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I hope that R* doesn't pull a San Andreas

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Rjeev142
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#91

Posted 28 July 2013 - 03:30 PM

QUOTE (cbiscuit93 @ Sunday, Jul 28 2013, 04:19)
The thing is, you're complaining about how SA had random sub-stories, and then you say IV had them too but they made sense, and then you list how they're connected. You're problem is you didn't take the time to remember & write down how SA's sub-stories connect as well. There are reasons why Carl does what he does in SA. And you keep saying he should have spent more time 'finding' his brother? He knew where his brother was, he didn't have to find him. He was in jail. The game was about getting him out of jail. But the whole time you had Tenpenny breathing down your neck.
I'm not saying the game doesn't have flaws, but I don't believe the story was bad at all.

This guy knows what he's talking about. Why does Cj work with Truth? Because Tennpenny forces him to do so, and in doing so Cj and Truth become friends. Why does Cj rob caligula's casino with Woozie? So that he can get enough money so that once sweet is out of jail, him and Cj can move out of the ghetto. Why does Mike Toreno contact you? He see's how Cj effectively takes down the loco syndicate, and decides to use him to his advantage and in return he'll get sweet out of jail. The plot of san andreas was perfectly connected, you just have to put the points together yourself to fully understand the plot. Unlike in GTA IV where the points were connected and explained by the game itself.

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#92

Posted 28 July 2013 - 03:33 PM

QUOTE (redx165 @ Sunday, Jul 28 2013, 00:18)
At least SA had good missions and wasn't the same boring repetitive missions IV had.

You do know the story was about trying to get his brother back. He got side tracked with money ( Which robbing the casino is a side mission )

This is exactly what I was thinking.

The thread writer is suggesting that he'd rather play the same 50 missions (have a shootout at an abandoned warehouse) than have a wide variety of diverse missions just because it'd cater to the story more. Dude, read a freakin' book. If the story were so important to you just buy the strategy guide. Seriously, buy the strategy guide so that you can read through the story and have yourself a gay-old time.

Grand Theft Auto is a videogame. Games are played for fun and amusement. They are not designed to tell a story. The great thing about San Andreas is that it was fun. You got to do so many things; whether scripted or spontaneous. That is the epitome of a great open-world game.

Yes, the story matters to the extent that it doesn't turn into a mindless arcade game, but the story will never supersede the gameplay. If you think it does (and that a game is obsolete without a heralded plot), then send me $140 right this instant. It'll be your fee for the Collector's Edition of my GTA memoirs. Hurry up! I'll even include a bookmark and a bibliography; plus some posters of the page layouts. Act fast!

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#93

Posted 28 July 2013 - 03:36 PM

This forum is legit retarded
Get at me ryan

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#94

Posted 28 July 2013 - 03:45 PM

QUOTE (thegtaman531 @ Sunday, Jul 28 2013, 04:14)
Make a side mission where you cut heads off hobos with a dildo while riding a unicorn, idgaf. By the looks of it, GTA V looks like a Heat inpired film that will work using a basic concept.

Well considering Red Dead had a unicorn then it's plausible.
..and it's a video game. Not a film based off heat.
I enjoy random crazy missions. Not to mention movies are tops 3 hours. Video games are upwards to 30 hours. I don't want every mission to follow the same exact plot down to a T. I want variety.
Personally I thought San Andreas had an amazing story backed up by fantastic voice acting which made it all the better of a story.

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#95

Posted 28 July 2013 - 03:50 PM

QUOTE (evilrex @ Sunday, Jul 28 2013, 15:23)
The RDR story was amazing. One of Rockstars best stories in my opinion. Hope we get story telling like that in V.

Yeah I thought Red Dead was the best story I've ever played. Until Rockstar ups themselves one more. Maybe with V?

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#96

Posted 28 July 2013 - 03:53 PM


I think people are kinda missing the point of San Andreas. You're not suppose to take the story seriously. It's less of a gritty drama and more of an escapist whirlwind adventure. CJ isn't Michael Corleone, he's Luke Skywalker.

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#97

Posted 28 July 2013 - 04:13 PM

QUOTE (Mega_Byte @ Sunday, Jul 28 2013, 15:33)
QUOTE (redx165 @ Sunday, Jul 28 2013, 00:18)
At least SA had good missions and wasn't the same boring repetitive missions IV had.

You do know the story was about trying to get his brother back. He got side tracked with money ( Which robbing the casino is a side mission )

This is exactly what I was thinking.

The thread writer is suggesting that he'd rather play the same 50 missions (have a shootout at an abandoned warehouse) than have a wide variety of diverse missions just because it'd cater to the story more. Dude, read a freakin' book. If the story were so important to you just buy the strategy guide. Seriously, buy the strategy guide so that you can read through the story and have yourself a gay-old time.

Grand Theft Auto is a videogame. Games are played for fun and amusement. They are not designed to tell a story. The great thing about San Andreas is that it was fun. You got to do so many things; whether scripted or spontaneous. That is the epitome of a great open-world game.

Yes, the story matters to the extent that it doesn't turn into a mindless arcade game, but the story will never supersede the gameplay. If you think it does (and that a game is obsolete without a heralded plot), then send me $140 right this instant. It'll be your fee for the Collector's Edition of my GTA memoirs. Hurry up! I'll even include a bookmark and a bibliography; plus some posters of the page layouts. Act fast!

Best Comment I have read so far icon14.gif

Here some Cookies Sir cookie.gif cookie.gif

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#98

Posted 28 July 2013 - 04:18 PM

Everything is San An added up...Play the game again, you just didn't pay attention or something. Shifty41s_beerhatsmilie2.gif

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#99

Posted 28 July 2013 - 04:24 PM

QUOTE (Innovention @ Sunday, Jul 28 2013, 06:16)
IV's story was garbage. More garbage than SA.

On the first half of the story I definitely cannot agree with you but on the other half I sort of do. The story wasn't that great and was overrated in my opinion.

But since the storyline is not the priority in a GTA game I don't really care that much. The missions however are more important and the design.

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#100

Posted 28 July 2013 - 05:02 PM Edited by SP3CTR3, 28 July 2013 - 05:05 PM.

Both IV and San Andreas had good stories. The only difference for me is that i stuck with SA because how attached i got to the characters. its a game i didn't have to be really serious about while enjoying it. the only person that stuck out for me in IV was Brucie , and that is it. I'm sure V will surpass both previous game's stories.

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#101

Posted 28 July 2013 - 05:04 PM

Agreed. SA's story was a mess, but a lot of fun. The places where it was weak and random kind of encouraged you to take regular times off and just explore and goof off. The faster you rushed through it, the less sense it made.

IV's story was great. I think a lot of people that hate on it just don't get all the deeper dimensions that it works. It's really smart and self-aware. But in it's drive to give a more cohesive narrative, you're kind of driven forward relentlessly. So taking time out from the storyline feels unnatural if Roman is kidnapped and Elizabeta about to get caught, multiple gang wars going on around you, bla bla bla.. once it got going, the story carried you straight to the end. Nice thing about SA was that it didn't do that.

Another issue I have with IV's story is that it doesn't quite cover the entire city. It's always Niko, so it kind of remains a very Broker/Bohan focussed story. Alderney was a bit like.. whatever.. TLaD and TBoGT fixed it a bit. Also why I immediately loved the three protags in V. Each is going to have their own angle to the map: richman, gangs and rednecks. Especially the interplay between Michael and Franklin's worlds is going to be great. They're really close geographically but worlds apart. Trevor is way out there in the sticks, so he's the guy you're gonna jump into if you want to do some crazy sh*t. I think that's going to do more for how you experience the game than we can imagine now. It's a f*ckin brilliant solution to avoiding the pitfalls of both SA and IV's story.

This is clearly going to be their best story yet, especially in how it connects the gameplay to the characters. Characterization is one thing they've always done well.

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#102

Posted 28 July 2013 - 05:18 PM

QUOTE (droppdeadd @ Sunday, Jul 28 2013, 15:45)
QUOTE (thegtaman531 @ Sunday, Jul 28 2013, 04:14)
Make a side mission where you cut heads off hobos with a dildo while riding a unicorn, idgaf. By the looks of it, GTA V looks like a Heat inpired film that will work using a basic concept.

Well considering Red Dead had a unicorn then it's plausible.
..and it's a video game. Not a film based off heat.
I enjoy random crazy missions. Not to mention movies are tops 3 hours. Video games are upwards to 30 hours. I don't want every mission to follow the same exact plot down to a T. I want variety.
Personally I thought San Andreas had an amazing story backed up by fantastic voice acting which made it all the better of a story.

Though the unicorn is apart of undead nightmare dlc

Tycek
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#103

Posted 28 July 2013 - 05:34 PM

The SA got a few issues with the story that ruined the whole thing for me:

Issue #1

California is state with a lot of different cultures and if you're going to throw Nevada in the mix you will get something hard to swallow. And R* unfortunately did that. They simply put too much food on the plate. They should focus of few chosen cultures and make them deeper. Since we're starting in LS, we should get street gangs and hip-hop since one is coming from another, dirty cops, crack and for example FBI investigating whole drugs/dirty cops scene.

Instead we got a bit of everything, but it's very shallow. We got rednecks, Triads, Mafias, UFOs, hippies, etc, but we can't say much about any of the culture. VC was focused on drugs and mafia, III on revenge in crime infested city (mostly Mafia, Yakuza and Cartel) and in IV we got similar crime infested city (Russian Bratva, Mafias and street hoodlums). SA simply got too much of everything.


Issue #2

Game was simply too short for its size. It may sound like a joke, but it's not. We were starting slowly in LS as a gangbanger learning our jobs, tagging the turf and trying to rebuild our weakened gang, but mission "Green Sabre" was beginning of the end. Since that point game was rushing through everything not giving us moment to think. We were redneck, race driver, working for Catalina, Triads, blowing Yayo, working for government and stealing jetpacks from military bases. It was too fast and too short.

Issue #3

Lack of logic and common sense is third issue. Game as I already mentioned started nice and slow giving us '90s LA feel, but soon we fell into black hole of stupidity: robbing National Guard depo, shooting at the Vagos riding on the roof of the train, running like a rabbit with ADHD and making errands for anybody and his mother. Stealing Green Goos (?), Jetpacks, jumping from plane to plane and doing similar not needed stuff. Game felt like one of the recent Fast and Furious movie. Let's make it fast and loud and without any logic. It doesn't matter there are simpler and better solutions, we need the most complicated and the stupidest one.

Another lack of logic is coming from the gameplay features, for example CJ needs to rob banks and gas stations with Catalina to pay The Truth for the weed, but I visited horses betting and I already got like 1 milion dollars on my account. Another one? Oh, I am so poor, I need to earn some cash and get out of the hood. Damn, man you already got all the homes in LS, because you won at the horse races. Features like this should be locked till SF, to force the feeling of the poverty of the hood.


R* showed with IV that they know how to make a good story and since they're focusing mostly on one thing in V (bank robberies) I am sure, we won't get SA again.

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#104

Posted 28 July 2013 - 05:39 PM

/sigh.

I'll repeat it again, SA's story was a clusterf*ck because SA was supposed to have more than one protag, but due to hardware limits, they had to reduce it to one protag.

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#105

Posted 28 July 2013 - 05:42 PM

QUOTE (Sleepy187. @ Sunday, Jul 28 2013, 19:39)
/sigh.

I'll repeat it again, SA's story was a clusterf*ck because SA was supposed to have more than one protag, but due to hardware limits, they had to reduce it to one protag.

It doesn't matter what was it supposed to be. It matter what it was and what was sold to us. I was supposed to be born in rich-ass family with personal bodyguard and yoga teacher, but I'm not.

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#106

Posted 28 July 2013 - 05:46 PM

It's a huge mistake on Rockstar's part for even attempting to write a story with 2-3 protags for a console like Xbox and PlayStation 2, the comparison you made isn't even relevant to this thing in my opinion at least.

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#107

Posted 28 July 2013 - 06:21 PM

QUOTE (thegtaman531 @ Sunday, Jul 28 2013, 06:14)
Alright guys, let's face it.
The San Andreas story was bad. Seriously.

I completly disagree. It was great, especially once we left LS for the first time

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#108

Posted 28 July 2013 - 06:45 PM

QUOTE (Eternal Moonshine @ Sunday, Jul 28 2013, 18:21)
QUOTE (thegtaman531 @ Sunday, Jul 28 2013, 06:14)
Alright guys, let's face it.
The San Andreas story was bad. Seriously.

I completly disagree. It was great, especially once we left LS for the first time

You crazy.. that's exactly the point where it all goes to hell.

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#109

Posted 28 July 2013 - 06:48 PM

Do you have any proof that SA was supposed to have multiple protagonists, because I smell bullsh*t here? Also I don't exactly see how it wasn't included because of technology limitations. They wouldn't be doing things for themselves when we left them as it will be in V, but they could simply "sleep" until we need them. Space wasn't much of an issue if R* managed to include big map with three different cities and a lot of vehicles. Getaway wasn't as big as SA, but they managed to write nice story with three protagonists, so I can't see why R* wouldn't be able to do the same.

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#110

Posted 28 July 2013 - 06:50 PM Edited by Sleepy187., 28 July 2013 - 06:55 PM.

QUOTE (Deacon Bosco @ Sunday, Jul 28 2013, 15:54)
QUOTE (Sleepy187. @ Sunday, Jul 28 2013, 12:07)
Correct me if I am wrong, but didn't Leslie Benzies or Imran Sarwar say in recent interviews that SA was supposed to have multiple protags, but due to limitation of the hardware they had to cut it back to one protag?

Hence the clusterf*ck of SA, because a story is written first, then comes development, and by the time they were developing SA it was too late to change the story.

Wow, you're right. This makes much more sense when you think about it.

http://www.examiner....le-protagonists

I can't belive nobody reported this before...

QUOTE (Tycek)
Do you have any proof that SA was supposed to have multiple protagonists, because I smell bullsh*t here? Also I don't exactly see how it wasn't included because of technology limitations. They wouldn't be doing things for themselves when we left them as it will be in V, but they could simply "sleep" until we need them. Space wasn't much of an issue if R* managed to include big map with three different cities and a lot of vehicles. Getaway wasn't as big as SA, but they managed to write nice story with three protagonists, so I can't see why R* wouldn't be able to do the same.


There you go, read the thread next time.

Edit: Learn to paragraph too, warrior.

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#111

Posted 28 July 2013 - 06:54 PM

QUOTE (Tycek @ Sunday, Jul 28 2013, 18:48)
Do you have any proof that SA was supposed to have multiple protagonists, because I smell bullsh*t here? Also I don't exactly see how it wasn't included because of technology limitations. They wouldn't be doing things for themselves when we left them as it will be in V, but they could simply "sleep" until we need them. Space wasn't much of an issue if R* managed to include big map with three different cities and a lot of vehicles. Getaway wasn't as big as SA, but they managed to write nice story with three protagonists, so I can't see why R* wouldn't be able to do the same.

It's not bullsh*t, because I remember reading or hearing about that. It's in a interview with one of the game developers. I think it was one of the GTAVClock videos. Brb gonna see if I can find it.

Edit: nvm. It was in a interview, posted above and earlier in the thread.

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#112

Posted 28 July 2013 - 07:15 PM

The story in San Andreas was absolutely absurd.

CJ was just such a pussy getting pushed around by Tenpenny through the entire game.

You take on armed gangs, criminal organisations, even the f*cking military (hell you even break into Area 51 and take on all of it's security before escaping with a jetpack) and yet you still have to take sh*t from one crooked cop?

I kept thinking that if I was playing SA as Tommy Vercetti, he would've killed Tenpenny the first time he met him, buried his body somewhere in the desert and that would've been the end of it.

Seriously, that's what Mission 1 in San Andreas would've been if the protagonist wasn't such a bitch.

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#113

Posted 28 July 2013 - 07:46 PM

some of you cant realise that gta san andreas was made in 2005 , dont know any games that were good as SA , i enjoyed missions , they were a bit hard , which was the point of the mission ,not like gta iv...

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#114

Posted 28 July 2013 - 07:58 PM

QUOTE (boyfromeast1 @ Sunday, Jul 28 2013, 19:46)
some of you cant realise that gta san andreas was made in 2005 , dont know any games that were good as SA , i enjoyed missions , they were a bit hard , which was the point of the mission ,not like gta iv...

hard?

heheh.. .which ones? Apart from some side missions like races I found it very easy. It was the first game that was easy for me but I still really enjoyed for being just plain fun to play and experience.

But true. What it did was awesome at the time. Of course there had been better stories in games and it wasn't brilliant graphically, but nothing really that tied everything together so nicely as GTA. That was already the case with VC and SA was just insult to injury. For all their nice graphics, a lot games today are still play catch up to SA's gameplay and sense of place and immersion.

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#115

Posted 28 July 2013 - 08:03 PM

The only ways in which IV was not a step backwards from San Andreas was in size, prettiness and vehicle handling (also, free-shooting from vehicles and multiplayer).

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#116

Posted 28 July 2013 - 08:14 PM

QUOTE (stranger44 @ Sunday, Jul 28 2013, 19:15)
The story in San Andreas was absolutely absurd.

CJ was just such a pussy getting pushed around by Tenpenny through the entire game.

You take on armed gangs, criminal organisations, even the f*cking military (hell you even break into Area 51 and take on all of it's security before escaping with a jetpack) and yet you still have to take sh*t from one crooked cop?

I kept thinking that if I was playing SA as Tommy Vercetti, he would've killed Tenpenny the first time he met him, buried his body somewhere in the desert and that would've been the end of it.

Seriously, that's what Mission 1 in San Andreas would've been if the protagonist wasn't such a bitch.

Well said. CJ was made into a major pussy. It never was clear to me why wouldn't he just pull out his gun and shoot Tempenny and Pulaski and end it all. Like you said, Tommy would just do that and go on.

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#117

Posted 28 July 2013 - 08:17 PM

QUOTE (boyfromeast1 @ Sunday, Jul 28 2013, 21:46)
some of you cant realise that gta san andreas was made in 2005 , dont know any games that were good as SA , i enjoyed missions , they were a bit hard , which was the point of the mission ,not like gta iv...

Only a few of the missions were really 'hard' in San Andreas, and even they weren't that much of a problem after playing them through a couple of times. In fact, I think San Andreas' missions were easier than the ones in its predecessors.

QUOTE (Tycek @ Sunday, Jul 28 2013, 20:48)
Do you have any proof that SA was supposed to have multiple protagonists, because I smell bullsh*t here?

QUOTE (http://www.examiner.com/article/gta-5-isn-t-the-first-time-rockstar-games-considered-multiple-protagonists)
First off, Grand Theft Auto V isn’t the first time that Rockstar Games contemplated having switchable main characters inside the franchise. The developer revealed that the original plans for Grand Theft Auto: San Andreas called for multiple protagonists, but technical limitations on the original Xbox and PS2 at the time prevented the idea from happening. So the idea of placing several characters in the hands of gamer control is something that Rockstar Games has wanted to see in the series for some time.


I have even checked how credible this article from examiner is by translating the interview between Leslie Benzes and Jeuxactu, and that is the result:
QUOTE (http://www.jeuxactu.com/gta-5-interview-rockstar-north-sur-le-switch-des-personnages-88398.htm)
Where did you get the idea of three exchangable characters?
Leslie: We had already thought about multiple playable characters in San Andreas, but we couldn't put it up for technical reasons. [...]

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#118

Posted 28 July 2013 - 08:27 PM

QUOTE (wwinterj @ Sunday, Jul 28 2013, 04:17)
Good post. I doubt R* will take a step back in there storytelling. After GTA IV R* seems to have got better at telling a story and I don't think V will be any different.

Look at Red Dead Redemption, brilliant story, no doubt it will be the same with V.

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#119

Posted 28 July 2013 - 08:34 PM

QUOTE (PhilGTA1 @ Sunday, Jul 28 2013, 20:27)
QUOTE (wwinterj @ Sunday, Jul 28 2013, 04:17)
Good post. I doubt R* will take a step back in there storytelling. After GTA IV R* seems to have got better at telling a story and I don't think V will be any different.

Look at Red Dead Redemption, brilliant story, no doubt it will be the same with V.

I really don't know how you could make an awesome story by killing your main protagonist like in RDR. The story in V will be difficult to create considering we now have three protagonists.

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#120

Posted 28 July 2013 - 08:52 PM

QUOTE (Hameer @ Sunday, Jul 28 2013, 20:34)
QUOTE (PhilGTA1 @ Sunday, Jul 28 2013, 20:27)
QUOTE (wwinterj @ Sunday, Jul 28 2013, 04:17)
Good post. I doubt R* will take a step back in there storytelling. After GTA IV R* seems to have got better at telling a story and I don't think V will be any different.

Look at Red Dead Redemption, brilliant story, no doubt it will be the same with V.

I really don't know how you could make an awesome story by killing your main protagonist like in RDR. The story in V will be difficult to create considering we now have three protagonists.

Personally I've never been big on stories where the main protagonist dies. But it fit with RDR I think.

IV was written better than SA, I enjoyed IV quite a bit. I think the fact that SA is so disjointed and a mess that makes me like its story better.




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