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VCRules86
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#4651

Posted 16 September 2013 - 03:39 AM

Whoa. Walt is far from 'evil incarnate'. He's done some terrible things... but really, So has Hank. Lest we forget Hank setting Jessie up to get murdered?

I'd say what he let happen to Jane and his poisoning of a small child qualify him as pretty evil. Hank can't even approach that. He's done his share of bad things but nothing on that level.

MLGTA
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#4652

Posted 16 September 2013 - 03:39 AM

i dont have any words for that episode


Otter
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#4653

Posted 16 September 2013 - 03:40 AM

he didn't try to kill the small child and Jane, the woman who threatened him she'd destroy everything, did it to herself. Hank sent Jesse to die.

Edit - banana, spoilers are OK in here, but that signature... Give it a few days man. :p

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#4654

Posted 16 September 2013 - 03:40 AM

Hmm. Walt's head in the reflection aligned with the bullet hole. Subtle little foreshadowing there. :ph34r: :ph34r:  

 

tumblr_mt78ixFsgd1rhkkzmo1_500.jpg


TEoS
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#4655

Posted 16 September 2013 - 03:41 AM

 

I'm not saying Hank is on the same level as Walt, I'm just saying he's no angel. I think Hank's willingness to break the law is the same kind of sh*t Americans should be weary of what our government is currently doing in the name of the "greater good." Obviously Hank is the good guy of the two, but that doesn't make him a paragon. We're watching a TV show so it's easy to dismiss his actions because it's fiction, but if Hank was a real life DEA agent, I wouldn't be a fan of him.

Probably not. But this being a TV show, I'm going to let him slide and say that I feel like he, and Gomez who was the one true good guy here and a loss I hate, deserved far better than to die at the hands of the subhuman animals that are Walt and the nazis.

 

So who exactly would you have been content with their dying by? A federal judge?

 

Hank (and Gomez) were pursuing an illegal, off the books  investigation in which the primary motivation was to save face. The fact that Hank (and Gomez) were willing to sacrifice an essential witness in order to take down their target is nothing less than proof that their moral high ground was not as shallow as they and their defenders would like to admit.


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#4656

Posted 16 September 2013 - 03:43 AM

he didn't try to kill the small child and Jane, the woman who threatened him she'd destroy everything, did it to herself. Hank sent Jesse to die.

Jane threatened him because he was trying to screw Jesse out of his money. She didn't deserve what he let happen to her. And poisoning a kid is poisoning a kid. He also seemed to have no problem with what Todd did to the poor kid that stumbled upon their train robbery. I don't know if Walt's dead at the end of this series, but he certainly has it coming.

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#4657

Posted 16 September 2013 - 03:46 AM


 

I'm not saying Hank is on the same level as Walt, I'm just saying he's no angel. I think Hank's willingness to break the law is the same kind of sh*t Americans should be weary of what our government is currently doing in the name of the "greater good." Obviously Hank is the good guy of the two, but that doesn't make him a paragon. We're watching a TV show so it's easy to dismiss his actions because it's fiction, but if Hank was a real life DEA agent, I wouldn't be a fan of him.

Probably not. But this being a TV show, I'm going to let him slide and say that I feel like he, and Gomez who was the one true good guy here and a loss I hate, deserved far better than to die at the hands of the subhuman animals that are Walt and the nazis.
 
So who exactly would you have been content with their dying by? A federal judge?
 
Hank (and Gomez) were pursuing an illegal, off the books  investigation in which the primary motivation was to save face. The fact that Hank (and Gomez) were willing to sacrifice an essential witness in order to take down their target is nothing less than proof that their moral high ground was not as shallow as they and their defenders would like to admit.
I have no problem people questioning Hank's motives. I just don't get how they can tear Hank down while at the same time, make excuses for Walt. And I think Gomez was more in it to help out his friend than to save face.

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#4658

Posted 16 September 2013 - 03:47 AM

Wow! I probably shed a gallon of tears throughout that episode! I couldn't even breathe!
Ozymandias is the top episode, for sure!

I have this withdrawal where I just want to be alone and think through things.

Otter
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#4659

Posted 16 September 2013 - 03:48 AM

he didn't try to kill the small child and Jane, the woman who threatened him she'd destroy everything, did it to herself. Hank sent Jesse to die.

Jane threatened him because he was trying to screw Jesse out of his money. She didn't deserve what he let happen to her. And poisoning a kid is poisoning a kid. He also seemed to have no problem with what Todd did to the poor kid that stumbled upon their train robbery. I don't know if Walt's dead at the end of this series, but he certainly has it coming.

She didn't deserve to OD on the drugs she took? Team Hank is twisted.

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#4660

Posted 16 September 2013 - 03:52 AM

he didn't try to kill the small child and Jane, the woman who threatened him she'd destroy everything, did it to herself. Hank sent Jesse to die.

Jane threatened him because he was trying to screw Jesse out of his money. She didn't deserve what he let happen to her. And poisoning a kid is poisoning a kid. He also seemed to have no problem with what Todd did to the poor kid that stumbled upon their train robbery. I don't know if Walt's dead at the end of this series, but he certainly has it coming.
She didn't deserve to OD on the drugs she took? Team Hank is twisted.
She didn't deserve to have Walt just sit there and watch her die. Failing to do something in that scenario is just as bad as doing it yourself. Hank wasn't an angel, I can see that point, but I don't understand how Walt can be seen as little more than a complete bastard at this point. Just because he cares about his family doesn't make the things he did any more justifiable. I'm not trying to convert anyone to team Hank, I'm not even sure how we slipped into this argument. I'm just voicing my view that Walt really deserves to die at this point and I'll be disappointed if he doesn't get his come-uppance

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#4661

Posted 16 September 2013 - 03:53 AM

 

 

 

I'm not saying Hank is on the same level as Walt, I'm just saying he's no angel. I think Hank's willingness to break the law is the same kind of sh*t Americans should be weary of what our government is currently doing in the name of the "greater good." Obviously Hank is the good guy of the two, but that doesn't make him a paragon. We're watching a TV show so it's easy to dismiss his actions because it's fiction, but if Hank was a real life DEA agent, I wouldn't be a fan of him.

Probably not. But this being a TV show, I'm going to let him slide and say that I feel like he, and Gomez who was the one true good guy here and a loss I hate, deserved far better than to die at the hands of the subhuman animals that are Walt and the nazis.
 
So who exactly would you have been content with their dying by? A federal judge?
 
Hank (and Gomez) were pursuing an illegal, off the books  investigation in which the primary motivation was to save face. The fact that Hank (and Gomez) were willing to sacrifice an essential witness in order to take down their target is nothing less than proof that their moral high ground was not as shallow as they and their defenders would like to admit.
I have no problem people questioning Hank's motives. I just don't get how they can tear Hank down while at the same time, make excuses for Walt. And I think Gomez was more in it to help out his friend than to save face.

 

I don't think anyone has defended Walt's motives besides my quip about him trying to provide for his family, which was largely in jest. What it comes down to is people calling Hank the good guy, when he's far more suited to an anti-hero role. And the fact of the matter is, regardless if you like Walt, he is the protagonist of this show. If you have a problem with that, then I'd have to question anyone who watches Scarface, The Godfather, Casino, Goodfellas, The Sopranos etc and not question it's protagonist's moral responsibilities. Walt may be the IRL bad guy, but he is our primary perspective for the show, and if you don't feel any loyalty to him, I'm not sure why you're watching in the first place. The show is called Breaking Bad, not urp derp Finding Justice.


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#4662

Posted 16 September 2013 - 03:56 AM

This show...

 

It has been a very important part of my life. I am sure alot of you know that. Everything about it is great to me. It's the first show I have been very, very emotionally invested in. The character development, music, story... everything... is just perfect. I have always enjoyed a story about a rise to the top, and a downfall (like Scarface). Greek tragedy. Tonight's episode put me through so many emotions... I honestly can't even fathom the right set of words to type to explain how I feel. I just can't believe what I witnessed tonight...

 

Please excuse me if anything I just typed is incomprehensible. I am quite emotional at the moment, and the 17 or so bong hits is really taking it's toll.

 

I can't think of anything else to add. Ozymandias is indeed my favorite episode of the entire series. Everything Walt has done... he has officially payed for it. I can only hope that the reason Walt returns to New Mexico in the flashforward is to rescue Jesse. I really want to see him go out as a hero. The M60 could be used to take down the Nazis... but why does he need the ricin? Time will tell.

 

I love you all. 

 

 

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VCRules86
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#4663

Posted 16 September 2013 - 03:56 AM


 

 

 

I'm not saying Hank is on the same level as Walt, I'm just saying he's no angel. I think Hank's willingness to break the law is the same kind of sh*t Americans should be weary of what our government is currently doing in the name of the "greater good." Obviously Hank is the good guy of the two, but that doesn't make him a paragon. We're watching a TV show so it's easy to dismiss his actions because it's fiction, but if Hank was a real life DEA agent, I wouldn't be a fan of him.

Probably not. But this being a TV show, I'm going to let him slide and say that I feel like he, and Gomez who was the one true good guy here and a loss I hate, deserved far better than to die at the hands of the subhuman animals that are Walt and the nazis.
 
So who exactly would you have been content with their dying by? A federal judge?
 
Hank (and Gomez) were pursuing an illegal, off the books  investigation in which the primary motivation was to save face. The fact that Hank (and Gomez) were willing to sacrifice an essential witness in order to take down their target is nothing less than proof that their moral high ground was not as shallow as they and their defenders would like to admit.
I have no problem people questioning Hank's motives. I just don't get how they can tear Hank down while at the same time, make excuses for Walt. And I think Gomez was more in it to help out his friend than to save face.
 
I don't think anyone has defended Walt's motives besides my quip about him trying to provide for his family, which was largely in jest. What it comes down to is people calling Hank the good guy, when he's far more suited to an anti-hero role. And the fact of the matter is, regardless if you like Walt, he is the protagonist of this show. If you have a problem with that, then I'd have to question anyone who watches Scarface, The Godfather, Casino, Goodfellas, The Sopranos etc and not question it's protagonist's moral responsibilities. Walt may be the IRL bad guy, but he is our primary perspective for the show, and if you don't feel any loyalty to him, I'm not sure why you're watching in the first place. The show is called Breaking Bad, not urp derp Finding Justice.
I'm watching because I enjoy the show. The creators never told me I had to like the main character. This is a unique experience for me in the manner that I've never felt such contempt for the main character before. I don't think I've said anything to warrant such a rude quip as urp Derp finding justice"

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#4664

Posted 16 September 2013 - 03:56 AM

Can you not be team Walt but also acknowledge Hank was some what of a stand up guy? I didn't know I had to choose sides.


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#4665

Posted 16 September 2013 - 03:57 AM

Failing to do something in that scenario is just as bad as doing it yourself.


Completely disagree. And this argument is a blast, don't worry about it.

I just think that Walt is still redeemable at this point.

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#4666

Posted 16 September 2013 - 04:00 AM

Failing to do something in that scenario is just as bad as doing it yourself.

Completely disagree. And this argument is a blast, don't worry about it.

I just think that Walt is still redeemable at this point.
Agree to disagree then. I was on Team Hank from the start, and Gomez and Jane were favorites of mine who I always saw as two of the only true good guys on the show. I haven't liked Walt since he let Jane die and at this point, I want him to reap what he's sewn. That's all. Perhaps I came off a bit too argumentative at the start but forgive me, I've watched that SOB be directly or indirectly responsible for the deaths of several of my favorite characters and am a tad emotional ;).

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#4667

Posted 16 September 2013 - 04:02 AM

Can you not be team Walt but also acknowledge Hank was some what of a stand up guy? I didn't know I had to choose sides.

I don't think anyone's saying you can't. I'm sorry if I gave off that impression that you had to have a side.

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#4668

Posted 16 September 2013 - 04:03 AM

 

 

 

he didn't try to kill the small child and Jane, the woman who threatened him she'd destroy everything, did it to herself. Hank sent Jesse to die.

Jane threatened him because he was trying to screw Jesse out of his money. She didn't deserve what he let happen to her. And poisoning a kid is poisoning a kid. He also seemed to have no problem with what Todd did to the poor kid that stumbled upon their train robbery. I don't know if Walt's dead at the end of this series, but he certainly has it coming.
She didn't deserve to OD on the drugs she took? Team Hank is twisted.
She didn't deserve to have Walt just sit there and watch her die. Failing to do something in that scenario is just as bad as doing it yourself. Hank wasn't an angel, I can see that point, but I don't understand how Walt can be seen as little more than a complete bastard at this point. Just because he cares about his family doesn't make the things he did any more justifiable. I'm not trying to convert anyone to team Hank, I'm not even sure how we slipped into this argument. I'm just voicing my view that Walt really deserves to die at this point and I'll be disappointed if he doesn't get his come-uppance

 

What an interesting statement. Watching someone die and not helping is the same as murdering them (and may I may add, a death that comes from their own irresponsible decisions? HAHA). Walt is a bastard, and that is why he's one of the best characters to appear on television. You quickly dismiss his desire to provide for his family, but is that not one of the most noble of motivations? Imagine how horrible it must be to be in the lower-middle class, working two jobs and barely making enough to get by on. Suddenly, you are diagnosed with terminal cancer. You, with a very valuable and particular skill, now have 12+ months to secure your familiy's financial future. You cook and sell meth. Yes, it's immoral, but we as humans are programmed with a desire to ensure our family's prosperity. We can see that Walt's immorality ends with harming members of his family, which is the only "pure" evolutionary responsible goal. Hank was willing to throw one of his family members in jail, even with his niece and nephew's future at stake. Yes, we can look and see that Walt violated the law and that Hank is fully within his professional responsibilities to put him in jail, but does that alleviate his familial responsibilities? What is more important, the family or the law? 

 

A great question Breaking Bad asks like no other show.

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#4669

Posted 16 September 2013 - 04:06 AM

http://www.youtube.c...h?v=tKjP1uNvk_A


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#4670

Posted 16 September 2013 - 04:08 AM


 

 

 

he didn't try to kill the small child and Jane, the woman who threatened him she'd destroy everything, did it to herself. Hank sent Jesse to die.

Jane threatened him because he was trying to screw Jesse out of his money. She didn't deserve what he let happen to her. And poisoning a kid is poisoning a kid. He also seemed to have no problem with what Todd did to the poor kid that stumbled upon their train robbery. I don't know if Walt's dead at the end of this series, but he certainly has it coming.
She didn't deserve to OD on the drugs she took? Team Hank is twisted.
She didn't deserve to have Walt just sit there and watch her die. Failing to do something in that scenario is just as bad as doing it yourself. Hank wasn't an angel, I can see that point, but I don't understand how Walt can be seen as little more than a complete bastard at this point. Just because he cares about his family doesn't make the things he did any more justifiable. I'm not trying to convert anyone to team Hank, I'm not even sure how we slipped into this argument. I'm just voicing my view that Walt really deserves to die at this point and I'll be disappointed if he doesn't get his come-uppance
 
What an interesting statement. Watching someone die and not helping is the same as murdering them (and may I may add, a death that comes from their own irresponsible decisions? HAHA). Walt is a bastard, and that is why he's one of the best characters to appear on television. You quickly dismiss his desire to provide for his family, but is that not one of the most noble of motivations? Imagine how horrible it must be to be in the lower-middle class, working two jobs and barely making enough to get by on. Suddenly, you are diagnosed with terminal cancer. You, with a very valuable and particular skill, now have 12+ months to secure your familiy's financial future. You cook and sell meth. Yes, it's immoral, but we as humans are programmed with a desire to ensure our family's prosperity. We can see that Walt's immorality ends with harming members of his family, which is the only "pure" evolutionary responsible goal. Hank was willing to throw one of his family members in jail, even with his niece and nephew's future at stake. Yes, we can look and see that Walt violated the law and that Hank is fully within his professional responsibilities to put him in jail, but does that alleviate his familial responsibilities? What is more important, the family or the law? 
 
A great question Breaking Bad asks like no other show.
We're obviously not going to agree on this. And that's totally fine. Walt's desire to provide for his family just isn't enough for me to look past what he's done. I had a problem with him letting Jane die, after she blackmailed him because he wasn't going to give Jesse his cut. I've grown to hate him, which is a testament to the show's greatness because I doubt there's been many stories that can hold a viewer's attention due to their wish to see the protagonist burn.
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#4671

Posted 16 September 2013 - 04:20 AM

I'm really confused, and I'm seeing this everywhere.

 

Why is Jack and his gang referred to as "Nazis?"


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#4672

Posted 16 September 2013 - 04:25 AM

I'm really confused, and I'm seeing this everywhere.
 
Why is Jack and his gang referred to as "Nazis?"

The Swastika tattoos probably have something to do with it.
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#4673

Posted 16 September 2013 - 04:27 AM

That was simply amazing.

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#4674

Posted 16 September 2013 - 05:06 AM

That was intense. 


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#4675

Posted 16 September 2013 - 05:09 AM Edited by MasterO, 16 September 2013 - 05:09 AM.

I6Zi7a5.png

bravo vince


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#4676

Posted 16 September 2013 - 05:12 AM

I don't get all this Team Walt vs. Team Hank talk.  One has to admit that basically every character on this show is a bastard to some extent or another, with the exception of Walt Jr.  Instead, it's all about how much you can empathize with each character despite right or wrong.

 

Take the argument about Walt letting Jane die, for example.  While I feel that just letting someone die like that is a horrible and immoral choice to make, it's not difficult to see why Walt would do such a thing.  He knew she was an addict and she was dragging Jesse down with her.  They had half a million dollars and couldn't even get out the door without giving in to shooting up syrupy heroin.  They were no good for each other, so Walt thought it best not to interfere and let the consequences of their actions take course.

 

Walt has been the most intriguing character in s series since Tony Soprano.


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#4677

Posted 16 September 2013 - 05:14 AM

Damn, this was an epic episode! My heart was pounding throughout. The barrel scene was perfect. Does anyone know what song that was?

 

Anyway, I can't decide who to root for. Walt gave up Jesse. At that moment I wanted to kill him.


Showstopper 26
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#4678

Posted 16 September 2013 - 05:16 AM Edited by Showstopper 26, 16 September 2013 - 05:16 AM.

What did that note on Holly say?

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#4679

Posted 16 September 2013 - 05:19 AM Edited by Doublepulse, 16 September 2013 - 05:20 AM.

Man, this episode was hard to watch :( I cannot this a stress reliever because it stressed me the f*ck out lol. I was afraid during that scene with the knife that either Skylar or Jr were gonna get stabbed.

In terms of perspective, we know Walt more than anyone in his family does, whether you want to defend him or despise him, we understand what exactly what he is doing.

In order to keep our hopes that Walter can still turn it around, they need someone just as bad or worst than him.

But man..my heart was racing and I was so struck in fear and sadness.

I really am just hanging on and I'm on the inch of hating him so much. But it is interesting to see how apparent the 2 sides are for his character.

I feel as Heisengberg and Walt are at a war with his body and control over him. It is exactly multiple personalities fighting eachother.

But f*ck.. I feel bad for Walt Jr and Jesse..he finally knows the truth and it hurts so bad

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#4680

Posted 16 September 2013 - 05:28 AM

and so Huell stays in that room forever.

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