, but either way, that's California state law. Tookie was convicted under California state law for a capital offense. He knew full well people get put to death for that. If women in the middle east can be stoned for walking around naked, leave or don't walk around naked. If you can be lethally injected in the USA for murdering four people, don't murder four people or leave.

 

I'm not a huge fan of the death penalty, but I won't lose any sleep over this guy's eternal one.

[AbbaZabba]

35 MINUTE DEATH!!!

Real humane..

The moral is nobody can be rehabilitated.

They should have shot him in the face.

Or better yet, why not just torture him?

 

ME LOVE DEATH! BRING BACK THE COLOSSEUM!!!