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The Potential Problem in Grand Theft Auto Online

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Xavier Horovitz
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#1

Posted 26 September 2013 - 01:16 AM Edited by Xavier Horovitz, 26 September 2013 - 01:16 AM.

I mean for this to be a serious discussion, so please keep all petty and childish claims out of the thread. And yes, this is a "wall of text" as some would call it. I can only imagine these people have never actually had to read anything on an academic level, being that this only takes a minute or two to read. Just, uh, leave the thread if you hate reading, I guess.
 
Grand Theft Auto Online is ambitious. There's no denying that. As excited for it as I am, I've got some fears that it won't be everything it could be. My fears stem from something that I'm certain not everyone thinks about, but probably should consider. For the purposes of this argument, I'll be focusing on the idea of instances. To clarify, instances are privatized areas that are technically part of the game world, but are limited to yourself and potentially those you invite.
 
For example, the player housing. There will obviously be a limited number of housing options, and there will be many times when you share a game session with someone who has purchased the same residence as yourself. The game will handle this in that you enter the instanced version of the residence that pertains to you (it will definitely differ provided we are given the option to customize our homes, which I hope is the case). From here, you can invite other players into the instance. If you're inside your home and someone else who owns the home enters, they enter their own instance that is set apart from yours. This is all very clear and obvious to most people, but more importantly, it works. It works out of the necessity of the situation. It has to be done this way or there will be game-breaking issues.
 
Let's talk about the core problem here. Varying hints and phrases have led me to believe that other parts of GTA Online will also be instanced, such as missions and heists. This is particularly disappointing. It offers a disconnect in what GTA Online should probably be, which is a primarily social experience backed by an open-ended "risk vs. reward" scenario. Say you're coming out of a bank with a score. You've just pulled off a pretty good heist with a few of your crew members, and you're feeling pretty damn good about it. As you're walking to your getaway car, it explodes. You enter a state of panic as shots begin to ring out. Some other crew got wind of your heist and now wants the cash for themselves. Dynamic situations like these cannot occur with instanced scenarios, and it's pretty heartbreaking.
 
Rockstar likes to throw out the word "persistent" when referring to GTA Online. I feel like we're only getting half of the definition when we're constantly forced to exit a free roam mode to go do missions and heists that could just as easily stay within the main world of a free roam. Where's the challenge? The social aspect? This is one of the few things separating heists and missions from being stale and repetitive. Instead of just taking the score and outrunning the cops, you have the potential to be held up even further by real players and engage in epic scenarios.
 
The common argument against this is that people don't want others "ruining their fun." Rockstar has already confirmed that you cannot mess with people while they are playing Golf and Tennis, and I'm sure those won't be the only protected activity. I'm not sure why we are being subjected to this overdramatic casualization of something that could be real next-level stuff, but it definitely brings down my hype levels.
 
We'll know more come Tuesday, of course, but what do YOU think?
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hadrianswall
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#2

Posted 26 September 2013 - 01:20 AM

cant see missions being instanced , ive read you cannot mess with people during tennis and such , but anything in the open world is fair game .
if anything the minor griefing aspects of online games are what i enjoy most, i dont mean intentionally messing peoples games up , but the risk reward for playing online , stealing and killing . far to many online games baby the player base , when the game that started it all off (ultima) had people hooked for these very reasons 


Xavier Horovitz
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#3

Posted 26 September 2013 - 01:22 AM

cant see missions being instanced , ive read you cannot mess with people during tennis and such , but anything in the open world is fair game .
if anything the minor griefing aspects of online games are what i enjoy most, i dont mean intentionally messing peoples games up , but the risk reward for playing online , stealing and killing . far to many online games baby the player base , when the game that started it all off (ultima) had people hooked for these very reasons 

 

I was a bit irate at the golf and tennis thing, but it really is a fair trade. I'd hate to be bombed by a fighter jet while playing golf with some buddies. Yet, for things like missions, I really like the idea of other players trying to interfere. Adds to the challenge. Adds some reward, too, if you can take them out and get their cash.


beastjeffrey
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#4

Posted 26 September 2013 - 01:23 AM

I love the point you made but...... Way to long didnt read lolololololol

ClingingMArs
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#5

Posted 26 September 2013 - 01:23 AM Edited by ClingingMArs, 26 September 2013 - 01:24 AM.

I do think you bring up some interesting points, but I'm not ready to pass judgment on how Rockstar handles "instances" until I play the game. And Rockstar even mentions screwing with other people in one of the articles, describing the ability to call in an airstrike on a race.


Xavier Horovitz
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#6

Posted 26 September 2013 - 01:24 AM

I love the point you made but...... Way to long didnt read lolololololol

 

Well, as long as you get the point :p

 

I do think you bring up some interesting points, but I'm not ready to pass judgment on how Rockstar handles "instances" until I play the game.

 

Believe me, I'm on your side. That's why the word "potential" is in the title. It's all only potential stuff.


ClingingMArs
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#7

Posted 26 September 2013 - 01:28 AM

 

I do think you bring up some interesting points, but I'm not ready to pass judgment on how Rockstar handles "instances" until I play the game.

 

Believe me, I'm on your side. That's why the word "potential" is in the title. It's all only potential stuff.

 

I think if they execute it the way we're hoping it will be a smashing success, barring any sort of server issues. All of the talk that's been coming from Rockstar has been about their multiplayer "ambition", how "this is the multiplayer we've always wanted to make", so I hope they really went for it here.


Santa-SmokinAces
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#8

Posted 26 September 2013 - 01:38 AM

Personally, I would want people from other crews to initiate an all out gang war against me and my fellas after a heist. I mean sure everyone wants the money, but what's the fun of all of that? You need to throw in something unpredictable and un-called for like a gang war in the middle of a heist. That would make you focus more, and think more. It would make you comprehend the situation at hand and think it through before you do it. It separates smart players, from the not-so smart. I don't mean to sound biased in any way, but this is my honest opinion. From passive mode, to this it really gets you thinking wisely about your decisions, and in all honesty I can't wait to see what they'll bring to the table. Either way, I'm sure it'll be a hell of an experience and no disappointment what-so-ever.


Xavier Horovitz
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#9

Posted 26 September 2013 - 01:40 AM

Personally, I would want people from other crews to initiate an all out gang war against me and my fellas after a heist. I mean sure everyone wants the money, but what's the fun of all of that? You need to throw in something unpredictable and un-called for like a gang war in the middle of a heist. That would make you focus more, and think more. It would make you comprehend the situation at hand and think it through before you do it. It separates smart players, from the not-so smart. I don't mean to sound biased in any way, but this is my honest opinion. From passive mode, to this it really gets you thinking wisely about your decisions, and in all honesty I can't wait to see what they'll bring to the table. Either way, I'm sure it'll be a hell of an experience and no disappointment what-so-ever.

 

You're definitely spot on about the "what's the fun of all of that" in terms of repetition. If it was simply run in, grab the score, outrun the cops and split the cash every time, it'd get depressing after awhile.


tre288
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#10

Posted 26 September 2013 - 01:43 AM

I don't think missions will be instanced. Only thing I'm thinking might be instance aside from apartments is possibly mission interiors like the bank you are holding up. Would be weird running into other people also trying to rob that bank. Once outside I can see it being fair game trying to make off with the cash safely with your friends.

It was mentioned before too that races take place right in the world, I remember reading duing a race someone collided with a cop car that was chasing another player.

I don't think you have anything to worry about

aR2k
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#11

Posted 26 September 2013 - 02:27 AM

I think the missions will be instanced, because too much can go "wrong", when other players can enter the same building, or simply hang around the same area.

 

But as you mentioned dynamic scenarios where one crew tries to steal the money from the guys who just did the heist should be possible, I would guess it would be something like, when you enter the bank, you go into an instance, but as you come out and get ready to roll out, you are back in the open world, where other people can see you and engage you


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#12

Posted 26 September 2013 - 02:34 AM

[quote name="tre288" post="1063470807" timestamp="1380159799"]

I don't think missions will be instanced. Only thing I'm thinking might be instance aside from apartments is possibly mission interiors like the bank you are holding up. Would be weird running into other people also trying to rob that bank. Once outside I can see it being fair game trying to make off with the cash safely with your friends quote]

acctually i think that would make hiest even more interesting and competitive if rival gangs met robing the same place

lannydee
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#13

Posted 26 September 2013 - 02:38 AM

What a mature thread you've got here.


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#14

Posted 26 September 2013 - 03:48 AM Edited by Spitfirex007, 26 September 2013 - 03:51 AM.

I'd be highly annoyed if I just pulled off a big bank heist, only to be met by rocket launchers. Yes the thrill of not knowing if someone is out there waiting to blow up your team would be fun.. but at the same time, if I spend the time planning the event, pull off the job etc and that whole hour or so it wasted, it ruin the fun of doing those types of things.

 

But I'm not a hardcore gamer. I could give two sh*ts less about my KD. I don't feel my online crib will get me laid in real life. These things aren't important. What is fun, is having fun with friends and just playing a game I enjoy.


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#15

Posted 26 September 2013 - 04:10 AM

You pull off this huge hiest, got the fast car, expensive guns and everything planned out. You go to execute the hiest and everything is going according to plan until as soon as you get in the car to escape you blow up and all that work goes to nothing. I honestly dont understand how that is considered "fun" or "makes you think". Now maybe other crews can sabotage your hiest in such ways as popping tires, setting up a sting for cops ect. But a crew waitinf outside a popular hiest mission and just rpging, Sticky bomb rigging and Gernade launching your crew as soon as you step out seems annoying and defeats the purpose.

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#16

Posted 26 September 2013 - 04:20 AM

You pull off this huge hiest, got the fast car, expensive guns and everything planned out. You go to execute the hiest and everything is going according to plan until as soon as you get in the car to escape you blow up and all that work goes to nothing. I honestly dont understand how that is considered "fun" or "makes you think". Now maybe other crews can sabotage your hiest in such ways as popping tires, setting up a sting for cops ect. But a crew waitinf outside a popular hiest mission and just rpging, Sticky bomb rigging and Gernade launching your crew as soon as you step out seems annoying and defeats the purpose.

 

That's why people should assign snipers and such as lookouts outside while the rest of the crew is inside getting the money. I don't want to be separated from non crew members when I'm doing a heist. I don't want to be put in a 'mission world' where opposing players can't intervene. That would kill a lot of immersion in my opinion.


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#17

Posted 26 September 2013 - 04:43 AM

You pull off this huge hiest, got the fast car, expensive guns and everything planned out. You go to execute the hiest and everything is going according to plan until as soon as you get in the car to escape you blow up and all that work goes to nothing. I honestly dont understand how that is considered "fun" or "makes you think". Now maybe other crews can sabotage your hiest in such ways as popping tires, setting up a sting for cops ect. But a crew waitinf outside a popular hiest mission and just rpging, Sticky bomb rigging and Gernade launching your crew as soon as you step out seems annoying and defeats the purpose.

 
That's why people should assign snipers and such as lookouts outside while the rest of the crew is inside getting the money. I don't want to be separated from non crew members when I'm doing a heist. I don't want to be put in a 'mission world' where opposing players can't intervene. That would kill a lot of immersion in my opinion.

One or two players cant hold off a crew of people with RPGs. The process time and money of setting up and planning a heist is pointless if you can just wait on people to do the work for you and then just kill them.

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#18

Posted 26 September 2013 - 05:11 AM

 

I mean for this to be a serious discussion, so please keep all petty and childish claims out of the thread. And yes, this is a "wall of text" as some would call it. I can only imagine these people have never actually had to read anything on an academic level, being that this only takes a minute or two to read. Just, uh, leave the thread if you hate reading, I guess.
 
Grand Theft Auto Online is ambitious. There's no denying that. As excited for it as I am, I've got some fears that it won't be everything it could be. My fears stem from something that I'm certain not everyone thinks about, but probably should consider. For the purposes of this argument, I'll be focusing on the idea of instances. To clarify, instances are privatized areas that are technically part of the game world, but are limited to yourself and potentially those you invite.
 
For example, the player housing. There will obviously be a limited number of housing options, and there will be many times when you share a game session with someone who has purchased the same residence as yourself. The game will handle this in that you enter the instanced version of the residence that pertains to you (it will definitely differ provided we are given the option to customize our homes, which I hope is the case). From here, you can invite other players into the instance. If you're inside your home and someone else who owns the home enters, they enter their own instance that is set apart from yours. This is all very clear and obvious to most people, but more importantly, it works. It works out of the necessity of the situation. It has to be done this way or there will be game-breaking issues.
 
Let's talk about the core problem here. Varying hints and phrases have led me to believe that other parts of GTA Online will also be instanced, such as missions and heists. This is particularly disappointing. It offers a disconnect in what GTA Online should probably be, which is a primarily social experience backed by an open-ended "risk vs. reward" scenario. Say you're coming out of a bank with a score. You've just pulled off a pretty good heist with a few of your crew members, and you're feeling pretty damn good about it. As you're walking to your getaway car, it explodes. You enter a state of panic as shots begin to ring out. Some other crew got wind of your heist and now wants the cash for themselves. Dynamic situations like these cannot occur with instanced scenarios, and it's pretty heartbreaking.
 
Rockstar likes to throw out the word "persistent" when referring to GTA Online. I feel like we're only getting half of the definition when we're constantly forced to exit a free roam mode to go do missions and heists that could just as easily stay within the main world of a free roam. Where's the challenge? The social aspect? This is one of the few things separating heists and missions from being stale and repetitive. Instead of just taking the score and outrunning the cops, you have the potential to be held up even further by real players and engage in epic scenarios.
 
The common argument against this is that people don't want others "ruining their fun." Rockstar has already confirmed that you cannot mess with people while they are playing Golf and Tennis, and I'm sure those won't be the only protected activity. I'm not sure why we are being subjected to this overdramatic casualization of something that could be real next-level stuff, but it definitely brings down my hype levels.
 
We'll know more come Tuesday, of course, but what do YOU think?

 

You forgot your thesis statement.  :lol:


Xavier Horovitz
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#19

Posted 26 September 2013 - 05:20 AM Edited by Xavier Horovitz, 26 September 2013 - 05:21 AM.

 

 

I mean for this to be a serious discussion, so please keep all petty and childish claims out of the thread. And yes, this is a "wall of text" as some would call it. I can only imagine these people have never actually had to read anything on an academic level, being that this only takes a minute or two to read. Just, uh, leave the thread if you hate reading, I guess.
 
Grand Theft Auto Online is ambitious. There's no denying that. As excited for it as I am, I've got some fears that it won't be everything it could be. My fears stem from something that I'm certain not everyone thinks about, but probably should consider. For the purposes of this argument, I'll be focusing on the idea of instances. To clarify, instances are privatized areas that are technically part of the game world, but are limited to yourself and potentially those you invite.
 
For example, the player housing. There will obviously be a limited number of housing options, and there will be many times when you share a game session with someone who has purchased the same residence as yourself. The game will handle this in that you enter the instanced version of the residence that pertains to you (it will definitely differ provided we are given the option to customize our homes, which I hope is the case). From here, you can invite other players into the instance. If you're inside your home and someone else who owns the home enters, they enter their own instance that is set apart from yours. This is all very clear and obvious to most people, but more importantly, it works. It works out of the necessity of the situation. It has to be done this way or there will be game-breaking issues.
 
Let's talk about the core problem here. Varying hints and phrases have led me to believe that other parts of GTA Online will also be instanced, such as missions and heists. This is particularly disappointing. It offers a disconnect in what GTA Online should probably be, which is a primarily social experience backed by an open-ended "risk vs. reward" scenario. Say you're coming out of a bank with a score. You've just pulled off a pretty good heist with a few of your crew members, and you're feeling pretty damn good about it. As you're walking to your getaway car, it explodes. You enter a state of panic as shots begin to ring out. Some other crew got wind of your heist and now wants the cash for themselves. Dynamic situations like these cannot occur with instanced scenarios, and it's pretty heartbreaking.
 
Rockstar likes to throw out the word "persistent" when referring to GTA Online. I feel like we're only getting half of the definition when we're constantly forced to exit a free roam mode to go do missions and heists that could just as easily stay within the main world of a free roam. Where's the challenge? The social aspect? This is one of the few things separating heists and missions from being stale and repetitive. Instead of just taking the score and outrunning the cops, you have the potential to be held up even further by real players and engage in epic scenarios.
 
The common argument against this is that people don't want others "ruining their fun." Rockstar has already confirmed that you cannot mess with people while they are playing Golf and Tennis, and I'm sure those won't be the only protected activity. I'm not sure why we are being subjected to this overdramatic casualization of something that could be real next-level stuff, but it definitely brings down my hype levels.
 
We'll know more come Tuesday, of course, but what do YOU think?

 

You forgot your thesis statement.  :lol:

 

 

Sh*t, I'm going to get an F :p


ClingingMArs
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#20

Posted 26 September 2013 - 05:26 AM Edited by ClingingMArs, 26 September 2013 - 05:26 AM.

There has to be a way to allow other crews to interact with you without allowing them to simply gank you after a heist. Here's hoping.


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#21

Posted 26 September 2013 - 05:40 AM

I totally see where you are coming from OP and that does worry me a tad too.  If missions and heists are instanced it would bum me out a bit.  The scenario you explained in your first post is exactly why.  These are amazing moments that stick with you.  If they are instanced I could see the problem of things becoming stale in a way as you feel a disconnect from the game world.

 

Not saying that they will be instanced but I share your worry a tad.

 

Very excited for the game to see how it turns out.  I know Rockstar has been wanting this Online GTA for a long time so I don't think they'll let it crash and burn so easily.

 

Plus if you read on their newsletter sent out today it says they really want our feedback on things.  If this is true and enough people complained about instanced missions, IF they were introduced, then I could see Rockstar even making changes to set things right.

 

I like to think of Rockstar as a pretty solid company, they said in an interview they've wanted to do this game since GTA III I believe so I have strong feelings that they've planned this out and have something great to give us on Tuesday.


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#22

Posted 26 September 2013 - 05:42 AM

Cannot stop checking this forum because GTAO isn't out yet dammit.


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#23

Posted 26 September 2013 - 06:33 AM

 

I mean for this to be a serious discussion, so please keep all petty and childish claims out of the thread. And yes, this is a "wall of text" as some would call it. I can only imagine these people have never actually had to read anything on an academic level, being that this only takes a minute or two to read. Just, uh, leave the thread if you hate reading, I guess.
 
Grand Theft Auto Online is ambitious. There's no denying that. As excited for it as I am, I've got some fears that it won't be everything it could be. My fears stem from something that I'm certain not everyone thinks about, but probably should consider. For the purposes of this argument, I'll be focusing on the idea of instances. To clarify, instances are privatized areas that are technically part of the game world, but are limited to yourself and potentially those you invite.
 
For example, the player housing. There will obviously be a limited number of housing options, and there will be many times when you share a game session with someone who has purchased the same residence as yourself. The game will handle this in that you enter the instanced version of the residence that pertains to you (it will definitely differ provided we are given the option to customize our homes, which I hope is the case). From here, you can invite other players into the instance. If you're inside your home and someone else who owns the home enters, they enter their own instance that is set apart from yours. This is all very clear and obvious to most people, but more importantly, it works. It works out of the necessity of the situation. It has to be done this way or there will be game-breaking issues.
 
Let's talk about the core problem here. Varying hints and phrases have led me to believe that other parts of GTA Online will also be instanced, such as missions and heists. This is particularly disappointing. It offers a disconnect in what GTA Online should probably be, which is a primarily social experience backed by an open-ended "risk vs. reward" scenario. Say you're coming out of a bank with a score. You've just pulled off a pretty good heist with a few of your crew members, and you're feeling pretty damn good about it. As you're walking to your getaway car, it explodes. You enter a state of panic as shots begin to ring out. Some other crew got wind of your heist and now wants the cash for themselves. Dynamic situations like these cannot occur with instanced scenarios, and it's pretty heartbreaking.
 
Rockstar likes to throw out the word "persistent" when referring to GTA Online. I feel like we're only getting half of the definition when we're constantly forced to exit a free roam mode to go do missions and heists that could just as easily stay within the main world of a free roam. Where's the challenge? The social aspect? This is one of the few things separating heists and missions from being stale and repetitive. Instead of just taking the score and outrunning the cops, you have the potential to be held up even further by real players and engage in epic scenarios.
 
The common argument against this is that people don't want others "ruining their fun." Rockstar has already confirmed that you cannot mess with people while they are playing Golf and Tennis, and I'm sure those won't be the only protected activity. I'm not sure why we are being subjected to this overdramatic casualization of something that could be real next-level stuff, but it definitely brings down my hype levels.
 
We'll know more come Tuesday, of course, but what do YOU think?

 

You know we won't be able to play it for like another 3 days since the servers are just gonna crash with everyone trying to get onto the multiplayer


SlicedSebs
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#24

Posted 26 September 2013 - 10:21 AM

I totally see where you are coming from OP and that does worry me a tad too.  If missions and heists are instanced it would bum me out a bit.  The scenario you explained in your first post is exactly why.  These are amazing moments that stick with you.  If they are instanced I could see the problem of things becoming stale in a way as you feel a disconnect from the game world.

 

Not saying that they will be instanced but I share your worry a tad.

 

Very excited for the game to see how it turns out.  I know Rockstar has been wanting this Online GTA for a long time so I don't think they'll let it crash and burn so easily.

 

Plus if you read on their newsletter sent out today it says they really want our feedback on things.  If this is true and enough people complained about instanced missions, IF they were introduced, then I could see Rockstar even making changes to set things right.

 

I like to think of Rockstar as a pretty solid company, they said in an interview they've wanted to do this game since GTA III I believe so I have strong feelings that they've planned this out and have something great to give us on Tuesday.

 

R* being so open to feedback is promising. This may be incorporated in GTAO anyway, but (assuming heists will all be instanced) I'm hoping they can or will include 'competitive heists'. Basically two or more groups going for the same score whether it be crew vs crew or just groups of randoms (although that would increase the change of griefers/team hamperers being involved), each faction being given a different starting point, with the usual betrayal mechanics for the winning/surviving group. Gives more edge and unpredictability to proceedings.

 

It's a balance. Random player-driven incidents could be spectacular and memorable, but by the same token, they could be infuriating and mindless... i.e. I don't want heists being sabotaged by people who are just going out of their way to screw them up (constant vehicle blocking/ramming or RPG'ing everything in sight for no reason). Bit like playing 11vs11 in Fifa. Some games are amazing with tight teamwork and competition with everyone holding their positions/roles, others have the goalkeeper constantly sprinting towards the halfway line, players who refuse to pass or people that got lumped with positions in defense constantly trying to score own goals, etc.


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#25

Posted 26 September 2013 - 10:35 AM

cant see missions being instanced , ive read you cannot mess with people during tennis and such , but anything in the open world is fair game .
if anything the minor griefing aspects of online games are what i enjoy most, i dont mean intentionally messing peoples games up , but the risk reward for playing online , stealing and killing . far to many online games baby the player base , when the game that started it all off (ultima) had people hooked for these very reasons 

 

Some missions at the very least will be instanced, take the launch for an example. You are going to have 16 people on the same server doing the exact same missions at the exact same time whilst levelling up to the hiests. There simply isn't a way to make this experience enjoyable, without some phasing to prevent conflicting events in other players missions from happening.

 

The effects of the phasing will be much more seamless than entering an instanced zone, you see this already in mmos where it is needed to deal with major events that people go to that would conflict with the normal world. So I have no doubt that phasing will exist in GTA as it is simply something that will be needed to make the experience flow. Obviously this opens the door for bigger events to become phased as well, which would be a mistake. But obviously we can't know if that will actually be a thing until the game is released, it is enough for people to have concerns regarding phased events until the game is out and we know for sure though. 


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#26

Posted 26 September 2013 - 11:32 AM

You guys have to take note. most, if not all, people who are setting up a ambush wont do it in a way that the people pulling off a heist even have a chance. Heist should be instanced. So I say again, why go through all the trouble buying everything when you can just camp out a heist location and take the money eaisly?
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Xavier Horovitz
  • Xavier Horovitz

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#27

Posted 26 September 2013 - 11:55 AM

 

 

I mean for this to be a serious discussion, so please keep all petty and childish claims out of the thread. And yes, this is a "wall of text" as some would call it. I can only imagine these people have never actually had to read anything on an academic level, being that this only takes a minute or two to read. Just, uh, leave the thread if you hate reading, I guess.
 
Grand Theft Auto Online is ambitious. There's no denying that. As excited for it as I am, I've got some fears that it won't be everything it could be. My fears stem from something that I'm certain not everyone thinks about, but probably should consider. For the purposes of this argument, I'll be focusing on the idea of instances. To clarify, instances are privatized areas that are technically part of the game world, but are limited to yourself and potentially those you invite.
 
For example, the player housing. There will obviously be a limited number of housing options, and there will be many times when you share a game session with someone who has purchased the same residence as yourself. The game will handle this in that you enter the instanced version of the residence that pertains to you (it will definitely differ provided we are given the option to customize our homes, which I hope is the case). From here, you can invite other players into the instance. If you're inside your home and someone else who owns the home enters, they enter their own instance that is set apart from yours. This is all very clear and obvious to most people, but more importantly, it works. It works out of the necessity of the situation. It has to be done this way or there will be game-breaking issues.
 
Let's talk about the core problem here. Varying hints and phrases have led me to believe that other parts of GTA Online will also be instanced, such as missions and heists. This is particularly disappointing. It offers a disconnect in what GTA Online should probably be, which is a primarily social experience backed by an open-ended "risk vs. reward" scenario. Say you're coming out of a bank with a score. You've just pulled off a pretty good heist with a few of your crew members, and you're feeling pretty damn good about it. As you're walking to your getaway car, it explodes. You enter a state of panic as shots begin to ring out. Some other crew got wind of your heist and now wants the cash for themselves. Dynamic situations like these cannot occur with instanced scenarios, and it's pretty heartbreaking.
 
Rockstar likes to throw out the word "persistent" when referring to GTA Online. I feel like we're only getting half of the definition when we're constantly forced to exit a free roam mode to go do missions and heists that could just as easily stay within the main world of a free roam. Where's the challenge? The social aspect? This is one of the few things separating heists and missions from being stale and repetitive. Instead of just taking the score and outrunning the cops, you have the potential to be held up even further by real players and engage in epic scenarios.
 
The common argument against this is that people don't want others "ruining their fun." Rockstar has already confirmed that you cannot mess with people while they are playing Golf and Tennis, and I'm sure those won't be the only protected activity. I'm not sure why we are being subjected to this overdramatic casualization of something that could be real next-level stuff, but it definitely brings down my hype levels.
 
We'll know more come Tuesday, of course, but what do YOU think?

 

You know we won't be able to play it for like another 3 days since the servers are just gonna crash with everyone trying to get onto the multiplayer

 

 

I don't really expect that at all. Not everything has to end in disaster. Tuesday is a school day, so I figure we'll have SOME time to play.


TimFL
  • TimFL

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#28

Posted 26 September 2013 - 12:45 PM

Wasnt it confirmed that only the mission interior is instanced? Once you're outside its fair game? That's what I read in the GTA:Online preview from IGN I think. They said that you'll be grouped up with other players on your crew (if you do matchmaking) and put in their world once you leave the bank heist interior. This seemingly confirms that you're in the open world again and others can interfer with you? I mean it wouldn't make any sense to have GTA Online if you are in your private instance (just you and the e.g. 3 other guys of your crew) until you lost the cops etc.


DaCosta
  • DaCosta

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#29

Posted 26 September 2013 - 12:52 PM

I think the missions will be instanced, because too much can go "wrong", when other players can enter the same building, or simply hang around the same area.

 

But as you mentioned dynamic scenarios where one crew tries to steal the money from the guys who just did the heist should be possible, I would guess it would be something like, when you enter the bank, you go into an instance, but as you come out and get ready to roll out, you are back in the open world, where other people can see you and engage you

 

I think missions will be instanced for the same reasons as above. If heists weren't instanced then two heists could take place at the same time, in the same location, and it wouldn't make sense. A heist requires all the pieces of the board to be specifically placed, including NPC characters, vehicles and items. These need to be in place or the heist simply won't work. For instance, if the heist involves you driving to a location and getting on a plane, and a free-roaming individual happens to randomly take the plane in the meantime, or another heist-crew happen to blow that plane up without realising its importance, then the mission ends with you not even knowing why. The mission text says "Get on the plane" and there is no plane. You can't have well-defined heists and missions crossing over into the free-roam world.

 

However, I've put a lot of thought into this and it might not be all bad if the game switches the crew back into free-roam immediately after the heist is completed (and when the police chase/escape occurs) This also goes along with what aR2k has said.

 

During this police evasion section (which happens after almost all GTA missions) it could notify all players on that server session that a heist has just occurred (through Weazel News), the amount stolen and size of crew, that the suspects are being chased (news footage from following helicopters) and their whereabouts (denoted on the map.)

 

Now, any crews in the area wouldn't have been able to sabotage the heist - because they didn't know it was about to happen, or where - but the moment the police chase happens they could choose to rush in their crew to try and steal the loot, before the theft-crew escapes the police and banks it.

 

This would result in the crew trying to not only escape the police but potentially any other players and crews that happen to be online, on their server, at the time of their heist. It would be very exciting and make fast police evasion all the more important.

 

Even after police evasion there would be paranoia that another crew might still be tracking them (from their last known location) and covering nearby ATM's and key locations. They would need to decide whether they should race to an ATM to "cash in" and conclude the mission or try and blend in with traffic and "lay-low"? Or travel in a well-armed convoy and take on anyone that tries to stop them. Or just get well out of the hot area and hope no-one is following them. The possibilities of strategy here are endless.

 

(With this system, I am assuming that you cannot always see the markers of other players on the mini-map, but can if police are after them.)

 

This system will allow instanced heists, prevent crews preparing blatant heist sabotages and yet will allow for the chaotic and open-ended conclusion that people want from GTA:Online. What are your thoughts?

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ItsWaRRioR
  • ItsWaRRioR

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#30

Posted 26 September 2013 - 01:12 PM

I think both are a possibility how ever I think I'd prefer no instances, after reading everyone's comments I think both have pros and cons, of course we won't know for sure till we try it next week. Hopefully R* tried it both ways and picked the best option for us...or maybe passive mode will remove the effect of free roaming interfering with a mission...




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