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Lexty.
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#1

Posted 27 January 2014 - 03:17 AM

Dry pilots and dashboards of black
Overhang the wooden charcoal pit
And bricks of Amber and rose crumble
It's grove of evergreen and the spiked pillars spit

Foreign boundaries on the outskirts of cacti
And junkyards of beat down cars, no doors
Shady looking figures wonder who's live of 9
And it's owner dressed in gowns and all

Failure is as simple as it is
No reason, no drawbacks
Just that but also this
Listen to your inner soul and pick the Potters ground
It's almost time but never it seeks in the lonesome fragile frown.

Failure is just of that,
It's scary and unbound of nature
Tattered in straws of light
Never returning again.
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Mokrie Dela
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#2

Posted 27 January 2014 - 10:14 AM

Once again, Coat, your language and imagery is beautiful.
Rhythmically, it flows very well,

 

 

I need to point out one of my pet peeves - i dislike seeing people say "lives of 9" - I personally think it doesn't look good. "lives of nine" would look much nicer imo. That might just be preference, but not typing out the word "nine" seems almost lazy, or cba - you don't see ampersands in poetry really; you see the word "and".

 

I also suspect there's a few typos/spelling errors in here - "Shady looking figures wonder who's live of 9" this doesn't make any sense to me. I actually stopped and tried to figure it out. Not what you want the reader to do with poetry.

 

Now the only other issue i see - i say issue, not problem, and it might be subjective here - is that, while the language is great, the flow good, i'm not getting any underlying connection between the verses. I can't figure out what much of it means or how it connects. Maybe it's over my head, but what's the meaning here? Does each line carry whatever meaning you want it to?

I do love that first verse and the first line of the second though. I got a sense of style from it, but I'll be honest with you, i'm not sure what this poem is trying to say to me...


Lexty.
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#3

Posted 27 January 2014 - 10:24 AM

Thanks Morkie for the feedback.

I understand what you mean about using words rather than simply numbers. But I would like you to do this for me - re-read this poem a few more times, and instead of trying to make a connection between the verses, try instead to find a whole meaning for the entire poem. You say my language and imagery is beautiful, yet you find no meaning? That's like calling a girl beautiful for what she looks like, rather than the deeper detail that lays within. Sometimes the detail that lays within is a true mystery, which you must find.

Mokrie Dela
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#4

Posted 27 January 2014 - 11:23 AM

Sometimes the detail that lays within is a true mystery, which you must find.

Ah, I think i might get what you're going for now.

Yes, there's definitely a feeling here of... well, I'm sensing desolation - in reading this i'd overlooked how poetry is interpreted as much as inferred - I was looking for a meaning, instead of just letting it be :(


D4 Damager
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#5

Posted 29 January 2014 - 04:57 AM Edited by D4 Damager, 29 January 2014 - 05:00 AM.

Could you please go over your poems again and double-check your apostrophes and spelling? I find it quite difficult to read your poetry because I am having to guess if you've used apostrophes correctly or not -- which just adds unnecessary confusion. There are also a couple of incorrect capitalisations, or at least one, anyway.

 

re-read this poem a few more times, and instead of trying to make a connection between the verses, try instead to find a whole meaning for the entire poem. You say my language and imagery is beautiful, yet you find no meaning? That's like calling a girl beautiful for what she looks like, rather than the deeper detail that lays within. Sometimes the detail that lays within is a true mystery, which you must find.

I have already been made to stop and re-read at quite a few points in the poem, to try and figure out what you are trying to say.

 

Notwithstanding the errors it seems as if certain sentences -- or even, certain portions of the poem -- just don't make any sense anyway. There are some bizarre word combinations that don't contribute any more to the imagery than a more orthodox choice would have.

 

I want to like this poem, I really do. However because there is no unifying feature or theme to it it reads like a couple of short vignettes followed by a piece on failure.


Lexty.
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#6

Posted 29 January 2014 - 06:28 AM

How I wrote it is exactly how I wrote it. If you'd like to point out my incorrect spelling, please do. As for the unusual capitalisation, that was merely a mistake but I decided to leave it as I didn't think it would matter. I don't usually use apostrophe marks in my poems as I usually like it to be just a flow of words - rather than a piece which tells you how to read it.

D4 Damager
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#7

Posted 29 January 2014 - 05:25 PM

Strange. I thought you'd misspelt charcoal in the opening verse. Never mind that, as I was either drunk or hungover when I wrote my first response.

 

How I wrote it is exactly how I wrote it. If you'd like to point out my incorrect spelling, please do. As for the unusual capitalisation, that was merely a mistake but I decided to leave it as I didn't think it would matter. I don't usually use apostrophe marks in my poems as I usually like it to be just a flow of words - rather than a piece which tells you how to read it.

 

I don't like the fact that you supposedly noticed the incorrect capitalisation and then thought it wouldn't matter. As a poet you're supposed to cultivate thoughts and images in the head of your readers, and in the proofreading stage you should be ironing out things like this rather than saying "f*ck it".

 

And I'm not trying to be confrontational for no reason but it appears as if you're usage of apostrophes is inconsistent across quite a few poems.

 

http://gtaforums.com...70978-i-saw-it/

http://gtaforums.com...7-jordans-tide/

http://gtaforums.com...661390-damaged/

 

You tend to not use apostrophes to indicate possession, except from when they are with "it" or "who". And when you do that, it's a mistake since "it's" only means "it is" and not "belonging to it". The same goes for "who's". If you're indicating possession then it should be "whose".

 

So if you aren't going to use apostrophes, don't use them at all. And if you do decide to use them, use them correctly. Especially since apostrophes don't tell the reader how to read the poem, unlike other punctuation marks they have a definite usage in marking the distinction between two grammatical cases.

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Mokrie Dela
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#8

Posted 30 January 2014 - 01:27 AM

I've got to say, regarding the spelling and that - writing the poem and going with the flow is great - i commend that. But before you upload it, you can give it a once over just to check spelling, grammar etc.

We all do it from time to time, but it's easy to address.

That said, i think D 4 Damager is making a mountain out of a mole hill - yes he's right, but i don't think you using "it's" instead of "its" ruins the poem - ignoring apostrophes (did you see the epic-ness of me trying to read The Road in the WR? :D) could be your "thing", but Damager's right in that it's inconsistent.

 

I'm a little worried, tbh, that you're not willing to take it on board. "How i wrote it is how i wrote it" - that, to me, sounds like "if you don't like it, f*ck off". I might be off the mark there, but i think we all want to improve, and listening to feedback is how you'll do that here.

 

I'll admit, coat, you're better than I am at poems.

 

I'm concerned you're ignoring the basics in writing, and saying "I saw the mistake, but thought i'd leave it" says one thing to me:

"I can't be bothered."

This will come over in your writings, and there's the risk of people becoming alienated because of it. I don't think that'll happen though; your poems are good and they have a nice flow to them. But imo that's no excuse to not bother with the basics - even if you add in the apostrophes and spelling changes AFTER you've written it - you won't lose the flow.

Those observant enough will notice the errors, and that WILL hinder the flow.

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Lexty.
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#9

Posted 30 January 2014 - 04:29 AM

I didn't mean to be coming off as edgy. And if I did, I do apologise.

I both understand what you are trying to say. Regarding you reading The Road - I am quite familiar with Cormac Mcarthy's writing and I admire it. I'm not saying I'm trying to dodge the rules of writing but at times I do like to write it my own way. I'm not trying to say 'if you don't like it, then f*ck off' rather I'm merely saying just accept how it's been written and if you still don't like it, I'm not going to hate you. After-all, it's poetry and not everyone likes how different poets craft their work.

Next time I'll take more care though. Thanks guys.

Mokrie Dela
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#10

Posted 30 January 2014 - 12:22 PM

I get you coat, don't worry.

But you have to think of it this way, and here's an analogy.

You're in a restaurant, and your dinner comes out. It looks like bowl of baby-vomit, and smells a bit musky. Most people would send it back, but if you tasted it, it might be the best thing you've ever tasted. But you eat with your eyes as much as your taste buds.

Appearance is important, and many writers will spot a missing apostrophe, or spelling error; many will overlook it, or as is quite natural, their minds will simply correct it*

But some will see it and it will be an issue.

 

 

I admire your confidence in your own style. On one hand, that's brilliant - everyone needs it - and saying "youre" for example is readable and, if consistent (like The Road, despite my issues with it!), could be your thing.

Personally, I don't see any major advantage of that. My understanding (in the end) of McCarthy's writing in The Road, was to convey that desolate, barren feel. In some of your works, i don't feel that's to your advantage, but at the end of the day, if that's your style, or choice, then stand by your conviction. Just be aware that it can, and at times, will, pull people out of it.

 

I've read some poems - and i THINK they might have been yours - that did have some basic errors is - the incorrect word, for example (lead or led, or something like that)**
It's all well claiming your style, and in the case of punctuation (which still plays a part in poetry), I can see where you're coming from, and if you do it right, it'll work. But with the spelling or incorrect words or phrase or whatever, it's really easy to fix. Seriously, you should see some of the first drafts i write; shocking. I once had to ditch an entire passage because, on editing, i just had no idea what the hell i was saying. I will give you that, however - with the exception of me not inferring the overall meaning too well (which one might argue is a failure on my part, or a failure to provide clarity, and that's neither here nor there) - such ommissions of apostrophes have not, for me at least, stopped me in my tracks and have me ask "what?"

I think you can get away with it - and i say "can" not "do" - but you have to be consistent and really conscious of what you're doing. Personally, I would advise a quick run through before you upload, checking the spelling and grammar, but that's just me.

I am curious to see what people like Eminence make of this subject.

 

 

*have you seen that thing where words are typed wrong, and you don't notice? Like:
"hvae you eevr noitced taht yuor mnid can raed wrods taht are misseplled?" or something like that?

 

** my memory isn't great so A it might not be yours im referring to and B i might have mistaken the context, if so, forgive me.

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D4 Damager
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#11

Posted 01 February 2014 - 05:05 PM

I second Mokrie's post. Consistency is key in things like this, and using apostrophes inconsistently is a bit of a mistake, since if you're trying to get the reader to buy in to your writing you need to make it relatively easy for them to see what you're doing and understand it.

 

That said, even if this poem was free of errors I still wouldn't have liked it because it seems to be without any link between the verses. I did like some of the other poems that I linked to though so I do think that you'd just benefit a bit from some more proofreading and crafting of your ideas :)

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