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Controversial Coppers: Shootings, the racist argument, and the effects

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#1741

Posted 19 June 2017 - 09:55 PM

https://www.washingt...m=.8934b52cb766

 

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#1742

Posted 22 June 2017 - 05:10 AM

The cop that shot Philando Castile... was he having a bad trip off some psychedelics? Why was he so over the top scared and paranoid? He was scared sh*tless lmao
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#1743

Posted 22 June 2017 - 05:47 AM

The cop that shot Philando Castile... was he having a bad trip off some psychedelics? Why was he so over the top scared and paranoid? He was scared sh*tless lmao

 

It's because Philando Castile was black, and the police force internalized racism. That's the reason why distressed white people get treated with utmost care by the police, whereas distressed black people end up in a coffin.

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#1744

Posted 22 June 2017 - 06:11 AM

The cop that shot Philando Castile... was he having a bad trip off some psychedelics? Why was he so over the top scared and paranoid? He was scared sh*tless lmao

 
It's because Philando Castile was black, and the police force internalized racism. That's the reason why distressed white people get treated with utmost care by the police, whereas distressed black people end up in a coffin.

I feel Americans are pretty much programed to fear blacks and other minorities through media and the subtle systematic racism we're conformed to. Luckily we're in the information age and the younger generation is smart enough to think for themselves but older generations are hopelessly sheepy and will internalize everything the see or hear on cable news. That being said, I can understand why the cop might be 'cautious' (some of the police training is questionable as well)

Furthermore, this guy seemed completely unfit to be a cop. He was a petrified, jumpy, hysterical mess.

I believe I have a good judgement of character and by my observation I dont believe the cop was some racist pos intent on killing blacks. Just some coward who, freaked out and overreacted. Watching the video you can tell he kinda knows he f*cked up

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#1745

Posted 22 June 2017 - 06:29 AM

 

I believe I have a good judgement of character and by my observation I dont believe the cop was some racist pos intent on killing blacks. Just some coward who, freaked out and overreacted. Watching the video you can tell he kinda knows he f*cked up

 

That's the problem; the system is racist, so the cops end up fitting the system.

 

Last year police was called to a suspected mentally ill man with a gun trying to kill himself. They arrive and find the mentally ill white man sitting in the road, with the person hired to take care of him, a black dude, nearby trying to calm him down. Upon the police arrival, the black man proceeds to lie down, hands in the air, and speaking calmly with the police to explain the situation. Everything perfectly calm. Explains that the mentally ill white man didn't have a gun; it was a toy train. And due to his disability, he can't comply with police orders very easily. 

 

In an instant, the black man was shot. Out of the blue. His reaction is to ask "why did you shoot me?". The officer replied: "I don't know.". Even after clearing it all up, he was still handcuffed and made to wait for 20 minutes, WITH A GUNSHOT WOUND, before getting any medical attention.

 

That's institutional racism. That's the systemic racism. Endemic to the police force since it started off as a force for capturing escaping slaves. The officers themselves might not racist pieces of sh*t; but it doesn't matter, because that's how they're trained to act. The dude was on the ground for f*cks sake. 

 

Conversely, young white male is found eating a man's face off after killing him and his wife. Police tries their best to reason with him but he won't budge. They keep trying to end it peacefully, despite the fact the guy just killed two people and is literally eating one of their faces. Eventually they resorted to tasering him, kicking him, and finally setting the dog on him when it was clear he wouldn't stop.

 

Had he been black, he'd have been shot on the spot. Like Terrence Crutcher did as he stood beside his broken down car in the middle of a road. Several police officers arrived on the scene, including a helicopter, and approached him with guns drawn. He kept explaining to them the situation, they didn't care. One of the officers ended up opening fire and killing him. After the slaying, another officer commented on how he was a "bad dude" from his appearance.

 

That's institutional racism for you.


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#1746

Posted 22 June 2017 - 07:06 AM

@Tchuck

Location has alot to do with it as well. In the case of that care giver, I think that cop WAS a racist pos. Not uncommon in the south. Disgustingly strong ignorance in the south...not only that but it seems the poor areas and nieghborhoods nationwide are the places where cops like to "reach thier quotas".

Cops pick on poor people. A good percentage of blacks are poor from the systematic racism I'm sure you know about (It's too deep and complex) Not the petty stuff, I'm talking about banks redlining, mass incarceration of males...all that good stuff

Classism is an issue affecting all Americans. It should be all of us vs the 1% but the super rich, tptb do a great job of making us pawns fight each other over stupid petty sh*t like skin pigmentation, while we slave away at work to make them richer. Cops are thier soldiers.

Also, cops do kill alot of white ppl as well but you wont hear it as much because cable news needs to fuel race tensions for the 1% to profit. Although I agree cops definitely would kill a "scary" black guy faster than a white guy

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#1747

Posted 22 June 2017 - 07:15 PM

I think 

 

 

 

I believe I have a good judgement of character and by my observation I dont believe the cop was some racist pos intent on killing blacks. Just some coward who, freaked out and overreacted. Watching the video you can tell he kinda knows he f*cked up

 

That's the problem; the system is racist, so the cops end up fitting the system.

 

Last year police was called to a suspected mentally ill man with a gun trying to kill himself. They arrive and find the mentally ill white man sitting in the road, with the person hired to take care of him, a black dude, nearby trying to calm him down. Upon the police arrival, the black man proceeds to lie down, hands in the air, and speaking calmly with the police to explain the situation. Everything perfectly calm. Explains that the mentally ill white man didn't have a gun; it was a toy train. And due to his disability, he can't comply with police orders very easily. 

 

In an instant, the black man was shot. Out of the blue. His reaction is to ask "why did you shoot me?". The officer replied: "I don't know.". Even after clearing it all up, he was still handcuffed and made to wait for 20 minutes, WITH A GUNSHOT WOUND, before getting any medical attention.

 

That's institutional racism. That's the systemic racism. Endemic to the police force since it started off as a force for capturing escaping slaves. The officers themselves might not racist pieces of sh*t; but it doesn't matter, because that's how they're trained to act. The dude was on the ground for f*cks sake. 

 

Conversely, young white male is found eating a man's face off after killing him and his wife. Police tries their best to reason with him but he won't budge. They keep trying to end it peacefully, despite the fact the guy just killed two people and is literally eating one of their faces. Eventually they resorted to tasering him, kicking him, and finally setting the dog on him when it was clear he wouldn't stop.

 

Had he been black, he'd have been shot on the spot. Like Terrence Crutcher did as he stood beside his broken down car in the middle of a road. Several police officers arrived on the scene, including a helicopter, and approached him with guns drawn. He kept explaining to them the situation, they didn't care. One of the officers ended up opening fire and killing him. After the slaying, another officer commented on how he was a "bad dude" from his appearance.

 

That's institutional racism for you.

 

 

Think about things like the MOVE bombing of Philadelphia. The police literally bombed a black militant group in the middle of a Philadelphia neighborhood.  Meanwhile, look at what happens when a bunch of white militants take over a federal installation at a wildlife refuge...

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#1748

Posted 26 June 2017 - 09:32 PM

LOL: https://www.washingt...m=.7c83aa8df2a5

 

But it's not systemic racism, right? It's not like cops see blacks as a threat. That would be outrageous.

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#1749

Posted 29 June 2017 - 01:30 PM

LOL: https://www.washingt...m=.7c83aa8df2a5

 

But it's not systemic racism, right? It's not like cops see blacks as a threat. That would be outrageous.

You just took how the Washington Post framed the incident as self evident truth, but if you look at the description of the incident, they were fired at by several armed suspects, I'm guessing most likely black. The officer was in fear of his life, and made a terrible mistake, possibly a criminal mistake depending how careless he was, but if the off duty cop would've been white it would not have been news.


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#1750

Posted 29 June 2017 - 02:01 PM

 

LOL: https://www.washingt...m=.7c83aa8df2a5

 

But it's not systemic racism, right? It's not like cops see blacks as a threat. That would be outrageous.

You just took how the Washington Post framed the incident as self evident truth, but if you look at the description of the incident, they were fired at by several armed suspects, I'm guessing most likely black. The officer was in fear of his life, and made a terrible mistake, possibly a criminal mistake depending how careless he was, but if the off duty cop would've been white it would not have been news.

Because the white officer wouldn't have gotten shot.

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#1751

Posted 29 June 2017 - 02:31 PM

If the report the cops would've gotten was of dangerous caucasian armed suspects a white off duty cop could've gotten shot, but it would have never even been a news article.


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#1752

Posted 30 June 2017 - 05:51 AM

 

LOL: https://www.washingt...m=.7c83aa8df2a5

 

But it's not systemic racism, right? It's not like cops see blacks as a threat. That would be outrageous.

You just took how the Washington Post framed the incident as self evident truth, but if you look at the description of the incident, they were fired at by several armed suspects, I'm guessing most likely black. The officer was in fear of his life, and made a terrible mistake, possibly a criminal mistake depending how careless he was, but if the off duty cop would've been white it would not have been news.

 

Yeah the mainstream media is pretty out of hand with their radically anti-police agenda. 


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#1753

Posted 30 June 2017 - 10:14 AM

Yeah the mainstream media is pretty out of hand with their radically anti-police agenda. 

Nah, white on black police shooting incidents are completely underreported on.


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#1754

Posted 30 June 2017 - 02:35 PM

 

Yeah the mainstream media is pretty out of hand with their radically anti-police agenda. 

Nah, white on black police shooting incidents are completely underreported on.

 

Well they are constant and shocking. 


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#1755

Posted 30 June 2017 - 03:09 PM

That's completely true, but the amount of crime, and the social problems in predominantly black neighbourhoods in general are shocking. And those are not just caused by the police, though to an extent they are. I read about how the Ferguson Police systematically uses fines purely to raise revenue and legally steal from residents, where most of the affected are poor and black.

But an effective and fair police force is in the best interest of black Americans.


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#1756

Posted 30 June 2017 - 07:49 PM Edited by SagaciousKJB, 30 June 2017 - 07:49 PM.

That's completely true, but the amount of crime, and the social problems in predominantly black neighbourhoods in general are shocking. And those are not just caused by the police, though to an extent they are. I read about how the Ferguson Police systematically uses fines purely to raise revenue and legally steal from residents, where most of the affected are poor and black.

But an effective and fair police force is in the best interest of black Americans.

 

The problem is that two different issues are being conflated. Systemic racism and the police-state; one conflates the other, but they are separate issues. On the one hand you have factors of systemic racism which disproportionately effect Black Americans on all levels, and on the other you have a police-state which is given de facto authority to play judge, jury and executioner due to pitiful use-of-force laws, and police protections that make prosecuting an officer nearly impossible.

 

Basically, think about what happened to Philando Catile. The officer thought his nose looked similar to that of a burglary suspect, and that was the only reason he had any reason to fear Castile: Because he looked like "he could have been a burglarly suspect". Okay, well guess what...  More often than not in America, a white or brown person decides that as black person "looks like they could have been a burglarly suspect" and doesn't hire them, or doesn't open the door for them, or doesn't stop and let them into their cab, or in the case of this police officer, doesn't allow them to present ID without believing they're going for a gun and shooting them.

 

I think misaligning the media to have some kind of anti-police agenda just suits the people who wish to protect this status quo the most. The media's only agenda is to make money, and so they cling to the most controversial and sensational issues, and so it just happens that when a black man is shot by the police that there is usually national coverage of it. White people are shot by the police all the time too, but it's usually only ever given local coverage, because the "outrage" and "sensation" factor of it just isn't high enough to attract national media attention.

 

The racial component confuses this sh*t so badly because while Americans are not segregated by color anymore, we are still very segregated by class, and so our perspectives clash.  The middle-class is comprised mostly of white Americans, with a sparse number of brown and black Americans who have broken through their proverbial "glass ceilings", and then there is the lower-class that is comprised mostly of minorities, the demographics of which change depending on region. The thing is, even when you go to one area of the country where the poor and burdened-class are mostly Hispanic, there are still white and blacks in the same area, of the same class; go to another portion of the country, where the poor and burdened-class are mostly White, there will still be blacks and Hispanics and natives there, etc. So everywhere along the country you have different people, of different colors living different lifestyles, but they all really only fall into one dichotomy: The haves and the have-nots.

 

The racial component of this is the greatest weapon of the people who want to end this unrest and outrage over the police-state. The reason why is because when you frame it as a race issue, then it becomes easy for white and poor people to go, "Well, my cousin/uncle/brother/aunt/sister/me got beat up by the police and unfairly arrested, so it's not just a problem with black people," and then suddenly it undermines part of the validity of things like Black Lives Matter even though the racial component of that is not the larger, more unifying issue.  That's why it was so easy for the police-defenders and race-deniers to co-opt the phrase, "All Lives Matter," to be some kind of anti-BLM phrase.  Really though, if you think about it, we're all at risk of being shot by the police any time we're pulled over for a traffic ticket, but it's this race-game that's blinded people to that.  

 

Then you have the middle-class, who white, brown, or black are typically totally ignorant of police misconduct and will go at any length to deny that it is a problem at all.  This of course usually only stops until one of their kids is shot to death by the police, and then they will suddenly make a stink about it. The fact is that these people live under the benevolent functions of the status-quo; they're the "good ones" that don't have to worry about getting shot.  It's really kind of stupid to expect people in this position to suddenly start thinking about this given how depressing it is, and then let alone to actually rock the boat and do something about it.  If you're actually gainfully employed enough to be part of the middle-class in the country, you don't have time to go stand on a free-way overpass or hold a protest sign, and so they're so busy running the rat race and finding happiness in slavery that they cannot afford to acknowledge the police state.  As long as it doesn't happen to them it's not a problem, so why in the world would they care if poor white and black Americans are being shot unjustly?

 

The media is just basically a whore that does what it needs to get paid like anyone else.  It's politicians and police unions and political groups like that, which seize upon what the media is doing and the political climate to make changes. The media's only agenda is to make money. There's this constant push in the U.S. to accuse the media of being controlled by "the liberals" but if you look at it closely, pretty much all the major broadcasting corporations are either Left or Right, and they are both playing it to their advantage. 

 

Take BLM for example...  Conservatives insist that this is the media trying to create anti-police sentiment, appealing to liberals and that demographic, because you know, all liberals think BLM is super cool and we're all social justice warriors.

 

Okay, well, what about the way Fox and Friends use the BLM coverage to manipulate Conservatives? They undermine the validity of the racial aspect of it as if that was the only aspect that mattered, and therefore convince tons of Americans that not only is there not a problem of police shooting unarmed black people, but not a problem of police shooting unarmed people in general.  There most definitely is, but because they were able to undermine the racial aspect, then that makes people assume the whole argument was invalid. In the meantime, the truly sad thing is that they're basically being fooled into promoting and encouraging the police to have totally impunity and authority to end anyone's life, including their own. That's the trick though: They don't consider it could happen to them, because they've been tricked by the problem being framed as a black issue.

 

The racial component of this was the worst thing to have ever manifested, and it was squarely on the shoulders of the left for not being more adamant to separate the two.  Now because the race issue is conflated with the police-state issue, then people who don't accept the issues of race, by proxy, don't accept the issues of police brutality and wanton use of lethal force.  The Left essentially handed the Right ammunition to use to shoot them down by not distancing general calls for police-reform with things like the BLM movement, and not doing more to prevent concepts like "All Lives Matter" from being co-opted by racists to mean something else.

 

People keep thinking that the problem is people who don't see the problem...  Like, some day, some white guy in Appalachia who has never seen a black man in his life is going to wake up tomorrow and think, "sh*t, you know, those Black Lives Matter protesters were right, the police are out of control."  That is never going to happen, they're never going to convince anyone who doesn't already see the problem that it's there, because the writing is on the wall.  Those who choose not to read it, chose not to read it for a reason.  Doesn't really matter what that was, because what they really need to recognize is that they are at the whims of police being "scared for their lives" too.  If instead of telling someone how much more likely a black man is to be shot by police than a white man, we were telling them how easily their own sons or daughters, or even them, they would start paying attention, and they would be outraged with the police's authority in choosing when to end a life.  I'm not just speculating, I've seen it happen; it's like people go their whole lives with horse blinders on, trying not to get caught up in the "media sensationalizing black teenager's deaths" and then suddenly when it happens to their family member, that's when it's a travesty and they wake up to see how things are out of control.

 

You know I think one of the most interesting things to frame what I'm talking about is the death of Lavoy Finicum, versus the death of Philando Castile.  Lavoy Finicum was one of the armed white militants who took over a federal wildlife refuge in Oregon. He was shot to death on the side of a highway after pointing his gun towards officers. Helicopter footage clearly shows him pointing his weapon, and seems to show quite a lot of time with him threatening the officers before they open fired and killed him.  Yet, all over America, white, conservative, 2A supporting types were just up in arms about how the police "slaughtered him on the highway". People were all a clamor about how this showed the importance of the right to bear arms, that they were fighting for their rights, and the surviving members of the takeover got acquitted after all this!

 

Meanwhile, Castile was a lunch-room cafeteria worker with a legal permit to carry, who was trying to show ID and notify the officer he had a firearm.  Where is the outrage about his right to carry guns?  Where is the outrage over the cop just slaughtering him?  It's certainly not on behalf of the same white ultra-conservatives who called Finicum's death unjust.  

 

What does that tell you?

 

I usually don't like to link to clips too much, but this one from Trevor Noah really breaks it down.

 

Skip to 2:50

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The Yokel
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#1757

Posted 30 June 2017 - 08:41 PM

It's become kind of obvious to everyone but f*cktards that cops see black people as a much bigger threat than white people and that their trigger finger gets itchy much faster when they see a black man.

Seriously, who in their right mind would even have the balls to argue that the opposite is true after countless shootings in the past couple of years alone?

Keep in mind, these are just the cases that the public is aware of thanks to technology that is available today. God only knows how many innocent black people cops have killed in the past when cameras weren't everywhere and there was no internet. There is absolutely zero chance that this is a problem that just happened overnight a few years ago.


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#1758

Posted 30 June 2017 - 10:09 PM Edited by Eutyphro, 01 July 2017 - 03:05 AM.

and on the other you have a police-state which is given de facto authority to play judge, jury and executioner due to pitiful use-of-force laws, and police protections that make prosecuting an officer nearly impossible.

I have to say, I think your post is very good, but I'm still going to point out how I feel about what you are saying. So to this point, that prosecuting police officers in the US is far too hard, I completely agree. But I still want to give some context for the sake of realism. In Western Europe, which is where I live, we have far better ways to prosecute police officers. But what should be understood is that human rights, however cynical this may sound, are luxury goods in a way. Human rights are based on trust and good behaviour. If people start behaving in disgusting and criminal ways more often, trust erodes, and human rights erode. So I recently read an article that where I live, in the Netherlands, the police are often too afraid to act when they see certain criminal acts, because they are afraid of being prosecuted or being investigated when they act to uphold the law in some cases. There has also been a tendency towards an erosion of humane treatment of criminals and harsher criminal justice in my country in the last years. Furthermore, what can't be denied is that violent crime and serious drug offences are being dominated by non native Dutch people. So the issue is that immigration from countries with a lower level of development causes the humane criminal justice that I highly value to erode. And that is terrible, but the undeniable truth. It's the negative side to diversity really..
 

The media's only agenda is to make money, and so they cling to the most controversial and sensational issues, and so it just happens that when a black man is shot by the police that there is usually national coverage of it.

I'm even slightly more cynical to think that the media might have an ideological agenda to further racial tensions.
 

They undermine the validity of the racial aspect of it as if that was the only aspect that mattered, and therefore convince tons of Americans that not only is there not a problem of police shooting unarmed black people, but not a problem of police shooting unarmed people in general.  There most definitely is, but because they were able to undermine the racial aspect, then that makes people assume the whole argument was invalid. In the meantime, the truly sad thing is that they're basically being fooled into promoting and encouraging the police to have totally impunity and authority to end anyone's life, including their own. That's the trick though: They don't consider it could happen to them, because they've been tricked by the problem being framed as a black issue.

Well, here you are absolutely right. And I've 'undermined' the racial aspect of it myself, because that is the conclusion a dispassionate look at the data gives you. If I would have never looked at the data I would be completely convinced the CNN coverage of these issues is reasonable. And a lot of people simply don't look at that data. So I think the sensationalism of using these incidents to boost ratings, and possibly sow division in society, is deeply harmful and disgusting.

And the fact that there is obviously a more general problem with police violence, which African Americans are most often the victims of in their community, because there are the most social problems in their communities, is absolutely right. But if the media simply assumes that all cops are racists that instantly pull the trigger when the person is black this completely escalates the issue. This does not contribute to a solution at all. And those on the left just don't have the balls to point that out, and speak up.
 

If instead of telling someone how much more likely a black man is to be shot by police than a white man, we were telling them how easily their own sons or daughters, or even them, they would start paying attention, and they would be outraged with the police's authority in choosing when to end a life.

Yes, great point.
 

Meanwhile, Castile was a lunch-room cafeteria worker with a legal permit to carry, who was trying to show ID and notify the officer he had a firearm.  Where is the outrage about his right to carry guns?  Where is the outrage over the cop just slaughtering him?  It's certainly not on behalf of the same white ultra-conservatives who called Finicum's death unjust.  

I watched the clip on youtube, and there are many gun carrying conservatives condemning what the police did to Castile as a horrific criminal act. You are right probably none of the conservative hacks in the media condemned it, but the youtube response makes me feel positive.


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#1759

Posted 01 July 2017 - 07:40 AM

 

and on the other you have a police-state which is given de facto authority to play judge, jury and executioner due to pitiful use-of-force laws, and police protections that make prosecuting an officer nearly impossible.

I have to say, I think your post is very good, but I'm still going to point out how I feel about what you are saying. So to this point, that prosecuting police officers in the US is far too hard, I completely agree. But I still want to give some context for the sake of realism. In Western Europe, which is where I live, we have far better ways to prosecute police officers. But what should be understood is that human rights, however cynical this may sound, are luxury goods in a way. Human rights are based on trust and good behaviour. If people start behaving in disgusting and criminal ways more often, trust erodes, and human rights erode. So I recently read an article that where I live, in the Netherlands, the police are often too afraid to act when they see certain criminal acts, because they are afraid of being prosecuted or being investigated when they act to uphold the law in some cases. There has also been a tendency towards an erosion of humane treatment of criminals and harsher criminal justice in my country in the last years. Furthermore, what can't be denied is that violent crime and serious drug offences are being dominated by non native Dutch people. So the issue is that immigration from countries with a lower level of development causes the humane criminal justice that I highly value to erode. And that is terrible, but the undeniable truth. It's the negative side to diversity really..
 

The media's only agenda is to make money, and so they cling to the most controversial and sensational issues, and so it just happens that when a black man is shot by the police that there is usually national coverage of it.

I'm even slightly more cynical to think that the media might have an ideological agenda to further racial tensions.
 

They undermine the validity of the racial aspect of it as if that was the only aspect that mattered, and therefore convince tons of Americans that not only is there not a problem of police shooting unarmed black people, but not a problem of police shooting unarmed people in general.  There most definitely is, but because they were able to undermine the racial aspect, then that makes people assume the whole argument was invalid. In the meantime, the truly sad thing is that they're basically being fooled into promoting and encouraging the police to have totally impunity and authority to end anyone's life, including their own. That's the trick though: They don't consider it could happen to them, because they've been tricked by the problem being framed as a black issue.

Well, here you are absolutely right. And I've 'undermined' the racial aspect of it myself, because that is the conclusion a dispassionate look at the data gives you. If I would have never looked at the data I would be completely convinced the CNN coverage of these issues is reasonable. And a lot of people simply don't look at that data. So I think the sensationalism of using these incidents to boost ratings, and possibly sow division in society, is deeply harmful and disgusting.

And the fact that there is obviously a more general problem with police violence, which African Americans are most often the victims of in their community, because there are the most social problems in their communities, is absolutely right. But if the media simply assumes that all cops are racists that instantly pull the trigger when the person is black this completely escalates the issue. This does not contribute to a solution at all. And those on the left just don't have the balls to point that out, and speak up.
 

If instead of telling someone how much more likely a black man is to be shot by police than a white man, we were telling them how easily their own sons or daughters, or even them, they would start paying attention, and they would be outraged with the police's authority in choosing when to end a life.

Yes, great point.
 

Meanwhile, Castile was a lunch-room cafeteria worker with a legal permit to carry, who was trying to show ID and notify the officer he had a firearm.  Where is the outrage about his right to carry guns?  Where is the outrage over the cop just slaughtering him?  It's certainly not on behalf of the same white ultra-conservatives who called Finicum's death unjust.  

I watched the clip on youtube, and there are many gun carrying conservatives condemning what the police did to Castile as a horrific criminal act. You are right probably none of the conservative hacks in the media condemned it, but the youtube response makes me feel positive.

 

 

Well, I know that a lot of people are feeling that police here in the states are now not willing to to try to stop or investigate crimes because they are fearful of whatever civil or criminal repercussions might happen if they make a mistakes of some kind. I think the problem with that assessment is that it doesn't really reveal the root of the problem (i.e. current police tactics), and it is also too often used and trumpeted as propaganda by various police unions. I believe the unions, police academies, and things of that nature are actually more responsible for the problems that persist now than police departments in general.  There are a lot of corrupt departments, but there are also many that do everything in earnest to hold police accountable, the problem is simply with police union protections, lawyers, representatives, and even down to "the book" favor police in every instance.  

 

What I mean is when they say something was done "by the book" is that, the book basically says, "If an officer fears for his life for whatever reason, he can shoot to kill a person her perceives as a threat." At all levels of the use-of-force protocols, the training, the education and all the institutions which "test" and "evaluate" officers rely on procedures that essentially boil down to Shoot First, Ask Questions Later.  We have the problem on the extreme opposite of the spectrum, where the prosecution rate of officers remains astronomically low, and the level of egregiousness for an officer to even be charged is astronomically high. To me the epitome of this principle is captured by the argument of, "That officer wants to go home to his family," type of attitudes. Perhaps police should be granted an extra measure of protection by the law when they make a mistake, because after all it is their duty to enforce the laws we make; however, the level of protection they have now is virtual impunity.  What this has enabled, and perpetuated, is tactics that favor the use of heavy-handed methods and procedures that put citizens lives at risk for the sake of, "Making sure the officer goes home to eat dinner with his family."  Yet no one grasps the irony that they are public servants, and the public at large bends over backwards to justify their lethal interactions with their supposed protectors. It's like paying for your own extermination. 

 

Now the problem with the media is that the companies are not ran by the people who own them. The people who run them want to make money, and to do that you have to seize on sensationalism, and that's their primary concern. However, if you look at the majority of media and news outlets in the U.S., they're owned by a few different people, and that is why we have such clearly detectable and distinguished political bullsh*t between each different network.  CNN, MSNBC are for the Left, and Fox News and CBS are for the Right.  However, does that mean either one of those outlets is actually reporting on a different issue?  No, they just have their own brand of spin, and the spin is where the ownership of that particularly outlet comes into play.  Conservatives are quick to accuse the media of being owned by the Left, and accusing them of running stilted stories to try to further their political agenda, but the Right does the exact same thing on their networks.  Black Lives Matter is spun by the Right as some Liberal group of radical militants, but meanwhile the Left media networks exploit them for the exact same media-grabbing power while just using it to effect a different political agenda.  The media is in essence just for sale to the highest bidder in terms of what ends they are working to achieve, but the people actually producing the content get paid either way, so what sells on Fox News sells on CNN too.  It's just packaged different, two brands of bullsh*t, but it's the same bullsh*t.

 

Now, as far as why the statistics bare out that Black people are shot at a higher rate...  Well, first of all, there's still a lot of people disagreeing with these statistics, not understanding numbers or how rates versus raw figures works. I swear every time I see someone post how more white people are shot by the police, without understanding it's about the RATIO, it makes me want to scream because on top of that, the statistics don't mean squat.  Correlation does not equal causation. That's why even though it's a sound argument to say that, "Black people are shot more often, because they're more often engaged in the behavior that leads to those interactions," it may not actually be true. Looking at the statistics cannot actually bare out whether or not African Americans actually commit more crime, or are simply charged for more crime.  If you step back and look at the bigger picture, with all the different working components (mass incarceration, harsh drug sentencing, gentrification, voter disenfranchisement, weapons enhancement laws ) then you see a system that is engineered--deliberately or not--at every level to disproportionately effect people of color principally, and the poor collaterally.  

 

Ask yourself...  How can you implement racist laws, without seeming like they're racist? Just implement them in such a way that it effects them because of another common factor.  Black people have historically been the poorest demographic, and some would contend that it is by design that all this faulty legislation disproportionately effects the poor: Because the real target is the majority of people who are poor, i.e. people of color. This is the scheme Michelle Alexander points out in her book of the same title,  called "The New Jim Crow".  The thing is that African Americans are not always the most poor in any given community, and so in places like the South West for example, Natives and Hispanics are the most poor; in Appalachia, some of the poorest communities in the nation exist, and are predominantly White. However, even with all this diversity throughout the country, when you look at the federal prison system, the demographic which comprises 13% of the Nation's population, comprises nearly 66% of the federal prison population. In other areas you can see similar, or even greater disparities; Native Americans for example represent nearly the smallest percentage of the national population, but in some local jails represent huge portions of the incarcerated population.  The same trend is there for Hispanics.  It's hard to ignore that even when white people are being caught up as collateral damage of wanton police tactics, people of color are far more likely to actually end up incarcerated or institutionalized in some manner, which just represents yet another disparity: Whites are more likely to be given lesser sentences, or alternatives like probation and house arrest.

 

Just look at what happened to Brock Turner, the wholesome white college kid who raped a woman and got 6 months in jail for it. There are black people still in federal prison from the 80s who did nothing but sell some crack. How many Brock Turners have come and gone while the War on Drugs and mass incarceration ensured that recidivism and under-education would run rampant through black communities?

 

Yes I'm sure there are many conservatives who saw what happened with Philando Castile as wrong, I know it's not all black and white, but the problem is as Trevor Noah pointed out, that 12 people couldn't agree that what the cop did was wrong.  A random sampling of 12 people in this country found it reasonable for the cop to fear for his life and shoot Philando Castille.  When people bring race into the equation, people jump to the personal aspect; as if someone not liking black people would make them okay with the police just being able to shoot anyone they want.  It's not a problem of individualized racism; the cop who shot him probably didn't have a problem with black people.  The problem is that institutionalized racism has made it to where an officer pulled a man over for having a big nose, and then feared for his life because he was legally carrying a firearm, and it's obvious that even the officer knew he'd made a mistake.  So the question is why was he so afraid, and why did enough people out of 12 empathize with him enough to not get justice for Castile?

 

Another case recently that I can't understand when compared with this is the one where Michelle Carter was charged for manslaughter for telling her boyfriend to kill himself, which he did.  Somehow a jury can find someone guilty for manslaughter for urging someone to kill themselves, but not for shooting them 7 times because they were "afraid" because they "might" have had their hand on a gun that they "could" have been trying to shoot them with.


Melchior
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#1760

Posted 3 weeks ago Edited by Melchior, 3 weeks ago.

What do we do with cops? There's not much you can do about them violently, since their own violence is restrained and they'd probably love the chance to get into a low stakes brawl. Maybe we should just start jumping them on the street and sitting them down for lectures? Or infiltrating departments in order to educate them? 

 

How do you deal with people who are pathetically desperate to interfere in things they don't understand?

 

20246315_1464399283643073_78610478536220

 

If I'd never heard of the police and you described them to me I'd imagine they run into protests screaming "how dare you criticise Master in public! I'll show you his glory!" but they just... don't. A lot of them aren't even particularly nationalist. 

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#1761

Posted 3 weeks ago

What do we do with cops?

Throw them down a well.

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Melchior
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#1762

Posted 3 weeks ago

I mean what do we do with cops tomorrow.  Like when our numbers are big enough we'll challenge them to a civil war and hope we win? That's not really good enough, we need to resist their violence now, and also do damage to them that can't be repaired. A burned out APC is easily replaceable, so are the officers themselves as far as the state is concerned. Shooting them here and now would only confuse them and the average suburban bootlicker, unless it's specific retribution, but how often does that come up?

 

We need to get creative with these people. Infiltrators could easily damage their fraternity just by being there, and if they could normalise interference and snitching amongst cops, that's their fraternity smashed entirely. The biggest thing that keeps them at odds with the community isn't an ideology, it's their 'brothers in blue' spiel about having each others' backs. That's why they don't care that their neighbours spit on them, like anyone else would. That's why they sprint desperately into protests to break them up when they couldn't even tell you what they're about. 

 

Funny enough, the police produce a lot of deradicalisation techniques, and part of that must be breaking fraternities and rehumanising enemies. These could be powerful weapons against the police. You have to sit them down for it to work, but I'm sure someone somewhere is working on ways to apply them subtly. 

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#1763

Posted 3 weeks ago Edited by acmilano, 3 weeks ago.

http://www.abc.net.a...erience/8717936

 

A cop shot an Australian woman in Minneapolis few days ago.

 

 

The US police officer who shot dead Australian woman Justine Damond in a Minneapolis alley had little more than two years' experience on the force.


She was in her pyjamas when she approached Noor's police vehicle.

Officer Mohamed Noor shot the 40-year-old bride-to-be more than once from the passenger seat of his police vehicle.

Ms Damond called police just before midnight on Saturday after hearing a possible assault taking place in an alley behind her Minneapolis home.

Mr Noor, the first Somali-American officer at Minneapolis' 5th Precinct, was in the passenger seat and fired multiple times across his partner at Ms Damond, Minneapolis TV station KSTP reported.

A mobile phone was reportedly found near Ms Damond's body.

The moments immediately after the shooting were recorded over police radio.

One of the officers told dispatch that shots had been fired and asked for medical assistance.

"Shots fired. Can we get EMS Code 3 to Washburn and 51st Street. We have one down."

 

http://edition.cnn.c...igns/index.html

 

 

(CNN)Minneapolis Police Chief Janeé Harteau resigned Friday, less than a week after a city officer shot and killed a woman who had called officers for help.

Harteau, chief since 2013, said the killing of Justine Ruszczyk was among several factors that led her to step down.
"Last Saturday's tragedy, as well as some other recent incidents, have caused me to engage in deep reflection," she said in a statement. "I've decided I am willing to step aside to let a fresh set of leadership eyes see what more can be done for the MPD to be the very best it can be."
Mayor Betsy Hodges said she asked Harteau to resign because "I've lost confidence in the chief's ability to lead us further -- and from the many conversations I've had with people around our city, especially this week, it is clear that she has lost the confidence of the people of Minneapolis as well."




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