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mrshane88
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#1

Posted 21 October 2013 - 04:36 AM

    Hello, I joined this forum because I need some help troubleshooting a few problems I'm having.

 

    1. Gta 4 stutters, lags when driving fast. all settings are on low, 1280x800 res.  lowing res does not help and makes it worse, any higher then 1360x768 makes it glitchy where it will stutter or lag when driving.

 

    2. Heres my hardware specs.

 

  ---CPU.  dual-core T9600 @ 2.80 ghz.

  ---GPU.  Nvidia geforce 9800m gts @ 1 gb. vram

  ---RAM.  4gb ddr3

  ---HDD. 7200rpm 230gb

 

   Gateway FX P-7801-u

 

 Output of GTA4 benchmark

 

Average FPS: 47.01
Duration: 37.08 sec
CPU Usage: 97%
System memory usage: 52%
Video memory usage: 30%

Graphics Settings
Video Mode: 1280 x 800 (60 Hz)
Texture Quality: Low
Shadow Quality: Low
Reflection Resolution: Off
Water Quality: Low
Texture Filter Quality: Tri-Linear
Night Shadows: Off
View Distance: 22
Detail Distance: 11

Hardware
Microsoft Windows 8 Pro

Video Adapter: NVIDIA GeForce 9800M GTS   
Video Driver version: 327.23
Audio Adapter: Headphones (High Definition Audio Device)
Intel® Core™2 Duo CPU     T9600  @ 2.80GHz

 

 

   What I need to know is if I spend a good chunk of money for a quad-core will it fix the stutters and lag issues. I also wanted to get an ssd drive to boost texture loading and improve performance even more. Is this a good step or am I just wasting money ?  My GPU seems strong enough to run gta 4 but I'm on the fence about upgrading if will really fix the problems. I wanted to get a qx9300 quad-core which can be overclocked to 3.5ghz.  Yes I'm getting 47fps now but the gameplay is not good with all the slowdowns and stutters. I've tried a number of tweaks and patches but nothing is workings to make it smooth. Any help would really make me happy. thanks


marmoo
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#2

Posted 21 October 2013 - 03:21 PM Edited by marmoo, 21 October 2013 - 03:23 PM.

You need to upgrade graphics as well. Also, don't believe in-game benchmark. It is full of crap.

Noticed your graphics is m which implies mobility I.e laptop. Can you upgrade that?

mrshane88
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#3

Posted 21 October 2013 - 05:02 PM

You need to upgrade graphics as well. Also, don't believe in-game benchmark. It is full of crap.

Noticed your graphics is m which implies mobility I.e laptop. Can you upgrade that?

 

  I think I can upgrade to either the gtx 260m or 280m.  My chip is not soldered into the motherboard, I beleive its a mxm 2.1 slot so upgrading is possible. Do you think the 260m or 280m gtx will perform better ?


mrshane88
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#4

Posted 21 October 2013 - 06:00 PM

 Of course I'm not 100% sure the graphics can be upgraded untill I take apart the laptop. And when I say take apart, I mean everything down to the motherboard to get to the Gpu. So its a pain to do and I haven't tried yet. If it can't be upgraded will the quad-core and ssd help improve performance ? I'm not looking to max out the graphics settings I just need some some speed and faster response time when it loads objects such as building, people, trees, cars, all that stuff. I can already play some high graphics games just fine with my gpu, they even have better graphics then gta 4 too. And I've heard people with slightly older cards running gta 4 fine.


marmoo
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#5

Posted 21 October 2013 - 07:54 PM Edited by marmoo, 21 October 2013 - 07:58 PM.

As you are proberly aware GTA IV is a poorly optimised console port. To be honest I could not say with any certainty that upgrading to the 2 cards you have suggested will give you the performance you are looking for. This game does struggle on most laptops and to get a medium performance you will have to spending a bit of cash to get your laptop up to spec. How long you had that laptop as it was released in 2008? Also your GPU may not be soldered but what about CPU? What PSU is in these? Will you have enough juice to upgrade both GPU and CPU?

mrshane88
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#6

Posted 21 October 2013 - 10:32 PM

As you are proberly aware GTA IV is a poorly optimised console port. To be honest I could not say with any certainty that upgrading to the 2 cards you have suggested will give you the performance you are looking for. This game does struggle on most laptops and to get a medium performance you will have to spending a bit of cash to get your laptop up to spec. How long you had that laptop as it was released in 2008? Also your GPU may not be soldered but what about CPU? What PSU is in these? Will you have enough juice to upgrade both GPU and CPU?

 

   Yes I can its poorly coded but its fun when it smooth, which is for the most part frequent. It suffers during doing random things like driving. Its hard to describe because sometimes it runs fine, then it suffers other times. Almost like the cpu cant proccess eveything fast enough.  The laptop takes a 90w changer, the Gpu is 75w and the cpu is 35w.  I don't know how this factors in if it does at all.  The motherboard I have now is for gateway fx p-7801u, I found a motherboard for p-7901u which has the gtx 260m gpu and doing some research proved I can upgraded to the newer motherboard.  This may help out abit.  But first I'm going to upgrade to a qx9300 quad-core at 2.53ghz and see if that helps. The qx9300 is an overcloackable cpu up to 3.7ghz.  If not I just might replace the motherboard, but many signs are pointing to the cpu being the bottleneck.


VIPΣR
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#7

Posted 23 October 2013 - 10:36 AM

Instead of upgrading a laptop and wasting your money, I would recommend you to build a desktop PC. But it's your choice. If I was in your position I would build a desktop PC.

jpm1
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#8

Posted 23 October 2013 - 02:59 PM Edited by jpm1, 23 October 2013 - 03:02 PM.

yes do not install above 4 Mo car mods (except 3 or 4 that mean a lot to ya)

 

wrong thread . DELETE this plz


mrshane88
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#9

Posted 23 October 2013 - 07:02 PM

   Isn't there anyone here who knows about the hardware I'm talking about ?  Ah whats the point, I guess I'll save up for a Sager laptop with gtx 770m and i7 quad-core. I'll be saving for awhile since its 1,300$.


jpm1
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#10

Posted 24 October 2013 - 10:41 AM

i don't know your laptop but in GTA IV 90 % of the problems are not hardware related . it's most of the time caused by the game structure that is not respected while modding . so to your question "if i spend 2000 $ on a brand new hardware , will i get a huge improvement the answer is NO" . did you installed latest patch , did you tried without auto-save and video capture options . i don't know about your hardware (i change mine only once every 5 years) , but it seems pretty descent (?) . and be sure not to have 2000 programs running in background while you play GTA too . also you can try a tip i use myself , before each GTA session change user in Windows then go back to your session . it takes 5s and you'll see a huge improvement


mrshane88
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#11

Posted 25 October 2013 - 04:39 AM Edited by mrshane88, 25 October 2013 - 04:40 AM.

i don't know your laptop but in GTA IV 90 % of the problems are not hardware related . it's most of the time caused by the game structure that is not respected while modding . so to your question "if i spend 2000 $ on a brand new hardware , will i get a huge improvement the answer is NO" . did you installed latest patch , did you tried without auto-save and video capture options . i don't know about your hardware (i change mine only once every 5 years) , but it seems pretty descent (?) . and be sure not to have 2000 programs running in background while you play GTA too . also you can try a tip i use myself , before each GTA session change user in Windows then go back to your session . it takes 5s and you'll see a huge improvement

 

 

 

I'm the only user on my laptop so I have no other accounts to switch too?  I did some reseach on PS3 and found it was built with the geforce gtx 7800 which is two generations or more older then my card and has lower specs then my card the 9800m gts. They recommend a quad-core cpu and I only have a dual-core at 2.8ghz which should meet the requirements but fails the test for some reason on can you run it.com  My Gpu meets alot of modern day games requirements but comes short with the cpu.  Also when I play GTA 4 I notice alot of hard disk thrashing, I assume that to could be causing delays.

 

I loaded FRAPS and checked real-worls fps, I get 30-50 fps all the time. But its not smooth, its often jerky driving around even though frame rates are high which confuses me. It makes me think I should upgrade the cpu and hard drive.


jpm1
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#12

Posted 25 October 2013 - 03:03 PM Edited by jpm1, 25 October 2013 - 03:03 PM.

you don't need to have several accounts to do what i said . just do like you were changing of account and come back . laptop is definitly not recommended for a game like GTA which is very detailled and that  needs lot of ressources


unc13bud
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#13

Posted 26 October 2013 - 08:38 AM Edited by unc13bud, 26 October 2013 - 08:42 AM.

your view settings are high, knock slider down to 5. what is your vehicle slider set to? and i don't think you should be playing gta iv with nvidia MOBILE gpu OF THAT AGE

http://www.engadget....tive-its-a-lot/

edit forgot to add thse:

http://forum.noteboo...otebooks-8.html

and

http://www.insidemyl...-series-laptop/


mrshane88
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#14

Posted 26 October 2013 - 09:24 AM Edited by mrshane88, 26 October 2013 - 09:29 AM.

   Well if its set too low I get more stuttering because it tries to draw everything at the last minute. I have my view at 20 and detail at 15 with vehicle density at 1 but it still seems like a ton of traffic is still on the streets. I figured out a conbination of command settings and graphics mod that help out alot and makes it playable with very little stuttering. Plus I overclocked my gpu by about 5% and limited the games framerate to 30fps which makes it pretty smooth and about 80% lag free so I'v been playing it for hours now and it only crashed once. I deal with screen tearing no matter if Vsnyc is enabled or not and I think the tearing makes It stutter alittle here and there.  I guess its true that it wasn't coded that great. A game with these graphics should be smooth as butter for my graphics card. I have many other games that have higher graphics and run just fine. Oh well it will have to do for now.

 

   I thought about upgrading the cpu for even smoother gameplay since the game is almost running at full speed now and my cpu is maxing out at 96%. But my only options are either the T9900 dual-core 3.06ghz  or the Q9200 quad-core at 2.4ghz. I already have 2.8ghz dual-core so would an extra 300mhz and 6 more mb of L2 cach really make a difference if I get the T9900 ? I really don't want to spend money on something that may or may not work, Id like to be certain on which will work better.

 

   I've heard GTX 260 laptop gpu is good, theres 260, 285, 460 and others in laptops that seem stronger then mine. In fact the newer model of my laptop has a 260m I think P-7905U.  I know how to work on laptops and find it easy as I've worked on many before. I may replace the motherboard on this one with a newer one with newer GPU but I think the newer one may only support cpu socket P which might leave me stuck at only going so high when it comes to cpus. as I am now.


unc13bud
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#15

Posted 28 October 2013 - 03:23 AM

i won't be able to sign in to reply this week (maybe). so i will tell you right now that hands down, the quad is best. you could have a quad that runs only 800mhz and it would beat a dual or tri core running 3ghz. i put a x4 975 in a biostar motherboard that would only let the processor run at 800mhz (capped because board's power phase only allows for 95w tdp processors) and the performance was similar to the x4 925 that i had swapped it out. it chugged in tbogt, but i turned the settings down a bit to medium and it was fine... just make sure your laptop can cool the cpu properly - i would buy a notebook cooler in any case


mrshane88
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#16

Posted 29 October 2013 - 05:43 AM

 Man I really don't get how they coded this game. I tried these settings.

 

Resolution -- 1024x768

Texture quality -- High

Reflection -- Off

Shadow -- low (no night shadows)

Texture filter -- triliner

View distance -- 3

Detail distance -- 4

Vehicle density -- 3

 

 And now it runs better then when I had Texture quality at low, resolution 1280x720, view 20, detail 15, vehilce 1. shadow low, reflection off.  Weird isn't it, I don't get how it could run worse with low texture quality and better with high textures ? I'm not using any frame limiter and vsync dosen't seem too effect it any. Oh heres some command line options I use.

 

-availablevidmem 100.0
-percentvidmem 100
-norestrictions
-minspecaudio
-forcer2vb  -------- I don't know what this does ?
-stereo
-novblank
-noprecache  ---------- I don't know what this does ?
-noswapdelay  ------------- I'm not sure what this does either ?
-disableimposters
-shawdowdensity 0

 

  Some commands I'm sure what they do but judging from what others say they seem to improve performance alittle.


jpm1
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#17

Posted 29 October 2013 - 12:00 PM

GTA is very detailled , has lot of 3D objects in the environment , so if you upgrade the CPU yes gameplay will be improved but don't expect miracles . you gain 5/6 fps ,  maybe 10 if you're in luck :sigh: . and for the 298 000 th time it's not a question of coding it's because the environment has lot of 3D objects in it


mrshane88
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#18

Posted 30 October 2013 - 06:21 AM

 I see well then should'nt an SSD drive load all those objects the fastest? I have a 7200rpm drive and gta 4 does alot of hdd thrashing.  I'm selling my current laptop for a Sager laptop so My last question would be if this setup could run gta 4 with much smoother performance then my current setup. I'm not looking to max the game but just have it look decent and run smooth even if that means putting a frame limiter on it. Heres the setup I want to get.

 

http://www.xoticpc.c...sm1-p-5840.html

 

If I cant quite afford it then I might shoot for this setup. I plan to upgrade either one to have an SSD drive.

 

http://www.xoticpc.c...0sh-p-5997.html


jpm1
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#19

Posted 30 October 2013 - 10:21 AM Edited by jpm1, 30 October 2013 - 10:21 AM.

i canno't garantee to you that an hardware upgrade will give you what you want . because GTA as i said as lot of details and 3D objects , and these games are very ressource demanding . but with an i7 or an i5 i believe you'll get a pretty descent thing . SSD are definitly better for the OS or the apps loading times but won't drastically improve the fps of your games . however i think that for that kind of game most important is not the GPU but the CPU


mrshane88
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#20

Posted 08 November 2013 - 01:20 AM Edited by mrshane88, 08 November 2013 - 01:21 AM.

   Well I grew tired of my laptop I mentioned above so I went out and got an Alienware laptop. It has the gt 750m gpu and i7 4700MQ cpu which shows 8 cores. I'll post the benchmark below. The benchmark shows Intel HD 4600 graphics so I'm not sure why that is, I told Nvidia to use the 750m for GTA 4 but it still show Intel. I havent had one stutter or slowdown though. I definitly noticed the difference.

 

 

Statistics
Average FPS: 66.07
Duration: 37.09 sec
CPU Usage: 29%
System memory usage: 38%
Video memory usage: 76%

Graphics Settings
Video Mode: 1366 x 768 (60 Hz)
Texture Quality: High
Shadow Quality: High
Reflection Resolution: High
Water Quality: High
Texture Filter Quality: Anisotropic x4
Night Shadows: Off
View Distance: 25
Detail Distance: 31

Hardware
Microsoft Windows 8

Video Adapter: Intel® HD Graphics 4600
Video Driver version: 9.18.13.1148
Audio Adapter: Speakers (Realtek High Definition Audio)
Intel® Core™ i7-4700MQ CPU @ 2.40GHz

File ID: Benchmark.cli


jpm1
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#21

Posted 08 November 2013 - 01:24 AM

cool for you


mrshane88
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#22

Posted 08 November 2013 - 02:05 AM

    Thanks, I guess its true about older hardware having trouble, I still think it was the t9600 dual-core. Maybe an upgrade would've helped but that laptop is 5 years old and big at 17 inches. I like this 14' better, I just went out and rented the Alienware to see if its specs where up to the job so I might buy it. The lights are cool also. Anyway thanks to everyone who tried to help. I just thought I'd post this so other people know that these specs I have now work perfect.


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#23

Posted 20 November 2013 - 09:44 AM Edited by mrshane88, 20 November 2013 - 09:51 AM.

   After a few weeks playing gta 4 on the new Alienware 14 laptop with i7 4700mq, 8gb ram, and the GT 750M gpu, I thought I'd share some observations.  First off, while the game runs fine with all settings on high 1366x768 resolution, view 25, detail 30, vehical 30, vsync.  I found it better to take the settings down to medium, the reason is minor, When theres alot of action and explosions going on it can decrease frame rate down to 26 fps. Plus no matter what power settings I use, if you game on the battery it automaticly cuts 10 fps off the overall frame rate.

 

  So with everything at medium I've been running the game good. Visuals are still nice, and now if I game on the battery I can get more battery life and no decrease in frame rate that would cause any slowdown. The game can run on high settings, but its in situations where alot of action and explostions where the decrease might bother some people, plus if this happens while your on battery expect a slowdown to 15 fps instead of 25 fps plugged in. And thats why I toned down the settings. I hook this up and play it on my flatscreen at medium settings and it still looks good.

 

 So if anyone is having some slowdowns with the GT 750M on high settings, try medium. You can then run the game on battery power without a performance lose.

 

--These results were taken from intense gameplay, cops, mutipul explosions, intense action pushing the game to its max.--

 

 High with intense explosions ( A/C Power )  26fps - no lag, was playable

 High with intense explosions ( Battery )  16fps  - lagged on/off during intense action.

 Medium with instense explosions ( A/C Power )  36 fps -Good frate rate for alot of action

 Medium with instense explosions ( Battery )   30 fps - no lags or slowdowns

 

 Normally just walking, driving, flying around the city I get anywhere from 45-60 fps. It might drop to 45 in heavy tree areas but never lags. intense action in tree areas still brings 35 fps or more so the above tests were only during heavy combat with several explosions going off. On medium you shoud never have to worry about frame rate lag.


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#24

Posted 09 December 2013 - 04:56 PM

My HP laptop has a Radeon HD 7470M card and Core i7 2620M cpu
The setting is:
Texture high
Reflection very high
Water high
Shadow low
Night shadow off
Texture filter anistropic x4
Draw distance 20
Detail distance 20
Vehicle density 32
Vsync off

The frame rate is always at aroud 20 fps when cruising, 15 fps when causing havoc, the game runs choppy but seems cpu can handle it
The game is a not so good port, after all

unc13bud
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#25

Posted 30 December 2013 - 04:17 AM

 

HD 7470M

that videocard sux for gta iv, the "74" tells me it doesn't have shaders worth doodly, probably like 160, which is almost like onboard video nowadays - amd apu chips have 384 and 400 shaders, and they are still not good enough above 1280x1024 (imo)


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#26

Posted 01 January 2014 - 09:05 PM Edited by Andreas, 01 January 2014 - 09:07 PM.

you could have a quad that runs only 800mhz and it would beat a dual or tri core running 3ghz.

That's absolute nonsense. First of all, GTA IV doesn't even utilize four processor cores, but only three since it's ported from the Xbox 360, which, as you probably know, uses a triple-core CPU. But, you are right with your intimation that the clock speed is not all that matters when it comes to the performance of a CPU. GTA IV seems to benefit from a strong performance per given clock, but the clock spped still seems to play a certain role on this matter.
 

and for the 298 000 th time it's not a question of coding it's because the environment has lot of 3D objects in it

Not quite. The amount of 3D objects on the screen is not all that affects the in-game performance. Optimization plays a very important role in this as well, and IV lacks a bit in this area.
 

It has the gt 750m gpu and i7 4700MQ cpu which shows 8 cores. I'll post the benchmark below. The benchmark shows Intel HD 4600 graphics so I'm not sure why that is, I told Nvidia to use the 750m for GTA 4 but it still show Intel.

Just to let you know, the i7 4700QM is not an octa-core processor; it is actually a quad-core processor with Hyper Threading (HT/SMT). The in-game benchmark shows the HD4600 as used graphic unit, but that doesn't mean it's in fact the case. Going by the performance and the settings you're using, IV definitely runs with the 750M.

unc13bud
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#27

Posted 13 January 2014 - 01:14 AM

 

That's absolute nonsense. First of all, GTA IV doesn't even utilize four processor cores, but only three since it's ported from the Xbox 360, which, as you probably know, uses a triple-core CPU.

If that's the case, the benchmark wouldn't get above 75% usage for quad cores, but it does. but i don't really want to get into semantics, especially as i haven't been posting lately or playing gta IV/EFLC, i am trying to beat San Andreas' stupid plane missions before V comes out for PC





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