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"Living, breathing world" Not exactly

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Alvarez
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#31

Posted 01 March 2014 - 08:09 PM

 

Actually Sleeping Dogs ripped the shock paddle from Saints Row, I am also wondering how it would actually be to have coroners in a GTA game.

 

Police block off the scene of the crime/accident be it with fence, tape or their cars. Ambulance rolls in and paramedics try to revive the vic, 50/50% chance of success. If the the vic dies, the paramedics call for coroner, coroner/crime scene investigators arrive, photograph the scene and put vic in body bag, on the stretcher, stretcher goes in coroner's van and they drive off. 

 

All could be scripted quite easily.

 

Were there attempts to do it in GTA4, btw?


SingularSoul
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#32

Posted 01 March 2014 - 08:12 PM

Sorry but I have to disagree, the peds in IV felt the more scripted out of the whole saga. I remember crashing another car at a very slow speed in one of the taillights and all of the sudden all of them dropped their objects and looked at me with that souless stare.

You have every right to disagree ;) I do see your point, however, because I have experienced similar experiences myself. However, on the whole, IV's peds seem to just "do" more. I mean, putting up umbrellas, cleaning windows, sweeping streets, cleaning tables.... details that are either omitted or simplified in V for some reason. Plus, the peds seem to repeat themselves a LOT (Not saying IV's didn't, but V REALLY stands out in this respect.)


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#33

Posted 01 March 2014 - 08:15 PM

Something along these lines.

 

Xuszy8o.png

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Phoenix_Poop
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#34

Posted 01 March 2014 - 08:20 PM

Why do we get these pointless hate threads, about negative stuff about GTA V all the time...? Isnt this forum suppose to exist for FANS and people who love the franchise, and not negative threads pointing out things that suck about GTA V 24/7...?


xenorama
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#35

Posted 01 March 2014 - 08:22 PM

The FORMERLY living, breathing world LOL:

 

9dMGWnt.jpg

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Officer Ronson
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#36

Posted 01 March 2014 - 08:23 PM

Well pedestrians complaint because they dont have an umbrella so they start shivering, they actually do clean Windows and did they actually clean tables?

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one55
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#37

Posted 01 March 2014 - 08:24 PM Edited by one55, 01 March 2014 - 08:26 PM.

Hint:

 

"Living breathing world" = Marketing Bullsh*t.

 

but to be fair to Rockstar...GTA V has the most realistic world in a video game.

 

BUT it's still just fancy words to sell products.

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Alvarez
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#38

Posted 01 March 2014 - 08:24 PM

Something along these lines.

 

Xuszy8o.png

Awesome.

I hope this will get ported on GTA5 when it's on PC.


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#39

Posted 01 March 2014 - 08:25 PM

Why do we get these pointless hate threads, about negative stuff about GTA V all the time...? Isnt this forum suppose to exist for FANS and people who love the franchise, and not negative threads pointing out things that suck about GTA V 24/7...?

But haven't you been making these types of threads as well? ;)

 

@Raavi That would be nice in a future GTA game, but won't they be busy? Considering that a lot of people die every day in the GTA world.


SingularSoul
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#40

Posted 01 March 2014 - 08:29 PM

 did they actually clean tables?

 

This one I'm a little unsure of upon second thought. I've witnessed this on my uncle's PC, but I've yet to see it on my PS3, so it MAY have been a mod. :)


Blood-Is-in-Diamond
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#41

Posted 01 March 2014 - 08:41 PM

Hmm dont make me START OP,i havent comment on any GTA 5 complain threads in days ;)

BrokenLizard
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#42

Posted 01 March 2014 - 08:51 PM

It does feel more alive, but the interaction with NPCs feel dumbed down.
If you say two words to a cop, a gangster, or a woman...it's the same reaction.
I do like how things happen spontaneously though, and gun fights break out and catch you off guard.
You should be able to recruit random people or something, as extra help.
Something to add some variety to the pedestrians.
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[µT]
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#43

Posted 01 March 2014 - 08:52 PM

Why do we get these pointless hate threads, about negative stuff about GTA V all the time...? Isnt this forum suppose to exist for FANS and people who love the franchise, and not negative threads pointing out things that suck about GTA V 24/7...?

These aren't pointless hate threads, and we're discussing things that could potentially improve the game for us. We bring up these threads because we are fans that are passionate about the game and the series and are trying to find ways it can improve. I don't think anyone in this thread said they hated V so there is no need for a tampon at this moment :p

This is a GTA discussion forum, not a mentally-masturbate-over-everything-about-GTA V forum. If you even admit there is things that suck about GTA V, enough things to have a constant "24/7" stream of negative things regarding it why are you so upset when people discuss ways to make it better? The game is good but would it not be better without all of the things that suck?

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Detective Phelps
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#44

Posted 01 March 2014 - 08:54 PM Edited by Los Santos Police Department, 01 March 2014 - 08:54 PM.

If you say two words to a cop, a gangster, or a woman...it's the same reaction.

Welcome to Los Santos, where everyone you don't know hate your guts.

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Blood-Is-in-Diamond
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#45

Posted 01 March 2014 - 08:56 PM

Tbh I dont even want to start,Lol see them nitpickers saying Sleeping Dogs [of all games] is better than V,Lol do you guys even play games before comparing,how dare you say Los Santos isnt beautiful,Lol even Saints Row 2 is 100x better than that clusterf*cking Sh*t Kung-Fu mix with GTA crap.Man i had that game and after playing it for more than 5 hours i swear i couldnt take it anymore,I had to trade it in,nothing original.Man Dont make me Start.and btw Mafia 2 is the worst "GTA Clone" Ever,tbh why dont openworld games try to be original instead of copying ever GTA's Mechanics and features.

Detective Phelps
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#46

Posted 01 March 2014 - 08:58 PM

Tbh I dont even want to start,Lol see them nitpickers saying Sleeping Dogs [of all games] is better than V,Lol do you guys even play games before comparing,how dare you say Los Santos isnt beautiful,Lol even Saints Row 2 is 100x better than that clusterf*cking Sh*t Kung-Fu mix with GTA crap.Man i had that game and after playing it for more than 5 hours i swear i couldnt take it anymore,I had to trade it in,nothing original.Man Dont make me Start.and btw Mafia 2 is the worst "GTA Clone" Ever,tbh why dont openworld games try to be original instead of copying ever GTA's Mechanics and features.

You need to calm down and acknowledge that some people have opinions, and that some games have features that other games don't have. 

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SingularSoul
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#47

Posted 01 March 2014 - 09:02 PM Edited by SingularSoul, 01 March 2014 - 09:03 PM.

how dare you say Los Santos isn't beautiful

 

Beauty is in the eye of the beholder. 

Besides, 90% of Los Santos' beauty is down to the lighting. Sure, it's a nice city, but it feels squashed in parts, and doesn't represent the "real" LA as well as it could have done (Although this is a separate issue altogether).

Also, as a side-note, you really need to be more open and less narrow-minded. This is a forum for discussion, not oppression of opinions that don't match your own.


TheMasterfocker
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#48

Posted 01 March 2014 - 09:08 PM

 

If you say two words to a cop, a gangster, or a woman...it's the same reaction.

Welcome to Los Santos, where everyone you don't know hate your guts.

 

It'd be understandable if it was just Trevor (Who wouldn't freak out if you saw Trevor standing next to you?), but it's too much with Franklin and Michael.

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DaRkL3AD3R
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#49

Posted 01 March 2014 - 09:08 PM

Something along these lines.
 

Spoiler


That is truly incredible. It's one thing to miss this for V but if VI doesn't have this level of depth then they really are just being blind artists. Limiting themselves to their own direction.

As for that 5 minutes stores closed thing. Haven't experienced that once. I come back and they're perfectly fine. Plus it doesn't compare to owner staying dead anx police and medics at the scene setting up an investigation. V is just arcadey in comparison with this regard.
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killahmatic
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#50

Posted 01 March 2014 - 09:18 PM

While that scenario you mentioned sounds complex, killahmatic, it really isn't. Really all that's happening is you just so happened to be in aggressive gang territory when oh my the police chasing the pedestrian script ran, and the gang entered combat mode and just started shooting.

 

 

You can't be serious. You're using words in a way to dull down my story to make your drug dealer story sound like its even somewhat complex. You KNOW that peds for the most part are much smarter, which makes scenarios more interesting. Nearly everything you said was a very basic script. 

 

Here's why your story isn't complex:

- Walking down the street and bump into a drug dealer - they spawned everywhere in gang territories, in only two forms, not a big deal, no more complex than gangs spawning in territories which has been done since at least III. 
- He asks me if I would like to buy any, I say naw man. - a useless feature since CJ can't buy or use drugs
- Decide I might want to kill him and take his money so I start setting up in stealth for a knife kill - stealth is in V. No, you don't do the neck thing, but thats nothing more than just a different kill move
- Another pedestrian approaches him and does a deal, holy sh*t - another basic scripted event, why is that surprising? Again, no more complex than peds in V talking with each other and responding.
- As soon as the dealer hands the product to the random pedestrians a cop car pulls up with lights flashing - I still don't believe this since It never once happened to me during 5 years regular playing, but if you say so...
- The officer gets out and draws his weapon on the dealer, intent on arresting him, A small gun fight ensues, and the dealer flees on foot, The cops chased him down and killed him - cop chases in SA were scripted just as they are in V, no big deal.
- Shortly afterwards an ambulance came and revived the drug dealer - ambulances being called to a scene is an often used script in GTA, another very basic thing. 
 
 
To sum it up: drug deal, cops shoot, ambulance comes. Cool story bro.  :facedesk:
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Blood-Is-in-Diamond
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#51

Posted 01 March 2014 - 09:29 PM

@LSPD
I know bro,i am not saying no-one cant voice that opinions,if you want i can link a video of what other OWG "GTA Clones" does better than V but no matter what V is 100x better than Sleeping Dogs and no-one can deny it even Activision (I dont want to start talking about Sleeping Dogs History and flaws)...just saying :)

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#52

Posted 01 March 2014 - 09:44 PM

Remember that line from the trailer? I certainly do. After spending countless hours in every GTA since 3, I was expecting a truly remarkable "living breathing world." But was that really what we got? I'm not so certain.
 
For starters what makes a living breathing world? I would say "life" does. And that life to me, comes from all the different people walking around in the game world. This means drivers and pedestrians. I've invested probably close to 200 hours in GTA V just wandering around in free roam checking out various locations and just observing the game world, and while it is beautiful, it's far from "alive" as the trailers liked to describe it. Everything feels very scripted, and even then there is not much going on at any given time. The most life you can hope for is a cop car speeding by chasing a random civilian and maybe if you're lucky, they get into a gun fight.
 
I always see a police cruiser going up through the Mara Bunta hood driving very slowly beeping their sirens as they pass by gang members, its scripted that way as its the only place ive see a cruiser and happens almost every time. May be a easter egg in refernce to so ething 
Now let me contrast this to a scenario I experienced last night in San Andreas:
 
- Walking down the street and bump into a drug dealer
- He asks me if I would like to buy any, I say naw man.
- Decide I might want to kill him and take his money so I start setting up in stealth for a knife kill
- Another pedestrian approaches him and does a deal, holy sh*t
- As soon as the dealer hands the product to the random pedestrians a cop car pulls up with lights flashing
- The officer gets out and draws his weapon on the dealer, intent on arresting him
- A small gun fight ensues, and the dealer flees on foot
- The cops chased him down and killed him
- Shortly afterwards an ambulance came and revived the drug dealer
 
 
This whole scene that played out totally at random, in a game almost a decade old, felt more alive than any other moment I've had in GTA V. It was executed so perfectly you would think the cops were running a sting operation on the dealer, it was that good. And yet it wasn't, it was just by chance that a cop happened to be patrolling the area and witnessed a drug deal going on between two random pedestrians, and jumped into action. It was incredible to witness and really made me that much more aware of why San Andreas was titled the best game of the PS2 generation by IGN. It truly was a marvel for it's time, and still is giving me quality experiences to this day.
 
And this reminded me, where are the patrolling cops in V? What happened to making arrests? Why are there no drug dealers approaching Franklin asking him if he wants any?
 
Where is this living breathing world you advertised to me Rockstar?
 
 
Sure the graphics are pretty, but this game is about as dead as a free roam game can get. And that hurts to say, because what GTA V does right, it does amazing. The gunplay, the graphics, the missions all are fun and incredibly detailed. But man, that free roam is really truly dead.
 
Thoughts?


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#53

Posted 01 March 2014 - 09:48 PM

Killahmatic: realize that that event I described was truly and fully random and then you will see how beautiful it is. There aren't even any patrolling officers in V let alone ones that will dynamically engage citizens not because they spawned into the cop chase action, but because they witnessed pedestrian AI committing crimes and pursuing them.

It is correct that police cannot arrest peds. This is something that IV introduced. But stupidly enough Rockstar turned around and watered down the police AI in V and now you'll never see a cop arresting anyone because every single police interaction in V ends with someone dying. This is illogical for them to not include AI features that they already had in their code. Why not improve upon it instead of simply removing it?

Same thing goes for food vendors and restaurants. Yeah its nice look theres chefs smoking cigarettes behind a restaurant but where's the dynamics and interaction there? There is none. All interaction has been stripped from the game and to me this makes it feel a whole lot less alive if I can't do anything with these pedestrians except make them call the cops or fight me.

Not only is there no improvement in these past 10 years with AI interactions, but it's actually seen a regression. We have less ways of messing with peds in V then we had in IV and that is inexcusable.
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SingularSoul
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#54

Posted 01 March 2014 - 09:53 PM

Killahmatic: realize that that event I described was truly and fully random and then you will see how beautiful it is. There aren't even any patrolling officers in V let alone ones that will dynamically engage citizens not because they spawned into the cop chase action, but because they witnessed pedestrian AI committing crimes and pursuing them.

It is correct that police cannot arrest peds. This is something that IV introduced. But stupidly enough Rockstar turned around and watered down the police AI in V and now you'll never see a cop arresting anyone because every single police interaction in V ends with someone dying. This is illogical for them to not include AI features that they already had in their code. Why not improve upon it instead of simply removing it?

Same thing goes for food vendors and restaurants. Yeah its nice look theres chefs smoking cigarettes behind a restaurant but where's the dynamics and interaction there? There is none. All interaction has been stripped from the game and to me this makes it feel a whole lot less alive if I can't do anything with these pedestrians except make them call the cops or fight me.

Not only is there no improvement in these past 10 years with AI interactions, but it's actually seen a regression. We have less ways of messing with peds in V then we had in IV and that is inexcusable.

 

Spot on. Couldn't have put it better myself :)


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#55

Posted 01 March 2014 - 09:57 PM Edited by Raavi, 01 March 2014 - 09:59 PM.

What's even more frustrating is that an example of how it should've been is in the game:

 

Realistic chase, realistic arrest, handcuffing, putting suspect in the back of the squad car..

 

 

Skip to 2:00 and ignore title.

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Johan
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#56

Posted 01 March 2014 - 10:04 PM

I agree OP, I'm not sure if it's because there's barely many pedestrians on the streets or so, but the game is far less "alive" than GTA IV or any other game.

 

Most of the times it felt like I was in a ghost town no matter where I was, and when I did see people they were mostly doing what every other ped was doing, either walking while making a phone call or just standing there.

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#57

Posted 01 March 2014 - 10:05 PM

"Living, breathing world." is a marketing line that R* has been excessively using since GTA IV (maybe even before).  GTA IV was "living" and "breathing" to an extent, but even that didn't have as much AI interaction as the developers and community hyped it up to have before its release.  A lot of the cool things like public service workers on top of light poles and window washers are way too rare in GTA IV.  However, the people of modern day Liberty City and the State of Alderney still seem to have more "character" than those of modern day Los Santos and Blaine County.

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Officer Ronson
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#58

Posted 01 March 2014 - 10:07 PM Edited by Officer Ronson, 01 March 2014 - 10:16 PM.

NVM.


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#59

Posted 01 March 2014 - 10:09 PM

@Raavi We only arrest the rich, or people we feel sorry for, the rest get shot.

Officer Ronson
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#60

Posted 01 March 2014 - 10:15 PM

Actually in IV police arresting a civilian was a heavily scripted event, they just needed to get pretty near the guy to get him to put his hands up. After that they just put him in a car and they drive aimlessly then he gets out, such dynamic. much better than GTAV. Such wow. better AI. Not.

 

The AI in IV basically less dynamic, they would stay there for hours while the AI in V would just stay there for a couple of seconds until they decide to stop their current action and go on with their day.

 

In V the AI needs the current subject to stand still to be able to be arrested, its not cut, its just that the civilian AI will run towards any gun thats presented to them in the face. There is also lines for police officers ordering a suspect in custody to get inside of the their respective vehicle.

 

A few days ago I saw this cop get punched by an Union worker, the cop had a shotgun and got up fastly but didnt shoot, he started chasing the guy and eventually he lost sight and gave up while I saw the other guy just running away, the cop got into his car and resumed patrol. Now THAT IS DYNAMIC.





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