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UK Politics & Current Affairs Discussion Thread

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SA's Most Wanted
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#2131

Posted 19 April 2017 - 10:53 PM

Im sorry but, "Eeyore", Oh this has made my day.

Thanks man.


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#2132

Posted 20 April 2017 - 03:19 PM Edited by Argonaut, 20 April 2017 - 03:28 PM.

I do wonder just how cynical May can play this election before the public start to punish her for it. Not turning up to the leader's debates and generally downplaying the manifesto is going to tear up the political capital she needs to keep the narrative on a 'Brexit mandate' (even though she's already been able to tackle the difficult starting gun).

 

 

Labour perusing an 'anti-elites' message as demonstrated today is probably their best bet for garnering support from new voters, but with 7 weeks to go? Difficult to say. The amount of grassroots support Corbyn has to deploy is what keeps my thoughts on a "Difficult to say" level rather than "pack your bags", even though I'm not expecting much in the best of circumstances.

 

The Lib dem's approach is alittle frustrating as their ability on occasions to punch above Labour in opposing the government is limited in appeal when considering their narrow stance on the EU. Meanwhile, UKIP is advertising themselves as a 'reminder' to Theresa May which is just a joke of an approach.


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#2133

Posted 20 April 2017 - 03:25 PM

The Corbyn "anti-elites" stance was a little too reminiscent of Trump's rants about a "rigged system" for my tastes. Not that I'd vote for someone who wants to take money out of my pocket anyway. When he talks about having the "economic elites" pull their weight, what he actually seems to mean is the middle class going on the figures he's publicly backed for bumping tax.

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#2134

Posted 20 April 2017 - 03:31 PM

I do wonder just how cynical May can play this election before the public start to punish her for it. Not turning up to the leader's debates and generally downplaying the manifesto is going to tear up the political capital she needs to keep the narrative on a 'Brexit mandate' (even though she's already been able to tackle the difficult starting gun).

 

I do think Eeyore is being very cynical about the Leaders' debates, although I would expect her to back down later on in an almost, 'oh go on,' type of way.  Especially since now the broadcasters have agreed to carry on with her represented by an empty seat.

 

It's almost as if she's being dismissive of the campaigning already, like she's sure of a landslide.  She might have put the details of Brexit down and gone for the No SIngle Market route, but a lot of Leavers didn't vote for that and they're not happy.  Add to that the Care Crisis, the stripped bare NHS she is failing to help and an education plan that seems to only help those who can afford to pay to get their 11 year olds in grammar schools through tuition and you have an atmosphere for a complete backlash from everyone bar the middle classes.

 

I doubt she'll lose, I really do.  But she's set herself up for a far weaker win then many seem to think.

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#2135

Posted 20 April 2017 - 03:40 PM Edited by Argonaut, 20 April 2017 - 03:47 PM.

The Corbyn "anti-elites" stance was a little too reminiscent of Trump's rants about a "rigged system" for my tastes. Not that I'd vote for someone who wants to take money out of my pocket anyway. When he talks about having the "economic elites" pull their weight, what he actually seems to mean is the middle class going on the figures he's publicly backed for bumping tax.

 
Pretty much. It's almost as if he expects to lose because at no point have I ever seen him actually take the approach of "I understand that you do business here but you have to understand where I'm coming from" which saw Labour turn around it's image in the 90s. One-sided "tear it all down" rhetoric isn't going to earn him my vote.

 

I do think Eeyore is being very cynical about the Leaders' debates, although I would expect her to back down later on in an almost, 'oh go on,' type of way.  Especially since now the broadcasters have agreed to carry on with her represented by an empty seat.
 
It's almost as if she's being dismissive of the campaigning already, like she's sure of a landslide.  She might have put the details of Brexit down and gone for the No SIngle Market route, but a lot of Leavers didn't vote for that and they're not happy.  Add to that the Care Crisis, the stripped bare NHS she is failing to help and an education plan that seems to only help those who can afford to pay to get their 11 year olds in grammar schools through tuition and you have an atmosphere for a complete backlash from everyone bar the middle classes.
 
I doubt she'll lose, I really do.  But she's set herself up for a far weaker win then many seem to think.

 

I'd take a rough guess of between 25-60 seats at best, even at this very early stage. I'll think the Labour vote will either be squeezed and shared between other parties with a bias to hers or it'll be vaporized and divided between Pro-EU / Brexit parties.
 


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#2136

Posted 21 April 2017 - 01:56 PM

While the polls do look favourable to the Tories, let's not forget that UK polls have a tendency to be bad. On average, UK polls are 5 points off the mark a week before the election/referendum. It should be noted, that the polls predicted it would be a toss up for Brexit two days prior to the referendum, and that Trump's victory in the US was within the margin of error.

Another important factor to note is the shy Tory factor. Indeed, UK polls tend to skew in Labour's favour - or to be more precise against the Tories. They more often than not underestimate the Tories.

Sure, that might seem even more in May's favour, but they don't always swing that way.

As the article correctly points out, public opinion in the UK can change fast. People's response to opinion polling lately may have been found in a sense of them not expecting a general election any time soon, but once their votes are actually asked for, they may shift position.

Plus, there is a campaign to be held. And believe it or not, political campaigns actually shift elections.
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#2137

Posted 23 April 2017 - 09:31 AM Edited by SA's Most Wanted, 23 April 2017 - 10:00 AM.

Well, apparently Corbyn is pushing to add an extra 4 Bank Holidays each year.

Oh, and Happy St. Georges Day.

 

Spoiler

 

 

EDIT: Just heard that J.Corbyn 'Isnt ready to have ISIL leader killed'. Well this is very interesting indeed.

Now lets say, hypothetically, Labour wins, Corbyn becomes our P.M. and he starts withdrawing troops from the ground who are training rebel groups and/or Navy & Air Force personnell from the reigion or whatever, not sure how Parliament would be witht that, but like I said, Hypothetical. This in a way, would make our relationship with Trump worse right?

I mean considering how hihgly opionionated that guy is on many things, and how much he yaps on about taking ISIL head on, I mean you only need to look at the crap he has been doing lately to see he isnt exactly planning on messing around with them.

But Corbyn being so against the use of miltary action, including being against the Trident Nuclear Defence System we have in place, I mean I cant imagine him and Trump getting on well, and part of me feels like May & Trump are only as close as they are, because she wants the relationship between the U.K. & the U.S. to stand strong, in thehope that Trump will indeed see the U.K. through trade wise, because of us leaving the E.U.

I mean I could go on and on, but I'd eventually start going off-topic to what I was talking about, so going back to the whole statement Corbyn made with regard to the ISIL Leader, I just want to mention this:

 

Considering, (If I remember rightly), not too long ago, I was reading something regarding British Opinion on Intervention in the Middle East (more specificially, Military Intevention agaisnt ISIL), and the majority believed that we should be over there, both dealing with ISIL, and helping the civillians who are still out there.

For the life of me, I dont remember the source, but now that Ive heard this from Corbyn, its making me think.

Will people be happy with this, as in to think, oh he isnt messing around, and hence Britian might be slightly less of a target because of this, or will people be unhappy with this, as in to think, oh he clearly doesnt want to intervene and take out the leader of ISIL, etc.

Thats the problem with talking about terror-related issues, it seems to get everyone on edge, and actually leave many divided, then again, Politics does divide a lot of people anyway, but you get what I mean.


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#2138

Posted 26 April 2017 - 05:06 PM

I accidentally caught a few moments of PMQ's today. Jesus Christ, I mean its great that it's done but its so embarrassing and childish.

This early election will at least put Corbyn out of his misery. Labour will then be able to rebuild into some kind of proper party.

I would laugh if the SNP loose some seats to the Tories. That would put some icing on the cake.

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#2139

Posted 27 April 2017 - 12:32 PM Edited by Uncle Sikee Atric, 27 April 2017 - 04:07 PM.

Well, it has being an 'interesting' morning in the land of the Blue :

Boris' comments that saying no to the US over Syria would be difficult has a few interesting and alarming thoughts. Is it another case of Blustering Boris, or is he really suggesting they would strike against Syria without the approval of Parliament? If it's the latter, then perish the thought, but Eeyore really could be going 'full dictator' on the UK, almost like this predicts :
 
c50ae343690947.57f8d171dc5f0.jpg
 
Meanwhile, beyond the White Cliffs, Angela Merkel has finally voiced what most of us already knew. She's told the other 27 member states of the EU that 'some people in the UK have a false image of Brexit', like they will have a chance to cherry pick the best bits and leave the waste.

About time if you ask me, hopefully some of these illusionists will listen.

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#2140

Posted 29 April 2017 - 10:33 AM Edited by Uncle Sikee Atric, 29 April 2017 - 10:35 AM.

(Double post time again, but this is very interesting)

The Non-London regions are having as much fun as the London region now the General Election is getting into full swing.

First of all, this appeared in the news yesterday.... Is the EU considering a unified Ireland as a real possibility? Given the fractured state of NI politics currently, it must be a possibility.

Meanwhile, the Northern Non-London region is also having a field day, with with the suggestions Eeyore is more in touch with Scots than Sturgeon.

It's a curious suggestion and may be true, but it has caused a furor and an open letter to be written (This is from Leslie Thomson and taken from Facebook, I'm not sure of the original source currently.)
 

An Open Letter to Ruth Davidson - From Leslie Thomson
*
Dear Ruth,
I today received a shameful Scottish Conservatives leaflet, written by you, "We need to send Nicola Sturgeon and the SNP a message they CAN'T ignore".
In this leaflet, you claim "The SNP promised the 2014 independence referendum would be a 'once in a generation' vote." and accuse the First Minister and her party of breaking that promise.
In fact, no such promise was ever made. Alex Salmond and Nicola Sturgeon both gave their opinions that the vote should be a once in a generation event. You and your party have continually tried to twist these opinions to make them sound like SNP policy, which they never have been.
Not two weeks ago your boss, Theresa May, was saying there would be no General Election until 2020. Was that a promise? And if so, is that now a broken promise?
You say "Nicola Sturgeon is demanding another independence referendum". In fact, in 2015 Scotland sent 56 out of 59 MPs to Westminster, whose goal is Scottish independence. Nicola Sturgeon stood for election as First Minister in 2016 on a mandate to seek a second referendum on independence, and the majority of the Scots electorate voted in an SNP government on that understanding.
And while we are on about broken promises, in the run up to the 2014 referendum, the Scots electorate were told that staying in the Union was the only way to stay in the EU. The subsequent vote to leave the EU, opposed by 62% of the Scots electorate across all 32 local authority areas, gave a distinct change in constitutional matters, which gives even more impetus for the importance a second referendum on independence.
If the Scots electorate do not want a second referendum on independence, then the continued popularity of the SNP is a very strange way of showing it.
You say "We need to send her a clear message - we don't want another vote on independence." And who do you quote on that? The Scottish Daily Express, the Scottish Daily Mail, and the Scotsman; three newspapers known to be extremely sympathetic to the Conservative Party and Unionist views.
You say "Only the Scottish Conservatives can be relied on to send that message", and supply headlines of Jeremy Corbyn, saying it should be held, a "Labour Deputy" saying they would not stand against it, and Nick Clegg warning against trying to block it.
Have the Conservatives learned nothing from the 1990s, when yours was the only party to completely oppose a referendum on devolution? That referendum went ahead despite Tory opposition - and ultimately gave you the post which you hold today. Now that senior political figures are saying that a second independence should be held, do you not think it would be wise to listen to them? Or are you intent on being on the wrong side of history yet again?
On the rear of the leaflet you say "her government should get back to the job they were elected to do - improving our schools and hospitals and growing our economy".
That would be the Scottish schools which are doing better than their counterparts in England in the core subjects, in a Scotland which is the best educated country in Europe. The Scottish hospitals which are outperforming hospitals in England. And yes, the Scottish economy did fall, along with the rest of the UK, in the wake of the EU Referendum. Yet Scotland has the lowest unemployment in the UK, and businesses continuing to start up and locate in Scotland. The Scottish economy is in fact doing rather well, despite the Westminster and the Union holding it back from its true potential.
When I look at the way that Westminster is mismanaging education, health and the economy, compared to Holyrood, I know which I prefer.
You say "Week in, week out, we will continue to demand the SNP drops its obsession with independence." Go ahead. And you will only make people sick to death of your continual one-issue parroting. It will be about as effect as your petition to block a second independence referendum was; not at all.
You then state that you will challenge the SNP to deliver "better public services, safer streets, and more jobs", while conveniently failing to mention that Scotland has excellent public services, crime is at an all-time low in Scotland, and - again - unemployment in Scotland is lowest in the UK.
But then, neither do you make any mention, nowhere, not once in the entire leaflet, the policies of the Scottish Conservatives on any of these issues.
All you have is negativity. All you can do is keep whinging about a second independence referendum. And given that we have local authority elections in May and a general election in June, for you to fail to make any mention of what your policies are on any of the above, indeed no mention of any Conservative policies at all, is utterly despicable.
And here's the rub, although I do want a second referendum on independence, I am not even a member of the SNP, or any political party for that matter. As such, I was completely turned off by your leaflet and all the negativity it contains. I am only writing this before I put your leaflet in the bin, which is the only fit home for it.
This is one voter you have completely failed to reach, and have only made all the more determined to vote for the SNP; who are delivering upon their election promises, despite the Westminster government doing their utmost to try and stop them doing so.
If you had any courage of your convictions, you would not oppose a second referendum on independence. That you are so vociferously against it suggests to all is that your real fear is that it would deliver a resounding YES for an independent Scotland.
If you are so sure Scotland does not want independence, put your money where your mouth is, persuade the Prime Minister to allow a second referendum, and allow the people of Scotland to decide.
Yours faithfully, a well-informed Scot
Leslie Thomson


This battlecry makes the Tories look rather out of touch north of the border if you ask me....

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#2141

Posted 29 April 2017 - 11:18 AM

I have to say, I am more than a little tired of people suggesting Theresa May is going to somehow dismantle the entire NHS, or go full-on Thatcher. I've seen nothing so far that suggests this. She's not a monster, and the hysterics about her don't help anyone.

I trust her, as a person, far more than I trust the Conservative Party as a whole. Perhaps not enough to actually vote for her, because the track record of that party, as a whole, in regards to their treatment of the poor and working classes has not been the the best. Neither in terms of my conscience, nor my own self-interest, could I ever vote Conservative. But I don't think they want to destroy the country, or intentionally starve the poor, or anything as dramatic as that.


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#2142

Posted 01 May 2017 - 02:36 PM Edited by Uncle Sikee Atric, 01 May 2017 - 02:37 PM.

This is interesting, but it does beg the question, which side is right, or is the actual answer somewhere inbetween?

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#2143

Posted 01 May 2017 - 08:55 PM

Considering the dinner was behind closed doors, it depends on who "leaked" the story to the paper, and what their motives were.  The paper that published it is centre-right, which is on the spectrum of the Tories, so I doubt it would be a for any side scoring, it's likely to be more of a pro-Unionist stance considering that Germany has the most to lose in any negotiations, that is until we know more what's going to happen in France.


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#2144

Posted 05 May 2017 - 07:01 PM

Well, judging from the local election results UKIP is all but finished. I'm not happy about all these Conservative gains across the country, but I suppose we can take some solace in the complete humiliation of Farage's merry band of twats.


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#2145

Posted 05 May 2017 - 10:08 PM

UKIP wanted us out of Europe and they got it. I'd say that's satisfaction not humiliation. They achieved their ultimate goal and can now happily fade away with their heads held high. 

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#2146

Posted 05 May 2017 - 10:16 PM

Hitler wanted Jews burned alive in ovens and he got it. I'd say that's satisfaction not humiliation. he achieved his ultimate goal and can now happily fade away with his head held high.

 

:breadfish:

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#2147

Posted 06 May 2017 - 08:19 PM

So anyways, interesting that the Tories are even making gains in Scotland. Be nice to see the SNP lose a few seats come June. This and the polls I've seen regarding a 2nd independence referendum make me feel quite confident Scotland won't be leaving us anytime soon.


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#2148

Posted 06 May 2017 - 08:27 PM Edited by Uncle Sikee Atric, 06 May 2017 - 08:28 PM.

So anyways, interesting that the Tories are even making gains in Scotland. Be nice to see the SNP lose a few seats come June. This and the polls I've seen regarding a 2nd independence referendum make me feel quite confident Scotland won't be leaving us anytime soon.

 

Not that we won't lose Northern Ireland, now the EU has agreed that NI would auto-join if Ireland unified, plus it voted Remain in the Referendum and the DUP has lost a lot of ground....

 

The SNP losing seats to the Tories wouldn't change any Independence Referendum result right now.  Besides, the earliest point for one would be later next year, once the Scots have seen a rough idea of what they would get from a Brexit Deal.  How they feel about it then would affect the result, Tory gains or not.

 

I'm personally laughing at the Pro-Brexit press as it flusters over Eeyore imploding over the EU stance and fawning over her 'Brexit Bob' haircut....  I'm certain there will be a cartoon Brexit Bob that will be the official mascot for the Tory Brexit failure over the coming years.

 

I'm sure Eeyore will be booted out over Brexit before the next five years are up.  She's gonna fail for the same reason Maggie went before her, Europe, talk about a perfect legacy for her premiership. 

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#2149

Posted 09 May 2017 - 03:30 PM Edited by Uncle Sikee Atric, 09 May 2017 - 03:37 PM.

Double post time yet again, but now it's the launch period for the manifestos and the advertising, something very 'worrying' has started to appear :
 

Prime-Minister-Theresa-May-on-the-genera

 

As much as I detest Eeyore, this isn't the actual thing I am complaining about, nor is it the fact that everything is being so carefully stage managed to keep the hostile, unwashed masses away, it's the slogan behind her!  Theresa May's Team?  Have the Tories actually lost it and put it all on El Presidente to lead us forward as a true dictator?

 

It's a very alarming sign for a campaign that is basically already won, but it seems the spin doctors are actually wondering if it's her, or the party that have the ratings so high, or is there another reason within the Tories for Team Theresa May?  Personally it screams of a beautiful parody :

 

1oomhx.jpg

 

But are the Tories setting themselves up for a massive fall?  Given the fragile state of the PM over the EU and the lukewarm attempts to improve her android-like personality, are they putting too much on Eeyore for when things start to fail, which they will when things like the Brexit talks go as far south as expected, or the immigration figures never get anywhere near the repeated pledge of 'tens of thousands.'

 

Nothing about the Tories is making me believe they're a strong party.  It is just nagging me that they're not trying to win this election by improving ratings, if things carry on as they are right now, their ratings could actually start to slip rapidly as no other Tory is making an effort, just Eeyore harping on about strength and unity. 

 

Just like Mr Meeseeks himself, Team Theresa May could disappear into an ether of non-existence as soon as the job is done.


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#2150

Posted 16 May 2017 - 11:16 PM

I have to say, I am more than a little tired of people suggesting Theresa May is going to somehow dismantle the entire NHS, or go full-on Thatcher. I've seen nothing so far that suggests this. She's not a monster, and the hysterics about her don't help anyone.

The NHS has been being dismantled bit by bit for a long while now, the likely election of the Tories again on June 8th will probably speed that up unless there is a hung parliament. So no, she's not single handedly going to dismantle the entire NHS but you're a fool if you think she is going to protect it.

 

As for her not being a "monster", well, these types of descriptions are of course subjective but if we look at her voting record

 

Voted against the hunting ban

Voted against scrapping the bedroom tax
Voted against equalising the age of consent for homosexual and hetrosexual couples
Voted against same sex adoption 

Voted against repeal of section 28

 

She has apologised for her past voting record (for whatever that's worth to you) so yeah maybe monster is a bit too strong. Still, lying hypocritical tory bellend probably fits okay. 
 


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#2151

Posted 19 May 2017 - 04:45 PM

Well, another week has gone by in the race (or non-race if you take the Tories at face value) for the General Election and this has been the week the manifestos have appeared, but there's been a rather differing view to the results.
 
Let's start with the release of the Labour manifesto on Tuesday as it was the first of the mainstream ones to be released....  Now this manifesto was quite detailed and fairly balanced, even down to the costings :
 
18556294_10155063631496049_4401885468206
 
This sort of clarity is pretty unusual for Labour, usually they have an annoying tendency to hide the numbers and not reveal detail, but this time they have been very open, very clear and very honest and that is probably Red Jezza leading in the way he does.  So his manifesto deserves some praise for the refreshing detail and plans, it even had the chance of steal votes off the Tories and provide a real alternative to Eeyore, how did the papers respond?
 
_96082034_dm-frontpage-17may2017.jpg
_96082470_index.jpg
 
Yup, Ian Brady got as much of the limelight, even though that evil bastard doesn't even deserve an obituary and he died the day before the manifesto launch....
 
So Thursday comes around and we reach the Tory manifesto launch, which actually has an alarming number of new points in it that will affect all ages and threatens to tighten the stranglehold El Presidente Eeyore, wishes to have over us, stealth taxes on the elderly (doubly so for those suffering dementia), the scrapping of free school meals for infants, to be replaced with a free school breakfast (so they lose a balanced and healthy meal and instead get a bowl of cereal and a piece of toast, let alone most kids don't attend school breakfast clubs), a Brexit we have no control over and we leave, no deal or not (The complaint here is there is no room for negotiation, something she really hasn't grasped is the absolute lack of control the EU will grant her over the talks).  But then there's the little things niggling too (This proposal, hidden in the back of the manifesto paperwork is discussing the fact the Government wants to control internet content at a state level, whatever happened to the idea of free speech, or are we becoming the new China in leaving the EU?). 
 
How do the papers respond on Friday?
 
_96097022_eex18p001-1st.jpg
_96097026_the-sun-front-page-18.05.17.jp
591d755c270000520090ea5e.png
 
Spot the difference?  I'm struggling to see how Labour can get the message across when the print media is so Tory biased at this time, yet the Tories have not produced decent costings for their proposals (Eeyore even dithered on the manifesto launch podium about one costings question and gave a 'wait and see' answer!).  Meanwhile the television and radio stations keep asking for interviews with the strong and stable android and her cronies, yet they keep refusing, barring the softest grilling ever on The One Show couch, (The ITV Leadership Debate on Thursday was a huge own goal for the Tories, while Red Jezza refusing to attend because Eeyore wasn't there didn't help them either....)
 
But at least the TV and radio stations are trying now.  The BBC has been constantly criticized for not appearing to provide a fair balance and I think those sorts of comments are a little unjustified in the current situation, the Corporation seems to be trying it's hardest to provide a fair view of equality, especially on 5 Live Radio, but the sheer bloody mindedness of this bunch of Tories is astounding.  The best example today was the Victoria Derbyshire  show, where all the other parties were represented by members, while the Tories flat outright refused to attend when it was only a small cross section of people, unsure of who they would vote on June 8th!
 
So the print media is totally stuck up the rectal passage of Eeyore, while the rest are either ignored or carefully sent to pre-arranged mass meets where only Tories and staged questions are present.  It became clearer why earlier this week when a voter caught Eeyore during a rare walkabout, the result spoke volumes for everyone as to the fragility of the Tories and Eeyore, when she clearly couldn't determine the differences between mental illness and learning disabilities and spouted off the same dogma she's been drawling for months.
 
Eeyore has even annoyed the palace (yet again) with this election.  Brenda was due to be overseas on an important state visit to Spain on the day of the vote and that has all had to be rapidly rearranged, pretty much at the last minute.  While many might not think that is an important visit, they fail to notice the diplomatic hostility over Brexit, Gibraltar and the trade gaps between Spain and the UK that Brenda was supposed to be helping to bridge, instead it's all been thrown into disarray and now it looks likely that the new Spanish timetables will mean it's Phil's last trip at Brenda's side, before he finally withdraws from his main duties.  
 
All this Tory smugness and lack of tact over the election is actually starting to suggest the polls are changing. The latest polls suggest the gaps between the parties are starting to close and Labour is on the up, with positive climbs for both Labour in general and Red Jezza's leadership.  Maybe the political atmosphere in the UK is starting to alter, if only the print media would notice....

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#2152

Posted 20 May 2017 - 12:19 PM

I forget. Why do you call The Queen "Brenda", and May "Eeyore" again? Alright then now that we've got the deep politics out the way...

 

I agree with the decision to get rid of some of the unnecessary OAP bribes like the winter fuel allowance. Also agree with getting rid of free school meals. If you can't afford to feed your children then you're horribly mismanaging your finances and need to cut back on something else. Free school meals doesn't subsidise the cost of school meals, it subsidises other things which are then covered by not having to pay to feed your kids. If a child is not being fed by their parents then their parents clearly have their priorities wrong and are also committing a criminal act in the form of neglect. It's also not like it gets rid of govt support. There's already support provided by the govt in the form of child benefits. Feed your kids instead of getting a pack of fags or a new phone.


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#2153

Posted 20 May 2017 - 12:29 PM

I think you are confusing 'not able to properly feed their children' with 'not able to feed their children'. Some parents' lives are incredibly complicated due to debt, their work and personal lives. You can make the argument then that the children should be taken away from them, but in general, it's cheaper to provide school meals than to take care of people's children.

I mean, what's the alternative? The children just not getting fed? School meals exists because there was a problem. Removing them will simply reintroduce that problem.

But hey, f*ck those children that will go hungry or eat unhealthy diets. If my parents were making some f*cked up decisions, I'd like for my government to come in and do something about it. School meals are an effective and cheap place to start.

And that's with the caveat, that I come from a country where we don't have school meals at all. Not in government schools anyway, you better had to bring your own meal.

Actually, I don't know how it is anymore, I haven't gone to school for a long time.
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Uncle Sikee Atric
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#2154

Posted 20 May 2017 - 03:38 PM Edited by Uncle Sikee Atric, 20 May 2017 - 03:39 PM.

I forget. Why do you call The Queen "Brenda", and May "Eeyore" again?

 

The Queen as Brenda is a reference to Private Eye, when the magazine gave the royals, 'working class nicknames' after the 1969 documentary 'Royal Family.'

 

The Queen - Brenda

Phil - Keith

Charlie - Brian

 

As for Eeyore, it's a lookalike, in personality and looks :

 

Eeyore_3.jpg

theresa-may-an103106230epa05433683.jpg

 

 

I agree with the decision to get rid of some of the unnecessary OAP bribes like the winter fuel allowance. Also agree with getting rid of free school meals. If you can't afford to feed your children then you're horribly mismanaging your finances and need to cut back on something else. Free school meals doesn't subsidise the cost of school meals, it subsidises other things which are then covered by not having to pay to feed your kids. If a child is not being fed by their parents then their parents clearly have their priorities wrong and are also committing a criminal act in the form of neglect. It's also not like it gets rid of govt support. There's already support provided by the govt in the form of child benefits. Feed your kids instead of getting a pack of fags or a new phone.

 

Means testing the winter fuel allowance is okay with me, it's the cost of care cover that is alarming, perish the thought you get dementia as well.  It's a badly thought out issue and will weigh heavily on many families.

 

Free school meals are a different issue.  Most kids don't attend breakfast clubs to benefit from free breakfasts and the basic plans do not allow for a balanced meal, which is what free lunches do.  Besides, in families like mine, we receive free meals because my wife is disabled and I am her stay at home carer.  These proposals do not consider situations like ours, Tory supporters just class us as scroungers and to stop buying booze and fags.  I have never smoked and I have not had a drink in three months, plus I follow a healthy eating plan and have lost 4 stone to gt to where I am.

 

Besides, the health service solution is just to employ more staff, sod the fact that half the staff already there are feeding their families on the breadline and nurses have resorted to using food banks to feed themselves.  The staff already there deserve recognition and pay increases, then their morale and productivity would benefit, so the situation improves.  Pay them right before taking on extra staff.

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#2155

Posted 20 May 2017 - 04:55 PM

The biggest problem with the NHS is collectively middle and senior management. It's endemically, institutionally incompetent. If you sacked 80% of the non-practicing staff you'd probably improve productivity automatically and free up enough cash to recruit more nurses and give everyone a healthy pay rise.

I'm not averse to people who have the means to do so having to contribute towards the costs of their social care. I don't see any reasonable alternative given the demographic changes in this country. We're already seeing a generation poorer than their parents for the first time in modern history, I think it's only reasonable to defer some of the rapidly increasing costs of care to the people receiving it rather than having a diminishing number of workers being disproportionately taxed to pay for it.

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#2156

Posted 21 May 2017 - 11:24 AM

To be fair to May, nothing she has proposed seems too awful to me. Means-testing social care isn't the worst idea in the world, and it's hardly as if she's tossing the elderly into the nearest flop house.

Besides, political loyalties in this country are largely tribal in nature, and mostly unaffected by actual policy. The older generation will always vote Conservative, and would still do so even if May was half the monster that people believe. She can afford to squeeze the older generation, and still count on their votes.


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#2157

Posted 21 May 2017 - 11:53 AM

Tactically it's actually a great time to implement such a policy. All the opposition parties are polling so badly that they can gladly alienate a good chunk of their core support with a single policy and still win a landslide.

Then they can point to it and say "see, we're taking the financial burden of later life care off the working population". Quite clever really.

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#2158

Posted 21 May 2017 - 01:26 PM Edited by Uncle Sikee Atric, 21 May 2017 - 01:36 PM.

Tactically it's actually a great time to implement such a policy. All the opposition parties are polling so badly that they can gladly alienate a good chunk of their core support with a single policy and still win a landslide.

Then they can point to it and say "see, we're taking the financial burden of later life care off the working population". Quite clever really.


But the polls issued today suggest the support is slowly draining away, with several Sunday polls released and they place the Tories only about 9 to 12 points in front. In terms of actual seats, based on these polls, the majority she could expect to have is around 40, rather less than the 100+ she was aiming for. (we all know the polls have been wrong so some variance is expected, but all of them are showing this increase of support for Labour.)

Even the print media is noticing this drain of support and voicing their alarm to the faithful, but I'm suspicious some of the core voters for the Tories may not actually vote, in protest of these proposals. They might have a point of actually doing something to alleviate care costs, but snapping the hands of those that cannot even realistically vote due to dementia and memory issues is typical of the Tories, 'hit those who cannot hit back' seems to always have been their mantra....

Also, this 'plan' is only short term as growing numbers in the UK only rent their homes and never own them. As more and more are sold to pay for care costs, the families left behind will struggle still further to pay for their own homes in future with only 100K to split between siblings. The result will be more landlords, more rents and fewer and fewer estates worth more than 100K+, so in a generations' time the plan will be essentially worthless, what then?

EDIT - Just had a thought, there is a blatant loophole in these plans as well. Equity Release companies part buy homes owned by OAPS and they then live in them while releasing significant funds, these funds are then transferred to family, or used by the OAPS and when they die, the equity release company take the lions share of the sale of the house, the family get their guaranteed 100k and the care system gets the dregs! What a brilliant solution to not pay for your care after all....

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#2159

Posted 22 May 2017 - 04:27 PM

The Dementia Tax and subsequent climb down is mind-blowing. Almost any other GE in history that would almost be a death knell for the Tories. Starting to think we may see a hung parliament if this keeps up. 

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#2160

Posted 22 May 2017 - 06:28 PM

The Dementia Tax and subsequent climb down is mind-blowing. Almost any other GE in history that would almost be a death knell for the Tories. Starting to think we may see a hung parliament if this keeps up. 

I wouldn't bet on it.

At this point, I think Corbyn could promise to line the streets with gold and make it rain marshmallows, and it still wouldn't be enough. I really hope I'm wrong, but that's how I see it going.

Worse, I really doubt he'll step down, even if he loses. 





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