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Why does the bridge lift?

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universetwisters
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#1

Posted 23 July 2013 - 06:25 PM

You guys know about the lift bridge that runs between Shoreside and Staunton, right? Why does it keep moving up and down, especially when there's no boats going underneath it. And even then, the bridge is high enough for most of the ships in-game to clear it.

Tycek
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#2

Posted 23 July 2013 - 06:40 PM Edited by Tycek, 23 July 2013 - 06:46 PM.

Developers foreseen the future that there will be one nosy GTAForums member who will be asking all kinds of unnecessary questions and they thought they will give him another reason to wake him up at night, so here you go! You got lift bridge, which lifts itself even without vessels coming underneath it and even if it's high enough for ships to pass it below.

Seriously: it's adding life to the game, because it's actually a nice to hear the siren when you are somewhere around Belleville Park, Aspatria or Bedford Point. It's nice to see the bridge coming up, it's nice to wait for your turn to drive, etc. IIRC Saints Row also got lift bridge lifting up even without ships. Things like that are cool, and let's be honest, do cool things really need reason to be?

Andreaz1
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#3

Posted 23 July 2013 - 06:44 PM

How else would they keep you from accessing Shoreside Vale too early? tounge.gif

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#4

Posted 23 July 2013 - 07:02 PM

QUOTE (Andreaz1 @ Tuesday, Jul 23 2013, 18:44)
How else would they keep you from accessing Shoreside Vale too early? tounge.gif

This. Rockstar can't use the same blown up bridge excuse.

Vic 2.0
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#5

Posted 23 July 2013 - 07:06 PM

QUOTE (Tycek @ Tuesday, Jul 23 2013, 18:40)
Developers foreseen the future that there will be one nosy GTAForums member who will be asking all kinds of unnecessary questions...

Make that two. By a strange coincidence (or maybe not?) I just finished asking this question myself on a separate topic a little before this thread was started.

And of course that means I think it's a legitimate one. I think it would've been pretty AWESOME to have a big ship float through there real quick. And maybe they could've made it where you can jump onto it if you timed it right, etc. They could've made it like the L-Train in Portland, where you can ride it around the island (with or without an opportunity to jump off onto Shoreside early via some difficult trick), or maybe even ride it to Portland where you're offloaded as cargo! Hehe

Okay, I know they weren't there yet, but it still would've been cool.

Arsen Vitiuk
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#6

Posted 23 July 2013 - 09:00 PM

I have to agree with Tycek - I think it's all about realism. And while there were no ships to lift the bridge for, the idea of a lift bridge itself - which has never been re-used anywhere outside III's LC - was really great, so they decided to implement it. Taking into account the fact that this was the first III era GTA, made in 2001, and back then the programmers would make their minds busy with such an uneasy code for the bridge to work like it should, and you realise that it was a really awesome feature - especially back in 2001.

Plus, it's a good excuse to lock off Shoreside Vale in an easy manner - the lift bridge mechanism got damaged.

As well as it would give an extraordinary location for a Hidden Package - which was successfully utilised.

Xegethra
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#7

Posted 23 July 2013 - 10:01 PM

I agree that it adds to realism by having it, but it only half adds to the realism it wants to employ which is why universetwisters has asked the question of it being there. The realism is taken away in part because there is no ship going through it lifting. Even if it happened in Saints Row, it's still a bit disappointing there was no ship there too.

When I heard the bell go and first time I went on the bridge and it went up I wondered immediately why there was no ship. They have planes that fly around in circles...why not have a couple of freight ships sailing around too? The realism for me, in that respect was taken away when I learnt there was no ship. It's a good idea though, to lock off the map sections like that....but it doesn't work because lifts don't go up and down for no reason. It didn't even have to be a full ship for you to go on either....could have just been something that reflects you off it when you touch it.

I dunno whatever reason there is for not putting it in the game, and I agree that the game doesn't definitively need it, but it would have helped the bridge feel more like what its supposed to represent.

Arsen Vitiuk
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#8

Posted 24 July 2013 - 07:15 AM

QUOTE (Xegethra @ Wednesday, Jul 24 2013, 01:01)
They have planes that fly around in circles...why not have a couple of freight ships sailing around too?

I guess they just didn't bother...

But before they figured out the trick with putting the barriers on bridges (which they implemented in VC and on), they decided to use such and odd technique to seal off Shoreside Vale before its allotted time. And you won't put a wall on the bridge either - like the one you could put in Porter Tunnel.

So I guess the bridge's presence and function is sort of explainable - even if its function serves no "real-world" purpose.

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#9

Posted 24 July 2013 - 07:30 AM

QUOTE (Xegethra @ Wednesday, Jul 24 2013, 08:01)
They have planes that fly around in circles...why not have a couple of freight ships sailing around too?

Probably because no ship would be able to fit through here.

user posted image

Which even further draws the question of why there would need to be a lift bridge here if ships that pass it can't even go anywhere. tounge.gif

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#10

Posted 24 July 2013 - 07:35 AM

The realism provided by the bridge was definitely much better than junk piled on bridges in later titles (not to mention police coming out of nowhere to kill the player).

However, I felt that the bridge was being raised too often, and the alarm became rather annoying. This might have been the reason why the mechanism broke down. I think the frequency of the bridge rising was alright if the player was only doing missions in quick succession. But not when cruising around the city.

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#11

Posted 24 July 2013 - 07:57 AM

I did a little modding, and well.. I stand myself corrected on my previous statement.

user posted image

Xegethra
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#12

Posted 24 July 2013 - 08:23 AM

Haha awesome, all it needs to do is circle Staunton Island endlessly and the bridge lift should stay down while the ship isn't there!

But I'm guessing that's just a map mod at the moment?

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#13

Posted 24 July 2013 - 10:25 AM

QUOTE (dingleman @ Wednesday, Jul 24 2013, 07:57)
I did a little modding, and well.. I stand myself corrected on my previous statement.

user posted image

Haha, wow.

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#14

Posted 24 July 2013 - 10:34 AM

QUOTE (dingleman @ Wednesday, Jul 24 2013, 07:30)
QUOTE (Xegethra @ Wednesday, Jul 24 2013, 08:01)
They have planes that fly around in circles...why not have a couple of freight ships sailing around too?

Probably because no ship would be able to fit through here.

user posted image

Which even further draws the question of why there would need to be a lift bridge here if ships that pass it can't even go anywhere. tounge.gif

Naturally, they would've avoided this problem if it had occurred to them to add a ship circling the island.

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#15

Posted 24 July 2013 - 11:02 AM

Just because it's been repaired doesn't mean that it's working correctly.

Logical explanation: the lift mechanism is being tested. Sorry for the inconvenience.

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#16

Posted 24 July 2013 - 11:56 AM

The better question would be why you can't navigate freely on water even after Shoreside is unlocked? You need to pass a mission from Donald Love I think until the ways on water to Shoreside are fully unlocked.

Arsen Vitiuk
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#17

Posted 24 July 2013 - 01:20 PM

QUOTE (Nukey Shay @ Wednesday, Jul 24 2013, 14:02)
Logical explanation: the lift mechanism is being tested. Sorry for the inconvenience.

So how would you explain the bridge's functionality in LCS then? Testing the mechanism for over 3 years prior to it breaking down? I don't think so.

The only reasonable explanation is the ships passing by. Let's just pretend that those are invisible ships, and everything will be fine.

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#18

Posted 24 July 2013 - 01:25 PM

QUOTE (Arsen Vitiuk @ Wednesday, Jul 24 2013, 14:20)
QUOTE (Nukey Shay @ Wednesday, Jul 24 2013, 14:02)
Logical explanation: the lift mechanism is being tested.  Sorry for the inconvenience.

So how would you explain the bridge's functionality in LCS then? Testing the mechanism for over 3 years prior to it breaking down? I don't think so.

The only reasonable explanation is the ships passing by. Let's just pretend that those are invisible ships, and everything will be fine.

Here we are guys:
user posted image
Now, these can turn red regardless of whether there is a pedestrian waiting to cross the road. Same explanation with the bridge, it lifts automatically to allow traffic to stop and boats, whether there are any, to pass through


Arsen Vitiuk
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#19

Posted 24 July 2013 - 01:40 PM

QUOTE (GTAKid667 @ Wednesday, Jul 24 2013, 16:25)
Here we are guys:
user posted image
Now, these can turn red regardless of whether there is a pedestrian waiting to cross the road. Same explanation with the bridge, it lifts automatically to allow traffic to stop and boats, whether there are any, to pass through

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Why, nobody here has ever pushed that idea up ahead! Have a cookie.gif for yourself.

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#20

Posted 24 July 2013 - 02:00 PM

QUOTE (Arsen Vitiuk @ Wednesday, Jul 24 2013, 14:40)
QUOTE (GTAKid667 @ Wednesday, Jul 24 2013, 16:25)
Here we are guys:
user posted image
Now, these can turn red regardless of whether there is a pedestrian waiting to cross the road. Same explanation with the bridge, it lifts automatically to allow traffic to stop and boats, whether there are any, to pass through

My man! You amaze me!

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I'd kiss you, if you'd shaved!


Why, nobody here has ever pushed that idea up ahead! Have a cookie.gif for yourself.

Thanks Arsen, I was surprised no-one mentioned it before. wink.gif

j7n
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#21

Posted 24 July 2013 - 02:26 PM

Actually some traffic lights can be requested to turn red by a pedestrian.

user posted image

In my area those are installed on heavily travelled roads, where they are likely to interrupt lots of cars, and/or where pedestrian frequency is low but where they have no other safe options of crossing the road.

It wouldn't be unreasonable to have some sort of signaling of an approaching ship built at the bridge to a) save the lifting mechanism and save energy, b) prevent the ship from slowing down, which it can't do easily, to wait for the bridge cycle.

The bridge spends almost as much time up than down, and moves up and down like a traffic light indeed.

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#22

Posted 24 July 2013 - 02:33 PM

QUOTE (j7n @ Wednesday, Jul 24 2013, 15:26)
Actually some traffic lights can be requested to turn red by a pedestrian.

user posted image

In my area those are installed on heavily travelled roads, where they are likely to interrupt lots of cars, and/or where pedestrian frequency is low but where they have no other safe options of crossing the road.

It wouldn't be unreasonable to have some sort of signaling of an approaching ship built at the bridge to a) save the lifting mechanism and save energy, b) prevent the ship from slowing down, which it can't do easily, to wait for the bridge cycle.

The bridge spends almost as much time up than down, and moves up and down like a traffic light indeed.

Yes, some. Some also have both a button and an automatic signal.

The Bridge is one of many, the one that works solely automatically instead of solely manual.

Xegethra
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#23

Posted 24 July 2013 - 02:34 PM

Yeah, we have traffic lights like that too....and even though some have buttons to press it doesn't seem like they work...even if nobody presses them the lights still change and when they do press them they can still take ages. And yeah, it's rather a common sight to see lights change to let people cross the road when nobody wants to so cars have to sit there anyway.

But I've still never seen real bridges go up and down with no ships passing by....I'm just gonna go with the invisible ship idea, being sailed by Wonder Woman

Vic 2.0
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#24

Posted 25 July 2013 - 12:16 AM

QUOTE (_____ @ Wednesday, Jul 24 2013, 11:56)
The better question would be why you can't navigate freely on water even after Shoreside is unlocked? You need to pass a mission from Donald Love I think until the ways on water to Shoreside are fully unlocked.

Hmmm, "Good news for swimmers. Authorities have finally managed to capture the last rabid shark/loch ness monster that has been attacking people in the water, and now the water is safe again." wink.gif

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#25

Posted 25 July 2013 - 03:32 AM

It really didn't need a reason in 2001. It was just a cool feature at the time that added to the immersion of III. Same thing with Driver 2, it had opening bridge(s) just for the cool factor. I'm sure they (R*) wanted to put prop boats that passed through it, but they just didn't have enough dev time to implement it.

Xegethra
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#26

Posted 25 July 2013 - 05:02 AM

I don't think it does add to the immersion, purely for the missing ships....

I dunno how much time it would have taken as I don't know the size of the team, but if they couldn't do it it's still a shame that they couldn't all the same...sure we don't need a ship sailing through, but it would have been another of those cool things to see in the game.

Like if planes weren't flying around, sure we wouldn't need them but they are a nice touch....but yet we have those.

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#27

Posted 25 July 2013 - 04:00 PM

My guess is that the CPUs of ten years ago would've been challenged to keep big masses of pixels, like container ships, moving around all the time. But now we have speedy powerful processors (enough to keep things moving in GTA V) and there's a potential for updating.

I suggest some Liberty City changes: first, the two big bridges are swapped: the Staunton Lift Bridge goes where the Callahan Bridge is now. Why? Because Portland Harbor and Hepburn Heights also get swapped. Makes better sense, instead of the harbor facing east and the open ocean, it’s west-facing and sheltered, and ships coming in and out pass under the lift bridge.

As for the Callahan Bridge connecting Staunton and Shoreside Vale, since the water’s a little wider, there’s room to make a more conventional-looking suspension bridge, with two supports instead of one. This means a little change in the opening scenario: when the Cartel kidnaps Donald Love’s “Oriental friend” (and enabling Claude and 8-Ball's escape) they damage both bridges, to make it seem they fled upstate (and bombed the two tunnels on Shoreside behind them.)

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#28

Posted 25 July 2013 - 04:10 PM

That would require the change of far too many missions and side quests...let alone packages, jumps and rampages, any possible dialogue that mentions places....wouldn't really work.

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#29

Posted 04 August 2013 - 04:34 PM

In theory, couldnt it be modified into the game with (relative) ease? For example, the model dingleman posted on the previous page could replace an unused vehicle (such as the Ghost since it's used in one mission), then edit the main.scm to have the boat sail around the map? I'm not too into modding games, but I've seen vehicles drove in pre designated paths in Vice City scm modding, so couldn't boats could roughly do the same in III? If done it could add a vast amount of possibilities, such as vehicle transportation (especially for those who can't fly the Dodo properly for import/export), docking at each island, etc.

Again this is all in theory and I have minimal experience in modding aside from .txd files but surely someone could implement this? Would be a nice feature alongside the helicopter mod that's being worked on.

Xegethra
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#30

Posted 04 August 2013 - 07:44 PM

QUOTE (e l y x i a @ Sunday, Aug 4 2013, 16:34)
In theory, couldnt it be modified into the game with (relative) ease? For example, the model dingleman posted on the previous page could replace an unused vehicle (such as the Ghost since it's used in one mission), then edit the main.scm to have the boat sail around the map? I'm not too into modding games, but I've seen vehicles drove in pre designated paths in Vice City scm modding, so couldn't boats could roughly do the same in III? If done it could add a vast amount of possibilities, such as vehicle transportation (especially for those who can't fly the Dodo properly for import/export), docking at each island, etc.

Again this is all in theory and I have minimal experience in modding aside from .txd files but surely someone could implement this? Would be a nice feature alongside the helicopter mod that's being worked on.

I can't fly the Dodo either....so I drove it. It's not any slower than a slow car really.

But yeah, a proper mod that makes a ship sail around would be nice. They could maybe copy one of the container ships at the Portland docks and have that sail around. Maybe even going out to sea in the far distance until it disappears. Then a few minutes later "another" one pops up and sails under the bridge, stops at a dock for a few in game hours and then sails off again. Making it looks like several ships are coming and going. Or maybe copy over a big cruise ship from Vice City or another game, and have that circle the city.




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