What Not To Post.

[Kayuni]

I've noticed the graphics forums, both the requests and general discussion, have been inundated by generally hideous chop-ups of photographs, and signatures that consist of a pre-made image plus a filter or two.

 

Now, although perfection would be nice, it's not going to happen anytime soon.

 

A few things to improve when making signatures; both as their own topics and while answering requests:

 

Your Own:

• If you've decided to post your own signature in the general discussion, please put over 15 minutes of work into it.
• Please refrain from taking a picture and adding filters, followed by your name and a border.
• Stay as far away from San Andreas screenshots as possible.
• Try to avoid over-used fonts such as Old English and Pricedown, they don't make your piece look any better.
• To leave the best impression, try starting from scratch and working your way up, piece by piece.

Requests:

• When fulfilling a request please read what the topic starter would like in their signature.
• Try to avoid the points mentioned above.
• Use only your own work, and not someone else's template.
• Try to create something unique. Individuality makes a signature all that much better.
• If the topic starter doesn't wear your signature, don't flame them for it, and when posting your signature, don't demand that they wear it because it's the best.

 

That said, hopefully at least one person learns from this.

 

I don't need any flaming, I kept names private, but there are a good few people making signatures in the fashion mentioned above.

 

Edit: Thanks for unlocking this.

 

What I meant by this was, "Don't submit work that consists of a cropped screenshot, and some text."

 

A poorly made signature is fine if you're just starting out and actually put some effort into it.

Edited August 29, 2005 by Kayuni

[Superilldude]

Not to attack you or anything, but I don't see this even helping allot. If you want to help them then maybe post some good tutorials? Plus, everyone got to start some where so just leave them alone, it's not like you have to wear them. If they don't post "l33t" art work then their benefiting by discovering new things every time they do digital artwork, and you can just skip them.

 

A sig doesn't have to include all kind of over used skills in a sig, but rather what someone is interested in.

 

P.s: I know people that spent well over an hour on some graphics but their work still sucked and that is when they started, now they can make pretty decent sigs. You just have to flow with it.

 

[niteangel´]

You took the words right out of my mouth SID !

[Otter]

 

If you've decided to post your own signature in the general discussion, please put over 15 minutes of work into it.

 

 

 

[Clown.]

yeah, i agree with SID. when i started my first sig was awful, and i starting using filters and stuff. but i learned and now i make good sigs still make crap sigs, but i'm getting better. you can't expect people to not post anything untill they are a master graphics maker. part of posting crap stuff is so that people can advise how you can make it better.

you've got to live and learn.

[anuj]

 

Not to attack you or anything, but I don't see this even helping allot. If you want to help them then maybe post some good tutorials? Plus, everyone got to start some where so just leave them alone, it's not like you have to wear them. If they don't post "l33t" art work then their benefiting by discovering new things every time they do digital artwork, and you can just skip them.

 

A sig doesn't have to include all kind of over used skills in a sig, but rather what someone is interested in.

 

P.s: I know people that spent well over an hour on some graphics but their work still sucked  and that is when they started, now they can make pretty decent sigs. You just have to flow with it.

 

I like the way he said it.

 

tbh, I don't see this helping too much, otherwise me or papsmearnesta would've written it into the rules. I mean, who are we to tell people what their signature should be. It's their sig, really.

 

I'm rambling.

 

Upon further review:

 

I'm going to reopen this so we can discuss it, at least. I suppose all members should be able to contribute what they believe is 'worth' posting or not. Me and papaincesta shouldn't be the only ones writing rules around here.

Edited August 29, 2005 by anuj

[Kayuni]

If you've decided to post your own signature in the general discussion, please put over 15 minutes of work into it.

 

 

 

Otter: I never posted that for critique. It's a piece of Tsuroki's artwork, given a border. I never said my signature was made by me. I make my own signatures, pixel by pixel, typically, but I like this one as well, plus it fits the Zaibatsu theme.

 

Clown.: See my edit above.

[yngve]

Not to attack you or anything, but I don't see this even helping allot. If you want to help them then maybe post some good tutorials?

 

 

 

 

Tutorials is'nt the solution to everything, you know. It's good if you want to know how to do something specific, but ramdomly browsing tutorials, then copying them step by step is'nt really very educational if you want to learn PS.

 

 

Plus, everyone got to start some where so just leave them alone, it's not like you have to wear them.

 

They have to start somewere. I understand that. Why they have to post every single sh*tty image they make, I do not.

 

 

A sig doesn't have to include all kind of over used skills in a sig, but rather what someone is interested in.

 

Few are the people that are interested in streched screenshots from San An with some text on them.

 

Skill or no skill, when people ask for signatures, I guess they would like something that dose'nt look like some retarded 5 year old made. There is a difference between 'simple signatures' and 'butt-ugly'-signatures.

 

 

P.s: I know people that spent well over an hour on some graphics but their work still sucked  and that is when they started, now they can make pretty decent sigs. You just have to flow with it.

 

Still. No need to actually POST it if it looks horrible.

[SWEETSAPRIK]

As you said, not to name names, but a few people lately have posted things that were not only sh!t, but also not even requested. That should get people a warning.

 

But couldn't possibly disagree with the rest of this less.

 

In GFX General Discussion posting anything asking for advise is good, no matter how much it sucks, and no matter how little effort, time, or skill went into it. That's the whole point of asking for C&C. If it sucks, people will tell you so, and (hopefully) give you ways to improve it. If it was just a copy&paste job, people will tell you to actually do some work, (besides cropping something and adding a border) before asking for C&C. Everyone sucked at one point, it takes time and experience (and occasionally even advise, or a comment along the lines of "It sucks, stop posting") to motivate someone to get better.

 

As for in the REQ and TUT forum, if someone requests a specific image to be cropped and have a minimal amount of text added, then that's what they want. If they ask for something specific and a copy&paste job fits the bill, then they'll use it, whereas if someone with skill comes along and posts something they might use that. Sometimes the requests are really simple, and require no skill, or effort. There are some people on here with amazing skills, and those people rarely reply in a topic that asks for such a simple copy&paste job. As long as the poster actually submitted something close to what was requested, it should be fine. If someone wants to use it they will, if they don't then they won't, simple. A specific topic also comes to mind where someone made a request, and the submissions were all copy&paste jobs except one. That one was made by one of the top ten most skilled people on the board, it was all original, and a fair amount of effort went into it. The member making the request opted for one of the lame, effortless sigs. Why? Because there's no accounting for taste.

 

I for example suck ass at graphics, and I know my own limitations, but I've still had people use a few of my submissions. I only bother making an attempt when I know I have at least a shot at completing it. But there have been times when a topic asks for so little that it sits unanswered for days. Lately it seems like many people have been trying to fill requests, but it hasn't, isn't, and won't always be the case.

[colour_my_world]

Let me add -

 

"Never post anything similar to a post by Colour_My_World"

 

[Kayuni]

As you said, not to name names, but a few people lately have posted things that were not only sh!t, but also not even requested. That should get people a warning.

 

But couldn't possibly disagree with the rest of this less.

 

In GFX General Discussion posting anything asking for advise is good, no matter how much it sucks, and no matter how little effort, time, or skill went into it. That's the whole point of asking for C&C. If it sucks, people will tell you so, and (hopefully) give you ways to improve it. If it was just a copy&paste job, people will tell you to actually do some work, (besides cropping something and adding a border) before asking for C&C. Everyone sucked at one point, it takes time and experience (and occasionally even advise, or a comment along the lines of "It sucks, stop posting") to motivate someone to get better.

 

As for in the REQ and TUT forum, if someone requests a specific image to be cropped and have a minimal amount of text added, then that's what they want. If they ask for something specific and a copy&paste job fits the bill, then they'll use it, whereas if someone with skill comes along and posts something they might use that. Sometimes the requests are really simple, and require no skill, or effort. There are some people on here with amazing skills, and those people rarely reply in a topic that asks for such a simple copy&paste job. As long as the poster actually submitted something close to what was requested, it should be fine. If someone wants to use it they will, if they don't then they won't, simple. A specific topic also comes to mind where someone made a request, and the submissions were all copy&paste jobs except one. That one was made by one of the top ten most skilled people on the board, it was all original, and a fair amount of effort went into it. The member making the request opted for one of the lame, effortless sigs. Why? Because there's no accounting for taste.

 

I for example suck ass at graphics, and I know my own limitations, but I've still had people use a few of my submissions. I only bother making an attempt when I know I have at least a shot at completing it. But there have been times when a topic asks for so little that it sits unanswered for days. Lately it seems like many people have been trying to fill requests, but it hasn't, isn't, and won't always be the case.

Your points are valid, however; As I mentioned as my first point in the R&T section, the artist should try to adhere to the request as closely as possible.

 

These aren't meant to be taken as a set of rules, more as a guideline. If someone requests a simple copy & paste, so be it, it's not contradictory because these aren't set-in-stone rules. If someone wants that, it's their choice, and they have that freedom. My points merely suggest ways to improve certain aspects.

 

When I first started doing graphics, I didn't learn much by slapping some text onto a picture. I started out making ugly-as-sin signatures that I never wore, until I improved. Now, I'm not great, but I at least know my way around, which is good.

 

To end on a high note: I wouldn't say you suck at graphics, I like your signatures, actually.

[Superilldude]

 

Tutorials is'nt the solution to everything, you know. It's good if you want to know how to do something specific, but ramdomly browsing tutorials, then copying them step by step is'nt really very educational if you want to learn PS.

 

Yes, I agree with you but something’s require tutorials to be accomplished, such as scan lines for example, such things can't be learn by doing artwork on and on. You need some person to help you on the way.

 

 

They have to start somewere. I understand that. Why they have to post every single sh*tty image they make, I do not.

 

It's something they are proud of, for them it is pretty neat since they haven’t accomplished something that cool before, but they will have the same point of view as you when they become good and look back on their artwork.

 

 

Few are the people that are interested in streched screenshots from San An with some text on them.

 

Skill or no skill, when people ask for signatures, I guess they would like something that dose'nt look like some retarded 5 year old made. There is a difference between 'simple signatures' and 'butt-ugly'-signatures.

 

 

 

I agree with you on that as well, but you never know what program they use. That makes a huge difference. A decent signature in programs such as paint shop is an ugly signature compared to Photoshop.

 

 

Still. No need to actually POST it if it looks horrible.

 

 

 

That is their risk, some of them post back just to help their friends or such. Again, you don't have look at, criticizes it if you don't want to, or even pick it.

 

Age plays a role as well, your taste changes over the years and we all know the members at GTAF aren't all teens (Majority, but not all)

 

[papanesta]

I allowed him to post it over msn, to see what people would say, more or less.

 

So yeah, I'm not going to lock it or anything, yet.

 

I for one agree with this to the fullest:

 

•When fulfilling a request please read what the topic starter would like in their signature.

Edited August 29, 2005 by papanesta

[yngve]

 

Let me add -

 

"Never post anything similar to a post by Colour_My_World"

 

I can only agree.

 

Because there's no accounting for taste.

 

I can both agree and disagree with that statement. Sure somene could want just a copy&paste job, a screenshot with a border, say. But some of the recent 'pieces' have been so horrible so no level of bad taste can excuse them. Don't want to flame anyone, but christ!

 

Tutorials is'nt the solution to everything, you know. It's good if you want to know how to do something specific, but ramdomly browsing tutorials, then copying them step by step is'nt really very educational if you want to learn PS.

 

Yes, I agree with you but something�s require tutorials to be accomplished, such as scan lines for example, such things can't be learn by doing artwork on and on. You need some person to help you on the way.

 

Uhm. That is exactly what I said.

 

I agree with you on that as well, but you never know what program they use. That makes a huge difference. A decent signature in programs such as paint shop is an ugly signature compared to Photoshop.

 

That is were you are soooo wrong. A decent signature is a decent signature regardless of what tools you use to make it.

 

When I first started doing graphics, I didn't learn much by slapping some text onto a picture. I started out making ugly-as-sin signatures that I never wore, until I improved. Now, I'm not great, but I at least know my way around, which is good.

 

 

(Also, my previous post was entirely about the R&T-section, if someone missed that)

 

Edited August 29, 2005 by yngve

[SWEETSAPRIK]

Thank you Kayuni I try, but I have no illusions about being anywhere near the level of some others here. Most of my "work" (lol) is little more then copy&paste jobs. The only thing I'm really good at is finding pictures and/or fonts that are perfect for the request.

 

And to clarify one of my statements, when I mentioned things that weren't requested, I meant when they don't try to answer the request, only post unrequested crap.

 

If for example a member requests a sig and nothing more, and someone submits what they asked for, and then adds an avatar, and a matching post wrapper, then their extra effort should not be frowned upon.

 

If however a member asks for an avatar, and another member posts a sig, a post wrapper, but no avatar, or even an avatar that is totally off from what was requested, then that person should recieve a warning.

 

And any comments about a signature's quality being related to the program used are just wrong. Viddy can make things in paint that most of us couldn't make in a year using any program. The most that can be said is that a better program can sometimes make up for a lack of skill.

[Superilldude]

 

That is were you are soooo wrong. A decent signature is a decent signature regardless of what tools you use to make it.

 

I think you took what I said wrong, a signature that is made in paint and looks very good for MS paint is some where ugly to Photo Shop. Of course, if you say it was made in paint then everyone would say positive comments but if people don't know that then they will be like your signature sucks and so on or just think that. So, basically for request's, people might not be making them with PS (Photo Shop) but rather some other free program from then net. I'm not saying you are not right because you actually are more right then me about this argument but people do have this problem and I know some who did.

[Kayuni]

I agree with you on that as well, but you never know what program they use. That makes a huge difference. A decent signature in programs such as paint shop is an ugly signature compared to Photoshop.

That is were you are soooo wrong. A decent signature is a decent signature regardless of what tools you use to make it.

 

I concur. I do a large amount of my work in Paint and it turns out far better than if I used Photoshop. Each program has advantages & disadvantages. For example, I wouldn't dream of making anything with pixels in Photoshop, and wouldn't waste my time making a gradient in Paint.

 

Sweet: Yeah, I get what you're saying. Going the extra mile can never hurt.

 

Taking a detour and doing it differently, can.

[Guybrush Threepwood]

I mean, who are we to tell people what their signature should be. It's their sig, really.

If he were to get his way, there would be no authentic Guybrush® sigs!

That'd suck. This world would suck. It'd be a dark and dingy place, full of monsters and whatnot. It'd be the middle ages all over again.

And nobody wants to be responsible for bringing back the middle ages. No sir. Nobody.

[Kayuni]

I mean, who are we to tell people what their signature should be. It's their sig, really.

If he were to get his way, there would be no authentic Guybrush® sigs!

That'd suck. This world would suck. It'd be a dark and dingy place, full of monsters and whatnot. It'd be the middle ages all over again.

And nobody wants to be responsible for bringing back the middle ages. No sir. Nobody.

As I've previously mentioned, it's a general guideline.

 

In general, I'm referring to people who make one signature out of a San Andreas screenshot and add text or a filter.

 

You use many images, which are on a rotator. They've got a different value; as they've each got a unique quote on them, unlike the Thug Lyfe you might see written on the signatures mentioned above?

 

And taking the last bit frivolously; I wouldn't mind bringing back the Middle Ages. More grog and ale than you can fathom, and every man's home truly is his castle.

[Guybrush Threepwood]

 

As I've previously mentioned, it's a general guideline.

 

In general, I'm referring to people who make one signature out of a San Andreas screenshot and add text or a filter.

 

You use many images, which are on a rotator. They've got a different value; as they've each got a unique quote on them, unlike the Thug Lyfe you might see written on the signatures mentioned above?

 

And taking the last bit frivolously; I wouldn't mind bringing back the Middle Ages. More grog and ale than you can fathom, and every man's home truly is his castle.

Well, there you are right. I've even made a sig, with the SA font and a picture of BJ or LJ or AC or whatever his name is, mocking people with such a sig.

But generally when you see a request and somebody makes a thug lyfe sig, ignore it. If somebody wants to degrade himself into wearing it, that's their problem.

Which reminds me to check out the requests sometimes, be philanthropic 'n sh*t.

 

And about the middle ages, well, the ale is good, the homes were nice. But I could never get used to wiping with poison ivy leafs.

[Kayuni]

Well, there you are right. I've even made a sig, with the SA font and a picture of BJ or LJ or AC or whatever his name is, mocking people with such a sig.

But generally when you see a request and somebody makes a thug lyfe sig, ignore it. If somebody wants to degrade himself into wearing it, that's their problem.

Which reminds me to check out the requests sometimes, be philanthropic 'n sh*t.

 

And about the middle ages, well, the ale is good, the homes were nice. But I could never get used to wiping with poison ivy leafs.

What you've said is good and well with the requests forum, which I don't visit all that often, but in the graphics forum, if I come to admire some nicely made graphics, I'd rather not mine for the diamonds. Similarly to model releases for Half-Life, etcetera, I believe that general discussion should be somewhat of a showcase, as well as a place to seek critique and constructive criticism.

 

There aren't too many people anymore who post something half-decent and request criticism on how to improve. More it's just the ignorant who post, and expect rave reviews for their abominations.

 

Occasionally if I see something half-decent, I'll post in there, but those who think their filtered San Andreas images are all that, and stick to that adamantly can't really be helped.

 

So I suppose even if I had worded the original post better, and if it was of some use, it would still be ignored by those who would gain the slightest benfit from it.

 

Not to say that I'm giving up on this. Who knows; someone could stumble upon it and it may help them ever so slightly.