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An honest discussion

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tenpennyisplainevil
  • tenpennyisplainevil

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#31

Posted 24 August 2013 - 01:48 PM

QUOTE (Boozexlightyearxx @ Saturday, Aug 24 2013, 07:38)
Sadly blaming video games is the easy answer for them.

There's plenty off issues such as why didn't the caretaker kept the gun in a secure place?
Or better yet have one.... i'm not against owning guns but still?

There's been alot of tragedy occurring with little kids killing someone nd why? Irresponsible parents and on one case....a idiot father giving his five year old son a gun as a gift....

I remember just a few weeks ago a toddler shot his friend in the face with his parents' gun. No GTA player. They just look for scapegoats, nothing more. But I'm telling you, the problem lies with irresponsible parents, storing their gun in an unsafe location that is not only unlocked but somehow also reachable by a 4 year old. They can even take the example of John Marston, an ex-murderer in freaking 1911 that plundered people throughout an entire state, even he had the common sense to store his weapons in a safe place and locked (in his bedroom, you can see). Stupid parents will be stupid, I guess.

Costar
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#32

Posted 24 August 2013 - 02:03 PM

I think there is some validity to "garbage in, garbage out." People are influenced by their environment regardless of age. It is up to an individual however, to make the right decisions in any given situation and whilst no one is perfect, you have to exercise common-sense and some modicum of intelligence.

When you look at terrorism in overseas countries where its prominent, you find "its what they've been taught, its what they hear and see," "there is a lack of *proper* education." In the states for example, there are still many places w/ uneducated/undereducated youth AND adults. Thug lifestyles on tv/in music *preach* kill that "MF" and take his .....! Instead of applying ones-self and working for anything, its being glorified that its *easier* to steal and kill for it. The gold chains, palaces and fine rides are for naught when you're dead, lookin over your shoulder the rest of your life or in prison w/ BIG Bubba as your cell mate.

R*'s games (and others) do not teach people to be responsible contributors to society! BUT THEY'RE VIDEO GAMES! Thats the problem, they're NOT supposed to be teaching your kids (or adults). That is supposed to be the responsibility of parents for their children and adults for themselves! You're 18, 28, 40, 65, do you really need "Mommy" to tell you to wipe your own ....?, get educated, go to work, be responsible?!
As a child progresses in life, its also their responsibility to make something of themselves and not say "Ma didnt give me .... Dad was a drunk, so I'm gangsta." "I shoulda had as good a life as I wanted as a kid," "I oughta get my way all the time, respect me MF."

Grow up and take some responsibility for your own education, career etc. I dont know anyone who has ever had that "great childhood" but it didnt give 'em a right to lay waste to ppl at a McDonalds because they didnt like the service or just shoot some dude walkin down the street, such as happened w/ Chris Lane. The thugs that killed him, 15, 16, & 17 said "it was a joke", "it was for fun" they were "bored" they claim, "saw him and said thats our target." After listening to what the parents said, its clear they're not truly "Parents."

It is up to the individual to make up their own minds what they will do in any given situation. Its been said "life is 20% what happens to us and 80% how we react." We can either brute about the problems we have, drown them in "woe is me" sorrows or get off your ..... and do something about it, stop acting like everyone else owes you something, including respect, normally that is earned, not by how many "MF" you can beat down and kill but by overcoming the desire to wallow in self-pity and think "its all about me." Put your mind and body to work the RIGHT way for the good things you want in life instead of steal/kill.

That is directed towards kids and parents but parents need to take up the reigns and behave more like parents than kids themselves. If you had more parents taking responsibility for the offspring they thought would be fun to create just because they had an opportunity to jump in the sack, then you'd have a lot fewer problems in society w/ kids, especially as they become adults, IMO.

Civkiller
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#33

Posted 24 August 2013 - 02:08 PM

This is the problem with media, they're like little children pointing fingers to blame someone for something instead of actually doing some investigative journalism like they should. Why don't we have a look at the real problems (sorry in advance for repeats):

1. How did an 8 year old kid get access to a gun?
2. Why would a gaurdian buy an 8 year old kid a video game that's clearly known for its content and is rated M for Mature?
3. What was the actual relationship like between the two? (Did they always fight?)
4. What was the underlying psychological reasoning for this kid's actions? (There's no way a kid would shoot their grandma for no reason and don't give me the video game made me do it excuse)

There's 4 very valid questions to ask/answer but do you think the media would cover that.... no.

Not to mention all of the violent tv shows/movies that are available 24/7 on tv with no passwords or anything of the sort where as gta you physically have to go and get it.

I'm so fed up with newd agencies putting the blame on video games, people usually mindlessly watch tv. Did you know that your brain is more active while playing a game compared to just watching tv? I bet more than 50% of the population would say no to that.

Racecarlock
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#34

Posted 24 August 2013 - 02:42 PM

You know, I see a lot of valid hate for the media here.

But why the f*ck is it that whenever someone makes a thread about the creative killing of pedestrians on this board, several people immediately go in and tell him he needs a therapist? Because those people are as bad as these newspapers and pundits and senators are. It's not a real person. That's the key. We're not imagining doing these things to real people. And the pedestrians carry as much worth as any cluster of code and graphics would.

I mean, if you don't want to kill pedestrians in GTA, fine, but don't shame others for doing so, that's just a bad attempt to make you look like a good person.

R3AL1Z3
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#35

Posted 24 August 2013 - 03:28 PM

QUOTE (Racecarlock @ Saturday, Aug 24 2013, 14:42)
You know, I see a lot of valid hate for the media here.

But why the f*ck is it that whenever someone makes a thread about the creative killing of pedestrians on this board, several people immediately go in and tell him he needs a therapist? Because those people are as bad as these newspapers and pundits and senators are. It's not a real person. That's the key. We're not imagining doing these things to real people. And the pedestrians carry as much worth as any cluster of code and graphics would.

I mean, if you don't want to kill pedestrians in GTA, fine, but don't shame others for doing so, that's just a bad attempt to make you look like a good person.

My point remains valid. I don't feel like there is any media shaming going on, as they are trying to demonize GTA by presenting false information. If I was unashamedly bashing the story without warrant I could understand.

Feurian42
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#36

Posted 24 August 2013 - 03:52 PM

This is how news in the US works. Take any tragic story and blame it on video games and bam! You know what just happened? A local tragedy becomes an international sensation! Then they can sell the story to everyone who wants to run it. And the reporter moves up in their career much faster. I'm wondering how do they know it was the kid playing? I guess no one thought that maybe someone else could have been there playing and left before the incident.

R3AL1Z3
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#37

Posted 24 August 2013 - 03:58 PM

QUOTE (Feurian42 @ Saturday, Aug 24 2013, 15:52)
This is how news in the US works. Take any tragic story and blame it on video games and bam! You know what just happened? A local tragedy becomes an international sensation! Then they can sell the story to everyone who wants to run it. And the reporter moves up in their career much faster. I'm wondering how do they know it was the kid playing? I guess no one thought that maybe someone else could have been there playing and left before the incident.

Truth.

And as I stated, its The Associated Press. Expect nothing less.

MetalMilitia
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#38

Posted 24 August 2013 - 04:00 PM

The way i see it is that if you know that there is something wrong with your brain you shouldnt be playing violent video games, if youre a normal person you should realise that a game and real life is 2 differnet things.

Racecarlock
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#39

Posted 24 August 2013 - 04:43 PM

QUOTE (MetalMilitia @ Saturday, Aug 24 2013, 09:00)
The way i see it is that if you know that there is something wrong with your brain you shouldnt be playing violent video games, if youre a normal person you should realise that a game and real life is 2 differnet things.

sh*t, I have aspergers and I could tell the difference between reality and games at the age of ten. Which is when I got Vice City, coincidentally.

FUBAR1991
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#40

Posted 24 August 2013 - 04:49 PM

Blaming video games for people's violent actions is like blaming a gun for shooting someone.

OP let me guess your against lethal injection to?

Kemo66
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#41

Posted 24 August 2013 - 04:57 PM

QUOTE (R3AL1Z3 @ Saturday, Aug 24 2013, 13:31)
[QUOTE=Nobitos,Saturday, Aug 24 2013, 12:50]


@Kemo66

The age qualification they put on video games and how they classify them are perfectly fine. However, I believe it is the job of the parent to research what they are putting in their childs hands. Can a minor play a mature rated title? Yes; only if they have the mental capacity to carry the weight of said content without adopting the behaviors of the information they are receiving. Again, that lays on the upbringing of the child and how involved a parent is in the shaping of a childs ability to process information.

Absolutely agree.

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R3AL1Z3
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#42

Posted 24 August 2013 - 05:33 PM

QUOTE (FUBAR1991 @ Saturday, Aug 24 2013, 16:49)
Blaming video games for people's violent actions is like blaming a gun for shooting someone.

OP let me guess your against lethal injection to?

I'm going to assume to did not read my post in its entirety.....


I was arguing AGAINST the article.

FirstLadyofGTA
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#43

Posted 24 August 2013 - 05:37 PM Edited by FirstLadyofGTA, 24 August 2013 - 05:41 PM.

I agree somewhat with what you say however I'm not one of those people that believe violent forms of media are completely innocent. I often defend GTA (to an extent) when in conversations by saying I personally feel in my humble opinion, that GTA is merely a caricature of violence and criminal lifestyles in the U.S. If these realities didn't exist I don't think the game would have come into existence in the nature that it is. An example I would use is the presence of prostitutes in the game. Many women don't like that they are present in GTA and that violence against women and rape (YES...according to some female activists the act of having sex with a prostitute and then beating her up or killing her and taking her money is rape..however I'm no expert on that) can occur within this virtual setting. When discussing this with another woman (well my sis smile.gif ) she said she really didn't like that and my initial thought was that I find prostitutes in REAL LIFE way more sad and disturbing than something that is not real. I wanted to say to her instead of getting upset about artificial animations in a game do you spare a thought to a REAL woman you may see on the corner...or what are you doing to stop international sex trafficking..but I didn't want to get into a debate with her and she's my big sis after all smile.gif .

Humans are creatures of imitation and GTA imitates and mocks (in entertainment form) all that is wrong with modern western society. That's why for me as a gamer I enjoy GTA as whole experience (the radio shows, the music, the funny dialogue etc, even the mocking of conservative thought via Republican Space Rangers) and not necessarily as a 'shooter' style game. It is the only game that I own that involves shooting because normally I don't particularly like that genre. However staying with the imitation theme I think that it is in our own common sense that we feel that these forms of media could harm our minds which is why we have rating systems/ warnings of content etc. It doesn't matter whether any study finds a link or not to violent media and violent acts of humans...I think it's just our common sense that tells us that these things can affect minds...especially immature under-developed ones such as those of children.

It is annoying that video games are often the punching bag for dopey politicians, or hardcore feminists etc who might not be interested in having a debate on real issues that affect society but let's not pretend there are no real concerns either...especially when it comes to GTA and violence against women. I think what worries many people is this is a medium (unlike films, or music) where we actually get to engage with it physically. We are playing make-believe with our hands or bodies ( in the case of the things like the 'Connect' for XBox) and we become a PART OF (not just a witness) to the violence that is being portrayed. However for me that is what has been the genius of gaming since pong (although I'm an 80's baby so for me it would be Super Mario) and why I enjoy it so much...because of that interaction. However many who do not understand gaming and truly still believe it is a form of entertainment that is aimed at children have not understood it's evolution. Because we went from cartoon style games that everyone could play to some of the masterpieces of gaming that are out there now in the 21st century (and no I'm not just talking about GTA) with their beautiful realistic environments, and fantastic story lines that often deal with adult themes...those who have not taken part in that process are probably taken aback as to when and why this is happening. There has always been adult gamers and we want something that is catered to our age groups and that's something that some people just don't understand or want. When we tackle real issues that are KNOWN to have horrible affects on our society then maybe I would take people who call for bans etc. more seriously. Right now I just find it to be a red-herring for them.

Water Pipes
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#44

Posted 24 August 2013 - 05:40 PM

I'M GOING TO BE HONEST HERE. I saw stuff in the spoilers that I'm not going to speak of, but the way some things end up let's just say it gets brutal. Also the cutscenes, radio commercials, random character encounters, there was a lot of people talking about violent things going on and around the city. Weazel News went all the way with it. We already know about the nudity, the language on the songs, language from characters, drug use, all that. NO KID SHOULD BE PLAYING THIS GAME. WAIT YOUR TURN KIDDIES(HYPOCRITICAL.) BUT I LOVE ALL THOSE DETAILS. devil.gif

#TEAMTREVOR

FirstLadyofGTA
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#45

Posted 24 August 2013 - 06:28 PM

QUOTE (Oppressor @ Saturday, Aug 24 2013, 08:43)
#1. The parents can simply adjust the "parental control level" in the PS3's security settings preventing stupid kids from playing M rated games.
#2. Why did this kid have an M rated game?
#3. Why was having access to a gun with bullets so easy for this kid to gain access to it?
#4. If anyone (doesn't matter who you are) can't see the difference from fantasy or reality then they need to be in a mental institute.
#5. He probably just asked his granny if she could make him a sandwich and when she didn't he said, "f*ck it what good is the ol' bag if she can't plop her walker down and creep her ass to the kitchen, and make me a damn sandwich?".

Parents always blame video games as to why their kid did this or that and they always say, "I had no idea they were doing this or that their was a problem". NO sh*t DUMB PHUCKS, BECAUSE YOU SUCK AS PARENTS!



Anyways sorry about number five... it could happen though.

In my opinion, # 4 is too simplistic and offensive. It's not about telling the difference between reality and fantasy (fantasy being something that is impossible or improbable) and there are many things in GTA that are very realistic...running someone over...shooting and killing someone, killing a cop, killing a prostitute...these things aren't fantastical, they can happen in real life. It's more about whether witnessing constant violence and or participating in it in an artificial form has an affect on the human mind...I personally believe it can depending on that mind which is engaging with said violence.

Racecarlock
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#46

Posted 24 August 2013 - 06:32 PM

QUOTE (FirstLadyofGTA @ Saturday, Aug 24 2013, 11:28)
QUOTE (Oppressor @ Saturday, Aug 24 2013, 08:43)
#1. The parents can simply adjust the "parental control level" in the PS3's security settings preventing stupid kids from playing M rated games.
#2. Why did this kid have an M rated game?
#3. Why was having access to a gun with bullets so easy for this kid to gain access to it?
#4. If anyone (doesn't matter who you are) can't see the difference from fantasy or reality then they need to be in a mental institute.
#5. He probably just asked his granny if she could make him a sandwich and when she didn't he said, "f*ck it what good is the ol' bag if she can't plop her walker down and creep her ass to the kitchen, and make me a damn sandwich?".

Parents always blame video games as to why their kid did this or that and they always say, "I had no idea they were doing this or that their was a problem". NO sh*t DUMB PHUCKS, BECAUSE YOU SUCK AS PARENTS!



Anyways sorry about number five... it could happen though.

In my opinion, # 4 is too simplistic and offensive. It's not about telling the difference between reality and fantasy (fantasy being something that is impossible or improbable) and there are many things in GTA that are very realistic...running someone over...shooting and killing someone, killing a cop, killing a prostitute...these things aren't fantastical, they can happen in real life. It's more about whether witnessing constant violence and or participating in it in an artificial form has an affect on the human mind...I personally believe it can depending on that mind which is engaging with said violence.

Yeah, but that mind has to be SEVERELY f*cked up, and if that's the case, seeing the color green could have the same effect.

guden
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#47

Posted 24 August 2013 - 06:40 PM

Don't sell the game to kiddies. That's all.

FirstLadyofGTA
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#48

Posted 24 August 2013 - 06:59 PM

QUOTE (Racecarlock @ Saturday, Aug 24 2013, 18:32)
QUOTE (FirstLadyofGTA @ Saturday, Aug 24 2013, 11:28)
QUOTE (Oppressor @ Saturday, Aug 24 2013, 08:43)
#1. The parents can simply adjust the "parental control level" in the PS3's security settings preventing stupid kids from playing M rated games.
#2. Why did this kid have an M rated game?
#3. Why was having access to a gun with bullets so easy for this kid to gain access to it?
#4. If anyone (doesn't matter who you are) can't see the difference from fantasy or reality then they need to be in a mental institute.
#5. He probably just asked his granny if she could make him a sandwich and when she didn't he said, "f*ck it what good is the ol' bag if she can't plop her walker down and creep her ass to the kitchen, and make me a damn sandwich?".

Parents always blame video games as to why their kid did this or that and they always say, "I had no idea they were doing this or that their was a problem". NO sh*t DUMB PHUCKS, BECAUSE YOU SUCK AS PARENTS!



Anyways sorry about number five... it could happen though.

In my opinion, # 4 is too simplistic and offensive. It's not about telling the difference between reality and fantasy (fantasy being something that is impossible or improbable) and there are many things in GTA that are very realistic...running someone over...shooting and killing someone, killing a cop, killing a prostitute...these things aren't fantastical, they can happen in real life. It's more about whether witnessing constant violence and or participating in it in an artificial form has an affect on the human mind...I personally believe it can depending on that mind which is engaging with said violence.

Yeah, but that mind has to be SEVERELY f*cked up, and if that's the case, seeing the color green could have the same effect.

Severely....no I don't agree sorry. I said 'have an affect on the mind' and I don't believe you need to be severely mentally ill for a game to affect you. I guess you meant (or thought I meant) maybe like going on a murdering rampage or something after playing a game....yes in that case severe mental illness probably has already set in. But I'll give you a personal example. Manhunt 2. I played it...it gave me a panic attack. Why?? I don't know. What I do know is that I was more concerned due to reading the content warning of the bloody violence than anything else and that's what I prepared myself for. So when I played I was prepared for the violence but not the deep psychological/schizophrenia storyline which I could not handle (in that it made me very scared). I am a deep thinker and someone with an academic mind (Honors History Student) so maybe my downfall was instead of taking it face value I started to over analyze what I was engaging with. I mean parts of it were just too creepy for me (mission like 'Origins'). What I learned from that experience was that I CANNOT handle psychotic thrillers but CAN handle blood violence which ironically is what I thought I couldn't handle. I really envy people who can. I went online and people are complaining that it wasn't scary enough and I was so jealous...like why am I such a chicken lol. If Manhunt 3 ever came out as you can imagine I probably wouldn't buy because I know my mind and now know I can't handle it (unless it was more along a slasher line as opposed to a psychological thriller). So as a sane adult I learned something about myself. It had an affect on me even though my intellect knew it wasn't 'real'.

Oppressor
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#49

Posted 24 August 2013 - 07:54 PM

QUOTE (FirstLadyofGTA @ Saturday, Aug 24 2013, 18:28)
QUOTE (Oppressor @ Saturday, Aug 24 2013, 08:43)
#1. The parents can simply adjust the "parental control level" in the PS3's security settings preventing stupid kids from playing M rated games.
#2. Why did this kid have an M rated game?
#3. Why was having access to a gun with bullets so easy for this kid to gain access to it?
#4. If anyone (doesn't matter who you are) can't see the difference from fantasy or reality then they need to be in a mental institute.
#5. He probably just asked his granny if she could make him a sandwich and when she didn't he said, "f*ck it what good is the ol' bag if she can't plop her walker down and creep her ass to the kitchen, and make me a damn sandwich?".

Parents always blame video games as to why their kid did this or that and they always say, "I had no idea they were doing this or that their was a problem". NO sh*t DUMB PHUCKS, BECAUSE YOU SUCK AS PARENTS!



Anyways sorry about number five... it could happen though.

In my opinion, # 4 is too simplistic and offensive. It's not about telling the difference between reality and fantasy (fantasy being something that is impossible or improbable) and there are many things in GTA that are very realistic...running someone over...shooting and killing someone, killing a cop, killing a prostitute...these things aren't fantastical, they can happen in real life. It's more about whether witnessing constant violence and or participating in it in an artificial form has an affect on the human mind...I personally believe it can depending on that mind which is engaging with said violence.

Ok I used the word Fantasy because its a game and anyone in their right mind would see this as fantasy, because they wouldn't/couldn't ever go out and actually do it. Maybe I should have said virtual reality instead. If someone goes out and starts doing this sh*t because of constant participation then they have a serious mental problem. But your right some human minds are weak and therefore would do stupid things seen on tv and video games.

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#50

Posted 24 August 2013 - 08:05 PM

The good thing is that Dinosaur generation is close to extinction. sooner or later future journo's and politicians will have been gamers in1 way or another so views will change

Thejamman123
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#51

Posted 24 August 2013 - 08:10 PM

you must be f*cked in the head if you do stuff irl that you saw in a video game, to be honest. gaming does not make people violent, and if it does this person most likely had "problems" in the first place.


R3AL1Z3
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#52

Posted 24 August 2013 - 11:51 PM

QUOTE (Oppressor @ Saturday, Aug 24 2013, 19:54)
QUOTE (FirstLadyofGTA @ Saturday, Aug 24 2013, 18:28)
QUOTE (Oppressor @ Saturday, Aug 24 2013, 08:43)
#1. The parents can simply adjust the "parental control level" in the PS3's security settings preventing stupid kids from playing M rated games.
#2. Why did this kid have an M rated game?
#3. Why was having access to a gun with bullets so easy for this kid to gain access to it?
#4. If anyone (doesn't matter who you are) can't see the difference from fantasy or reality then they need to be in a mental institute.
#5. He probably just asked his granny if she could make him a sandwich and when she didn't he said, "f*ck it what good is the ol' bag if she can't plop her walker down and creep her ass to the kitchen, and make me a damn sandwich?".

Parents always blame video games as to why their kid did this or that and they always say, "I had no idea they were doing this or that their was a problem". NO sh*t DUMB PHUCKS, BECAUSE YOU SUCK AS PARENTS!



Anyways sorry about number five... it could happen though.

In my opinion, # 4 is too simplistic and offensive. It's not about telling the difference between reality and fantasy (fantasy being something that is impossible or improbable) and there are many things in GTA that are very realistic...running someone over...shooting and killing someone, killing a cop, killing a prostitute...these things aren't fantastical, they can happen in real life. It's more about whether witnessing constant violence and or participating in it in an artificial form has an affect on the human mind...I personally believe it can depending on that mind which is engaging with said violence.

Ok I used the word Fantasy because its a game and anyone in their right mind would see this as fantasy, because they wouldn't/couldn't ever go out and actually do it. Maybe I should have said virtual reality instead. If someone goes out and starts doing this sh*t because of constant participation then they have a serious mental problem. But your right some human minds are weak and therefore would do stupid things seen on tv and video games.

That's the sense I was using fantasy in as well. Fantasy doesn't just mean things along the lines of Dungeons & Dragons. Anything that aids in escaping reality is essentially in the catagory of fantasy.

R3AL1Z3
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#53

Posted 25 August 2013 - 12:08 AM

QUOTE (Thejamman123 @ Saturday, Aug 24 2013, 20:10)
you must be f*cked in the head if you do stuff irl that you saw in a video game, to be honest. gaming does not make people violent, and if it does this person most likely had "problems" in the first place.

Of course there is a chance that an underlying condition was present; however, that's not necessarily the case in all instances. Sometimes a person just wasn't pre-conditioned to understand right from wrong. Of course we all have a moral compass that tells us violence against other human beings (and animals) isn't right.

That being said, younger people aren't generally emotionally and mentally mature enough to understand death and how it works. The kid probably did not even realize the gravity of the situation even after the police came. I blame the parents in all instances, even if there is a mental deficiency. Its a parents job to nurture the development of their child but most of the time, especially in middle and lower class Americans, its a viscious cycle.

For instance:

People classified as middle and lower class generally have parents that work two jobs or long hours to make ends meet, leaving children to problem solve on their own. It wasn't the intent of the parent to neglect their child when in all reality they were trying to provide for them monetarily, without realizing the lack of parental support. I'm not saying they are completely oblivious to what is essentially developmental and emotional neglect, but in their eyes they have been brought up with the idea embedded in them that they need to work hard to provide so their children can flourish. And then that child grows up with the same ideas and it becomes a loop.

MrSelfHater
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#54

Posted 25 August 2013 - 12:18 AM Edited by MrSelfHater, 25 August 2013 - 12:27 AM.

Does this need to be discussed further? Everyone has been on game companies' asses for decades now and all the sides said all the arguments that were to be said.

Ultimately - condemn a game like GTA - you're gonna have to take most movies (plus a sh*tload of books and a lot of art in general) with it
Besides, GTA games don't give "points" for killing. You control a character who made some bad choices in life and he's doing bad things to make ends meet. The games make the players ask themselves, where is the line between a "good person" and a bad one, GTA IV especially.

As much as I enjoy controlling a criminal in games or rooting for one in a TV show, it all has learned me one thing - Stay out of that lifestyle, because if you do bad sh*t, bad sh*t is gonna happen to you.

Gigabomber
  • Gigabomber

    Infinite Ammo Amorous

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#55

Posted 25 August 2013 - 12:20 AM

Why don't they ever cite movies anymore for this. I mean, The movie theater shooter actually said he was emulating the joker as I recall.

FirstLadyofGTA
  • FirstLadyofGTA

    Killer in Heels

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#56

Posted 25 August 2013 - 12:32 AM

QUOTE (R3AL1Z3 @ Saturday, Aug 24 2013, 23:51)
QUOTE (Oppressor @ Saturday, Aug 24 2013, 19:54)
QUOTE (FirstLadyofGTA @ Saturday, Aug 24 2013, 18:28)
QUOTE (Oppressor @ Saturday, Aug 24 2013, 08:43)
#1. The parents can simply adjust the "parental control level" in the PS3's security settings preventing stupid kids from playing M rated games.
#2. Why did this kid have an M rated game?
#3. Why was having access to a gun with bullets so easy for this kid to gain access to it?
#4. If anyone (doesn't matter who you are) can't see the difference from fantasy or reality then they need to be in a mental institute.
#5. He probably just asked his granny if she could make him a sandwich and when she didn't he said, "f*ck it what good is the ol' bag if she can't plop her walker down and creep her ass to the kitchen, and make me a damn sandwich?".

Parents always blame video games as to why their kid did this or that and they always say, "I had no idea they were doing this or that their was a problem". NO sh*t DUMB PHUCKS, BECAUSE YOU SUCK AS PARENTS!



Anyways sorry about number five... it could happen though.

In my opinion, # 4 is too simplistic and offensive. It's not about telling the difference between reality and fantasy (fantasy being something that is impossible or improbable) and there are many things in GTA that are very realistic...running someone over...shooting and killing someone, killing a cop, killing a prostitute...these things aren't fantastical, they can happen in real life. It's more about whether witnessing constant violence and or participating in it in an artificial form has an affect on the human mind...I personally believe it can depending on that mind which is engaging with said violence.

Ok I used the word Fantasy because its a game and anyone in their right mind would see this as fantasy, because they wouldn't/couldn't ever go out and actually do it. Maybe I should have said virtual reality instead. If someone goes out and starts doing this sh*t because of constant participation then they have a serious mental problem. But your right some human minds are weak and therefore would do stupid things seen on tv and video games.

That's the sense I was using fantasy in as well. Fantasy doesn't just mean things along the lines of Dungeons & Dragons. Anything that aids in escaping reality is essentially in the catagory of fantasy.

I am quite aware of how he meant the use of the word fantasy. Where in my post do I talk about Dungeons and Dragons? Those are your words. Please don't patronize me. I used the definition terms of impossible or improbable. The point I was trying to make was that the argument goes ABOVE knowing the difference between what is 'real' and what is 'fiction'. Of course it doesn't take an Einstein I.Q. to understand that animation is not real but what does that have to do with how animation (particularity when it's trying its hardest to look as real as possible) can have an affect on someone's behavior. I believe in the OP it was said that it makes sense to have ratings but according to his argument if it's as simple as separating what you call 'fantasy' from reality then why the hell do we need any ratings...and in that case children should be allowed to play because after all surely any 5,6,7,8 year old without any disabilities (and even probably with in some cases) can tell the difference between what they see on a screen and the real world surrounding them?

R3AL1Z3
  • R3AL1Z3

    Lone Wolf

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#57

Posted 25 August 2013 - 12:37 AM

QUOTE (MrSelfHater @ Sunday, Aug 25 2013, 00:18)
Does this need to be discussed further? Everyone has been on game companies' asses for decades now and all the sides said all the arguments that were to be said.

Ultimately - condemn a game like GTA - you're gonna have to take most movies (plus a sh*tload of books and a lot of art in general) with it
Besides, GTA games don't give "points" for killing. You control a character who made some bad choices in life and he's doing bad things to make ends meet. The games make the players ask themselves, where is the line between a "good person" and a bad one, GTA IV especially.

As much as I enjoy controlling a criminal in games or rooting for one in a TV show, it all has learned me one thing - Stay out of that lifestyle, because if you do bad sh*t, bad sh*t is gonna happen to you.

Again, someone who skimmed my original post. I'm NOT condemning GTA, hell, look at my join date! I've been here since 2007. It was the AP article that was putting blame on GTA as a series. I was arguing FOR GTA. As a long time GTA fan, I know they don't give points ANYMORE for random acts of violence, you just have the attention span of a goldfish and saw the embiggened text.



And if people feel like discussing this more, so what? Skip over the thread. The fact that you took time out of your day to complain about people on a FORUM for discussing things is beyond me. Are we hurting your feelings?

FirstLadyofGTA
  • FirstLadyofGTA

    Killer in Heels

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#58

Posted 25 August 2013 - 12:37 AM

QUOTE (MrSelfHater @ Sunday, Aug 25 2013, 00:18)
Does this need to be discussed further? Everyone has been on game companies' asses for decades now and all the sides said all the arguments that were to be said.

Ultimately - condemn a game like GTA - you're gonna have to take most movies (plus a sh*tload of books and a lot of art in general) with it
Besides, GTA games don't give "points" for killing. You control a character who made some bad choices in life and he's doing bad things to make ends meet. The games make the players ask themselves, where is the line between a "good person" and a bad one, GTA IV especially.

As much as I enjoy controlling a criminal in games or rooting for one in a TV show, it all has learned me one thing - Stay out of that lifestyle, because if you do bad sh*t, bad sh*t is gonna happen to you.

Probably not which is why I'm bowing out lol....people ask for a discussion when actually they don't really want one.

R3AL1Z3
  • R3AL1Z3

    Lone Wolf

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  • Joined: 01 Apr 2007

#59

Posted 25 August 2013 - 12:39 AM

QUOTE (FirstLadyofGTA @ Sunday, Aug 25 2013, 00:32)
QUOTE (R3AL1Z3 @ Saturday, Aug 24 2013, 23:51)
QUOTE (Oppressor @ Saturday, Aug 24 2013, 19:54)
QUOTE (FirstLadyofGTA @ Saturday, Aug 24 2013, 18:28)
QUOTE (Oppressor @ Saturday, Aug 24 2013, 08:43)
#1. The parents can simply adjust the "parental control level" in the PS3's security settings preventing stupid kids from playing M rated games.
#2. Why did this kid have an M rated game?
#3. Why was having access to a gun with bullets so easy for this kid to gain access to it?
#4. If anyone (doesn't matter who you are) can't see the difference from fantasy or reality then they need to be in a mental institute.
#5. He probably just asked his granny if she could make him a sandwich and when she didn't he said, "f*ck it what good is the ol' bag if she can't plop her walker down and creep her ass to the kitchen, and make me a damn sandwich?".

Parents always blame video games as to why their kid did this or that and they always say, "I had no idea they were doing this or that their was a problem". NO sh*t DUMB PHUCKS, BECAUSE YOU SUCK AS PARENTS!



Anyways sorry about number five... it could happen though.

In my opinion, # 4 is too simplistic and offensive. It's not about telling the difference between reality and fantasy (fantasy being something that is impossible or improbable) and there are many things in GTA that are very realistic...running someone over...shooting and killing someone, killing a cop, killing a prostitute...these things aren't fantastical, they can happen in real life. It's more about whether witnessing constant violence and or participating in it in an artificial form has an affect on the human mind...I personally believe it can depending on that mind which is engaging with said violence.

Ok I used the word Fantasy because its a game and anyone in their right mind would see this as fantasy, because they wouldn't/couldn't ever go out and actually do it. Maybe I should have said virtual reality instead. If someone goes out and starts doing this sh*t because of constant participation then they have a serious mental problem. But your right some human minds are weak and therefore would do stupid things seen on tv and video games.

That's the sense I was using fantasy in as well. Fantasy doesn't just mean things along the lines of Dungeons & Dragons. Anything that aids in escaping reality is essentially in the catagory of fantasy.

I am quite aware of how he meant the use of the word fantasy. Where in my post do I talk about Dungeons and Dragons? Those are your words. Please don't patronize me. I used the definition terms of impossible or improbable. The point I was trying to make was that the argument goes ABOVE knowing the difference between what is 'real' and what is 'fiction'. Of course it doesn't take an Einstein I.Q. to understand that animation is not real but what does that have to do with how animation (particularity when it's trying its hardest to look as real as possible) can have an affect on someone's behavior. I believe in the OP it was said that it makes sense to have ratings but according to his argument if it's as simple as separating what you call 'fantasy' from reality then why the hell do we need any ratings...and in that case children should be allowed to play because after all surely any 5,6,7,8 year old without any disabilities (and even probably with in some cases) can tell the difference between what they see on a screen and the real world surrounding them?

Nobody was patronizing you, I was clarifying a statement. No reason to go on a tirade.

R3AL1Z3
  • R3AL1Z3

    Lone Wolf

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  • Joined: 01 Apr 2007

#60

Posted 25 August 2013 - 12:43 AM

QUOTE (FirstLadyofGTA @ Sunday, Aug 25 2013, 00:37)
QUOTE (MrSelfHater @ Sunday, Aug 25 2013, 00:18)
Does this need to be discussed further? Everyone has been on game companies' asses for decades now and all the sides said all the arguments that were to be said.

Ultimately - condemn a game like GTA - you're gonna have to take most movies (plus a sh*tload of books and a lot of art in general) with it
Besides, GTA games don't give "points" for killing. You control a character who made some bad choices in life and he's doing bad things to make ends meet. The games make the players ask themselves, where is the line between a "good person" and a bad one, GTA IV especially.

As much as I enjoy controlling a criminal in games or rooting for one in a TV show, it all has learned me one thing - Stay out of that lifestyle, because if you do bad sh*t, bad sh*t is gonna happen to you.

Probably not which is why I'm bowing out lol....people ask for a discussion when actually they don't really want one.

There's 3 pages of LEGITIMATE intelligent discussion, more than I've seen on the board in a while.

And its been super civil in here, again, more respect than I've seen on this board in a while.


You just happened to take offense where no offense was meant. My words were not harsh nor critical.


Were all friends here icon14.gif




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