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A sad day..

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skyfamster
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#421

Posted 24 May 2013 - 11:01 AM

Happiness can't be bought.

Miamivicecity
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#422

Posted 24 May 2013 - 12:27 PM Edited by Miamivicecity, 24 May 2013 - 12:43 PM.

Hmmm I honeslty don't see the issue. There's plenty of vanilla games I've bought and haven't felt as if I've missed out compared the special and/or collector's editions.

Think of it like this if you went to a nightclub would you complain about not having access to the V.I.P area? or a luxuary box at a sports event?

It's not like the special and collector's edition contain two of the protagonists and everyone with the vanilla game is stuck with one. The map is restricted, no properties exist etc. I guess what I'm saying is all of this extra stuff is extra incentive, but someone who bought the standard version is still going to get a quality experience.

Just like with GTA IV and RDR I want to spend that bit extra because it's worth every cent IMO.

Ferocious Banger
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#423

Posted 24 May 2013 - 12:43 PM

QUOTE (Miamivicecity @ Friday, May 24 2013, 17:57)
Hmmm I honeslty don't see the issue. There's plenty of vanilla games I've bought and haven't felt as if I've missed out compared the special and/or collector's editions.

Think of it like this if you went to a nightclub would you complain about not having access to the V.I.P area? or a luxuary box at a sports event?

It's not like the special and collector's edition contain two of the protagonists and everyone with the vanilla game is stuck with one. The map is restricted, no properties exist etc. I guess what I'm saying is all of this extra stuff is extra incentive, but someone who bought the standard version is still going to get a quality experience.

Just like with GTA IV and I want to spend that bit extra because it's worth every cent IMO.

I'm not blaming you particular, Miami. But because of people buying into these CE's of games with in-game content not found otherwise in the vanilla version of that game, the habit by publishers has grown. It wasn't like this in the last generation, is it?

The fact that my faaaaavorite developers/publisher ever, Rockstar, have taken the route, slightly saddens me.

Freezer89
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#424

Posted 24 May 2013 - 12:47 PM

QUOTE (Ferocious Banger @ Friday, May 24 2013, 14:43)
The fact that my faaaaavorite developers/publisher ever, Rockstar, have taken the route, slightly saddens me.

At least they aren't like Ubisoft, EA & Co with their annual game releases and that these are only slightly improved. R* takes their time in developing.

Them going the same bussiness way as many others is just a slight disadvantage/disappointment.. they could at least only add physical extras then it would be just perfectly fine. But ingame bonusses.. yeah whatsthat.gif

No developer/publisher is perfect. Even Valve. Actually.. there is one: CDProject Red. No DRM, great games, no paid DLCs, etc.

Liudeius
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#425

Posted 24 May 2013 - 02:03 PM

QUOTE (man dragon @ Friday, May 24 2013, 04:54)
QUOTE (KFranchise @ Friday, May 24 2013, 03:46)
The people who get the Collector's or Special Edition get the content within it, if you get Standard Edition, you'll get it later. MP3, RDR, and LA Noire did the same, so stop bitching.

Everybody listen to this man.

Look at it this way, Rockstar want you to have the content, yet the Special/Collector's Editions won't be on sale forever. When they become unavailable in stores, the in-game content will be able to be purchased over PSN/XBL. Further on this point, they've spent time/resources/effort on making the blimp flyable, why would they limit it to a fraction of consumers?

No, that is baseless speculation.

And if they are going to make is available for free anyway, it's pointless.

If you are suggesting they will make it available as extra DLC, that doesn't change the fact that they have removed main content and sold it as DLC.

Cyper
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#426

Posted 24 May 2013 - 02:05 PM

QUOTE (Pwned. @ Thursday, May 23 2013, 15:23)
Yes, it is such a disaster, omg like seriously they took out 1 car omg and a few challenges omg.

Anyways, why EA's direction? Dude this is the new STANDARD in gaming. Deal with it, you may not like it all but you cant change it.

It's not the new standard in gaming, it's the gamer's new standard.

The only reason why Rockstar is doing this is because gamer's accept it. If they few people would accept it, they would not do it.


And the fact that Rockstar develop games with high quality isn't an excuse. Two wrongs don't make a right.

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#427

Posted 24 May 2013 - 02:06 PM

That's called capitalism.

Ferocious Banger
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#428

Posted 24 May 2013 - 02:08 PM

QUOTE (Cyper @ Friday, May 24 2013, 19:35)
QUOTE (Pwned. @ Thursday, May 23 2013, 15:23)
Yes, it is such a disaster, omg like seriously they took out 1 car omg and a few challenges omg.

Anyways, why EA's direction? Dude this is the new STANDARD in gaming. Deal with it, you may not like it all but you cant change it.

It's not the new standard in gaming, it's the gamer's new standard.

The only reason why Rockstar is doing this is because gamer's accept it. If they few people would accept it, they would not do it.


And the fact that Rockstar develop games with high quality isn't an excuse. Two wrongs don't make a right.

Exactly. This is happening not because of EA; not because of Capcom. But because of people's mindsets.

tenpennyisplainevil
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#429

Posted 24 May 2013 - 02:14 PM

QUOTE (Ferocious Banger @ Friday, May 24 2013, 15:08)
QUOTE (Cyper @ Friday, May 24 2013, 19:35)
QUOTE (Pwned. @ Thursday, May 23 2013, 15:23)
Yes, it is such a disaster, omg like seriously they took out 1 car omg and a few challenges omg.

Anyways, why EA's direction? Dude this is the new STANDARD in gaming. Deal with it, you may not like it all but you cant change it.

It's not the new standard in gaming, it's the gamer's new standard.

The only reason why Rockstar is doing this is because gamer's accept it. If they few people would accept it, they would not do it.


And the fact that Rockstar develop games with high quality isn't an excuse. Two wrongs don't make a right.

Exactly. This is happening not because of EA; not because of Capcom. But because of people's mindsets.

And we can't change it, so we might as well cease this useless discussion.

HaythamKenway
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#430

Posted 24 May 2013 - 02:23 PM

QUOTE (tenpennyisplainevil @ Friday, May 24 2013, 14:14)
And we can't change it, so we might as well cease this useless discussion.

Sure we can't change it, but if we don't even talk about it, it would be like voicing our approval with these practices. If we don't like something, we should speak up. Even if R* won't listen to us and people will buy LEs and CEs like crazy, at very least, we'll say what needs to be said.

GTAaLEX117
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#431

Posted 24 May 2013 - 02:26 PM

I was certain they would do this, especially after RDR and MP. I still wonder why some people considered this as such a big surprise.

wwinterj
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#432

Posted 24 May 2013 - 02:34 PM

QUOTE (Liudeius @ Friday, May 24 2013, 15:03)

No, that is baseless speculation.

Hardly baseless speculation when MP3, RDR, and LA Noire did the same. This in-game content will no doubt be on PSN/Marketplace at some point. Free or paid. I'm that confident in this that I'm just buying the normal edition and then buying this DLC later unless it's free or unlocked in the game. Point is if you think this content is just going to be for those who buy these editions and that's it then you're in for a reality check.

Ferocious Banger
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#433

Posted 24 May 2013 - 02:42 PM

QUOTE (tenpennyisplainevil @ Friday, May 24 2013, 19:44)
QUOTE (Ferocious Banger @ Friday, May 24 2013, 15:08)
QUOTE (Cyper @ Friday, May 24 2013, 19:35)
QUOTE (Pwned. @ Thursday, May 23 2013, 15:23)
Yes, it is such a disaster, omg like seriously they took out 1 car omg and a few challenges omg.

Anyways, why EA's direction? Dude this is the new STANDARD in gaming. Deal with it, you may not like it all but you cant change it.

It's not the new standard in gaming, it's the gamer's new standard.

The only reason why Rockstar is doing this is because gamer's accept it. If they few people would accept it, they would not do it.


And the fact that Rockstar develop games with high quality isn't an excuse. Two wrongs don't make a right.

Exactly. This is happening not because of EA; not because of Capcom. But because of people's mindsets.

And we can't change it, so we might as well cease this useless discussion.

QUOTE (tenpennyisplainevil @ Friday, May 24 2013, 14:14)
And we can't change it, so we might as well cease this useless discussion.

Sure we can't change it, but if we don't even talk about it, it would be like voicing our approval with these practices. If we don't like something, we should speak up. Even if R* won't listen to us and people will buy LEs and CEs like crazy, at very least, we'll say what needs to be said.

What he^ said.

TheFlyingAngel
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#434

Posted 24 May 2013 - 02:45 PM

im just bummed about the blimp and the stunt challenges, these should be on the main game. extra weapons and clothng etc are normal for dlcs

bakerach
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#435

Posted 24 May 2013 - 02:45 PM

QUOTE (Cyper @ Friday, May 24 2013, 14:05)
And the fact that Rockstar develop games with high quality isn't an excuse. Two wrongs don't make a right.

The saying "two wrongs doesn't make a right" doesn't really apply here-- more like "a bunch of rights make an alleged wrong seem a little more acceptable"

BlackNoise
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#436

Posted 24 May 2013 - 02:51 PM

QUOTE (Ferocious Banger @ Friday, May 24 2013, 14:08)
Exactly. This is happening not because of EA; not because of Capcom. But because of people's mindsets.

The outrage is because of people's mindsets.

R* and other developers/publishers are offering "exclusive" content as preorder bonuses and SE/CE bonuses simply because there's a market for it.

If it's really a problem, the market will work itself out.

Ferocious Banger
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#437

Posted 24 May 2013 - 02:54 PM

QUOTE (BlackNoise @ Friday, May 24 2013, 20:21)
QUOTE (Ferocious Banger @ Friday, May 24 2013, 14:08)
Exactly. This is happening not because of EA; not because of Capcom. But because of people's mindsets.

The outrage is because of people's mindsets.

R* and other developers/publishers are offering "exclusive" content as preorder bonuses and SE/CE bonuses simply because there's a market for it.

If it's really a problem, the market will work itself out.

So, you are happy with getting an "incomplete: version of a game, unlike how in the last generation, we paid once, and and enjoyed all the fruits?

baguvix_wanrltw
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#438

Posted 24 May 2013 - 03:00 PM

QUOTE (BlackNoise @ Friday, May 24 2013, 14:51)
If it's really a problem, the market will work itself out.

Please tell me you are a politician. And that you take big pockets full of money to spread ridiculous lies like that. Because if not... dewde. EVERY SINGLE TIME EVER IN THE HISTORY OF HUMANITY that people actually believed this crap it turned out they were wrong.

Example: see my f*cking signature. Taking clean water away from the people who it belongs to, only to sell it at a huge profit to those who can afford it while the others are left to drink basically sh*t, if anything at all. THAT'S what "the market" gets you.

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#439

Posted 24 May 2013 - 03:05 PM

The base, standard edition game will still be a 5/5, god-tier game. It will be marvelous. This is undisputed.

However, people concerned about the content being excluded from the standard game have a valid point. As many have pointed out, there is no fuss to be made about external promotions or physical products being offered as bonus items. It's the actual in-game code being sold from day one that has raised legitimate concerns. People are quick to claim that "it's not a big deal", and no, it's largely not. But the exclusion from in-game content from day one, no matter how subtle, is inherently evil. And to be honest, I'm not certain it's necessary for a title like GTA V.

In November 2004, Halo 2 was released. Consumers were offered a standard and a collector's edition. The collector's edition was, of course, more expensive and offered things not found in the standard. The collector's edition sold like hotcakes, and guess what? It didn't contain exclusive in-game content. It contained an altered instruction manual, an additional booklet, a metal case, and a bonus DVD that offered a behind-the-scenes look at the making of the game. That's it. Consumers weren't excluded from code if they went with the standard edition. The collector's edition sold as well as it did because of the established Halo brand. Consumers were exited for it. It was a collectible piece.

Grand Theft Auto, a certainly established brand, did not need to offer in-game exclusives to sell special editions.

Input
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#440

Posted 24 May 2013 - 03:05 PM

I'm not a big fan of the whole exclusive this and that. You know, most of us are from the "expansion pack" era where we really got our moneys worth. But it's not the worse thing that they could do, I mean they could of sold GTA V as just Micheal and made Trevor and Franklin DLC's. A couple cars, guns, and clothes are just small bonuses, were still getting a full game and that's all that should really matter.

BlackNoise
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#441

Posted 24 May 2013 - 03:10 PM

QUOTE (Ferocious Banger @ Friday, May 24 2013, 14:54)
QUOTE (BlackNoise @ Friday, May 24 2013, 20:21)
QUOTE (Ferocious Banger @ Friday, May 24 2013, 14:08)
Exactly. This is happening not because of EA; not because of Capcom. But because of people's mindsets.

The outrage is because of people's mindsets.

R* and other developers/publishers are offering "exclusive" content as preorder bonuses and SE/CE bonuses simply because there's a market for it.

If it's really a problem, the market will work itself out.

So, you are happy with getting an "incomplete: version of a game, unlike how in the last generation, we paid once, and and enjoyed all the fruits?

That's what I mean when I say the outrage is because of people's mindsets. My thinking is it's extra content. I've played incomplete games before and I only use that term for unfinished/broken games. You know what an incomplete game is just by playing it. It has nothing to do with something else a developer is offering. You guys let that stuff get into your head and then you feel like R* is taking advantage of you.

It's just how you look at it. If you didn't know about the bonuses, you wouldn't call it an incomplete game. Now that you know they exist, they could actually be additional content R* created specifically as bonus DLC, but that wouldn't matter. You would still think your game is incomplete.

To answer your question, no I'm not really happy, but I understand and accept this is the industry for the current and future generations. Last generation we paid once, but GTA SA didn't have any extra(DLC) missions or content. It was a fun game, but who knows what R* would've come up with if the concept of DLC existed back then?

That reminds me, I need to download Far Cry 3: Blood Dragon.

.dre.
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#442

Posted 24 May 2013 - 03:18 PM

It's not added content to me. It's cut content, because the game isn't even out yet. How are they adding to a game that isn't out yet? That's why people see it as cut content.
I'm not going to bitch about it though because I can get 20 extra bucks easily, but I can understand why some people are frustrated. Still doesn't excuse an all out bitch fest thread.

Mr.Mordecai
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#443

Posted 24 May 2013 - 03:18 PM

QUOTE (Ferocious Banger @ Friday, May 24 2013, 06:54)
QUOTE (BlackNoise @ Friday, May 24 2013, 20:21)
QUOTE (Ferocious Banger @ Friday, May 24 2013, 14:08)
Exactly. This is happening not because of EA; not because of Capcom. But because of people's mindsets.

The outrage is because of people's mindsets.

R* and other developers/publishers are offering "exclusive" content as preorder bonuses and SE/CE bonuses simply because there's a market for it.

If it's really a problem, the market will work itself out.

So, you are happy with getting an "incomplete: version of a game, unlike how in the last generation, we paid once, and and enjoyed all the fruits?

You can actually stop it. Boycott it if it bothers you soo much, oh wait, even though you disapprove of it you bitch and moan about it, you will still buy it. This is why you're not gonna get anywhere and change anything, because you're a weak-minded fool.

BlackNoise
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#444

Posted 24 May 2013 - 03:21 PM

QUOTE (baguvix_wanrltw @ Friday, May 24 2013, 15:00)
QUOTE (BlackNoise @ Friday, May 24 2013, 14:51)
If it's really a problem, the market will work itself out.

Please tell me you are a politician. And that you take big pockets full of money to spread ridiculous lies like that. Because if not... dewde. EVERY SINGLE TIME EVER IN THE HISTORY OF HUMANITY that people actually believed this crap it turned out they were wrong.

Example: see my f*cking signature. Taking clean water away from the people who it belongs to, only to sell it at a huge profit to those who can afford it while the others are left to drink basically sh*t, if anything at all. THAT'S what "the market" gets you.

I can afford clean water, so that water belongs to people like myself. The good news is there are people who notice how f*cked up that is for those who can't afford clean water. People like myself have created a demand for clean water for poor people. Now industries are being created to supply that clean water.

Again, if it's really a problem, the market will work itself out. It takes time, but people will figure it out eventually.



HaythamKenway
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#445

Posted 24 May 2013 - 03:21 PM

QUOTE (BlackNoise @ Friday, May 24 2013, 15:10)
That's what I mean when I say the outrage is because of people's mindsets. My thinking is it's extra content. I've played incomplete games before and I only use that term for unfinished/broken games. You know what an incomplete game is just by playing it. It has nothing to do with something else a developer is offering. You guys let that stuff get into your head and then you feel like R* is taking advantage of you.

It's just how you look at it. If you didn't know about the bonuses, you wouldn't call it an incomplete game. Now that you know they exist, they could actually be additional content R* created specifically as bonus DLC, but that wouldn't matter. You would still think your game is incomplete.

To answer your question, no I'm not really happy, but I understand and accept this is the industry for the current and future generations. Last generation we paid once, but GTA SA didn't have any extra(DLC) missions or content. It was a fun game, but who knows what R* would've come up with if the concept of DLC existed back then?

That reminds me, I need to download Far Cry 3: Blood Dragon.

In past generation, if R* created this content, they would have added it to the main game, because there was no such thing as a pre-order DLC, so there would be no reason to keep it away from a large portion of consumers.

Pre-order and collector's edition DLCs are never a good thing. Hell, even post-release DLC isn't often a good thing, because nowadays, developers often hold off content from the main game to release it as a DLC later. Sure, you can do DLCs right, but what if R* starts releasing weapon/clothing/vehicle DLC packs like Volition with SR: TT? I wouldn't call that a good use of DLC at all.

tenpennyisplainevil
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#446

Posted 24 May 2013 - 03:23 PM

QUOTE (Ferocious Banger @ Friday, May 24 2013, 15:42)
QUOTE (tenpennyisplainevil @ Friday, May 24 2013, 19:44)
QUOTE (Ferocious Banger @ Friday, May 24 2013, 15:08)
QUOTE (Cyper @ Friday, May 24 2013, 19:35)
QUOTE (Pwned. @ Thursday, May 23 2013, 15:23)
Yes, it is such a disaster, omg like seriously they took out 1 car omg and a few challenges omg.

Anyways, why EA's direction? Dude this is the new STANDARD in gaming. Deal with it, you may not like it all but you cant change it.

It's not the new standard in gaming, it's the gamer's new standard.

The only reason why Rockstar is doing this is because gamer's accept it. If they few people would accept it, they would not do it.


And the fact that Rockstar develop games with high quality isn't an excuse. Two wrongs don't make a right.

Exactly. This is happening not because of EA; not because of Capcom. But because of people's mindsets.

And we can't change it, so we might as well cease this useless discussion.

QUOTE (tenpennyisplainevil @ Friday, May 24 2013, 14:14)
And we can't change it, so we might as well cease this useless discussion.

Sure we can't change it, but if we don't even talk about it, it would be like voicing our approval with these practices. If we don't like something, we should speak up. Even if R* won't listen to us and people will buy LEs and CEs like crazy, at very least, we'll say what needs to be said.

What he^ said.

I agree with you on this. This generation is way too easily influenced. It's like they don't even want to stand up against overpricing, DLCs and whatever crooked aspect of this new form of gaming. And once you show weakness at the beginning it's ridiculously hard to change their view on you. What the new generation did was showing their weakness by accepting higher prices, 'additional' content, etc. To show that we don't put up with this anymore we'd have to hurt their sales somehow, but that isn't gonna happen. It can really be seen how companies gradually shifted towards pleasing the new customers rather than the older ones, eventually leading to a CoD-like scenario. Older people with some brains refuse to buy it (most of them at least), but the young generation will be an everlasting money-source that seems to have no scepticism, whatever the companies pull. Naturally, companies respond by catering to them, enabling 'easy mode' on all games (look at post-AC2 Assassin's Creed, the last few Splinter Cells, Saint's Row choosing for the beyond ridiculousness road, the new Hitman, the change of mindset of the now most hated gaming company EA, need I go on?). Sad part is, a series like CoD will always be more profitable than a hard-working company as R* will be. That being said, in my opinion R* even deserves to get an extra amount of money, even thought it isn't right. R* has built a huge loyal fanbase by reflecting their hard work into their games and will now use that fanbase by having a special and collector's edition like this. There certainly will be a lot of buyers, including me. I guess even our beloved R* is a tad bit corrupted by the new form of gaming industry.
Sorry for this rant, needed to get it out of my system.

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#447

Posted 24 May 2013 - 03:44 PM

QUOTE (SFPD officer @ Friday, May 24 2013, 15:21)
In past generation, if R* created this content, they would have added it to the main game, because there was no such thing as a pre-order DLC, so there would be no reason to keep it away from a large portion of consumers.

Pre-order and collector's edition DLCs are never a good thing. Hell, even post-release DLC isn't often a good thing, because nowadays, developers often hold off content from the main game to release it as a DLC later. Sure, you can do DLCs right, but what if R* starts releasing weapon/clothing/vehicle DLC packs like Volition with SR: TT? I wouldn't call that a good use of DLC at all.

I enjoyed the episodic DLC for GTA IV and Undead Nightmare for RDR. R* didn't add anything like that to any GTA before DLC existed. I can take or leave the smaller stuff(weapons, clothing etc.), because it's just so cheap it really doesn't affect me one way or the other.

It's just another revenue stream for an industry where it's hard to make profits. It doesn't hurt me, but it definitely helps the developers I support. If your a BS developer, I won't even buy your game, so I definitely won't buy your DLC. But for a developer like R*, I usually want whatever they offer.

If I didn't purchase any DLC for RDR, I would still love that game. The DLC only made the experience better. So if I don't buy, I'm happy and if I do, I'm happier. It isn't this way for every developer, but with R* they care about their core product so much, you don't really need to worry about what you're missing when it comes to DLC. Just buy it when it's available or don't. You'll still enjoy their game.

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#448

Posted 24 May 2013 - 04:04 PM

@tenpennyisevil - What you said is exactly what I have been trying to convey. Glad you saw where I am coming from.


@Blacknoise - Some fair points made there. But I disagree with the fact that GTAV would possibly struggle in the "struggling market". Rockstar simply have no reason to do this with GTAV, other than getting some extra money over the already massive amount of money they are bound to generate through GTAV.

gunziness
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#449

Posted 24 May 2013 - 04:40 PM

man, just buy the standard PC version (wait 10 months for it, yes), and then you get the new content by mods, easy peasy wink.gif

Im also against this method R* is using by the way, if there are DLCs at day one, then theres CUT content from the game, period. (dont start comparing a game with a car or a damn house like some of you did lol).

If they do this, its because people actually buy this extra content, so they have already 1 valid reason to make this extra money, which is reasonable, but still personally, I dont like this idea, so I'll just wait for the standard edition anyway.



Snake Without a Tongue
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#450

Posted 24 May 2013 - 04:47 PM

QUOTE (GúnZinEss @ Friday, May 24 2013, 16:40)
man, just buy the standard PC version (wait 10 months for it, yes), and then you get the new content by mods, easy peasy wink.gif

Content by mods? Pfft, five days after the PC release somebody will mod the blimp with missiles and boobs or something. LOL Bonus content will be old news.




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