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Should Paedophilia be Seriously Defended?

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El_Diablo
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#151

Posted 04 July 2014 - 04:32 AM Edited by El_Diablo, 04 July 2014 - 04:33 AM.

the media absolutely affects this particular issue.

 

you can't exactly perform a "study" on this idea, but I'm personally convinced that the world today has more pedophiles in it than it would naturally thanks directly to the impact of our hypersexualized beauty and fashion industry. not porn, and not TV, and not movies, but the mainstream fashion and beauty industry (clothing, makeup, etc). they specifically go out of their way to focus on an unnatural and unhealthy image of what they think an attractive person is supposed to look like and it's sick.

 

since the turn of the last century, mainstream fashion and beauty around the world has been geared toward the skinniest possible models who are all thoroughly waxed from head to toe and clean shaven like prepubescent children. this is not natural and it's not healthy; it's not healthy physically for the models themselves and it's not healthy for society. our standards for what should and should not be a sexual object have become totally f*cked. the natural standard for beauty used to be maturity and fitness, not skin and bone. the most desirable women were those who were in shape, ate a healthy diet, had 'child bearing hips,'  etc etc. for hundreds of thousands of years this was the normal and natural way of attraction; just look at ALL of human art before the last 125 years. you don't see the kind of women we see in magazines today, you see women like this:

 

(contains some artistic nudity)

Spoiler

 

I submit that society knew exactly what normal beauty was supposed to look like until recently.

normal, healthy looking, adult women.

 

the kind of chemical imbalance that would otherwise cause someone to be born a pedophile is no longer the only factor in certain people become pedophiles.

this world we have constructed is breeding more sexual deviants where there wouldn't be.

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Xavierr
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#152

Posted 07 July 2014 - 10:51 PM

I seriously can't believe this thread.

 

 

I just hope I die before people start trying to justify bestiality.

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sivispacem
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#153

Posted 08 July 2014 - 07:32 AM

I seriously can't believe this thread.


If that's all you have to contribute to it it would be better you didn't bother at all. Check the D&D rules please.
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Myron
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#154

Posted 12 July 2014 - 03:40 AM Edited by Myron, 12 July 2014 - 03:44 AM.

If I were attracted to kids I would kill myself and I advise anyone who is to follow suit, or at least hide in eternal shame. A modern liberal society does not accept it like homosexuality for the same reason it doesn't accept people with a strong compulsion to murder so yes these freaks should be oppressed and if that comes in the form of prison justice a la a dumbbell to the head then I personally would not cry at their funeral. It's pretty sick that anyone would defend this, but then again typhus is an admitted aforementioned freak.

on another note el diablo's notion that modern media culture exacerbates this due to women shaving their crotches and being thin is complete trash
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El_Diablo
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#155

Posted 12 July 2014 - 04:57 AM

on another note el diablo's notion that modern media culture exacerbates this due to women shaving their crotches and being thin is complete trash

I could cite studies saying otherwise but why bother with you...

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Myron
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#156

Posted 12 July 2014 - 10:00 AM


on another note el diablo's notion that modern media culture exacerbates this due to women shaving their crotches and being thin is complete trash

I could cite studies saying otherwise but why bother with you...

'You can't exactly perform a study on this but... '

Nice work bro.

HolographicBunny
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#157

Posted 12 July 2014 - 10:55 AM

In certain anthropological constructs, an adult-child relationship might not be abuse. Our modern society is not one of those. Romantic interest, even should it mutually exist in that situation, isn't sustainable, and true romantic interest has sustainability as a goal. So on the topic of whether paedophilic acts can gain acceptance with better understanding, no. Not here and now anyway, nor should they.

The fear and hate mongering surrounding this subject must change, though. Not only because it's wildly unfair to the pedophile (in particular those disinclined to be harmful) but also to the children at risk.

Most pedophiles are normal people. A great many recognize that to act on their impulse is almost certainly abuse. A great many would never harm a child, at about the same rate of the rest of the population. A great many are disinclined to take sexual advantage of anyone of any age, at about the same rate as the rest of the population.

The draconian laws involved (for example, if I were two draw 2 stick figures in a compromising position, and then write age 8 on the paper, with an arrow pointing to one of them, in many jurisdictions I am equally guilty of producing child pornography as someone who videotaped a molestation) make it hard to get the proper mental help that someone dedicated to controlling their urges may need.

People get turned in all the time, by professionals they sought out, for trying to do the right thing. It's like when people were ignorant enough to think every homosexual was a pedophile. Now people think every pedophile's a rapist. It's simply not true.

It also means that for every story of a guy who tries to find professional help, and at the least gets publicly outed and his home and life turned upside-down by an investigation, there's a guy who hears that story and decides trying his best to be his best is too great a risk. The therapist who outed the original guy thought she was trying to help, but she's put all the children around the second guy at a greater degree of risk.

This is a topic I feel strongly about, but my phone's about to die, so I will clarify and expound on this at some point in the next day or so.
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HolographicBunny
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#158

Posted 12 July 2014 - 11:03 AM Edited by HolographicBunny, 12 July 2014 - 11:27 AM.

If I were attracted to kids I would kill myself and I advise anyone who is to follow suit, or at least hide in eternal shame. A modern liberal society does not accept it like homosexuality for the same reason it doesn't accept people with a strong compulsion to murder so yes these freaks should be oppressed and if that comes in the form of prison justice a la a dumbbell to the head then I personally would not cry at their funeral. It's pretty sick that anyone would defend this, but then again typhus is an admitted aforementioned freak.

on another note el diablo's notion that modern media culture exacerbates this due to women shaving their crotches and being thin is complete trash

A) That's an easy thing to say from outside the situation, but you wouldn't jump enthusiastically at the chance to kill yourself if your hypothetical was true. That's kind of ignorant.

B) How's this for an alternative to suicide or resignment to wallow stagnant in a pit of abject shame? If you can't be proud of all the things you are, you can at least be proud of how you fight against the things in yourself you don't like.

C) I must confess I half-skimmed the whole thread before I weighed in, but I have great confidence in my ability to derive content that way. If I did miss something, my preemptive apologies. You did though, specifically use the word compulsion, as opposed to action.

As far as I read, we were discussing pedophilia the condition, not pedophilia the act. Considering that, are you genuinely advocating the concept of thought police? Or did you only think it through as far as "Pedophiles are bad, mmm'kay?" before you started typing?

HolographicBunny
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#159

Posted 12 July 2014 - 11:43 AM

there's no defense for pedophilia.

being sexually attracted to children is a disease of the mind. it's not healthy for the adult and it's certainly not healthy for the child.
even if it's not rape, it's still wrong. consent from a child does not make having sex with a child right or acceptable; it doesn't matter if you coerced the child into consent because it's still coercion on the part of the adult who is supposed to be mature and responsible.

children can have sex with children. that's relatively normal.
2 people of the same age (or very close together, in the same school) exploring their sexuality is normal.

an adult seeking out sex with a child (because they're a child) is not normal.
it's indefensible.


And here we have another individual incapable of distinguishing the condition from the act. Of course an adult seeking out sex w/ a child is indefensible. What about in the situation of a pedophile who's very aware of that? Are impure thoughts indefensible? Are only certain impure thoughts defensible? How would
you go about policing/legislating desire?

HolographicBunny
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#160

Posted 12 July 2014 - 11:53 AM

Pedophile or not, if an adult touches a child in any sort of sexual manner, no, that person should not be seriously defended. That person should be tortured and killed. Period.

If you're sexually attracted to children and you can't control it than you should commit suicide immediately because you have serious f*cking issues, and because someone else will probably kill you for it anyways.


We don't disagree that adult/child sexual contact is just plain not ok, but torture, huh? Way to make a moral stand. :/

sivispacem
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#161

Posted 12 July 2014 - 02:21 PM

Whilst I welcome your intelligent contributions, please edit posts before multiple posting in the future.

CenMan
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#162

Posted 12 July 2014 - 03:14 PM Edited by CenMan, 12 July 2014 - 03:15 PM.

HolographicBunny, would you consider watching child pornography as harmful? While I agree that not all pedophiles are rapists, I would guess (of course I can't say I know) that a significant portion of them watches child pornography. One might say that it is harmful because it creates a demand for child pornogrpahy, but it might also be true that a lot of it is made because the producer gets a kick out of it, not for financial gain. We can say for certain that when it is watched, it has already been produced and the only harm done is another person seeing it, probably without the knowledge of the child or his/her family. I haven't looked at any studies, but I can imagine that child pornography might satisfy some urges, preventing an actual molestation. But then again, I can also imagine the opposite being true.

 

My personal opinion is that when people are caught with child pornography, they should undergo psychological/psychiatric treatment, forcefully if necessary. I think the overtness of it (to what extent the person's surroundings become aware of the treatment) and the forcefulness of it should be judged on a case by case basis. A high risk case should be treated in a closed institution, lower risk cases could go on with their lives while undergoing the treatment. People who have molested children should without a doubt be in a closed institution or in prison with treatment. People who can't be helped by treatment should, unfortunately for them, be put in a closed institution indefinitely.


El_Diablo
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#163

Posted 12 July 2014 - 08:02 PM Edited by El_Diablo, 12 July 2014 - 09:51 PM.

'You can't exactly perform a study on this but... '

 

because none of them are definitive.

but instance of pedophilia predation has been on the rise since the about the 1930's. you can look it up.

 

the research that's been done has to deal with the simple conflict of rise in statistics.

the reason it's not conclusive is because you'd have to consider the fact that we simply didn't track clinical pedophilia prior to the turn of the last century. so the rise in numbers might also be due to mere awareness more than anything. interestingly enough, this theory was born out of accidental results from studies that dealt with female (and even male) body image / self esteem based on the media.

 

those studies were never focused on the unintended effects that our media has on sexual predation, but the consequences they reveal appear regardless. so you're not exactly going to find literature that is worded in such context. which is why I said what I said originally...

 

either way, pedophilia appears to be more prevalent in recent society than historically.

which is why those studies will never be definitive, but they're out there, and why my theory is actually more than "trash."


Eden1023
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#164

Posted 4 weeks ago Edited by Eden1023, 4 weeks ago.

-Ignore-

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erykahleigh16
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#165

Posted A week ago

I dont understand some of these people's posts. Its never f*cking okay to abuse a child. EVER. end of story. It's abuse because it harms these children. thats what abuse is. Anyone who believes that there are certain cases where its okay might as well be Satan himself. Its not that these abusers have these desires (because i do believe some of them cannot control it) its that they ACT upon them! Sorry if you dont agree. you dont have to, but thats my opinion


sivispacem
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#166

Posted A week ago

I dont understand some of these people's posts. Its never f*cking okay to abuse a child.

I don't know where you've got the idea that anyone ever said it was okay?
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erykahleigh16
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#167

Posted 6 days ago

 

I dont understand some of these people's posts. Its never f*cking okay to abuse a child.

I don't know where you've got the idea that anyone ever said it was okay?

 

 is it inherently wrong to sexualise children the way we do adults?

 

    •  
    • This statement implies that it is necessary to ask the question whether it is right to be sexual towards children the way we are to adults

      Why should one even have to ASK that question? It implies that some people would believe it IS okay. Which of course, it isn't. Also, this person writes "is it abuse because children are supposed to be off limits or is it abuse because children are not taught to consent the way adults are" (that's not the exact quote but that's what is said) This statement, in my opinion is ridiculous as well because children are not SUPPOSED to be taught to consent as adults and NO sh*t that children are off limits. THEYRE CHILDREN for God's sake!


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#168

Posted 6 days ago

 is it inherently wrong to sexualise children the way we do adults?

    •  
    • This statement implies that it is necessary to ask the question whether it is right to be sexual towards children the way we are to adults

      Why should one even have to ASK that question? It implies that some people would believe it IS okay. Which of course, it isn't. Also, this person writes "is it abuse because children are supposed to be off limits or is it abuse because children are not taught to consent the way adults are" (that's not the exact quote but that's what is said) This statement, in my opinion is ridiculous as well because children are not SUPPOSED to be taught to consent as adults and NO sh*t that children are off limits. THEYRE CHILDREN for God's sake!

 

I've known myself to completely screw up the wording of my replies, making my point not clear, but I'll give it a shot here anyway.

 

I can answer the first part of what you were saying, rhetoric or not. The general reason people ask questions is so that they can further their knowledge - in this case, it's understanding why the answer is yes/no. Sure, you may think that a question such as this has an obvious answer that is 'right', but it's pretty useless if you don't know why you 'should' be thinking that - a bad thing, in all. It's basically just adopting the opinions of other people without bothering to make your own - which kinda defeats the point of opinions. Look at the discussion it's generated; simply saying "of course it isn't" is a very blunt statement with little meaning. And yes, some people do think it's okay - as the OP said, entire cultures thought/think it's okay. 

 

As for the second part, you pretty much show what I'm talking about. You just throw the question away with the only reasoning being "they're children". Oh, won't somebody think of the children! Simply "they're children" doesn't answer the question - children shouldn't eat pizza because they're children for god's sake! Look how useless that it. What trait(s) universal to children lead to the conclusion, and how do they lead to it? That's what this discussion is about. 

 

It's certainly not trying to justify abusing children, it's just discussion.

Especially since it's moved to general "are paedophiles bad" which is a tad removed from abusing children. 





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