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Destructible Environments?

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EOL_92
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#1

Posted 09 April 2014 - 11:57 AM

Anyone else think destructible structures/buildings/walls etc. would work in future GTA games? And im not talking scripted mission scenes or pieces of cover crumbling when you get shot at, I mean full blown destruction like the Battlefield or Red Faction series. Personally, I think it would be amazing but only if they could devise a system where structures slowly get rebuilt/ fixed over time. What are your thoughts and is it something you are really hoping to see in future titles?


Tilemaxx
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#2

Posted 09 April 2014 - 11:59 AM

RAM is huge in PS4/One, so i don't see why not.


Midnightz
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#3

Posted 09 April 2014 - 06:32 PM

Of course we'd love it. It's an issue of practicality. Games that usually have something like that, have far less objectives and smaller, restricted mapped areas.

Take a map the size of GTAV and offer thousands upon thousands of dynamic objects and surfaces and you get something so resource intensive, no console could handle it. Shoot, a PC would struggle too.

The only way I see R* pulling it off in a GTA is if they utilize an engine that generates objects at a sub-atomic level, no polygons, just tiny particles put together and duplicated exponentially. See YouTube.
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DIEXEL
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#4

Posted 10 April 2014 - 07:52 AM Edited by DIEXEL, 10 April 2014 - 07:52 AM.

The classic one...

 

...the tents are made by concrete in GTAV. That's really ridiculous that you can't drive over a tent with a car or a tank......... :rol:


EOL_92
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#5

Posted 10 April 2014 - 11:11 AM

The classic one...

 

...the tents are made by concrete in GTAV. That's really ridiculous that you can't drive over a tent with a car or a tank......... :rol:

 

Don't forget those 10inch thick trees that can stop an 18 wheeler going 60mph in its tracks  :blink:


Vanto
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#6

Posted 10 April 2014 - 05:29 PM

I don't think it would work in sandbox games like GTA.

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tehSpitefulPotato
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#7

Posted 10 April 2014 - 05:32 PM Edited by tehSpitefulPotato, 10 April 2014 - 05:35 PM.

It would be weird. You f*cked a building up, then drive away, return back and it's okay again. never mind, didn't read the OP's post to the end.

If seriously, why would GTA have this? It's a game about shooting and driving cars. Pretty much every GTA game has cool storyline, detailed characters and worlds, etc. The whole series is one of few games that can be actually considered art nowadays (at least among games made by big corporations). GTA is not Battlefield or a terrorist simulator. Deal with it.

 

You COMPLETELY miss the point of GTA. GTA is not Crysis “oh hay guys look at these kewl graphics omg teh best gaem evar!!!.” GTA is not Battlefield’s pseudo-realsitic destructions. GTA is not Halo, Mass Effect, or Call Of Duty. GTA is a place for people to play a game – the awesome, detailed, interesting game like every game should be.

 

...though trees stopping tanks are stupid, yep.

 

 

I don't think it would work in sandbox games like GTA.

This is basically a tl;dr version of my post.

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universetwisters
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#8

Posted 10 April 2014 - 08:00 PM

I think Mercenaires ha something like that. I wasn't much of a fan of it.

EOL_92
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#9

Posted 11 April 2014 - 10:56 AM Edited by EOL_92, 11 April 2014 - 10:58 AM.

It would be weird. You f*cked a building up, then drive away, return back and it's okay again. never mind, didn't read the OP's post to the end.

If seriously, why would GTA have this? It's a game about shooting and driving cars. Pretty much every GTA game has cool storyline, detailed characters and worlds, etc. The whole series is one of few games that can be actually considered art nowadays (at least among games made by big corporations). GTA is not Battlefield or a terrorist simulator. Deal with it.

 

I personally don't see how being able to blow a hole in a wall takes away from the GTA experience of 'shooting and driving cars', if anything it adds to it, makes combat more interesting and adds an element of strategy. For example: your pinned down by waves of police, you pull out your grenade launcher and shoot out part of the wall to a warehouse or something, run inside and continue the fight inside the building (I understand this isn't something likely to be possible in the next few years). Please explain how that takes away from the game? And isn't GTA already kind of a 'terrorist simulator' (as you like to put it) I mean, you can run around shooting hundreds of innocent people in the face for no reason and blow up cars etc. lol. I just think that destruction is such a cool concept and VERY few games have implemented well into games and is something that could bring GTA truly forward into the Next Generation of consoles. 

 

You COMPLETELY miss the point of GTA. GTA is not Crysis “oh hay guys look at these kewl graphics omg teh best gaem evar!!!.” GTA is not Battlefield’s pseudo-realsitic destructions. GTA is not Halo, Mass Effect, or Call Of Duty. GTA is a place for people to play a game – the awesome, detailed, interesting game like every game should be.

 

 

So by your logic, it seems that GTA is to stay the exact same until the series ends, with no innovation? When a game takes elements from other AAA games that work well within the game they are creating, I can only see that as a good thing tbh. Why wouldn't you want the game to have amazing graphics crysis, realistic destruction like Battlefield, or a more in-depth character relationship system like mass effect? It's still GTA just a number of cool ways to make it even better than before!

 

 

I think Mercenaires ha something like that. I wasn't much of a fan of it.

 

And yeah, but mecenaires destruction sucked (as did most of the game in general), you basically shot a building until its 'life bar' reached empty and then the whole thing collapsed, it was very very basic and I think when we're speaking about GTA games in say 10 years it would be abit better than that. However its an example of how destruction can be implemented into open world games similar to GTA, but I believe Rockstar would be alot more successful if they tried it.


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#10

Posted 11 April 2014 - 11:20 AM

Maybe if gta for ps4 will be exact copie of gta 3 they could implent ( still not but yeah ). Takes way to much power of system + then you want see holes in ground after explosion and then next day npc are fixing that road, the longer you play the more changes ( npc build new building and demolish old buildings ). Also npc that burn down their company for insurance money. Its just a video game and all destruction is scripted ( untill this day ) so see non scripted destruction is impossible. I rather choose realistic car damage ( from outside, not that you die from collision damage ). EOL 92, you talk bout 10years later. Go 10years back there you got gta sa, it has more as gta5 so maybe over 10years gta8 will have less as gta5 have. Destruction never gonna happen in gta ( like how OP wants it ). Just gta5 with even less and slightly better graphics.


EOL_92
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#11

Posted 11 April 2014 - 01:06 PM

Maybe if gta for ps4 will be exact copie of gta 3 they could implent ( still not but yeah ). Takes way to much power of system + then you want see holes in ground after explosion and then next day npc are fixing that road, the longer you play the more changes ( npc build new building and demolish old buildings ). Also npc that burn down their company for insurance money. Its just a video game and all destruction is scripted ( untill this day ) so see non scripted destruction is impossible. I rather choose realistic car damage ( from outside, not that you die from collision damage ). EOL 92, you talk bout 10years later. Go 10years back there you got gta sa, it has more as gta5 so maybe over 10years gta8 will have less as gta5 have. Destruction never gonna happen in gta ( like how OP wants it ). Just gta5 with even less and slightly better graphics.

 

Well honestly, I have no idea how powerful consoles will be in 10 years time or what they'll be capable of but if in 2009 Red Faction Guerrila was able to have a completely destructible map which was probably the same size of  GTA 4's world (yes there were alot less buildings in red faction), then I fully believe that 15 years after that game someone will have the tech to implement that in a world found in the GTA series. Not saying it's definitely going to be possible but you honestly never know as like the first reply to this thread says - the size of xbox 1/ps4 RAM is big, so it is certainly not impossible. A few games have already done 'non-scripted' destruction on a smaller level so its just the case of building on that and bringing to a larger map with more buildings.

And in regards to you preferring realistic car damage, that could have been done in V but it seems it was a design decision R* made that they would tone it down for whatever reason (not that I agree with it, just saying its not really on the level of how new and amazing 'destructible environments' would be, its pretty basic tbh) 


Aintgottime2bleed
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#12

Posted 11 April 2014 - 01:25 PM Edited by Aintgottime2bleed, 11 April 2014 - 01:27 PM.

 

Maybe if gta for ps4 will be exact copie of gta 3 they could implent ( still not but yeah ). Takes way to much power of system + then you want see holes in ground after explosion and then next day npc are fixing that road, the longer you play the more changes ( npc build new building and demolish old buildings ). Also npc that burn down their company for insurance money. Its just a video game and all destruction is scripted ( untill this day ) so see non scripted destruction is impossible. I rather choose realistic car damage ( from outside, not that you die from collision damage ). EOL 92, you talk bout 10years later. Go 10years back there you got gta sa, it has more as gta5 so maybe over 10years gta8 will have less as gta5 have. Destruction never gonna happen in gta ( like how OP wants it ). Just gta5 with even less and slightly better graphics.

 

Well honestly, I have no idea how powerful consoles will be in 10 years time or what they'll be capable of but if in 2009 Red Faction Guerrila was able to have a completely destructible map which was probably the same size of  GTA 4's world (yes there were alot less buildings in red faction), then I fully believe that 15 years after that game someone will have the tech to implement that in a world found in the GTA series. Not saying it's definitely going to be possible but you honestly never know as like the first reply to this thread says - the size of xbox 1/ps4 RAM is big, so it is certainly not impossible. A few games have already done 'non-scripted' destruction on a smaller level so its just the case of building on that and bringing to a larger map with more buildings.

And in regards to you preferring realistic car damage, that could have been done in V but it seems it was a design decision R* made that they would tone it down for whatever reason (not that I agree with it, just saying its not really on the level of how new and amazing 'destructible environments' would be, its pretty basic tbh) 

 

Ok it always takes more power to have destruction so they have to cut out some other things , is that worth it?. Biggest problem is what if you bazooka on house ( so wall is gone )? you see the interior ?, if yes then theres goes all ps5 his power in making evry single house an interior. Now theres no more power left for evrything else. I really never see it happen ( to much waste of power/memory no matter what console/pc since they always need cut out other stuff like worse graphics or draw distance etc. ).


EOL_92
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#13

Posted 11 April 2014 - 01:49 PM

 

 

Maybe if gta for ps4 will be exact copie of gta 3 they could implent ( still not but yeah ). Takes way to much power of system + then you want see holes in ground after explosion and then next day npc are fixing that road, the longer you play the more changes ( npc build new building and demolish old buildings ). Also npc that burn down their company for insurance money. Its just a video game and all destruction is scripted ( untill this day ) so see non scripted destruction is impossible. I rather choose realistic car damage ( from outside, not that you die from collision damage ). EOL 92, you talk bout 10years later. Go 10years back there you got gta sa, it has more as gta5 so maybe over 10years gta8 will have less as gta5 have. Destruction never gonna happen in gta ( like how OP wants it ). Just gta5 with even less and slightly better graphics.

 

Well honestly, I have no idea how powerful consoles will be in 10 years time or what they'll be capable of but if in 2009 Red Faction Guerrila was able to have a completely destructible map which was probably the same size of  GTA 4's world (yes there were alot less buildings in red faction), then I fully believe that 15 years after that game someone will have the tech to implement that in a world found in the GTA series. Not saying it's definitely going to be possible but you honestly never know as like the first reply to this thread says - the size of xbox 1/ps4 RAM is big, so it is certainly not impossible. A few games have already done 'non-scripted' destruction on a smaller level so its just the case of building on that and bringing to a larger map with more buildings.

And in regards to you preferring realistic car damage, that could have been done in V but it seems it was a design decision R* made that they would tone it down for whatever reason (not that I agree with it, just saying its not really on the level of how new and amazing 'destructible environments' would be, its pretty basic tbh) 

 

Ok it always takes more power to have destruction so they have to cut out some other things , is that worth it?. Biggest problem is what if you bazooka on house ( so wall is gone )? you see the interior ?, if yes then theres goes all ps5 his power in making evry single house an interior. Now theres no more power left for evrything else. I really never see it happen ( to much waste of power/memory no matter what console/pc since they always need cut out other stuff like worse graphics or draw distance etc. ).

 

 

What if houses had copy and paste interiors like the 24/7 stores or ammunations though? I'm not saying every house is differently decorated or anything. Even if they made the map smaller, i'd rather have a smaller area with more depth than a much larger shallow wasteland. I really don't know though, as none of us have any idea how powerful consoles or pc's can/will become in the future so there is no definitive answer that this will or won't be possible, alot can change in 10 years and i honestly think it would be more an issue of increased workload for the creators than limitations of the machine. 


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#14

Posted 11 April 2014 - 03:09 PM

At EOL, it doesnt matter which console/pc ( unless we reached real life graphics ) since the destruction takes alot of power. Over 20years we have ps7 with gta12 but then still we have the problem. R* could give vehicles tuning options from old nfs and more cars as gt5 ( over 800 ) but then alot of playstation 7 power is wasted ( even if not all this stuff requires power so theres less power over for other stuff ) so you would have 800cars etc. but then get playstation 6 graphics cuz something gets less ( like the graphics ). Maybe 800cars + awsome graphics owh now you get 10second loading screen evry 5 seconds. If it was so easy prolly evry game had destruction + big open world with no load times and awsome graphics on 100+fps but these days you have to choose ( since you cant have all no matter what console/pc ). So i really dont see it happen. Long story short, destruction would use to much power for a gta game so at the end something else suck and lets say its just not worth it, not for R* and not for us unless ps4 is magic like the more power you use the more power it gains so you have infinite power/resources.


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#15

Posted 16 April 2014 - 12:49 PM

@few posts behind me - guys, this isn't a thread to discuss console power, come to the point. The OP asked if it could work, not if it will happen.
As for destructible environments, they could work beautifully if put right. Something like breaking things made out of glass, or running down a thin tree, the common sense stuff. Not large-scale like buildings going down and 9/11 reenactments. I remember in SA you could break bottles and burst cars by shooting the gas tank. In VC, you could break the glasses in front of some shops in the mall and at sunshine autos. I don't know if that's the case for every GTA afterwards, but if Rockstar expands it to trees and misc, why bother?

Aintgottime2bleed
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#16

Posted 16 April 2014 - 07:06 PM

@few posts behind me - guys, this isn't a thread to discuss console power, come to the point. The OP asked if it could work, not if it will happen.
As for destructible environments, they could work beautifully if put right. Something like breaking things made out of glass, or running down a thin tree, the common sense stuff. Not large-scale like buildings going down and 9/11 reenactments. I remember in SA you could break bottles and burst cars by shooting the gas tank. In VC, you could break the glasses in front of some shops in the mall and at sunshine autos. I don't know if that's the case for every GTA afterwards, but if Rockstar expands it to trees and misc, why bother?

To get it working you need power right, he talking bout non scripted destruction ( big scale like he mentioned ), no it will never happen unless we reached the max so theres additional power left. Expand by trees and misc?, in gta3 theres this building you can walk thru with if im right blue interior and you can shoot glass and it break,in gta sa u can drive over lil trees ( they get loose from ground ) so they already got that. Sorry for ruining/keep posting this topic but this aint gonna happen unless R* makes another 180 degree turn. R* happy with their sales so no need to put extra effort or change alot ( since less power so u get like small map, draw distance , popup, etc. ). Its a to big change that wouldnt work out.


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#17

Posted 19 April 2014 - 10:24 PM

it would be nice same with being able to drive thou shrubs  





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