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End this driving debate already! Read

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IEATclowns717
  • IEATclowns717

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#61

Posted 25 September 2013 - 11:04 AM Edited by IEATclowns717, 25 September 2013 - 11:12 AM.

Because I can take a turn at 40 mph and not end up fish tailing and turning into a 180 and sliding all over like the road is covered with ice.

Define "turn"? The on-ramp at the interstate? Yeah, we all can do that. The minimum turning radius for a car going 40mph is 30 meters. About 100 feet. A third of a football field. That's a turn you can take at 40mph on a real car. You can do slightly better on warm racing slicks, but on all-weathers and city streets you are liable to do worse. A typical city intersection is 40-50 feet. You can't take that going faster than 25-30mph. If you think you can take one of these going 40, please try. Then post pictures of your car smashed into a wall. We all need a laugh.

Fact is, static traction is exaggerated in V. Stopping distances and minimum turn radii for a given speed are larger on a real car. There are other issues as well, but I won't go into details. GTA IV had the right amount of traction. The problem was primarily with suspension, especially on sports cars.

One thing that both games had right was the amount of traction you lose when you start to slide. This is realistic, and this is what a lot of people complained about and continue to do so. People used to burnout physics where a drifting car somehow has as much traction as a cornering one, meaning drifting is actually better for going through a turn. That's total B.S., of course, unless you are driving rally-style on a dirt road.
I feel like the driving in IV was a lot more physics based. V feels very arcadeish and a hell of a lot less physics based. I think all the needed to do to fix IVs driving was give the cars more torque, so you can actually hold a drift, tighten up the suspension a bit so they don't feel like boats, and improve throttle/ turning response a little. I still enjoy the driving in V and I absolutely love the damage/ rollover effects. This game is epic and let's hope rockstar hears a bit of the griping so VI can be even more excellent!
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MisterT_T
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#62

Posted 25 September 2013 - 05:52 PM Edited by MisterT_T, 25 September 2013 - 05:53 PM.

 

But in GTA V your taking right angle bends at probably over 100mph and not loosing grip

Imma stop you right there and say "No you can't". Almost all of the driving you do in that game is way under 100 miles per hour; you're generally only going to hit that speed on the freeway, especially since traffic in GTA V is much more dense than in previous games. You're more likely going 60 to 70 and you just can't tell what speed it is because you've never gone 100 miles per hour before.

 

Also, you definitely CAN'T take right angle turns at those speeds, and you'll be lucky to take them at 40 in anything that's not a supercar. Even the 9F will pretty easily spin out if you don't slow down before a tight turn, and I spun out several times on my first time driving in the game. People tend to exaggerate it as "Mario Kart" or "Crazy Taxi" or "Saints Row/Sleeping Dogs", but it's nothing like any of those games and trying to drive like it is will just result in a lot of crashes.

 

Why is it impossible for people to make an argument without stupid strawmen and exaggerations? You just end up looking like an idiot.

 

I'm going to stop you right there as you are a noob if you actually managed to spin out in this game. Still when people were talking about mario kart, they were talking about ATV'S! Have you tried those yet? Or any offroad car for that matter? OR dirtbikes and motorbikes? Because the physics for them is so bad I just want to cry! But yeah cars is pretty bad as well, som cars actually make instant turns! It's even easier to drive in GTA V than San Andreas! Which had pretty easy driving lmao.


vietboi2
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#63

Posted 25 September 2013 - 05:58 PM

i am just pissed you can't drift cars anymore and there barely any tire smoke


chitoryu12
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#64

Posted 25 September 2013 - 09:49 PM

 

 

But in GTA V your taking right angle bends at probably over 100mph and not loosing grip

Imma stop you right there and say "No you can't". Almost all of the driving you do in that game is way under 100 miles per hour; you're generally only going to hit that speed on the freeway, especially since traffic in GTA V is much more dense than in previous games. You're more likely going 60 to 70 and you just can't tell what speed it is because you've never gone 100 miles per hour before.

 

Also, you definitely CAN'T take right angle turns at those speeds, and you'll be lucky to take them at 40 in anything that's not a supercar. Even the 9F will pretty easily spin out if you don't slow down before a tight turn, and I spun out several times on my first time driving in the game. People tend to exaggerate it as "Mario Kart" or "Crazy Taxi" or "Saints Row/Sleeping Dogs", but it's nothing like any of those games and trying to drive like it is will just result in a lot of crashes.

 

Why is it impossible for people to make an argument without stupid strawmen and exaggerations? You just end up looking like an idiot.

 

I'm going to stop you right there as you are a noob if you actually managed to spin out in this game. Still when people were talking about mario kart, they were talking about ATV'S! Have you tried those yet? Or any offroad car for that matter? OR dirtbikes and motorbikes? Because the physics for them is so bad I just want to cry! But yeah cars is pretty bad as well, som cars actually make instant turns! It's even easier to drive in GTA V than San Andreas! Which had pretty easy driving lmao.

 

I spun out on the first mission with Franklin because I was influenced by the "Driving is arcadey and lame and too easy!" whining from the leaks and previews and decided to just zoom around the first bend. Didn't work out that way.

 

And yes, I've tried them. I've tried every vehicle except for that rusty tractor near the lighthouse, the tank, and the fighter jet. I honestly like it a lot better than GTA IV. It's more fun and there's fewer ridiculous spinouts or crashes.


boxmonster
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#65

Posted 25 September 2013 - 10:16 PM Edited by boxmonster, 25 September 2013 - 10:30 PM.

Ok I have a 2013 Camaro with low profile toyo tires and can take a 90 degree turn at 40 mph with very limited fish tailing. So spare me your physics talk.

I have an Enzo Ferrari with a custom Gemballa bodykit and and I can confirm that this is true. :rol:

 

 

GTA4 driving felt like you were driving a f*cking boat on the road..

 

Now GTA V feels like riding a Radio Flyer... I'm sure it's funner to drive a boat.


suicidehummer
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#66

Posted 26 September 2013 - 06:39 AM

 

Most cars have noticeable body roll when cornering hard, something well recreated in IV and absent in V.

Problem with IV is that they rolled too much. I was actually thinking about it, and it seems like R* modeled the suspension properly, but did not take the sway bar into account at all. For an SUV this isn't a big deal, because these things do have an almost independent suspension, but for a sports car, sway bar is a big part of keeping the thing stable through a turn. Hence the SUVs felt just about right in IV, and sports cars were a quite a bit off in tight turns.

But yeah, V physics is a step back, definitely. It doesn't bother me too much, but they really could have kept improving the physics of IV instead of starting in a completely different direction.

In general, I keep having the feeling that people who wrote V car physics never tried driving on the track, people who programmed bikes never been on one, and people who programmed airplanes have the loosest of ideas of how one is flown at all. I mean, why the hell do engines stall? Stalling an aircraft has nothing to do with the engines! I suspect the same applies to other vehicles. But they did manage to make all of these things fun, so I can't complain too much.

 

Yeah, sports cars definitely had too much body roll, but upgrading the suspension at LS Customs could fix that. It's like the dumbed down damage, why did they have to overhaul it when you can get armor at LS Customs? Just slight tweaking of IV's physics would have been perfect. They just needed to firm up the suspensions a little bit and allow cornering at slightly faster speeds.

 

However, I'm still enjoying V too, it's just a shame the core mechanics are a step back when everything else is fantastic.


K^2
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#67

Posted 26 September 2013 - 07:06 AM

Just slight tweaking of IV's physics would have been perfect. They just needed to firm up the suspensions a little bit and allow cornering at slightly faster speeds.

Not quite that simple. If you just take IV's suspension and make it harder, yeah, it will make cornering more realistic. But then you'll end up losing a lot of traction on slightest of bumps. I mean, there is a reason they just don't do away with suspension all together on racing cars. The way it works on a real vehicle is that left and right wheel suspensions are linked, and the vehicle behaves differently in a turn compared to a straight.

Now, this really isn't hard to implement, but I don't think people who coded vehicles in V have any sort of technical know-how. These clearly weren't the same people who worked on the vehicle physics in IV, and they have messed up a lot of things.
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gmoneymaster24
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#68

Posted 26 September 2013 - 07:46 AM

The game is perfect and Rockstar can retire. In fact, there's no room for improvement of any kind so all studios should just stop making games.

Really? There are countless threads about the police/stealth system which is totally flawed. 


MisterT_T
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#69

Posted 26 September 2013 - 10:48 AM

GTA4 driving felt like you were driving a f*cking boat on the road..

Just gotta love how all the f*cktards starts saying it's like driving a boat just because in an article it's said that a "rockstar" employee said it was boatlike (which it isn't)
Still if you think it's like driving a boat then you're just uber retarded as driving a car is NOTHING alike!
Still the biggest flaw is what they've done with motorbikes, I mean the physics is so bad, I can't imagine they who created it actually thought it was good...


Lee Everett
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#70

Posted 26 September 2013 - 10:51 AM

Why couldn't you have posted that in the already stickied thread here: http://gtaforums.com...driving-debate/ ?


richiespeed13
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#71

Posted 26 September 2013 - 11:09 AM

Lmao at the OP and all who agree with him. You know nothing about cars or driving, so hush up.

 

And for the record, I have no issue with GTA V driving. I also really liked IV, but it doesn't bother me that they changed it. 

 

But posts like these make me laugh. Whilst fun, GTA V's physics are far from realistic. Gran Turismo is classed as a "simulation", and even that doesn't come close to PC sims like iRacing, rFactor 2, Netkar Pro, Assetto Corsa, etc. 

 

Get some knowledge before you claim this game has, or ever claimed it had, realistic physics.


MisterT_T
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#72

Posted 26 September 2013 - 11:12 AM

Lmao at the OP and all who agree with him. You know nothing about cars or driving, so hush up.

 

And for the record, I have no issue with GTA V driving. I also really liked IV, but it doesn't bother me that they changed it. 

 

But posts like these make me laugh. Whilst fun, GTA V's physics are far from realistic. Gran Turismo is classed as a "simulation", and even that doesn't come close to PC sims like iRacing, rFactor 2, Netkar Pro, Assetto Corsa, etc. 

 

Get some knowledge before you claim this game has, or ever claimed it had, realistic physics.

It bothers me that they changed it as it gives me no joy as it's not a challenge anymore.
But yeah GTA V is far, FAAAAAAR from realistic, I mean GTA IV wasn't realistic either but it was a step in the right direction, and it was fun as hell to drive. This was like 360 step backwards...


richiespeed13
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#73

Posted 26 September 2013 - 11:22 AM Edited by richiespeed13, 26 September 2013 - 11:25 AM.

 

Lmao at the OP and all who agree with him. You know nothing about cars or driving, so hush up.

 

And for the record, I have no issue with GTA V driving. I also really liked IV, but it doesn't bother me that they changed it. 

 

But posts like these make me laugh. Whilst fun, GTA V's physics are far from realistic. Gran Turismo is classed as a "simulation", and even that doesn't come close to PC sims like iRacing, rFactor 2, Netkar Pro, Assetto Corsa, etc. 

 

Get some knowledge before you claim this game has, or ever claimed it had, realistic physics.

It bothers me that they changed it as it gives me no joy as it's not a challenge anymore.
But yeah GTA V is far, FAAAAAAR from realistic, I mean GTA IV wasn't realistic either but it was a step in the right direction, and it was fun as hell to drive. This was like 360 step backwards...

 

When I first got the game, I would have agreed with you in regards to how much I enjoy the physics. I still think they could have kept a few features from GTA IV to get the best of both worlds.

 

But as someone who spends a lot of time racing in real life and also in simulations, I do actually enjoy the driving in GTA V. It's unrealistic, but fun. 

 

Things I don't like about V, is that the cars are too grounded, they need to move around and slide more. The brakes are a little too good. And most annoyingly, I hate being able to rotate the car in the air, and also being able to flip it back onto it's wheels sucks.

 

There are some other things too, which could be improved. But overall it's nowhere near as bad as I first thought when looking at pre-release videos.

 

A few features from IV combined with V, and we have that perfect combination that keeps a little base realism, and combines it with old school fun. 

 

The next step for me would be mechanics (such as changing gears), tuning, customization, and a full HUD system (rev meter, speed, etc) on par with the NFS series. Arcade as f*ck, but adds immersion in a game like GTA, which isn't exactly realistic anyway.


stevieV
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#74

Posted 26 September 2013 - 11:25 AM

The driving mechanics are fine.


aTruVibe
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#75

Posted 26 September 2013 - 11:44 AM

I disagree. Especially considering the performance parts you are adding to your cars, you should be able go slide more without losing all your speed as those cars realistically would. i think forza should be the golden standard tbh.

Phyxsius-
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#76

Posted 26 September 2013 - 12:05 PM Edited by Phyxsius-, 26 September 2013 - 12:45 PM.

Some of you do need this game to have realistic physics - as in sim-like physics - iRacing damn physics. It would be really fun to see you "skilled" drivers handle a car in such conditions...

 

And on topic: Neither of the two models is realistic, as much as you might want it to be. They are more or less arcade, so, instead of bitching and moaning about GTA 4 and 5 and how you can take a 90 degree turn with a pimped Camaro at 40 mph, how about you ask for iRacing physics, or realistic and simulation physics?

 

Btw, drifting is not as easy as you see it on TV and in movies. Take your daddy`s car, try to drift it, then explain to him that you kinda totaled it...I`m sure he`ll understand...


MisterT_T
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#77

Posted 26 September 2013 - 01:31 PM

 

 

Lmao at the OP and all who agree with him. You know nothing about cars or driving, so hush up.

 

And for the record, I have no issue with GTA V driving. I also really liked IV, but it doesn't bother me that they changed it. 

 

But posts like these make me laugh. Whilst fun, GTA V's physics are far from realistic. Gran Turismo is classed as a "simulation", and even that doesn't come close to PC sims like iRacing, rFactor 2, Netkar Pro, Assetto Corsa, etc. 

 

Get some knowledge before you claim this game has, or ever claimed it had, realistic physics.

It bothers me that they changed it as it gives me no joy as it's not a challenge anymore.
But yeah GTA V is far, FAAAAAAR from realistic, I mean GTA IV wasn't realistic either but it was a step in the right direction, and it was fun as hell to drive. This was like 360 step backwards...

 

When I first got the game, I would have agreed with you in regards to how much I enjoy the physics. I still think they could have kept a few features from GTA IV to get the best of both worlds.

 

But as someone who spends a lot of time racing in real life and also in simulations, I do actually enjoy the driving in GTA V. It's unrealistic, but fun. 

 

Things I don't like about V, is that the cars are too grounded, they need to move around and slide more. The brakes are a little too good. And most annoyingly, I hate being able to rotate the car in the air, and also being able to flip it back onto it's wheels sucks.

 

There are some other things too, which could be improved. But overall it's nowhere near as bad as I first thought when looking at pre-release videos.

 

A few features from IV combined with V, and we have that perfect combination that keeps a little base realism, and combines it with old school fun. 

 

The next step for me would be mechanics (such as changing gears), tuning, customization, and a full HUD system (rev meter, speed, etc) on par with the NFS series. Arcade as f*ck, but adds immersion in a game like GTA, which isn't exactly realistic anyway.

 

Priority - Fix bikes, dirtbikes and atv physics, also make so you are able to accelerate while drifting with cars, and for the love of god bring back so you can use your normal brake to steer the car in the right direction if you are going to spin out, thanks to that It never happened to me in IV, but some cars like muscle cars intend to spin out as soon as you tap the handbrake and steer a little, not even much enough for the car to actually start spinning irl or in IV. I know that we don't need to use handbrake anymore as the driving is faceroll with the instant turns etc but I want the option as I got in IV.


FasterThanYou
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#78

Posted 26 September 2013 - 01:36 PM

Some of you do need this game to have realistic physics - as in sim-like physics - iRacing damn physics. It would be really fun to see you "skilled" drivers handle a car in such conditions...

 

 

That would be awesome. Getting sim-quality physics in a game that provides so many different scenarios to race: crowded streets, mountain paths...

 

But it´s not realistic to ask them to do that in a game this big. I would be happy with 4 physics slightly improved, which is what everyone expected to get.


richiespeed13
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#79

Posted 26 September 2013 - 01:44 PM

 

Some of you do need this game to have realistic physics - as in sim-like physics - iRacing damn physics. It would be really fun to see you "skilled" drivers handle a car in such conditions...

 

 

That would be awesome. Getting sim-quality physics in a game that provides so many different scenarios to race: crowded streets, mountain paths...

 

But it´s not realistic to ask them to do that in a game this big. I would be happy with 4 physics slightly improved, which is what everyone expected to get.

 

I for one would LOVE a PC game, that takes the GTA world, peds, police, guns etc, and then gives you iRacing physics and detailed cars, and lets you cruise around doing police chases and what not...

 

Combine that with elements of BeamNG physics, and you have an epic game!

 

Shame this dream will not become a reality for a long, long time!


BurnCK
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#80

Posted 26 September 2013 - 01:50 PM

Not sure why everyone's bitching, especially as this isn't even specifically a driving game. Sure, it's an aspect of it to get from A to B or escape the cops, but it's not sold as a driving game...it falls into the category of Action-adventure, or possibly even RPG. 


madmanaz
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#81

Posted 26 September 2013 - 02:04 PM

Ok so would you rather taking a turn and completely 180ing every time and crashing into buildings? This is not a driving game!!!


Grand Theft Auto. Pretty sure that requires operating a motor vehicle. Whether on land, sea or air, Grand Theft Auto has and always will be a game about driving and shooting. You cannot walk and expect to beat a 2min timer across a large map. So you drive, quickly. I could understand not sliding out in a Veyron, but as it stands, the driving in GTA5 is a little weird. I can't back flip a bicycle but I can barrel roll my 2300lb hummer from a flat jump and roll my convertible back onto it's top when I flip it and magically don't die.

MisterT_T
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#82

Posted 26 September 2013 - 05:50 PM

Not sure why everyone's bitching, especially as this isn't even specifically a driving game. Sure, it's an aspect of it to get from A to B or escape the cops, but it's not sold as a driving game...it falls into the category of Action-adventure, or possibly even RPG. 

Because you're spending like 70% of the time you play driving?? f*cking idiot. Driving is the most important aspect of the game, then comes shooting, content etc but driving comes first, just take a look at Sleeping Dogs, Just Cause 2, Saints Row IV etc, those games have the most sh*ttiest driving physics and mechanics, and they are all sh*t games and isn't well liked at all expect Just Cause 2 for some weird reason.





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