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Gay rights

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familyguy98
  • familyguy98

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#511

Posted 07 September 2013 - 09:14 AM

Gays dont deserve equal rights

gtaxpert
  • gtaxpert

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#512

Posted 07 September 2013 - 11:56 AM Edited by gtaxpert, 07 September 2013 - 06:41 PM.

See, now you're changing it up. You said "homosexuality". That includes the trait of being gay and the actions that such people will inevitably engage in. I can't think of a good reason to oppose that. I wouldn't exactly want to sit around all day hating myself, would I?

 

 

As far as I know ``equal rights for homosexuals´´ and ``equal rights for gay people´´ are interchangeable expressions.

 

But "equality for homosexuals" does indicate political action. I would say that includes things such as:

 

- Updating of laws that dictate what marriages are allowed

- Language of marriage forms

- Updating protected classes in hate crime and hate speech laws

- Updating protected classes in anti-discrimination laws

- Process of adoption for same-sex couples

- Laws about surrogacy and artificial insemination for same-sex couples

- Laws banning gay conversion for minors or/and adults

 

 

These are all interesting questions, but these were the only only ones talked about in this thread:

- Updating of laws that dictate what marriages are allowed

- Process of adoption for same-sex couples

Because they are the ones that are easiest to be a bigot troll about. And as far as I know there is no unequality between gay people and straight people when it comes to "surrogacy and artificial insemination". But if there is unequality on that issue then you might be able to update me on it.

 

1. How does allowing same-sex couples to get married suddenly make marriage truly equal for all? Last I checked, such laws only changed the gender requirements. They don't allow any people to go out and get a marriage. It's the same laws with different gender requirements (in some instances, tighter age requirements, as seen in Brazil). The government is still handing out its government certificates on its own terms.

 

2. People who aren't married are still missing out on the benefits that married couples get. For me it's not a case of gay marriage vs. straight marriage, it's just a case of marriage vs. no marriage, and to me, legalizing same-sex marriage is expanding government control over marriage. That's not to say I'd vote against it, but again, it's largely incorrect to assume that all opposition to same-sex marriage comes from moral objections. Imagine some advocate for marriage equality saying something to the effect of "You wouldn't have a problem with any sort of straight marriage".... are you sure about that  :)? I pretty much agree with Chunkyman in this regard.

 

3. I fully support hate crime laws, but from my less-than-professional knowledge of hate speech laws, I'm not that convinced of the concept of "hate speech" anyway. I do not think that punishing people for their opinions (I.E. not actions that discriminate against others, just the speech) designates them being labeled hateful. I would apply this to all of the groups of crazy Christians that spend their time crusading against gays. Do I agree with them? Not at all. Do we need to make laws specifically to shut them up and designate them as hate groups? Who cares?

 

4. Also, regarding the idea that everyone in this topic that dared to dissent from the gay rights side of things in some way, I'm not convinced that all of them are bigots. Like I said above: who cares? Why do we need to label everyone and shut down opposing remarks?

 

(numbered them to answer them easily)

1. It's an issue wether it's mandatory for government officials to marry gay people. The most common sense solution to me is that yes, it should be mandatory, and someone who isn't willing to serve a marriage depending on race religion or sexuality, should go find other work.

 

2. How the state hould be involved and wether married people should have benefits over single people are indeed relevant issues. I do think most people like the fact that the state keeps track of who's married and who's not, and right now most countries do give benefits to married people over single people, so that makes it essential for the state to keep track of marriage for the sake of giving people benefits. But I also agree that giving married people benefits over single people is discrimination, and that that should be abolished.

 

3. This is an issue concerning how we should punish discrimination in general. That's a complicated issue. All issues of punishment for crimes are complicated. I don't have the credentials concerning law to start making up the most effective punishments right here on the spot. It's a research topic.

 

4. It's offensive to see people say hateful things about birth traits. But I see that you are shutting yourself down from being personally offended by such things, and I find that admirable and wise.


Cyper
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#513

Posted 11 January 2014 - 06:46 PM Edited by Cyper, 11 January 2014 - 06:50 PM.

It is interesting how religion sometimes have an exclusive right to spread hate.

Imagine someone to say something like this today:

 

''Hey, I don't believe in rights for black people. It is unnatural to be black. If I would burn myself in the sun I would go to the doctor. Black people should do the same because they are sick.  Being black is a perversion of the white skin color.That's my religious belief. ''

 

These arguments may sound completely idiotic, and of course they are, but if you replace ‘black’ with ‘gay’ then you’ve  pretty much covered up some of the main arguments against homosexuality. Arguments that both educated and uneducated people spit out.

 

Today's discussion about sexuality is pretty much same as the discussion about the jews in 1930-1944. Jews were ‘’spreading their  propaganda’’, taking over high positions in society and degenerating germans. In the 50s the the same discussion about races was active in the U.S. Certain americans were worried because of the race mixing.  People thought that if white and black people had children, it would degenerate the society.

 

So what does all this rubbish has in common?

 

It’s all based on superstition, conspiracy, and lack any scientific evidence. Regarding gay marriage it is important to state that the church does not have an ownership over marriage. It is beyond me how it is possible for the church to dictate laws in a country. That is indeed forcing religious beliefs on everyone. Gay marriage should be legal, and then it’s up to every single priest to decide whenever they want to let same-sex couples merry.

 

 

Here is a russian politician. He is real. This is no joke. It's 100% real.

 





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