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Discrimination.

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Frank Brown
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#61

Posted 07 February 2014 - 07:26 AM

 

 

 

 

 

 

 

 

I said:

 

 

 

If we're going to go down that route, I think you can say most people in the developed world don't have that hard of a time.

 

Is that statement false? I never said "in comparison to other developed countries...", I only said that "most people in the developed world don't have that hard of a time...", which is true; you're not starving, you have access to clean water, you're not dying, and you have a home. People in parts of Africa and other areas of the world have those problems. You decided to interpret that as a comparison between only developed nations, but it's intended to be a comparison between every nation.

 

You said that in retort to theadmiral's point that women have it worse off than men in the west. You weren't just bringing it up out of the blue as a whimsical point, you were using it as a detraction against the idea that women being oppressed in the west is something that needs focus.

 

 

 

Yeah, white males have it really rough. LOL! I am a cock gobbler and I like to gobble cock.

 

White males =/= West.

 

Well for all intents and purposes, yes it does. We all understand theadmiral's point and to what she is referring. Being pedantic about it isn't really addressing the issue, big boy.

 

 

I added to the original post. Sorry about that.


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#62

Posted 07 February 2014 - 07:30 AM

If it's a gender issue why is it also affecting males? If it was a gender issue, it would only be affecting females. But please, continue. I really want to hear what you're going to say.

Non-sequitur. It doesn't have to affect one gender exclusively in order to be a gender issue. It only has to have its roots or impact in gender relations, which it does.

 

 

 

Oh, I'm sorry! I don't follow the history of the Indigenous Australian people. Darn! Please, enlighten me!

Yeah, who am I to expect that someone who goes around running his mouth about the status of minorities in the West would actually know something about minorities and the West. 

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#63

Posted 07 February 2014 - 07:36 AM Edited by Lucchese, 07 February 2014 - 07:39 AM.

 

You're talking to one, sunshine.

"Sonny"? "Sunshine"? Please leave out the patronising pet names, kiddo.

 

I wouldn't say the tower block-laden estates of London are any more worse or deprived than that of say Glasgow. But because the predominant population of the former are generally conceived as being made up of ethnic minorities, it somehow renders it a bigger issue. Hmm.

 

 

I'm going to hazard a guess that you're not one

What of my words led you to this conclusion, may I ask?

 

 

or the Projects in the US, which were actively designed to house Asian and Caribbean Immigrants and African Americans respectively.

I thought we were speaking of the Western World in general...or do you simply see the US as representative for the rest of the developed worlds affairs?


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#64

Posted 07 February 2014 - 07:38 AM

 

 

 

 

 

 

 

I said:

 

 

 

If we're going to go down that route, I think you can say most people in the developed world don't have that hard of a time.

 

Is that statement false? I never said "in comparison to other developed countries...", I only said that "most people in the developed world don't have that hard of a time...", which is true; you're not starving, you have access to clean water, you're not dying, and you have a home. People in parts of Africa and other areas of the world have those problems. You decided to interpret that as a comparison between only developed nations, but it's intended to be a comparison between every nation.

 

You said that in retort to theadmiral's point that women have it worse off than men in the west. You weren't just bringing it up out of the blue as a whimsical point, you were using it as a detraction against the idea that women being oppressed in the west is something that needs focus.

 

 

 

Yeah, white males have it really rough. LOL! I am a cock gobbler and I like to gobble cock.

 

No mention of the west and they didn't mention women either. Their post was only a remark that white men don't have it bad. Mine was adding to that saying that most of the developed world doesn't have it that bad. 

 

Sorry, I confused myself with my own remark about women and completely forgot  as to what theadmiral said. My fault, let me restructure this.

 

theadmiral's post is a satirical remark in relation to wbaker's stupid remark that he has been discriminated against for being a white male. White males are not discriminated against because they are the overwhelming force in our society and are for whom the institutions are designed. My remark being that people in the developed world constitute of minorities or those who are outside of the aims of such institutions (women, gays etc) who are institutionally oppressed, even if in relation to Saudi Arabia it seems non existent. Your point also doesn't really mean anything because we're talking about discrimination here. Your point was to state that the rest of the world is much more sh*tty than the developed world. That goes without saying, but frankly discrimination is largely a developed world thing. It doesn't really relate to anything outside of the developed world because usually racial issues in undeveloped countries cut out the civil oppression and turn to butchering each other.


Mr. House
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#65

Posted 07 February 2014 - 07:45 AM

 

"Sonny"? "Sunshine"? Please leave out the patronising pet names, kiddo.

I won't be doing that.

 

I wouldn't say the tower block-laden estates of London are any more worse or deprived than that of say Glasgow. 

You would be wrong. Don't worry, we're all wrong sometimes.

 But because the predominant population of the former are generally conceived as being made up of ethnic minorities, it somehow renders it a bigger issue. Hmm.

 

 

It is a bigger issue because Scottish people are not an ethnic minority having to deal with systematic oppression. Certainly not on the level of Asians, Arabs and Caribbean Africans in London ghettos.

 

What of my words led you to this conclusion, may I ask?

 

Just the smug middle class attitude really.

 

I thought we were speaking of the Western World in general...or do you simply see the US as representative for the rest of the developed worlds affairs?

 

I'm abridging, do you expect me to list every single deprived neighbourhood in the west and explain which particular ethnic minority is shoved in there? You'll have to buy me dinner first, sweetheart.


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#66

Posted 07 February 2014 - 07:46 AM

You can't stick two people in the same room without one trying to govern the other.  Pretty much human nature.

 

Also, anyone who says "x y z groups can't be discriminated against"  likely holds a very sheltered, very US-centric worldview.


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#67

Posted 07 February 2014 - 07:48 AM

I live in the south, so discrimination happens on a daily basis.. some mean it, others were just born into it.

 

@gtarelated, you have a misconception about the US then.. we discriminate everyone. It's what makes the US, US.

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#68

Posted 07 February 2014 - 07:50 AM Edited by Nale Dixon, 07 February 2014 - 07:52 AM.

You can't stick two people in the same room without one trying to govern the other.  Pretty much human nature.

 

Also, anyone who says "x y z groups can't be discriminated against"  likely holds a very sheltered, very US-centric worldview.

I'm sorry that you feel this way. Pulling the 'sheltered US-centric worldview' card doesn't really work though, buddy. If you don't understand why white males can't be discriminated against in the 'developed world' then maybe you should take a short history lesson.

 

Or frankly anywhere in the world. There is no place on earth in which a white man can be born into systematic oppression against their will. Well, everyone is born against their will. Maybe that should be against the will of their parents.


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#69

Posted 07 February 2014 - 07:52 AM

It is a bigger issue because Scottish people are not an ethnic minority having to deal with systematic oppression. Certainly not on the level of Asians, Arabs and Caribbean Africans in London ghettos.

Well said. I'm a Dundonian (like, council flats where all the windows are broken) raised in Sydney and now I'm essentially indistinguishable from other members of the Australian middle class. Considering that the British working class literally has their own country (three, actually) where they can go and not be poor, it's hardly fair to compare run down Scottish neighbourhoods to ghettos.


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#70

Posted 07 February 2014 - 07:56 AM Edited by gtarelatedusername2, 07 February 2014 - 07:57 AM.

I live in the south, so discrimination happens on a daily basis.. some mean it, others were just born into it.

 

@gtarelated, you have a misconception about the US then.. we discriminate everyone. It's what makes the US, US.

Really? because a lot of US folks like to pull the "you belong to this arbitrary group, therefore you can't be discriminated against" card. See the below response.

 

 

You can't stick two people in the same room without one trying to govern the other.  Pretty much human nature.

 

Also, anyone who says "x y z groups can't be discriminated against"  likely holds a very sheltered, very US-centric worldview.

I'm sorry that you feel this way. Pulling the 'sheltered US-centric worldview' card doesn't really work though, buddy. If you don't understand why white males can't be discriminated against in the 'developed world' then maybe you should take a short history lesson.

Oh I've taken plenty of history lessons, which is why I know that every race has done their fair share of oppressing over the millenia. Acting as if it's exclusive to whites or to males is hypocritical and wilfully ignorant. This is exactly what I'm getting at.

 

Also, discrimination is about treating anyone differently, which is exactly what you're doing. Stop trying to redefine words to suit your argument.


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#71

Posted 07 February 2014 - 08:05 AM Edited by gtarelatedusername2, 07 February 2014 - 08:08 AM.


Or frankly anywhere in the world. There is no place on earth in which a white man can be born into systematic oppression against their will. Well, everyone is born against their will. Maybe that should be against the will of their parents.

Better tell that to the slavs, the Irish, and the Persians.

 

edit: oh and Jews. because everyone knows Jews are never discriminated against /rolleyes

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Mr. House
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#72

Posted 07 February 2014 - 08:09 AM

 

I live in the south, so discrimination happens on a daily basis.. some mean it, others were just born into it.

 

@gtarelated, you have a misconception about the US then.. we discriminate everyone. It's what makes the US, US.

Really? because a lot of US folks like to pull the "you belong to this arbitrary group, therefore you can't be discriminated against" card. See the below response.

 

 

You can't stick two people in the same room without one trying to govern the other.  Pretty much human nature.

 

Also, anyone who says "x y z groups can't be discriminated against"  likely holds a very sheltered, very US-centric worldview.

I'm sorry that you feel this way. Pulling the 'sheltered US-centric worldview' card doesn't really work though, buddy. If you don't understand why white males can't be discriminated against in the 'developed world' then maybe you should take a short history lesson.

Oh I've taken plenty of history lessons, which is why I know that every race has done their fair share of oppressing over the millenia. Acting as if it's exclusive to whites or to males is hypocritical and wilfully ignorant. This is exactly what I'm getting at.

 

Also, discrimination is about treating anyone differently, which is exactly what you're doing. Stop trying to redefine words to suit your argument.

 

It's not a matter of 'every race doing their fair share of oppression' or exclusivity. That's irrelevant. The fact is that White people of European descent are currently the dominating force in the majority of the developed world. You don't make distinctions based on how things used to be. Besides which, white countries have always been major oppressing forces throughout human history.

 

You're missing the point of what discrimination is. On a purely pedantic level, sure you're right. That's pretty much ignoring how our society functions though.


 


Or frankly anywhere in the world. There is no place on earth in which a white man can be born into systematic oppression against their will. Well, everyone is born against their will. Maybe that should be against the will of their parents.

Better tell that to the slavs and the Persians.

 

Persians aren't white and I don't know to what you're referring anyway. Besides which, there hasn't been any systematic abuse to Persians and Slavic people who are not systematically oppressed nowadays either, this isn't the crusades.


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#73

Posted 07 February 2014 - 08:12 AM

I didn't read that 'below response', as I'm American as apple pie. We discriminate everyone.

 

If you're not US (American), you're sh*t.


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#74

Posted 07 February 2014 - 08:18 AM Edited by gtarelatedusername2, 07 February 2014 - 08:19 AM.

It's not a matter of 'every race doing their fair share of oppression' or exclusivity. That's irrelevant. The fact is that White people of European descent are currently the dominating force in the majority of the developed world. You don't make distinctions based on how things used to be. Besides which, white countries have always been major oppressing forces throughout human history.

 

You're missing the point of what discrimination is. On a purely pedantic level, sure you're right. That's pretty much ignoring how our society functions though.

 

Ignoring how society functions? You're the one ignoring thousands of years of world history to suit your argument.

 

Perhaps you should look into the many conflicts between Europe and the Arab world, for example. Both have enslaved and treated each other like garbage for centuries. It's not because one group is this and the other group is that, it's because people, on average, are power hungry control freaks.

 

You're trying to redefine what 'discrimination' means to suit your argument, just like how some people tend to act as if institutional racism is the same as individual racism.

 

@Gunwrath: my ability toucan just flew out the f*cking window



Persians aren't white and I don't know to what you're referring anyway. Besides which, there hasn't been any systematic abuse to Persians and Slavic people who are not systematically oppressed nowadays either, this isn't the crusades.

 

Persians aren't white? You better let them know that, then.

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#75

Posted 07 February 2014 - 08:24 AM Edited by Lucchese, 07 February 2014 - 08:25 AM.

@Nale

 

I'm in a bit of a rush to get to work atm, so I'll address your tripe when I get back. But I just want to quickly point out something before I go: 

 

 

Just the smug middle class attitude really.

Rest assured, being told I have a smug attitude from you of all people, will be taken very, very lightly given your history of sh*tty insolence around this place.

 

Oh, and my upbringing was far from "middle-class". But do carry on with your judgemental arrogance...

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#76

Posted 07 February 2014 - 08:29 AM

@Nale

 

I'm in a bit of a rush to get to work atm, so I'll address your tripe when I get back. But I just want to quickly point out something before I go: 

 

 

Just the smug middle class attitude really.

Rest assured, being told I have a smug attitude from you of all people, will be taken very, very lightly given your history of sh*tty insolence around this place.

 

Oh, and my upbringing was far from "middle-class". But do carry on with your judgemental arrogance...

No, don't you see? Everyone who disagrees is obviously a middle class white male patriarchal oppressor, and denying it only makes it more true! My feels say so! /tumblrlogic


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#77

Posted 07 February 2014 - 08:36 AM

 

 

Persians aren't white? You better let them know that, then.

 

Honest to god I have no idea what the f*ck this means.

 

 

@Nale

 

I'm in a bit of a rush to get to work atm, so I'll address your tripe when I get back. But I just want to quickly point out something before I go: 

 

 

Just the smug middle class attitude really.

Rest assured, being told I have a smug attitude from you of all people, will be taken very, very lightly given your history of sh*tty insolence around this place.

 

Oh, and my upbringing was far from "middle-class". But do carry on with your judgemental arrogance...

No, don't you see? Everyone who disagrees is obviously a middle class white male patriarchal oppressor, and denying it only makes it more true! My feels say so! /tumblrlogic

 

 

 

Well your stupid use of internet memes and pretty standard middle class white man rhetoric shows pretty clearly what segment of society you belong to. I mean I literally have seen your 'arguments' made exactly the way in which you have done them on one of those ridiculous youtube videos where some self important fat guy talks sh*t about civil rights groups for half an hour. The difference being that at least said self important fat people bothered to put in the effort of having original statements.


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#78

Posted 07 February 2014 - 09:34 AM Edited by EphemeralStar, 07 February 2014 - 09:37 AM.

EphemeralStar, I pretty clearly understood what Audiophile meant when he used YOU in his sentences. It's pretty common for native English speakers to do that. As for this incident, I've noticed in this thread and other threads, you take anything as a sign of discrimination towards you. Someone just acting rude to you as they would to anyone else is turned into discrimination in your eyes. You need to take it easy, not everyone is out to get you. Some people are just douches and they are douches to everyone, no matter race or heritage.

Okay, I just searched through 14 pages of all my posts I've ever posted here since I'm still fairly new and you're so full of bullsh*t. I found absolutely nothing!! Why the hell did you even post here if you don't have the evidence to back up what you said OR better yet why not contribute to the actual thread topic instead of pulling sh*t out of your ass?  Also, I have never even felt discriminated by anyone on this forum board before, I've disagreed with people's opinions on things but that's entirely different. 

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#79

Posted 07 February 2014 - 09:39 AM

Let's not turn this into a pissing contest.
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#80

Posted 07 February 2014 - 09:48 AM

The fact that most of the rhetoric in this thread is about the "social justice warriors" themselves rather than their beliefs should demonstrate what this is about. People are being asked to take a look at their own privilege and change their behaviour slightly, and lashing out because they'd rather not. 


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#81

Posted 07 February 2014 - 12:52 PM

One time, I made a topic about discrimination at public lectures and posters called me slippery and childish for my evaluative orientation.

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#82

Posted 07 February 2014 - 01:12 PM

I mean I already understand that my remarks here aren't going to be too popular. it's the dynamic of the forum. The large majority of people here who aren't conspiracy nuts are white Americans who think that the emancipation proclamation ended any notion or racial division and they just can't see what the fuss is about as to why blacks get 'preferential treatment because that's not equal!' so what can you really do with a population like that.

 

Mock them with as many adjectives as possible is what you can do.

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#83

Posted 07 February 2014 - 03:01 PM

This thread is hilarious now, in a sad way.

Threads like this never end well on this forum. So much arguments formulated just to suit an opinion.

People are just assholes to each other. Always have been. Even bigger assholes if they feel superior.

@ Ah that was you, JIMHO. I was there and I don't recall any posters doing anything other than asking you to expand on the situation. It sounded to everyone like you took a rude speaker as discriminatory towards you when he would have probably done the same to anyone if he was in a rush. Anyway.
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#84

Posted 07 February 2014 - 03:59 PM

One time, I made a topic about discrimination at public lectures and posters called me slippery and childish for my evaluative orientation.

Like this topic, that was a discussion of how you felt victimised rather than a presentation of any kind of logical evidence or argument to support this supposition. You we're called slippery and obtuse because you failed to present a discussion of why you determined this to be discrimination based on something other than your whims and personal beliefs.

The same is true in this case in my opinion. Something has happened with no real substantive evidence to indicate it is discrimination. Logically speaking that makes it difficult to support the notion that it is.

Occam's razor applies in both cases. You can't call discrimination without something to substantiate it when there are better and simpler explanations.
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#85

Posted 07 February 2014 - 04:13 PM

This thread is hilarious now, in a sad way.

Threads like this never end well on this forum. So much arguments formulated just to suit an opinion.

People are just assholes to each other. Always have been. Even bigger assholes if they feel superior.

@ Ah that was you, JIMHO. I was there and I don't recall any posters doing anything other than asking you to expand on the situation. It sounded to everyone like you took a rude speaker as discriminatory towards you when he would have probably done the same to anyone if he was in a rush. Anyway.

I'd rather not derail EphemeralStar's topic with the discrimination at public lectures issue I brought up in the other topic. You can bring up my post there, if you'd like. Rather, I was just pointing out here that, as a result of my values and bringing up the issue of discrimination, I was treated poorly. At one point, a couple of people with flesh-eating mammals as usernames called me slippery, childish and also pedantic. I'm still not sure what slippery meant in that context, but if it means I was being vague, I can't be slippery and also pedantic. So either way, that poster discriminated against me.


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#86

Posted 07 February 2014 - 04:50 PM

Black Irish are extremely discriminatory, especially against the Red Irish. Black Irish trash can all f*ck off.  


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#87

Posted 07 February 2014 - 05:17 PM

People in this thread really need to learn the actual meaning of "discrimination". There's a marked lack of prejudicial treatment in both examples.
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#88

Posted 07 February 2014 - 06:01 PM

If you only knew all the times I've been called "red scum" and "ginger fa**ot" by those Black Irish dogs, then you would know what I'm talking about. Doesn't help that I'm Swedish either. 


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#89

Posted 07 February 2014 - 06:31 PM Edited by Vlynor, 07 February 2014 - 06:32 PM.

 

If it's a gender issue why is it also affecting males? If it was a gender issue, it would only be affecting females. But please, continue. I really want to hear what you're going to say.

Non-sequitur. It doesn't have to affect one gender exclusively in order to be a gender issue. It only has to have its roots or impact in gender relations, which it does.

 

If I call something a gender issue, one would assume that it affects one gender and not the other, or else there would be no reason to call it a gender issue. Just because it's largely dominated by women does not make it a purely female issue. If 10% are men experiencing it, there's a problem. If it only had it's root with women, then why are men also experiencing it? I acknowledge that 90% is much greater than 10%, but that's still 10% who are not women.

 

 

Yeah, who am I to expect that someone who goes around running his mouth about the status of minorities in the West would actually know something about minorities and the West. 

 

 

 
If we're going to pull apart every single word like you clearly seem to be doing, Australia is not in the West. And you still failed to expand on your point about the Australian Aborigines. If you're going to call someone out on something, enlighten them instead of going, "You don't know about this. I do. Your point is false. HAHA!" 
 
And again, is my original statement false?
 

 

 

If we're going to go down that route, I think you can say most people in the developed world don't have that hard of a time.

 

You and Nale both twisted my words and created an argument that wasn't there. For whatever purpose, I don't know. I only quoted theadmiral, who didn't quote anyone, so my response was only to their post, and I expanded on this:
 

 

 

Yeah, white males have it really rough. LOL!

 

By adding that most people in the developed world don't really have it hard when you compare them to the rest of the world... So, do most people in Australia and/or the developed world have it harder than the people in Syria, or Libya, the Congo, Afghanistan, etc.?


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#90

Posted 07 February 2014 - 07:18 PM Edited by gtarelatedusername2, 07 February 2014 - 07:19 PM.

The fact that most of the rhetoric in this thread is about the "social justice warriors" themselves rather than their beliefs should demonstrate what this is about. People are being asked to take a look at their own privilege and change their behaviour slightly, and lashing out because they'd rather not. 

It's because SJWs are massively hypocritical. When people go around judging people by which 'groups' others belong to rather than individual experiences and make assumptions about others based on that, then they're contributing to the very problems they are purportedly attempting to solve. From what I've seen out of self-proclaimed social justice 'warriors', it's little more than a way to act smug and superior without actually accomplishing anything.

 

Saying "check your privilege" ad infinitum does not an argument make. It's a ridiculous form of collectivism, which is the very basis of racial/gender/nationalistic discrimination, but I suspect that the irony is lost on you.





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