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General political discussion thread

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ryan_J
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#61

Posted 20 December 2013 - 07:14 AM

39538.png

 

I've taken this test several times over the years and I've consistently been closest to Nelson Mandela on every result.

 

That test has such a left-wing bias.

 

I slightly agree, but I think it's just the way some of the statements are worded.

 

I'm about the same, I'm slightly more left wing and slightly more libertarian though but only slightly.


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#62

Posted 21 December 2013 - 01:35 AM

Can someone tell me the difference between Liberalism and Libertarianism?


Vlynor
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#63

Posted 21 December 2013 - 01:55 AM Edited by Vlynor, 21 December 2013 - 01:57 AM.

Can someone tell me the difference between Liberalism and Libertarianism?

 

Liberalism, as defined by Merriam Webster:

 

 

 

believing that government should be active in supporting social and political change : relating to or supporting political liberalism

 

Libertarianism:

 

 

 

believing that people should be allowed to do and say what they want without any interference from the government

 

I believe liberalism became it's antithesis in the early 1900's in America. It used to have a similar meaning to Libertarianism. That meaning is now renamed Classical Liberalism.


Simoneski
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#64

Posted 21 December 2013 - 02:03 AM

I'm a Libertarian Socialist or Anarcho-Syndicalist. 

I hate how the US capitalists hijacked Libertarianism and those who think socialism and communism equals fascism are ignorant hypocrites. Capitalists would rather have the means of production in the hands on the elite few yet they call us the fascists. Also, to be an anarchist is to be against hierarchy yet capitalism thrives on hierarchy, thus Anarcho-capitalism makes no sense. 

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RoadRunner71
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#65

Posted 21 December 2013 - 02:07 AM

I'm a Libertarian Socialist or Anarcho-Syndicalist. 
I hate how the US capitalists hijacked Libertarianism and those who think socialism and communism equals fascism are ignorant hypocrites. Capitalists would rather have the means of production in the hands on the elite few yet they call us the fascists. Also, to be an anarchist is to be against hierarchy yet capitalism thrives on hierarchy, thus Anarcho-capitalism makes no sense.

Gotta agree how the communism and socialism had been, and still are, criminalized, mainly by US media, when the capitalism have made over the years atrocities closer to the fascism under the false name of "liberty" and "democracy".
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Vlynor
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#66

Posted 21 December 2013 - 02:11 AM

I'm a Libertarian Socialist or Anarcho-Syndicalist. 

I hate how the US capitalists hijacked Libertarianism and those who think socialism and communism equals fascism are ignorant hypocrites. Capitalists would rather have the means of production in the hands on the elite few yet they call us the fascists. Also, to be an anarchist is to be against hierarchy yet capitalism thrives on hierarchy, thus Anarcho-capitalism makes no sense. 

 

I don't think there are many people who think Socialism, Communism, and Fascism are exactly alike. They share similarities, however. And to say that capitalists want the means of production in the hands of an elite few isn't true. Anarcho-Capitalism makes sense. Anarchism means without government, not without hierarchy.


Simoneski
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#67

Posted 21 December 2013 - 02:18 AM

Government is hierarchy. 

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Vlynor
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#68

Posted 21 December 2013 - 02:20 AM

Government is hierarchy. 

 

But hierarchy isn't government.


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#69

Posted 21 December 2013 - 02:23 AM Edited by RAS_ZeroZ, 21 December 2013 - 02:24 AM.

11smsdw.png

Economic Left/Right: 2.12
Social Libertarian/Authoritarian: -5.08

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#70

Posted 21 December 2013 - 04:04 PM

Is of very good for America.

Aga2Lzk.jpg


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#71

Posted 22 December 2013 - 04:01 AM

leftist. strictly secularist. but a little bit nationalist too.

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#72

Posted 22 December 2013 - 05:21 AM

Is of very good for America.

Aga2Lzk.jpg

Your avatar says Fascist but your post says Communist.

 

Wot m8.


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#73

Posted 22 December 2013 - 11:22 AM

Your avatar says Fascist but your post says Communist.
 
Wot m8.

I thought that was a European road sign?
Anyway, by accepting communism, American can into big like China!


sivispacem
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#74

Posted 22 December 2013 - 11:37 AM

My Christmas wish for you is that things you post make sense.

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RoadRunner71
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#75

Posted 22 December 2013 - 11:39 AM

 

Your avatar says Fascist but your post says Communist.
 
Wot m8.

I thought that was a European road sign?
Anyway, by accepting communism, American can into big like China!

 

Because China is still a communist country...


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#76

Posted 22 December 2013 - 11:50 AM Edited by Typhus, 22 December 2013 - 11:51 AM.

I would say that if any label best describes me, it would be that of a Social Democrat. I believe in Capitalism, but feel that we must temper fiscal ambition with social responsibility to the less fortunate.

I want a world state, and truly feel that as such a thing is an inevitability anyway, we should aim to work towards it whilst we can. The air has changed,and I don't think many politicians have truly grasped how fundamentally the internet has connected mankind or the extent to which it has eroded traditional values and propagated the spread of liberal ideas.

 

In such a world, I am growing increasingly impatient with those on the right wing - who far from inhabiting the same spirit of compromise of Nixon, or even the dynamism of Mussolini - are instead proving to be obstructionists, zealots and throwbacks to a bygone era.

I do not believe humanity can advance at a satisfactory rate if we continue to suffer the voices of naysayers and prudes forever lambasting our hopes and attempting to hobble our dreams with prattle of 'morality'.

 

In truth, I believe society to be a more moral place than it has been before. I believe the internet has led to a greater awareness of injustice and a stronger community spirit among the disenfranchised and persecuted.

It is not the right wing I have issue with, it is simply their inability to accept the world as it is instead of how they wish it to be.


Drake1212
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#77

Posted 22 December 2013 - 01:28 PM

Is it just me or is there a lot of communists in here?

Anyway, i don't think anyone no longer can define themselves being either liberalists, neo-communist, anarchist or something-else-ist.
Even the political compass (which defines your political stance in 2-dimensional space) doesn't have enough dimensions to accurately portray one person's political beliefs.

 

However, if I had to describe myself with one the old ideologies it would have to be liberalism.


Lupin III
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#78

Posted 22 December 2013 - 06:10 PM

Liberatrian or constitutional conservitive.. Although I do understand most of the things I believe in are nothing but a pipe dream for America at this point.

 

pcgraphpng_php.png


Vlynor
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#79

Posted 22 December 2013 - 06:12 PM

 

Your avatar says Fascist but your post says Communist.
 
Wot m8.

I thought that was a European road sign?
Anyway, by accepting communism, American can into big like China!

 

 

That's a strange road sign.


BabeRuth
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#80

Posted 22 December 2013 - 06:38 PM

Independent.

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#81

Posted 22 December 2013 - 08:42 PM

 

 

Your avatar says Fascist but your post says Communist.
 
Wot m8.

I thought that was a European road sign?
Anyway, by accepting communism, American can into big like China!

 

 

That's a strange road sign.

 

Great. I've been given a warning for that. Thanks a lot.

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DillBagnr
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#82

Posted 23 December 2013 - 01:11 AM

I've never really felt it'd be any good to fly any specific political flag.  It's too limiting and I tend to hold different and often contradictory beliefs depending on the situation.

The politicalcompass test is dogsh*t and I don't understand how it's become so popular on the internet.  Over half of the questions have nothing to do with politics and cannot be put into a little crossing-dichotomies thing.

Regardless, I did it again for kicks and got "7" on ec and "-6 and change" on soc, so somewhere in the bottom right.  I can't be bothered to save the image and host it somewhere to post here, though.
 


Melchior
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#83

Posted 23 December 2013 - 01:27 PM

I'm an Anarchist and a Market Socialist. I'll use that handy graph to show where I fall on the spectrum:

 

ugi.png

 

It seems like a no brainer to me. Left-wing positions and political thought are grounded in empiricism and sound philosophical arguments, while the right-wing is all fear, dogma, bitterness and feelings of isolation due to change in society and at its heart, hostility towards the left, which they perceive as being the elitist establishment in art, academia and the media.

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ShootPeopleNotDope
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#84

Posted 24 December 2013 - 09:41 PM

 Anarcho-Capitalism makes sense. Anarchism means without government, not without hierarchy.

 

Capitalism can't exist without a state to uphold private property. Furthermore, anarchism has been a socialist ideology since it's inception. That is, it's always been in opposition to private property, wage-labor, and classes.

 

Etymologically, theoretically, and historically speaking, 'anarcho'-capitalism is ideologically inconsistent, and downright, dog-on silly.

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Vlynor
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#85

Posted 08 January 2014 - 08:06 AM Edited by Vlynor, 08 January 2014 - 08:10 AM.

 

 Anarcho-Capitalism makes sense. Anarchism means without government, not without hierarchy.

 

Capitalism can't exist without a state to uphold private property. Furthermore, anarchism has been a socialist ideology since it's inception. That is, it's always been in opposition to private property, wage-labor, and classes.

 

Etymologically, theoretically, and historically speaking, 'anarcho'-capitalism is ideologically inconsistent, and downright, dog-on silly.

 

 

Hm. I guess you're right. It's about as silly of an idea as Anarchy in general, isn't it?

 

How could you punish criminals with no government? No justice system, etc.? Could someone enlighten me?

 

 

My Christmas wish for you is that things you post make sense.

 

 

That wasn't aimed at me now, was it?


sivispacem
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#86

Posted 08 January 2014 - 09:56 AM

Of course it wasn't. It was aimed and OFWhatever who got banned

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#87

Posted 08 January 2014 - 11:34 AM Edited by Chunkyman, 08 January 2014 - 11:47 AM.

 

 

 

How could you punish criminals with no government? No justice system, etc.? Could someone enlighten me?

 

 

 

 

There's a number of systems under which you can have law and enforcement that isn't dependent on government.  Historically, law has been capable of being generated privately and enforced privately. These systems generally weren't 100% free market institutions, but they often got very close, and the amount to which the state interfered with these systems was often negligible or easily replaceable. Taiwan was a notable example of this, as people were able to enforce property rights and contracts despite relying very little (and often not at all) on governmental court or legal systems.

 

Economist and historian David Friedman has done a good deal of work on the subject, and his findings are truly fascinating. Here's a basic introduction to both his economic theories and some historical examples of these sorts of systems in practice. 

 

 

The below video showcases historical examples of legal systems (both good and bad) that are completely alien to most Westerners. It doesn't directly answer your question, however I think it helps in lending credibility to the idea that there are not only legitimate alternative (and often private) legal systems possible, but that many of these have existed in practice and were actually a functional system at various points throughout history.


Melchior
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#88

Posted 09 January 2014 - 02:23 PM

The issue with private police and courts is that they're generally only found in unindustrialised societies. Most of Europe relied on private police prior to the industrial revolution, but that only succeeded because all goods were artisan goods and couldn't be fenced. Industrialisation brought standardised (non-artisan) goods; stealing became so easy that organised crime was born and societal violence changed as well. Public police and courts mainly arose because of this.

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JIMHO
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#89

Posted 09 January 2014 - 05:47 PM

I like the quiz questions in this quiz better: http://science.time....-your-politics/


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#90

Posted 09 January 2014 - 05:58 PM

I'm a liberal, but in the European sense of the word (not the American bastardisation of it, which would be leftist).

 

So I'm a centrist, socially very liberal in most matters (drug decriminalisation and legalisation, equal rights for minorities, but not affirmative action), and fiscally conservative to an extent. By this, I mean I support, for example, German led austerity measures in order to stabilise the Eurozone (following the fiscal irresponsibility of many countries), and I have come to understand the UK Coalition's efforts to trim back the deficit. Furthermore, I support the model of Ordoliberalism, or the Social Market economy; that is, an economy that is predominantly free market, but regulated so that competition is kept fair and not oligopolistic. The purist laissez fairez approach, espoused by many libertarians, I find leaves the predatory aspects of the free market all too sharp.

 

I'm strongly secular, even slightly anti-religious, and support strongly equality of opportunity. Certain policies of the left, such as the universal provision of healthcare, I also support fully. In foreign policy, however, I am hawkish, and while this could be construed as a right wing perspective, I see it as a 'liberal interventionist' one. Namely, I believe that the West should not neglect it's role as the world's focal point of power, and should be willing to intervene if and when necessary to preserve and improve lives abroad. To do otherwise would be callous.

 

Finally, I also find efforts to reform backwards electoral systems (such as FPTP) a priority, and strongly support proportional representation. Entrenchment of civil rights, too, I find an admirable and excellent goal, in countries where this may not be so e.g. the UK.

 

TL;DR: 'radical centrist', very socially liberal, fiscally conservative, liberal interventionist, internationalist, secular.

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