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[Spoilers] No Respect for the Lost

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T0X1C
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#61

Posted 30 September 2013 - 01:26 PM

I loved watching it. I liked Johnny, but he's not the protag anymore. Quite frankly I couldn't care less that he's dead. His death was to show how ruthless Trevor is and it worked well.

As much as it may pain you all, it's not your story. Rockstar wrote the story for us to play, no one really gives a sh*t whether you like what happems or not. If Rockstar let the fans influence the story we'd end up with some pile of sh*t about how CJ and Franklin get married and adopt Tommy Vercetti and make him ghetto together...
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IAMSHUGO
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#62

Posted 30 September 2013 - 02:20 PM Edited by IAMSHUGO, 30 September 2013 - 02:25 PM.

Trevor didn't intentionally kill him. He caught Johnny off guard and took a beating too far. And to say that they made Johnny a pussy is ridiculous. He's always been soft, especially with anything Ashley-related.  It all stays in character, and if you didn't like it - good, that's what Rockstar was going for.


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#63

Posted 30 September 2013 - 02:47 PM

There is nothing glamorous or awesome about biker gangs. This is the one single socially responsible image R* has portrayed in their games. 


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#64

Posted 30 September 2013 - 02:59 PM

Trevor didn't intentionally kill him. He caught Johnny off guard and took a beating too far. And to say that they made Johnny a pussy is ridiculous. He's always been soft, especially with anything Ashley-related.  It all stays in character, and if you didn't like it - good, that's what Rockstar was going for.

 

Not intentionally? And what about his actions right after that? Him confronting Clay and Terry, ridiculing Johnny and subsequently killing them? Was that also unintentional? Give me a f*cking break. He knew very well what he was doing.

 
And Johnny was never soft in TLAD. He didn't take sh*t from anyone, not even Billy, and was ready to beat his head in when he called Johnny a fa**ot. His relationship with Ashley was a dilemma. He cared about her, but he had to tell her to go f*ck herself in order to save himself and the club. He got screwed into working with Ray Boccino, and when things went south tried to make the best decision. Unfortunately, that ended in Jim's death and the ransacking of the clubhouse.
 
In the end, Johnny is left with nothing except the money he took from Ray. One would imagine that he would start over, not give himself over to meth, the plague he's been fighting for so long.
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#65

Posted 30 September 2013 - 03:03 PM

They made johnny go out like a little bitch lol. Trevor merked floyd too. killing floyd the cousin of his slacky friend after crashing at his place and screwing it up was even more grimmey. Floyds mean girlfriend deserved to die but not floyd, he was already such a weak push over 

Spoiler


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#66

Posted 30 September 2013 - 05:22 PM

Not only did Trevor stomp Johnny, but when his girlfriend was crying all over his dead body, I kinda ran her over with my car, felt a bit evil doin that


Lol I accidently did this too, then when I realised what I'd done I kinda shot them both in the face a few times, just to see if I could.

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#67

Posted 30 September 2013 - 05:29 PM

I loved watching it. I liked Johnny, but he's not the protag anymore. Quite frankly I couldn't care less that he's dead. His death was to show how ruthless Trevor is and it worked well.

As much as it may pain you all, it's not your story. Rockstar wrote the story for us to play, no one really gives a sh*t whether you like what happems or not. If Rockstar let the fans influence the story we'd end up with some pile of sh*t about how CJ and Franklin get married and adopt Tommy Vercetti and make him ghetto together...

It might not be our story, but there are some parts of the game where R* has been VERY irresponsible with it.

 

Lazlow from the radio and Willie from love fist, from vice city, appearing in the HD universe breaks the HD-3D universe rules. Not only that, but grove street making an appearance, which was previously owned by the Families in the HD universe before the HD Ballas drove them out. The fact that they sat down and said "Let's kill an important character just to make way for the magnificent Trevor" kills me.

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#68

Posted 03 October 2013 - 06:19 PM Edited by LeatherLion, 03 October 2013 - 06:37 PM.

f*ck the LMC. Bunch of racist, drug-addled idiots. Each and every one of them deserved to die.

The Lost were not racist. Jim was Latino and Clay was African-American. Plus, they are associated with African American MC, Uptown Riders. Johnny also working with Niko and Playboy X. You obvously haven't played the game. And they usually critisize Angels of Death for being racist.
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#69

Posted 03 October 2013 - 06:45 PM

I didnt know Klebbitz was almost like over a head taller than other people! I noticed it in GTA 5 for first time!


I remember in TLAD, he wasn't so tall. Might just be the meth, either Way he was my favourite character and i didn't want him to die.

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#70

Posted 03 October 2013 - 07:47 PM

It was shock value and something that establishes Trevor pretty damn quickly on how dangerous he is. Hell, much of Micheal's story he goes on about how dangerous Trevor can be and that scene as I think someone said, wouldn't have had anywhere near the impact if it wasn't a past major character we've associated with.

 

Well, considering it has been 5 years since The Lost were running Liberty City, it looks like they all became methheads and started dealing with the wrong kinda people. Was kinda mad how he died though. Made him look so pathetic.

 

Johnny gave in probably because of Ash after Trevor probably got his hooks in at some point, I'd like to find out how that all came about.

 

 

 

OP, in some way you will have a chance to avenge Johnny and his brothers, won't say anything else.

Please explain. :monocle:

 

Spoiler

 

I don't like how they made Johnny look either.

 

 

 

I agree about Johnny, they made him look like such a little bitch when we all know that wasnt the case in IV. He was one hard biker and even if he turned into a meth freak that shouldnt really change, if anything it should make him more crazy.

 

Oh well just a game but was sad to see them turn him into some weak as little bitch with no fight in him at all.

I was shocked and bummed out it was sad what became of Johnny but he looked like he needed to be put out of his misery. It wasn't that Johnny was a bitch or Trevor was a bad ass, Johnny was a shell of his former self and Trevor was unhinged after finding out that Micheal might still be alive.

 

 

Johnny is a hypocrite, he used to be a hard ass biker who despised meth. 5 years down the line he's a skinny meth head pussy who lets people get away with f*cking his woman and allows himself to be treated like a bitch. I used to like him but good riddance.


They ruined him

 

 

Meth ruined him.

 

 

I loved watching it. I liked Johnny, but he's not the protag anymore. Quite frankly I couldn't care less that he's dead. His death was to show how ruthless Trevor is and it worked well.

As much as it may pain you all, it's not your story. Rockstar wrote the story for us to play, no one really gives a sh*t whether you like what happems or not. If Rockstar let the fans influence the story we'd end up with some pile of sh*t about how CJ and Franklin get married and adopt Tommy Vercetti and make him ghetto together...

It might not be our story, but there are some parts of the game where R* has been VERY irresponsible with it.

 

Lazlow from the radio and Willie from love fist, from vice city, appearing in the HD universe breaks the HD-3D universe rules. Not only that, but grove street making an appearance, which was previously owned by the Families in the HD universe before the HD Ballas drove them out. The fact that they sat down and said "Let's kill an important character just to make way for the magnificent Trevor" kills me.

 

 

No it doesn't, Lazlow never appeared in VC as a 3D model and I don't recall seeing Willie in GTA V, just some dude who was on Fame or Shame who was a big fan. Grove Street made an appearance, yeah but it was a Grove Street where that Johnson family along with the other main members of the crew didn't exist.

 


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#71

Posted 11 October 2013 - 06:43 PM

I've made another futile rant here: http://gtaforums.com...spoilers/page-7

Already 20k views and many passionate replies, that should tell Rockstar something.

 

You should read the post I've linked, a lot of great discussion has arisen ATTEMPTING (but ultimately coming to no good justification) on rationalizing Johnny's death.

 

Why was his death such bullsh*t?

 

- It completely broke character. Johnny went through the ultimate journey of maturity; abandoning his junkie girlfriend WHO HE LOVED but KNEW she was bad for him and the club, losing his best friends to gang and drug violence, having to storm a government facility to kill his childhood friend and former mentor, and burning down his house and effectively his club and livlihood he literally killed to keep together, not for himself, but for his brothers.

 

- It was a lazy, half-assed, poorly writted way to kill off a PROTAGONIST. "What about Vic Vance?" Vic Vance first appeared in Vice City as a meaningless, two-dimensional nobody, but reappeared as a valiant and complex individual. Johnny was presented as a valiant and complex individual, and killed as a meaningless, tw-dimensional nobody.

Could we have not had a fight between the two? Johnny, the man who stormed Alderny State Correctional and killed several dozen fully trained SWAT officers, died hugging it out with the man who f*cked his girlfriend? (Whom of which he would never have gotten back together with if his character remained from IV.) I mean, the player model of Johnny still has a f*cking "Vice President" patch on his cut. You could argue they're leaving room for a president DLC, but more than likely, the models and writers were shown "here's a picture biker from the last game, and here's a girl he would f*ck, just kill them both or something."

 

- There was no need to bring him back. If they wanted to and they did it respectfully, I, as well as the several thousand other fans of TLaD, would have found that amazing. But what did they do? "Drugs are bad, guys! Don't do them! (Or maybe do speed instead of meth, look at what a badass Trevor is for doing speed!) To quote another poster,

"It would have been akin to have an ambulance arriving and reviving Victor Vance, but on the way back to the hospital the ambulance goes off route and flips upside down and crash and burn and explodes. It's overkill."

 

- It left a real sour taste or even completely RUINED Trevor as a playable character. The typical insipid gamer who could care less for a story were bought off with the novelty "lol hes a psychopath in his underwear lol." Trevor (IN MY OPINION) is a bad character to begin with. His personality was very inconsistant. He was the sane, moral authority with the minute-men, the psychotic individual in the story missions but one who could comprehensively plan and accomplish tasks, or just bat-sh*t insane "rampage" missions. Killing off three of my main characters was enough to make me HATE Trevor (who had far more game content than Michael and a bit more than Franklin open to him, unfortunately) him being just an egotistical, selfish asshole who abused the sh*t out of likeable Lester, Wade, Michael, Ron, and even Floyd were not going to redeem him. He's just a big cry-baby who isn't satisfied until he's handed a bigger lolipop.

 

- Terry and Clay? Seriously? Talk about f*cking overkill. These were our only "friends" surviving the end of TLaD (excluding Angus), and they weren't even dignified with a cutscene death, just a ram with a truck... They were fully developed, loyal, personalities that we were told to love in IV, and not give a sh*t about in V.

 

- What purpose did it serve killing them or Johnny? People who LIKED The Lost and Damned have had Trevor and their favorite story RUINED for them. People who DIDN'T KNOW OF of DIDN'T LIKE The Lost and Damned were probably just passing off Johnny as any other character, thus ruining the argument that R* did this to introduce the radical nature of Trevor with a bang. Why not kill Joe-Jon? The AoD Road Captain. We were taught to hate the AoD in TLaD. We were told the AoD are a so. Cal MC opperating out of San Fierro and Los Santos. Player who knew of TLaD would have known who Joe-Jon was, so it was a fun nod to them, but they would either be impartial or satisfied to see Joe-Jon's head stomped in. The same effect of Johnny's death would apply to those who didn't know about Joe-Jon.

 

- It ruined good story possibilities. You'd think with things out there like Sons of Anarchy that there's a good player base fond of the So. Cal MC scene, or the whole 1%er club idea in general.

In fact, there is. There's tons of MCs advertising on the forums and social clubs, same with Mafias. Though mafias and MCs are a good part of GTA's world, and the community, this game ONLY panders to the San Andreas fans who love their sagging pants and shooting each other for wearing purple or green.

Additionally, a war between the AoD and the Lost would have made an excellent transition to the desert; random events of chopper riders shooting at chopper riders on the freeway? Amazing, it'd make the world feel so much more alive, and be a good nod to TLaD's story. But nah, too much work, right, Rockstar? Thanks for like, the three planes, yoga, and Grove Street, bestist feechurs 2013.

 

 

Sorry this is such a crushing wall of text, but I'm REALLY pissed off by the ordeal. Rockstar has such a large and diverse player base, and V on a whole really only cators to one section of that, the San Andreas players who cared more about planes, Grove Street, and other dumb gimmicks than a real story. (Not to knock San Andreas as a game itself, it was quite revolutionary and I loved it, though its story and atmosphere will never trump that of IV, it's episodes, or Vice City.)

 

Make sure to check out my post. Long live Johnny K: killed 2013 by poor writting. Lost, but not forgotten.

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#72

Posted 11 October 2013 - 06:49 PM

 

This game has no respect for women either.

its gta...when have they ever respected anything. The game is built around stereotypes and it wont stop

 

There's a difference between the frequent "poking fun" at female stereotypes, like they did in IV, and the real "attacking" nature of it in this game.

 

I am by no means one of those PC, Liberal types, but it was real hard to ignore. All over the radio, and people like Franklin's Aunt, they made them raging feminists just for the sake of bashing feminism and female ideals. While I agree feminism and the typical feminist are ludicrous, they were tacked on into the story JUST to ridicule them.

 

Unlike IV, with at least A FEW powerful, relatable, or even just likeable female characters, like Liz Torrez or Kate, there was really nobody in the story this time to redeem them from all the blatant ridicule.

 

But, that's just what I've noticed. It didn't ruin the game for me or anything... like Johnny's death did.


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#73

Posted 11 October 2013 - 06:53 PM

f*ck the LMC. Bunch of racist, drug-addled idiots. Each and every one of them deserved to die. 

(Last post on here, I swear to God, guys.)

 

If you don't like them don't post.

And the whole thing about The Lost is that they're a multiracial club that Johnny tried to steer away from drugs and blatant "asshole-ism". Hell, like half the Lost NPCs in V are black or Asian.


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#74

Posted 10 November 2013 - 11:51 PM

i wanted johnny k to be what trevor was in the lost and damned.  johnny k was a wuss and a coward.  i hated him in the lost and damned i was overjoyed by his death.


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#75

Posted 10 November 2013 - 11:59 PM

I wouldn't be surprised that R* had already prepared the fate of Klebitz when they wrote the script of TLaD, considering how the storyline just showed the gang going to sh*t.

 

But seriously, I'm getting really tired of you, biker fanboys. Johnny is dead. Just let it go already.


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#76

Posted 11 November 2013 - 04:21 AM

I want to point out that at first Trevor shows no sign of realizing that he killed Johnny. ex. "COME ON! GET THE F*** UP!". He almost seems surprised that he did that like later

Spoiler
its almost like he has two personalities. I respect R* for this bold move. bc it impacts you alot more than just some random npc.

Old post, but wow, you're right. I never noticed that!

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#77

Posted 12 November 2013 - 12:15 PM

Don't think of it like that , they did that to show Trevor s full out dominance. Plus johnny obviously bem hang in with meth heads and the wrong ppl

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#78

Posted 16 March 2014 - 08:18 AM

Yes it's a video game but really hurts me when i saw the way trevor killed Johnny. F*ck you trever. rock star should not make any protagonist kill any other protagonist as there is, and also in the final 3 decision Mission. IMHO, the best way to end and a storyline would be like vice city and san andreas. 

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#79

Posted 16 March 2014 - 08:32 AM

Even Claude was a better character than Johnny.


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#80

Posted 16 March 2014 - 09:11 AM

I was glad to see Trev destroy those bikers.

I hate bikers.


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#81

Posted 16 March 2014 - 09:28 AM

Let me just ask this, because I'm curious. Who would you have had trevor kill?


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#82

Posted 16 March 2014 - 09:45 AM

R* are lucky they didn't pull off that stunt with Niko. I mean I liked Johnny, but I think R* would've had a riot on their hands if they pissed on Niko's character.

In saying that karma eventually came around for Trevor during ending A. Sweet justice indeed.
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#83

Posted 16 March 2014 - 10:03 AM

Ok I liked Johnny too, but why is it that every day I see another Johnny Klebitz topic either posted or bumped?

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#84

Posted 16 March 2014 - 10:18 AM

Ok I liked Johnny too, but why is it that every day I see another Johnny Klebitz topic either posted or bumped?

Yeah, bumped from November. :lol:

 

There are a lot of new topics discussing this incident now.

 

Well, Johnny could have fought back, but the meth changed him.


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#85

Posted 16 March 2014 - 10:43 AM Edited by Xerukal, 16 March 2014 - 10:44 AM.

Moral of the story: Don't buy your meth from TP Enterprises. Low quality, bound to make you weak. 

 

Always go with Heisenberg's Crystal Blue, bitch. 

 

Case closed. 

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#86

Posted 16 March 2014 - 10:55 PM

Ok I liked Johnny too, but why is it that every day I see another Johnny Klebitz topic either posted or bumped?

 

Because Rockstar made a bad decision that bothered many fans.

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#87

Posted 16 March 2014 - 11:23 PM

Iv got no respect for the OP. 


You are right. How dare he insult the mighty Trevor! Trevor is the best character ever and I have no respect for anyone who disagrees. They must burn in hell.

In all seriousness, it's "I've". Not "Iv". I wouldn't be surprised if you were a Trevor fanboy/girl.
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#88

Posted 16 March 2014 - 11:28 PM Edited by liquidussnake119, 16 March 2014 - 11:29 PM.

I liked Johnny a lot, but sh*t, I wasn't gay for him like some people on here. :p

 

Seriously, though, what was Johnny honestly going to do from the ending of TLaD?  I'm surprised he even lived and stuck with the gang, the ending convo's of TLaD made it pretty clear he was done with The Lost.

 

Yeah, it sucks they killed him off, but sh*t I was pretty sure he was going to wind up dead anyways by the end, by his own hand if not someone else.


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#89

Posted 17 March 2014 - 02:51 AM

The only one I remember killing was Johnny. Everybody else just seemed like a random npc. They really f*cked up on killing significant characters. My first play through, I didn't know the difference between Weston and Steven
(that's his name right?). Every f*cking antagonist was insignificant. They didn't give them the dialogue, missions, or time to allow you to hate them. On top of that, each protagonist had like two of their own enemies.
Micheal: That Mexican guy and Steven
Frank: Weston and Stretch
Trevor: Merriweather, Chinese gangsters, Lost
Too confusing, thus making them forgettable, shallow, bland, and mediocre.
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#90

Posted 17 March 2014 - 09:15 AM Edited by B Dawg, 17 March 2014 - 09:15 AM.

this game ONLY panders to the San Andreas fans who love their sagging pants and shooting each other for wearing purple or green.

I cannot agree. GTA V is nothing like San Andreas in any way. SA didn't have ridiculous chrome, SA had turf wars, SA vehicles had suspension, SA had Ryder and not Lamar, SA didn't have Yoga, SA had an Apache/Hunter unlike the butugly Buzzard/Scout Helicopter which you see in BF3/4, SA had good looking sports cars and not ugly hypercars. I can list a whole lot of other things too.

 

GTA V was a game made to get Saints Row/Call Of Duty/Need For Speed fans, not the SA fans. I'm suprised they didn't kill off Grove Street and made you play as the Ballas stomping on Grove Street boys.

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