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The Potential Problem in Grand Theft Auto Online

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EJTexasMade
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#31

Posted 26 September 2013 - 01:18 PM

I really doubt there's gonna be a 3 day lag with the servers. Some stalls or hang-ups may occur, but they've confirmed that for the last two weeks they've been buying and setting up new servers to combat the load.


DaCosta
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#32

Posted 26 September 2013 - 01:20 PM

I think both are a possibility how ever I think I'd prefer no instances, after reading everyone's comments I think both have pros and cons, of course we won't know for sure till we try it next week. Hopefully R* tried it both ways and picked the best option for us...or maybe passive mode will remove the effect of free roaming interfering with a mission...

 

I'm pretty sure it was confirmed that you could set the time of day, weather effects etc for heists. If this is true, then whenever anyone activates a heist it will have to forward-wind the time (as in single player) but this obviously won't happen for all 16 players on that session or it would be weird. I'm certain that the actual heist parts will be instanced.
 


EJTexasMade
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#33

Posted 26 September 2013 - 01:27 PM

 

I think both are a possibility how ever I think I'd prefer no instances, after reading everyone's comments I think both have pros and cons, of course we won't know for sure till we try it next week. Hopefully R* tried it both ways and picked the best option for us...or maybe passive mode will remove the effect of free roaming interfering with a mission...

 

I'm pretty sure it was confirmed that you could set the time of day, weather effects etc for heists. If this is true, then whenever anyone activates a heist it will have to forward-wind the time (as in single player) but this obviously won't happen for all 16 players on that session or it would be weird. I'm certain that the actual heist parts will be instanced.
 

 

This isn't what they said. They said you could set the time of day, weather effects, etc. for created missions. Not every mission. After they talked about that, they went on to talk about uploading the missions and sharing them.


maloy82
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#34

Posted 26 September 2013 - 01:36 PM

I understand the point I guess, but then again, I also feel like, your to dang lazy to do the work yourself so just gank the guy who did all the work  lazy in my opinion,  Ih ope they are instanced, make those beggers, work for it like I did, not kill me after I  took a  dang hour to plan. but oh well were All about opinions here, so theres mine.


mike_2621
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#35

Posted 26 September 2013 - 02:25 PM

It would work good if the heists arent instanced, if youre taking an hour to plan your heist and you dont plan on player interference, youre doing it wrong. haha

Plus there should be several entrances to the building to avoid people just rpging you as soon as you get out.


Fizwalker
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#36

Posted 26 September 2013 - 03:27 PM

 

I think both are a possibility how ever I think I'd prefer no instances, after reading everyone's comments I think both have pros and cons, of course we won't know for sure till we try it next week. Hopefully R* tried it both ways and picked the best option for us...or maybe passive mode will remove the effect of free roaming interfering with a mission...

 

I'm pretty sure it was confirmed that you could set the time of day, weather effects etc for heists. If this is true, then whenever anyone activates a heist it will have to forward-wind the time (as in single player) but this obviously won't happen for all 16 players on that session or it would be weird. I'm certain that the actual heist parts will be instanced.
 

 

I thought that was for the content creator....


DaCosta
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#37

Posted 26 September 2013 - 03:35 PM

 

 

I think both are a possibility how ever I think I'd prefer no instances, after reading everyone's comments I think both have pros and cons, of course we won't know for sure till we try it next week. Hopefully R* tried it both ways and picked the best option for us...or maybe passive mode will remove the effect of free roaming interfering with a mission...

 

I'm pretty sure it was confirmed that you could set the time of day, weather effects etc for heists. If this is true, then whenever anyone activates a heist it will have to forward-wind the time (as in single player) but this obviously won't happen for all 16 players on that session or it would be weird. I'm certain that the actual heist parts will be instanced.
 

 

I thought that was for the content creator....

 

 

The content creator will eventually allow you to create heists but fair enough, they haven't specifically stated that you can set time of day/weather effects for created heists yet.

 

But I'm certain heists will have to be instanced - as in, heists will become private sessions for those taking part. I just hope that the consequences spill out into the free-roam world afterwards.
 


_KC
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#38

Posted 26 September 2013 - 03:52 PM

You guys have to take note. most, if not all, people who are setting up a ambush wont do it in a way that the people pulling off a heist even have a chance. Heist should be instanced. So I say again, why go through all the trouble buying everything when you can just camp out a heist location and take the money eaisly?

You're gonna be extremely pissed when you go online.


BurnCK
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#39

Posted 26 September 2013 - 04:14 PM

I just hope that online is free aim only

TLagBro
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#40

Posted 26 September 2013 - 04:21 PM

You guys have to take note. most, if not all, people who are setting up a ambush wont do it in a way that the people pulling off a heist even have a chance. Heist should be instanced. So I say again, why go through all the trouble buying everything when you can just camp out a heist location and take the money eaisly?

You're gonna be extremely pissed when you go online.
Not really, im gunna be the one screwing people over. Im not wasting my money

BurnCK
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#41

Posted 26 September 2013 - 04:30 PM

I think people are also forgetting the 16 player limit (rumoured to now be 32). I can't see there being hundreds of players running round the map shooting at each other in a dynamic world.

ClingingMArs
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#42

Posted 26 September 2013 - 05:20 PM Edited by ClingingMArs, 26 September 2013 - 05:22 PM.

Bit like playing 11vs11 in Fifa. Some games are amazing with tight teamwork and competition with everyone holding their positions/roles, others have the goalkeeper constantly sprinting towards the halfway line, players who refuse to pass or people that got lumped with positions in defense constantly trying to score own goals, etc.

 

 

that's why you organize a club together ;) if crews in GTAO are anywhere near as fun as a well organized pro club in FIFA, I'll be satisfied.


ONEkingscar
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#43

Posted 26 September 2013 - 05:22 PM

 

You pull off this huge hiest, got the fast car, expensive guns and everything planned out. You go to execute the hiest and everything is going according to plan until as soon as you get in the car to escape you blow up and all that work goes to nothing. I honestly dont understand how that is considered "fun" or "makes you think". Now maybe other crews can sabotage your hiest in such ways as popping tires, setting up a sting for cops ect. But a crew waitinf outside a popular hiest mission and just rpging, Sticky bomb rigging and Gernade launching your crew as soon as you step out seems annoying and defeats the purpose.

 

That's why people should assign snipers and such as lookouts outside while the rest of the crew is inside getting the money. I don't want to be separated from non crew members when I'm doing a heist. I don't want to be put in a 'mission world' where opposing players can't intervene. That would kill a lot of immersion in my opinion.

 

This ^^.Just place someone outside the building to make sure no one tries to f*ck with your score.


ClingingMArs
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#44

Posted 26 September 2013 - 05:25 PM

 

I think the missions will be instanced, because too much can go "wrong", when other players can enter the same building, or simply hang around the same area.

 

But as you mentioned dynamic scenarios where one crew tries to steal the money from the guys who just did the heist should be possible, I would guess it would be something like, when you enter the bank, you go into an instance, but as you come out and get ready to roll out, you are back in the open world, where other people can see you and engage you

 

I think missions will be instanced for the same reasons as above. If heists weren't instanced then two heists could take place at the same time, in the same location, and it wouldn't make sense. A heist requires all the pieces of the board to be specifically placed, including NPC characters, vehicles and items. These need to be in place or the heist simply won't work. For instance, if the heist involves you driving to a location and getting on a plane, and a free-roaming individual happens to randomly take the plane in the meantime, or another heist-crew happen to blow that plane up without realising its importance, then the mission ends with you not even knowing why. The mission text says "Get on the plane" and there is no plane. You can't have well-defined heists and missions crossing over into the free-roam world.

 

However, I've put a lot of thought into this and it might not be all bad if the game switches the crew back into free-roam immediately after the heist is completed (and when the police chase/escape occurs) This also goes along with what aR2k has said.

 

During this police evasion section (which happens after almost all GTA missions) it could notify all players on that server session that a heist has just occurred (through Weazel News), the amount stolen and size of crew, that the suspects are being chased (news footage from following helicopters) and their whereabouts (denoted on the map.)

 

Now, any crews in the area wouldn't have been able to sabotage the heist - because they didn't know it was about to happen, or where - but the moment the police chase happens they could choose to rush in their crew to try and steal the loot, before the theft-crew escapes the police and banks it.

 

This would result in the crew trying to not only escape the police but potentially any other players and crews that happen to be online, on their server, at the time of their heist. It would be very exciting and make fast police evasion all the more important.

 

Even after police evasion there would be paranoia that another crew might still be tracking them (from their last known location) and covering nearby ATM's and key locations. They would need to decide whether they should race to an ATM to "cash in" and conclude the mission or try and blend in with traffic and "lay-low"? Or travel in a well-armed convoy and take on anyone that tries to stop them. Or just get well out of the hot area and hope no-one is following them. The possibilities of strategy here are endless.

 

(With this system, I am assuming that you cannot always see the markers of other players on the mini-map, but can if police are after them.)

 

This system will allow instanced heists, prevent crews preparing blatant heist sabotages and yet will allow for the chaotic and open-ended conclusion that people want from GTA:Online. What are your thoughts?

 

 

this sounds like the best case scenario imo


psychadelic145
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#45

Posted 26 September 2013 - 09:21 PM

 

I mean for this to be a serious discussion, so please keep all petty and childish claims out of the thread. And yes, this is a "wall of text" as some would call it. I can only imagine these people have never actually had to read anything on an academic level, being that this only takes a minute or two to read. Just, uh, leave the thread if you hate reading, I guess.
 
Grand Theft Auto Online is ambitious. There's no denying that. As excited for it as I am, I've got some fears that it won't be everything it could be. My fears stem from something that I'm certain not everyone thinks about, but probably should consider. For the purposes of this argument, I'll be focusing on the idea of instances. To clarify, instances are privatized areas that are technically part of the game world, but are limited to yourself and potentially those you invite.
 
For example, the player housing. There will obviously be a limited number of housing options, and there will be many times when you share a game session with someone who has purchased the same residence as yourself. The game will handle this in that you enter the instanced version of the residence that pertains to you (it will definitely differ provided we are given the option to customize our homes, which I hope is the case). From here, you can invite other players into the instance. If you're inside your home and someone else who owns the home enters, they enter their own instance that is set apart from yours. This is all very clear and obvious to most people, but more importantly, it works. It works out of the necessity of the situation. It has to be done this way or there will be game-breaking issues.
 
Let's talk about the core problem here. Varying hints and phrases have led me to believe that other parts of GTA Online will also be instanced, such as missions and heists. This is particularly disappointing. It offers a disconnect in what GTA Online should probably be, which is a primarily social experience backed by an open-ended "risk vs. reward" scenario. Say you're coming out of a bank with a score. You've just pulled off a pretty good heist with a few of your crew members, and you're feeling pretty damn good about it. As you're walking to your getaway car, it explodes. You enter a state of panic as shots begin to ring out. Some other crew got wind of your heist and now wants the cash for themselves. Dynamic situations like these cannot occur with instanced scenarios, and it's pretty heartbreaking.
 
Rockstar likes to throw out the word "persistent" when referring to GTA Online. I feel like we're only getting half of the definition when we're constantly forced to exit a free roam mode to go do missions and heists that could just as easily stay within the main world of a free roam. Where's the challenge? The social aspect? This is one of the few things separating heists and missions from being stale and repetitive. Instead of just taking the score and outrunning the cops, you have the potential to be held up even further by real players and engage in epic scenarios.
 
The common argument against this is that people don't want others "ruining their fun." Rockstar has already confirmed that you cannot mess with people while they are playing Golf and Tennis, and I'm sure those won't be the only protected activity. I'm not sure why we are being subjected to this overdramatic casualization of something that could be real next-level stuff, but it definitely brings down my hype levels.
 
We'll know more come Tuesday, of course, but what do YOU think?

 

Here's the thing i saw in a interview/news

So during the heist it's all instnace. It's during the getaway that others may interfere therefore one of your concerns is already addressed.


psychadelic145
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#46

Posted 26 September 2013 - 09:54 PM

in case no one saw my earlier post the way it will work is that you go through the heist as instance, once you are leaivng and on the getaway is when others may step in.


snacker111
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#47

Posted 26 September 2013 - 10:33 PM Edited by snacker111, 26 September 2013 - 10:33 PM.

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DaCosta
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#48

Posted 26 September 2013 - 10:45 PM

 

Here's the thing i saw in a interview/news

 

So during the heist it's all instnace. It's during the getaway that others may interfere therefore one of your concerns is already addressed.

 

 

Hi Psychadelic,

 

Have you got the source for this? Would be keen to see this interview/news article. :)


Xavier Horovitz
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#49

Posted 26 September 2013 - 11:44 PM

 

 

Here's the thing i saw in a interview/news

 

So during the heist it's all instnace. It's during the getaway that others may interfere therefore one of your concerns is already addressed.

 

 

Hi Psychadelic,

 

Have you got the source for this? Would be keen to see this interview/news article. :)

 

 

Someone has posted a thread detailing how heists work, and he confirmed it.


DaCosta
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#50

Posted 26 September 2013 - 11:51 PM

 

 

 

Here's the thing i saw in a interview/news

 

So during the heist it's all instnace. It's during the getaway that others may interfere therefore one of your concerns is already addressed.

 

 

Hi Psychadelic,

 

Have you got the source for this? Would be keen to see this interview/news article. :)

 

 

Someone has posted a thread detailing how heists work, and he confirmed it.

 

 

This topic? http://gtaforums.com...ries-explained/

 

Yes, well written and extensive by MactoTillDeath although the source remains a mystery. I really hope it plays out this way - it would be perfect!


Xavier Horovitz
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#51

Posted 27 September 2013 - 12:01 AM

 

 

 

 

Here's the thing i saw in a interview/news

 

So during the heist it's all instnace. It's during the getaway that others may interfere therefore one of your concerns is already addressed.

 

 

Hi Psychadelic,

 

Have you got the source for this? Would be keen to see this interview/news article. :)

 

 

Someone has posted a thread detailing how heists work, and he confirmed it.

 

 

This topic? http://gtaforums.com...ries-explained/

 

Yes, well written and extensive by MactoTillDeath although the source remains a mystery. I really hope it plays out this way - it would be perfect!

 

 

The best part about his thread is that it all makes sense. It's the completely logical way for everything to work, so I've got some hope.


Itislupus
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#52

Posted 27 September 2013 - 12:06 AM

I beg to differ. Less on the "oh hey some guys just blew up our getaway car" but more on the. "Hey, I know these guys are gonna rob this bank. I'm gonna start popping shots in front of it to lure the cops here as they walk in the door".

There is a difference between taking someone's score and griefing.

I just want to know how the shards will be maintained. Can we group up before entering the game world to ensure we get put together and avoid "game world full" messages? Will the shard be brought up on demand? IE: player is able to start new a lobby with x number of private slots. Not "searching for matches"

lilshadowxzx
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#53

Posted 27 September 2013 - 12:06 AM

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THE DRAGOON
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#54

Posted 27 September 2013 - 12:11 AM

You guys have to take note. most, if not all, people who are setting up a ambush wont do it in a way that the people pulling off a heist even have a chance. Heist should be instanced. So I say again, why go through all the trouble buying everything when you can just camp out a heist location and take the money eaisly?

Stil disagree. 
 

You said earlier snipers can't handle people with RPG's. You serious? Pretty simple the way I see it. Hopefully, they'll respawn somewhere a bit out of the way. Two snipes take out the RPG holders. Take cover again, taking their blips off. Move to another roof close to the area. 

Get away driver should only pull up when the people call on him. Pretty simple to me. 


giraffeboy
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#55

Posted 27 September 2013 - 01:38 AM

Yeah the onus should be on the robbers to get away through skill and wit, not the game to protect them. If you get killed and robbed after a job, well you obviously didn't plan it as well as you should, or were bettered by a more skilled player, either way it's down to you to learn from your mistakes for the next time. This way will allow for more strategy and long term enjoyment of the game, doing heists would prob get old if there's only one human element at work. I'm definitely going to experiment with robbing people on their way out of jobs, not because I'm a griefer, because it sounds like the hardest challenge to pull off. It's a task in itself to figure out where the heist is going to go down, set up the ambush strategy, and then successfully pull it off, all in a much shorter timeframe than the other guys have had to plan their heist. Its not as simple as just rocking up to a bank with an RPG and saying hello.


giraffeboy
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#56

Posted 27 September 2013 - 02:32 AM

Well that sucks, just read the Robberies/Heists thread and it appears that once you have done the job you spawn so people specifically can't ambush you, they'd have to catch you on the fly through a news announcement etc. I'm disappointed.


Xavier Horovitz
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#57

Posted 27 September 2013 - 02:33 AM

Well that sucks, just read the Robberies/Heists thread and it appears that once you have done the job you spawn so people specifically can't ambush you, they'd have to catch you on the fly through a news announcement etc. I'm disappointed.

 

This is the result of casualization. Some people aren't cut out to handle a proper game with difficulty. Still, things could have been worse.


TLagBro
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#58

Posted 27 September 2013 - 03:05 AM

You guys have to take note. most, if not all, people who are setting up a ambush wont do it in a way that the people pulling off a heist even have a chance. Heist should be instanced. So I say again, why go through all the trouble buying everything when you can just camp out a heist location and take the money eaisly?

Stil disagree. 
 
You said earlier snipers can't handle people with RPG's. You serious? Pretty simple the way I see it. Hopefully, they'll respawn somewhere a bit out of the way. Two snipes take out the RPG holders. Take cover again, taking their blips off. Move to another roof close to the area. 
Get away driver should only pull up when the people call on him. Pretty simple to me.
One or two sniper(s) going up against a four person crew with rpgs. Please tell me, how rpgs dont win?

ProGamerGov
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#59

Posted 27 September 2013 - 03:09 AM

You guys have to take note. most, if not all, people who are setting up a ambush wont do it in a way that the people pulling off a heist even have a chance. Heist should be instanced. So I say again, why go through all the trouble buying everything when you can just camp out a heist location and take the money eaisly?

Stil disagree. 
 
You said earlier snipers can't handle people with RPG's. You serious? Pretty simple the way I see it. Hopefully, they'll respawn somewhere a bit out of the way. Two snipes take out the RPG holders. Take cover again, taking their blips off. Move to another roof close to the area. 
Get away driver should only pull up when the people call on him. Pretty simple to me.
One or two sniper(s) going up against a four person crew with rpgs. Please tell me, how rpgs dont win?

Well it's a f*cking numbers game like that and if the snipers hit them long range then what can they do about it?

TLagBro
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#60

Posted 27 September 2013 - 03:54 AM

You guys have to take note. most, if not all, people who are setting up a ambush wont do it in a way that the people pulling off a heist even have a chance. Heist should be instanced. So I say again, why go through all the trouble buying everything when you can just camp out a heist location and take the money eaisly?

Stil disagree. 
 
You said earlier snipers can't handle people with RPG's. You serious? Pretty simple the way I see it. Hopefully, they'll respawn somewhere a bit out of the way. Two snipes take out the RPG holders. Take cover again, taking their blips off. Move to another roof close to the area. 
Get away driver should only pull up when the people call on him. Pretty simple to me.
One or two sniper(s) going up against a four person crew with rpgs. Please tell me, how rpgs dont win?

Well it's a f*cking numbers game like that and if the snipers hit them long range then what can they do about it?

Looks like hes gunna have to hit 3 more. Of course its numbers. It just would be way too easy to take someones score. A Poorly skilled crew of 4 spamming rpgs and gernade launcher beats 2 skilled snipers anyday of the week, you cant kill all 4 of them at the same time. Its that simple.




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