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The Lost and Damned's namesake (GTA V spolier)

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Nameless Foot Soldier
  • Nameless Foot Soldier

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#1

Posted 20 September 2013 - 12:57 AM

As I am a bit upset over Johnny's fate, as I believe other fans are, perhaps the fate was fitting after all. The DLC was called "The Lost and Damned", as in, these people were lost to ill fates and society, and damned to hardships and personal hell. Johnny's story from TLAD was quite sad when you think about it. The brothers stabbed each other in the back, conflict and pain come from the club and Johnny's personal life the whole story. Friends died, people got hurt and drugs were rampant. Then in the end, everything was burned down. While most of us liked to believe Johnny rode off into the sunset for a better life, somewhere deep down, we knew a life of hell was the only place for Johnny. He was damned from the beginning I suppose, he was the Lost boy after all. Thinking about what happened to him, I sort of think it's a fitting end and symbolic to TLAD's story. It came full circle guys and I think that Johnny's fate makes the whole of TLAD even more symbolic and sad, a better story of tragedy as a whole, one last push into the fires of hell and despair. "Life is pain brother"


Peachrocks
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#2

Posted 20 September 2013 - 02:21 AM

To me at least, it's not that Johnny died and the fact he's 'Lost and Damned', it's HOW he was killed. The way he was killed stretches Johnny's character a tad too far. I don't like believing in the 24/7 badass because nobody is like that, but he would have to be so far off his head that he wouldn't care about Ashley or anything before he'd go to hug Trevor which obviously wasn't the case. It's extremely out of Johnny's character, even a broken Johnny.

 

The fact Trevor killed him may have hurt his character regardless, I honestly can't be sure but it was all in the how he killed Johnny. When Niko killed Jim, even after we knew Jim far better, we didn't hate Niko afterwards. It was just business and 'him or me'.

 

In Trevor's case though the fact he killed a likeable character in such a cowardly manner did irreparable damage to Trevor's character in the minds of some and I cannot come up with one good reason why it was written like this. This was completely unnecessary and it's that which is why people are really annoyed I think.

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Nameless Foot Soldier
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#3

Posted 20 September 2013 - 02:36 AM

To me at least, it's not that Johnny died and the fact he's 'Lost and Damned', it's HOW he was killed. The way he was killed stretches Johnny's character a tad too far. I don't like believing in the 24/7 badass because nobody is like that, but he would have to be so far off his head that he wouldn't care about Ashley or anything before he'd go to hug Trevor which obviously wasn't the case. It's extremely out of Johnny's character, even a broken Johnny.

 

The fact Trevor killed him may have hurt his character regardless, I honestly can't be sure but it was all in the how he killed Johnny. When Niko killed Jim, even after we knew Jim far better, we didn't hate Niko afterwards. It was just business and 'him or me'.

 

In Trevor's case though the fact he killed a likeable character in such a cowardly manner did irreparable damage to Trevor's character in the minds of some and I cannot come up with one good reason why it was written like this. This was completely unnecessary and it's that which is why people are really annoyed I think.

Yeah, I will agree that the way he was killed was quite annoying and out there for him. I'd much rather of had a gang war with the Lost and had a chase/showdown with Johnny than hugging it out and then stomp glass into his face. But meth is an odd drug and it does make people act really f*cking weird. My parents were meth addicts and I can not explain enough of my childhood of poverty and crazy bullsh*t those f*cking f*cks did.


Peachrocks
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#4

Posted 20 September 2013 - 02:45 AM

It still seems screwy as hell, as if they were looking for an excuse to do it this way and I still can't think of why. It makes absolutely no sense from a writers perspective.

 

The shock value could have been got another way very easily but instead they choose this path that makes some people dislike Trevor...


AlinH92
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#5

Posted 20 September 2013 - 09:53 PM

well.. i look at it like this: he really loved Ashley.. but she dragged him in her misery and drug habit life.. that's why he went so soft.. soft enough to hug Trevor, anyway.. i'm not saying it was a honorable way to die.. but still, to put it in the appropriate phrasing: when you're lost, you are damned for life until death.. no matter how it comes :) 


Peachrocks
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#6

Posted 20 September 2013 - 09:59 PM Edited by Peachrocks, 20 September 2013 - 09:59 PM.

The problem is that he was enough of himself to care for Ashley but not enough of himself to hug Trevor. You don't need to look for long to see Trevor is a complete lunatic and regardless of Johnny's state of mind, it's still a big dick move from Trevor.

 

The whole thing felt like something an amateur fanfiction author would write.


Drunken Cowboy
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#7

Posted 20 September 2013 - 10:11 PM

I thought I already posted about this...
If we collaborate on my thread as maybe like a "super thread" with a couple hundred replies, we can always send it to Rockstar and... I don't know, get an answer why... maybe.

Peachrocks
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#8

Posted 20 September 2013 - 11:02 PM

Eh no matter. This talks about and tries to rationalize it from a different angle. I already sent an email off to Rockstar's mouth off, not expecting a reply but eh... you can email them too if you'd like. I did it quite tactfully though, not ranty like :p.


Jvaas
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#9

Posted 21 September 2013 - 04:09 PM

5 years is a long time...


thenamesbeer
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#10

Posted 23 September 2013 - 07:06 AM

I think one of the reasons is that I believe that Johnny K was the basis for a certain John Marston. Both couldn't see in one eye, both were in gangs that were being lead by insanity: both damned. The only change here is that Johnny Kelbitz didn't die a hero's death in the same way as John Marston.

However, I don't think we were ever meant to like any of the pro tags in V, least of all Trevor. While they may be funny, they're all scumbags. That's why o love the game.

kent002
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#11

Posted 23 September 2013 - 06:14 PM

i love this game

Best Windows Phone


Darth_Starkiller
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#12

Posted 30 September 2013 - 06:05 PM

Johnny went down like a prick, but Trevor killed him like a prick too. There should have at least been a fight, something memorable, you know, not just stomping his face after hitting it with a bottle.


ruud.
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#13

Posted 30 September 2013 - 06:22 PM

To me at least, it's not that Johnny died and the fact he's 'Lost and Damned', it's HOW he was killed. The way he was killed stretches Johnny's character a tad too far. I don't like believing in the 24/7 badass because nobody is like that, but he would have to be so far off his head that he wouldn't care about Ashley or anything before he'd go to hug Trevor which obviously wasn't the case. It's extremely out of Johnny's character, even a broken Johnny.

 

The fact Trevor killed him may have hurt his character regardless, I honestly can't be sure but it was all in the how he killed Johnny. When Niko killed Jim, even after we knew Jim far better, we didn't hate Niko afterwards. It was just business and 'him or me'.

 

In Trevor's case though the fact he killed a likeable character in such a cowardly manner did irreparable damage to Trevor's character in the minds of some and I cannot come up with one good reason why it was written like this. This was completely unnecessary and it's that which is why people are really annoyed I think.

 

Out of character? Have you done meth and stayed in character buddy? That's right, now shut up and keep it that way.

 

 

Johnny went down like a prick, but Trevor killed him like a prick too. There should have at least been a fight, something memorable, you know, not just stomping his face after hitting it with a bottle.

 

Memorable? Are you telling me you're going to forget it by the end of this year? No, I'm sure you'll remember it for years way past when the next GTA releases in another 5 years or so.

 

Also, what did you expect? A cheesy Hollywood fail "epic" where Trevor and Johnny had a RDR-esque duel on the summit of Mt Chiliad with all members of The Lost and Trevor's associates watching on and supporting as their seconds?

 

You really thought the style of GTA's storytelling R* have been doing all these years are inspired by your silly and cheesy fantasies that scream unoriginal? Get real, kid.

 

You too, like the guy above, should shut up and keep it that way.


Grievous
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#14

Posted 30 September 2013 - 07:00 PM Edited by Grievous, 30 September 2013 - 07:01 PM.

Out of character? Have you done meth and stayed in character buddy? That's right, now shut up and keep it that way.

 

 

But

 

Why

 

Did

 

Johnny

 

Decided

 

To

 

Take

 

Meth

 

Again

 

Spoiler

 

I mean would it really have been so far out difficult to have Johnny killed while he's still in the same state of mind as we last saw him ? ...

 

Of course we'll stil continue to talk about it , but at the moment I don't get the point of making him the way he turned out to be : what are we suppose to think of this ? that meths are bad and re-dating a meth addict will get you killed ? ...

 

I rather have that silly Mount Chilliad showdown, because it's actually the less silly option of the two to be had.

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Darth_Starkiller
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#15

Posted 30 September 2013 - 09:34 PM

 

To me at least, it's not that Johnny died and the fact he's 'Lost and Damned', it's HOW he was killed. The way he was killed stretches Johnny's character a tad too far. I don't like believing in the 24/7 badass because nobody is like that, but he would have to be so far off his head that he wouldn't care about Ashley or anything before he'd go to hug Trevor which obviously wasn't the case. It's extremely out of Johnny's character, even a broken Johnny.

 

The fact Trevor killed him may have hurt his character regardless, I honestly can't be sure but it was all in the how he killed Johnny. When Niko killed Jim, even after we knew Jim far better, we didn't hate Niko afterwards. It was just business and 'him or me'.

 

In Trevor's case though the fact he killed a likeable character in such a cowardly manner did irreparable damage to Trevor's character in the minds of some and I cannot come up with one good reason why it was written like this. This was completely unnecessary and it's that which is why people are really annoyed I think.

 

Out of character? Have you done meth and stayed in character buddy? That's right, now shut up and keep it that way.

 

 

Johnny went down like a prick, but Trevor killed him like a prick too. There should have at least been a fight, something memorable, you know, not just stomping his face after hitting it with a bottle.

 

Memorable? Are you telling me you're going to forget it by the end of this year? No, I'm sure you'll remember it for years way past when the next GTA releases in another 5 years or so.

 

Also, what did you expect? A cheesy Hollywood fail "epic" where Trevor and Johnny had a RDR-esque duel on the summit of Mt Chiliad with all members of The Lost and Trevor's associates watching on and supporting as their seconds?

 

You really thought the style of GTA's storytelling R* have been doing all these years are inspired by your silly and cheesy fantasies that scream unoriginal? Get real, kid.

 

You too, like the guy above, should shut up and keep it that way.

 

Memorable as in, not killing him like he was just introduced, appeared for a few seconds and died. No one knew him before. Johnny's death itself is memorable, but the moment... no. So... so random. Didn't keep up with Johnny's character.

By the way, you are a really nice guy.

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