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Are you enrolled in Obamacare yet?

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RAS_ZeroZ
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#1

Posted 19 December 2013 - 07:32 PM

With people spending a lot of time indoors during these long and cold winter months it's the puuurrrfect opportunity to enroll!  Here is some holiday cheer from the enroll youtube channel that should motivate you!

 

 

The Barack Obama team has really nailed it with this image!  From the president's twitter feed https://twitter.com/...079861922508800

 

 

BbuN8iJCMAA34dL.png

 


askinnywhitedildo
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#2

Posted 19 December 2013 - 07:34 PM

I purposely have not signed up yet. 


jptawok
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#3

Posted 19 December 2013 - 07:41 PM

Unfortunately I cannot get this hand out, I'm one of the people with a "real job".

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trip
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#4

Posted 19 December 2013 - 07:46 PM

Unfortunately I cannot get this hand out, I'm one of the people with a "real job".

It isn't a hand out.  

 

People who shop for insurance through obamacare still pay.  They may even pay a bit more than people like you and me(who have healthcare through work) do.

 

Do people really think it is a handout? 

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Moonshield
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#5

Posted 19 December 2013 - 07:48 PM

Unfortunately I cannot get this hand out, I'm one of the people with a "real job".

 

Please expound upon this.

 

I know plenty of friends that have signed up (as they're either students with an expensive university healthcare plan or in that weird zone that 20 somethings run into nowadays with being overqualified and underemployed).

 

Since I'm a self-employed freelancer, I have to pay for my own healthcare, and since I make enough that my current plan is still better for less than what I qualify for Obamacare, I'm sticking with my current plan. Plus Obamacare doesn't cover holistic medicine.


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#6

Posted 19 December 2013 - 07:58 PM

No. Until they dramatically increase the fines (which they eventually will) I have no intention of enrolling.


Myron
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#7

Posted 19 December 2013 - 08:12 PM

With people spending a lot of time indoors during these long and cold winter months it's the puuurrrfect opportunity to enroll!  Here is some holiday cheer from the enroll youtube channel that should motivate you!

 

 

The Barack Obama team has really nailed it with this image!  From the president's twitter feed https://twitter.com/...079861922508800

 

 

BbuN8iJCMAA34dL.png

 

I'm sure my stance on Nationalised healthcare is pretty established on this forum, so don't take this as me opposing 'obamacare', but this is the stupidest f*cking thing I've ever seen. I know the Obama administration won 'best advertising campaign', but this is ridiculous. Do Americans really need to have everything marketed to them like a candy bar to understand it?


jptawok
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#8

Posted 19 December 2013 - 08:16 PM

 

Unfortunately I cannot get this hand out, I'm one of the people with a "real job".

It isn't a hand out.  

 

People who shop for insurance through obamacare still pay.  They may even pay a bit more than people like you and me(who have healthcare through work) do.

 

Do people really think it is a handout? 

 

Then why not get insurance on your own time, and your own leisure, at a better price, instead of being forced into it by the Feds?

 

It is a handout, not in the traditional way.  You're getting handed insurance.  You're getting forced into private enterprise by the government.  It is a massive handout to insurance companies.

 

Why is it OK to force people into private enterprise?  Why should someone's premium be $1200, when it used to be $1000, just so you can get your premium for the AHA dictated price of $800 (numbers are fabricated to illustrate the point, someone else is paying for your fixed rate insurance).   Why should your healthcare be anyones problem other than yours and your families?  And lastly, why should one of the most expensive, highest technical demand sectors be an entitlement? 

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WhatsStrength
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#9

Posted 19 December 2013 - 08:20 PM

I'd rather pay the fee so I don't have to sign up for it. I already have health care coverage under a family plan.


jptawok
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#10

Posted 19 December 2013 - 08:22 PM

I'd rather pay the fee so I don't have to sign up for it. I already have health care coverage under a family plan.

Then you shouldn't even have to worry about it...?


Myron
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#11

Posted 19 December 2013 - 08:25 PM

 

 

Unfortunately I cannot get this hand out, I'm one of the people with a "real job".

It isn't a hand out.  

 

People who shop for insurance through obamacare still pay.  They may even pay a bit more than people like you and me(who have healthcare through work) do.

 

Do people really think it is a handout? 

 

Then why not get insurance on your own time, and your own leisure, at a better price, instead of being forced into it by the Feds?

 

It is a handout, not in the traditional way.  You're getting handed insurance.  You're getting forced into private enterprise by the government.  It is a massive handout to insurance companies.

 

Why is it OK to force people into private enterprise?  Why should someone's premium be $1200, when it used to be $1000, just so you can get your premium for the AHA dictated price of $800 (numbers are fabricated to illustrate the point, someone else is paying for your fixed rate insurance).   Why should your healthcare be anyones problem other than yours and your families?  And lastly, why should one of the most expensive, highest technical demand sectors be an entitlement? 

 

Americans are the only people in the world who see social healthcare as something being forced upon them, yet something like transfats (a useless poison) being disallowed in food is an invasion of freedom.

 

Priorities.

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Nipperkins
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#12

Posted 19 December 2013 - 08:28 PM

 

 

Unfortunately I cannot get this hand out, I'm one of the people with a "real job".

It isn't a hand out.  

 

People who shop for insurance through obamacare still pay.  They may even pay a bit more than people like you and me(who have healthcare through work) do.

 

Do people really think it is a handout? 

 

Then why not get insurance on your own time, and your own leisure, at a better price, instead of being forced into it by the Feds?

 

It is a handout, not in the traditional way.  You're getting handed insurance.  You're getting forced into private enterprise by the government.  It is a massive handout to insurance companies.

 

Why is it OK to force people into private enterprise?  Why should someone's premium be $1200, when it used to be $1000, just so you can get your premium for the AHA dictated price of $800 (numbers are fabricated to illustrate the point, someone else is paying for your fixed rate insurance).   Why should your healthcare be anyones problem other than yours and your families?  And lastly, why should one of the most expensive, highest technical demand sectors be an entitlement? 

 

Yeah! Why do people living in one of the richest nations on Earth feel entitled to live a healthy life!


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#13

Posted 19 December 2013 - 08:32 PM

 

 

Unfortunately I cannot get this hand out, I'm one of the people with a "real job".

It isn't a hand out.  

 

People who shop for insurance through obamacare still pay.  They may even pay a bit more than people like you and me(who have healthcare through work) do.

 

Do people really think it is a handout? 

 

Then why not get insurance on your own time, and your own leisure, at a better price, instead of being forced into it by the Feds?

 

 

Well that would be nice, but don't forget that the insurance companies didn't really make it possible for the average Joe to get a good price..and certainly not a "better" price.

 

So you started with saying you weren't eligible for the hand out...now you are claiming that the hand out is to the insurance companies...?


jptawok
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#14

Posted 19 December 2013 - 08:44 PM

Yeah! Why do people living in one of the richest nations on Earth feel entitled to live a healthy life!

 

I know, it's easy to ridicule the position of people who have never had a problem with healthcare's points. 

 

Are we also entitled to happiness?  Shouldn't we be entitled to transportation?  Why not be entitled to entertainment?  We're the richest country on the earth, and the government forcing people into private business always works out really well! 

 

 

Well that would be nice, but don't forget that the insurance companies didn't really make it possible for the average Joe to get a good price..and certainly not a "better" price.

 

So you started with saying you weren't eligible for the hand out...now you are claiming that the hand out is to the insurance companies...?

 

 

No, I am not eligible for the lower priced, handed out healthcare, a neither is my employer.  It's OK, they'll just pay the lower skilled employees less and stop offering them benefits all together.  That's ok, right?

 

The insurance companies actually did offer a "good price".  The problem, is the "average Joe", would rather have Uncle Sam tell him what to get, would rather have him pay part of the premium, and would rather have him force the insurance companies to leverage premiums on the employers(and employees of) for the sake of meeting the forced premiums set by the AHA.

 

The grand majority of the uninsured are happily so, and haven't even looked into health insurance until Obama said it's law.  They're the "risk takers".  They risk going into debt for the rest of their lives on the trade off that they don't have an insurance company there to back their massive bills, for highly technical services.  If you don't like the bill, get less sophisticated services.  I hear blood letting is still a thing.

 

Before Healthcare.gov, you could go to a private insurance exchange and get insurance on par with a Public Sector employee for less than $200 a month.  How do I know?  It's what I did when I was in college.  Before you talk sh*t about unrelated things, I paid for college with my own money from being an appliance salesperson, and with student loans.  That's also how I paid for my healthcare.

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El_Diablo
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#15

Posted 19 December 2013 - 11:27 PM

And lastly, why should one of the most expensive, highest technical demand sectors be an entitlement? 

 

sh*tty logic is sh*tty.

I'm not sure what the price or complexity of health care has to do with the fact that it should be a basic human right.

 

there's more than enough money and technology on this planet (or at least in the US...) to ensure that no one has to go without the bare minimum amount of food, shelter, and medicine. to say otherwise is callous, ignorant, and flatly untrue.

 

a rising tide lifts all boats.

this has always and will always be true.


jptawok
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#16

Posted 19 December 2013 - 11:44 PM

 

And lastly, why should one of the most expensive, highest technical demand sectors be an entitlement? 

 

sh*tty logic is sh*tty.

I'm not sure what the price or complexity of health care has to do with the fact that it should be a basic human right.

 

there's more than enough money and technology on this planet (or at least in the US...) to ensure that no one has to go without the bare minimum amount of food, shelter, and medicine. to say otherwise is callous, ignorant, and flatly untrue.

 

a rising tide lifts all boats.

this has always and will always be true.

 

Price and complexity has a lot to do with it.  The problem is the system is set up, with or without the AHA, to make other people pay more when more services are rendered.  It's how insurance works.  We all pay premiums to cover other peoples procedures, its a group buying process.  The premiums are set the way they are for inflation, and to cover all costs.  What's going to happen when Obama's people bust through the doors and tell the insurance companies what they can charge?  If they force insurance companies to give the same coverage to person A for $800 dollars, while person B has always paid $1000 (because that's what keeps the insurance company in business), who picks up the slack?  Guess what, it's not the insurance company, and the hospital sure as f*ck isn't charging less money.  You guessed it, it gets passed up the chain until someone picks up the slack.  Whether that ends up being a persons employer, or the policy holder himself, is bad for business. 

 

Now it starts making more sense for employers to offer fewer employees insurance because their premiums have gone up.  Maybe it causes more business to take the route of kicking their employees into the AHA exchange.  So maybe it does end up forcing the hospitals into charging less in the long run.  Guess what?  Now doctors and nurses are paid less.  Now what careers end up being less desirable?

 

When the federal government starts regulating private enterprise and forces it's citizens into private business, everything goes to sh*t.  It's way too optimistic to think we can just run around supporting every person who's down on luck with every basic necessity.  Then you create mooches, because why work for more, or put forth the effort to better yourself, if your government will give you every single necessity to survive?  Lastly, ask any Economist.  It's fiscally impossible, even for our "rich"(debted) country to be this utopia some people believe it should be.

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Nipperkins
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#17

Posted 20 December 2013 - 12:05 AM

 

Yeah! Why do people living in one of the richest nations on Earth feel entitled to live a healthy life!

 

I know, it's easy to ridicule the position of people who have never had a problem with healthcare's points. 

 

Are we also entitled to happiness?  Shouldn't we be entitled to transportation?  Why not be entitled to entertainment?  We're the richest country on the earth, and the government forcing people into private business always works out really well! 

 

 

"Life, liberty, and the pursuit of happiness" are right in the Declaration of Independence. Since decent health is a prerequisite for all of those, I think it's our governments duty to assure all citizens have decent health care.


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#18

Posted 20 December 2013 - 12:08 AM Edited by El_Diablo, 20 December 2013 - 12:09 AM.

1) What's going to happen when Obama's people bust through the doors and tell the insurance companies what they can charge?

 

2) Now it starts making more sense for employers to offer fewer employees insurance because their premiums have gone up.  Maybe it causes more business to take the route of kicking their employees into the AHA exchange.  So maybe it does end up forcing the hospitals into charging less in the long run.  Guess what?  Now doctors and nurses are paid less.  Now what careers end up being less desirable?

 

3) When the federal government starts regulating private enterprise and forces it's citizens into private business, everything goes to sh*t.  It's way too optimistic to think we can just run around supporting every person who's down on luck with every basic necessity.  Then you create mooches, because why work for more, or put forth the effort to better yourself, if your government will give you every single necessity to survive?  Lastly, ask any Economist.  It's fiscally impossible, even for our "rich"(debted) country to be this utopia some people believe it should be.

 

1) you honestly believe this is going to happen??
ok, I guess we should talk about death panels too... :sigh:

 

2) there's actually no evidence to support this theory.

you can't really prove that larger scale implementation of AHA would cause doctors and nurses to lose salary.

 

3) completely false.

if you'd like me to start listing the innumerable examples from which government investment into private enterprise has worked out just fine, I will. but I'd rather save you the embarrassment and let you pick a different line of argument.

 

you're using hyperbolic rhetoric that isn't true.

the AHA is not the equivalent of "running around supporting every person who's down on luck with every basic necessity." that's a gross exaggeration of what's going on and you know it. government subsidy does not create "moochers." no one aspires to live off of government handouts. it's embarrassing and shameful and petty. it's not a luxurious lifestyle.

 

also "ask any economist" is probably the stupidest line you could have used to start any kind of argument.

there are many different kinds of economists who adopt many different economic theories. they're not a monolithic group of people who all agree on the exact same thing. you can't just "ask any economist"  and expect the same answer. there are many economists who have demonstrated that the US could afford to do much more for its poorest citizens than it does. just because you don't like what they have to say doesn't mean they're wrong or can't be found...

 

try again.

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#19

Posted 20 December 2013 - 06:36 AM

I'm already covered at the time being but I haven't even visited the doctors in years, being forced to buy health insurance 'or else' is really f*cking stupid in my opinion. 

 

How about they use those millions of tax dollars that seem to magically disappear into politicians pockets to buy everyone health insurance instead of fining people who don't really want to pay for it? What fees and fines are they going to dream up of next? 

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#20

Posted 20 December 2013 - 08:42 AM

 

1) What's going to happen when Obama's people bust through the doors and tell the insurance companies what they can charge?
 
2) Now it starts making more sense for employers to offer fewer employees insurance because their premiums have gone up.  Maybe it causes more business to take the route of kicking their employees into the AHA exchange.  So maybe it does end up forcing the hospitals into charging less in the long run.  Guess what?  Now doctors and nurses are paid less.  Now what careers end up being less desirable?
 
3) When the federal government starts regulating private enterprise and forces it's citizens into private business, everything goes to sh*t.  It's way too optimistic to think we can just run around supporting every person who's down on luck with every basic necessity.  Then you create mooches, because why work for more, or put forth the effort to better yourself, if your government will give you every single necessity to survive?  Lastly, ask any Economist.  It's fiscally impossible, even for our "rich"(debted) country to be this utopia some people believe it should be.

 
1) you honestly believe this is going to happen??
ok, I guess we should talk about death panels too... :sigh:
 
2) there's actually no evidence to support this theory.
you can't really prove that larger scale implementation of AHA would cause doctors and nurses to lose salary.
 
3) completely false.
if you'd like me to start listing the innumerable examples from which government investment into private enterprise has worked out just fine, I will. but I'd rather save you the embarrassment and let you pick a different line of argument.
 
you're using hyperbolic rhetoric that isn't true.
the AHA is not the equivalent of "running around supporting every person who's down on luck with every basic necessity." that's a gross exaggeration of what's going on and you know it. government subsidy does not create "moochers." no one aspires to live off of government handouts. it's embarrassing and shameful and petty. it's not a luxurious lifestyle.
 
also "ask any economist" is probably the stupidest line you could have used to start any kind of argument.
there are many different kinds of economists who adopt many different economic theories. they're not a monolithic group of people who all agree on the exact same thing. you can't just "ask any economist"  and expect the same answer. there are many economists who have demonstrated that the US could afford to do much more for its poorest citizens than it does. just because you don't like what they have to say doesn't mean they're wrong or can't be found...
 
try again.

 

 
It's also worth pointing out that basically all of Europe has free-at-the-point-of-access healthcare and most of us are just as productive as Americans, if not more so.

The "ask any economist" bit made me laugh out loud. Right, because all economists with any academic credence think that state-run healthcare systems lead to a lack of betterment amongst the citizens. I'll go call Paul Volcker and wake Franz Böhm from his dirt nap to tell them that they can't be very good economists because jptawok says all good economists believe that state assistance leads to no-one doing any work.

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#21

Posted 20 December 2013 - 11:52 AM

When the federal government starts regulating private enterprise and forces it's citizens into private business, everything goes to sh*t.  It's way too optimistic to think we can just run around supporting every person who's down on luck with every basic necessity.  Then you create mooches, because why work for more, or put forth the effort to better yourself, if your government will give you every single necessity to survive?  Lastly, ask any Economist.  It's fiscally impossible, even for our "rich"(debted) country to be this utopia some people believe it should be.

 

I won't comment on any otherof your claims as I must admit I don't know much about the US system of healthcare.

 

I disagree completely with the notion that providing basic necessities to those in need would create and encourage "mooches." I challange you to provide credible proof backing your claim (which isoften cited by a lot of the US right-wing in such debates).

Even if your claim is in fact supported (which I doubt), the benefits of such social care greatly outweigh what little is lost via increased laziness. Having slave drivers whipping workers to work faster and harder might decrease work procrastination and somewhat boost productivity, but I don't see much people calling for the removal of basic worker's rights for the same reason.

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theadmiral
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#22

Posted 20 December 2013 - 02:50 PM

Isn't claiming that any sort of government or state run program creates mooches something that only far right American Republicans do? There is usually a racial element to the claim as well when you hear people make it.


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#23

Posted 20 December 2013 - 04:40 PM Edited by Vlynor, 20 December 2013 - 04:40 PM.

Isn't claiming that any sort of government or state run program creates mooches something that only far right American Republicans do? There is usually a racial element to the claim as well when you hear people make it.

 

That's a bit of a generalization, don't you think? The logic isn't wrong, many state run programs do create mooches, but I don't believe this is one of them. If we had tax-paid-for health care then I could understand this claim, but we don't. Food stamps are mooched off of occasionally. Hell, there's people locally that are on food stamps and they, supposedly, eat better than I do 6/7 times a week.

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#24

Posted 20 December 2013 - 04:55 PM

 

Isn't claiming that any sort of government or state run program creates mooches something that only far right American Republicans do? There is usually a racial element to the claim as well when you hear people make it.

 

That's a bit of a generalization, don't you think? The logic isn't wrong, many state run programs do create mooches, but I don't believe this is one of them. If we had tax-paid-for health care then I could understand this claim, but we don't. Food stamps are mooched off of occasionally. Hell, there's people locally that are on food stamps and they, supposedly, eat better than I do 6/7 times a week.

 

 

Is it a generalization, really? It may be, but it is one that is correct in my experience. How do you vote?


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#25

Posted 20 December 2013 - 04:55 PM

 

 

Isn't claiming that any sort of government or state run program creates mooches something that only far right American Republicans do? There is usually a racial element to the claim as well when you hear people make it.

 

That's a bit of a generalization, don't you think? The logic isn't wrong, many state run programs do create mooches, but I don't believe this is one of them. If we had tax-paid-for health care then I could understand this claim, but we don't. Food stamps are mooched off of occasionally. Hell, there's people locally that are on food stamps and they, supposedly, eat better than I do 6/7 times a week.

 

 

Is it a generalization, really? It may be, but it is one that is correct in my experience. How do you vote?

 

 

I can't vote. Legally.


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#26

Posted 20 December 2013 - 04:56 PM

 

 

 

Isn't claiming that any sort of government or state run program creates mooches something that only far right American Republicans do? There is usually a racial element to the claim as well when you hear people make it.

 

That's a bit of a generalization, don't you think? The logic isn't wrong, many state run programs do create mooches, but I don't believe this is one of them. If we had tax-paid-for health care then I could understand this claim, but we don't. Food stamps are mooched off of occasionally. Hell, there's people locally that are on food stamps and they, supposedly, eat better than I do 6/7 times a week.

 

 

Is it a generalization, really? It may be, but it is one that is correct in my experience. How do you vote?

 

 

I can't vote. Legally.

 

How would you vote if you could?


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#27

Posted 20 December 2013 - 04:58 PM

 

 

 

 

Isn't claiming that any sort of government or state run program creates mooches something that only far right American Republicans do? There is usually a racial element to the claim as well when you hear people make it.

 

That's a bit of a generalization, don't you think? The logic isn't wrong, many state run programs do create mooches, but I don't believe this is one of them. If we had tax-paid-for health care then I could understand this claim, but we don't. Food stamps are mooched off of occasionally. Hell, there's people locally that are on food stamps and they, supposedly, eat better than I do 6/7 times a week.

 

 

Is it a generalization, really? It may be, but it is one that is correct in my experience. How do you vote?

 

 

I can't vote. Legally.

 

How would you vote if you could?

 

 

It depends. In the 2012 elections? I would've voted for Gary Johnson who is a member of the Libertarian Party and a former Republican.


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#28

Posted 20 December 2013 - 04:58 PM

 

 

 

It depends. In the 2012 elections? I would've voted for Gary Johnson who is a member of the Libertarian Party and a former Republican.

 

 

Ok, so you are a right wing voter and you feel that programs like that create mooches. What is the issue?


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#29

Posted 20 December 2013 - 05:00 PM

 

 

 

 

It depends. In the 2012 elections? I would've voted for Gary Johnson who is a member of the Libertarian Party and a former Republican.

 

 

Ok, so you are a right wing voter and you feel that programs like that create mooches. What is the issue?

 

 

Right wing? That's not true. Republican =/= Right Wing all the time. He was only in the Republican party because of the publicity of the Primaries.

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theadmiral
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#30

Posted 20 December 2013 - 05:01 PM

 

 

 

Right wing? That's not true. Republican =/= Right Wing all the time. He was only in the Republican party because of the publicity of the Primaries.

 

You've expressed numerous right wing viewpoints in the past, also. I'm not saying if they are correct or not in saying that they create mooches, just that is a viewpoint you only hear from the American right.





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