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Was Obama a good president?

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Leftist Bastard
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#331

Posted 2 weeks ago

It always fascinates me how general lack of empathy and pragmatism to a fault is a point of pride to certain conservative folk. It's like middle school all over again only these people potentially chart a course for the whole country.

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The Yokel
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#332

Posted 2 weeks ago

It always fascinates me how general lack of empathy and pragmatism to a fault is a point of pride to certain conservative folk. It's like middle school all over again only these people potentially chart a course for the whole country.

It's called being a sociopath.


Svip
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#333

Posted 2 weeks ago Edited by Svip, 2 weeks ago.

When you are blinded by propaganda, it's easy to see things that way and only that way.

No, what is more curious, is why they bother arguing? I mean, do they honestly believe that they could convince someone to their point of view? Or do they yearn for those moments of slight victories in debates, where their opponents give slightly in?

But this thread is about President Obama. We just recently discussed his foreign policy and anti-gun policies. Both were - to put it bluntly - somewhat fruitless for the previous President. His attempts at resetting relations with Russia failed, and given the US' entanglement in Afghanistan and Iraq, he was ill-prepared to handle Syria, and made blunders in his public statements towards those affairs.

His anti-gun policies yielded nothing. There were quite a few mass shooting incidents during his Presidency, and every time he tried to get the ball rolling, but Congress would not budge.

However, neither of those two points makes President Obama a candidate for worst US president ever. His anti-gun policies were, after all, inconsequential (hell, during his Presidency, gun laws around the country got more relaxed in general). And his foreign policy, while not a success, did not get the US entangled in conflicts abroad to leave for the next administration to handle. And no, Syria doesn't count. You can argue that indirectly the US started it, but then that wouldn't be under the Obama administration either.

On his more positive aspects were his economical policies. President Obama understood the proper relation between government and corporations. During good times, the government should save money and repay its debts. During bad times, the government can then spend its saved money to help out the fledging industries to make things less miserable for the people at large.

You may consider the bailing out to be an inaccurate approach in a free marked economy. But truth be told, with all the tax code loopholes for corporations, we don't really have a free marked economy anyway. Or rather, not a perfect one at that. So the government stepping in is right in line with this.

This is also what bothered me about the counter European approach, which was austerity. Indeed, the European approach did not work as well as the US approach. The US economy got faster back to normal than its European counterparts, and parts of Europe are still suffering from these policies.

President Obama's stance on civil rights, drugs, law enforcement, etc. were also progresses in the right direction. Most of which have been rolled back under the new administration. Particularly on drug enforcement, the US has seen a major shift backwards, because AG Sessions just don't like 'em.

But someone in this thread countered one's suggestion that President Obama was the worst US President ever with a picture of President George W. Bush. However, even Bush isn't the worst US President.

Indeed, looking through history, there are better candidates (and that's ignoring President Trump). Buchanan, Johnson and Harding are far better candidates for 'worst US President'. It's not without reason that Buchanan and Johnson often compete for that position among US historians. Buchanan, for so blatantly missing the start of the civil war, and Johnson for so blatantly mishandling the aftermath of the civil war.

Which also serves to counter another argument against Obama I keep hearing; Obama was a bad President, because Trump is successor. By that logic, Lincoln should be the worst US President ever, as he was juxtapositioned by both Buchanan and Johnson.

But I think President Obama is in the top twenty, particularly for his handling of the financial crisis. Even if there were blunders, it was ultimately good for US citizens. The ACA, while a worthwhile goal, was terribly implemented, but primarily due to concessions made to Republicans.

But President Trump said it himself, the Australians have better healthcare, because they have a single payer system. (Well, he left the clarifier out, but that's why.)
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Eutyphro
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#334

Posted 2 weeks ago Edited by Eutyphro, 2 weeks ago.

It always fascinates me how general lack of empathy and pragmatism to a fault is a point of pride to certain conservative folk. It's like middle school all over again only these people potentially chart a course for the whole country.

Neither empathy nor pragmatism are absolute ethical principles though. Too much empathy for those who struggle can be marginalizing to the individual. And 'pragmatism' can lose track of important principles and values.


thatstupidbug
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#335

Posted A week ago Edited by thatstupidbug, A week ago.

The only perspective I can add about obama, as a "foreigner", it's the influx in media.

 

It has always baffled me how pretty much every president in the groening/seth mcfarlane cartoons were either forgettable or pretty much bad person (nixon, clinton, Bush sr and jr)...EXCEPT OBAMA!

 

He was pretty much flawless, except for one or two friendly jabs

 

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and michelle too was an inspirational, strong woman

 

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I'm not judging if it's a true or false depiction of Obama... just that's weird that almost EVERY president has been derided one way or another (even when still in charge), except him...

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El Diablo
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#336

Posted A week ago

yeah it's pretty funny, with everything that's going on right now, how much people already miss Obama and how much better George WBush looks after all these years. the Trump trainwreck sort of exonerates all the bullsh/t that people used to say about Obama and Bush. called em' the antichrist. call em' Hitler. called em' dictators. said they were trampling on the Constitution. attacks that were used by both Democrats and Republicans. but now we actually have a president who is as close to being impeached or convicted as anyone since Nixon. suddenly everyone can take a step back and examine other politicians in proper context.

 

people passionately hated Bush.

they passionately hated Obama.

 

we can point to things that they did rightly or wrongly, and find a lot to agree on. Bush was simpleton but he could've been a lot worse. Obama was cool but he could've been a lot more effective. fortunately, the one thing that nobody had to worry about was basic competency or trust. we could at least trust Bush and Obama (and Nixon, for that matter) to be intelligent and sympathetic human beings. we cannot trust that our new president is intelligent or competent or empathetic or even patriotic. it's just amazing what can happen in 6 months. absolutely amazing. makes the former presidents look better and better every day.

 

I miss these folks.

VzbNE9n.jpg

 

and this BAMF

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The Yokel
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#337

Posted A week ago Edited by The Yokel, A week ago.

I want Joe Biden to run in 2020. And I want Obama to be his VP. Best duo ever! They should have their own sitcom!

 

Well not really. I still prefer Sanders. But Biden would be my second choice. If I had any say in the matter lol.

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Svip
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#338

Posted A week ago

Obama cannot be VP.

The Yokel
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#339

Posted A week ago

Obama cannot be VP.

He can if it's a sitcom.

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PwnageSoldier
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#340

Posted 3 days ago

Way better than Dickhead McGee in the office right now. He's f*cking everything up with the trade which affects me because I'm on the other side of the deal.

F*ck you Trump. Grow up.

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