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Liberty City Mafia Families..

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vinnygorgeous
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#31

Posted 31 May 2009 - 01:17 PM Edited by vinnygorgeous, 03 June 2009 - 06:38 PM.

The Genovese family does not originate from the Bronx, that bit confused me too. The family that came out of the Bronx is the Lucchese family
But the Bonannos also have a powerful Bronx faction, up until 2005 they were once again at the top of the NY crime hierarchy , and could have easily have been described as the second most powerful family, like the Lupisellas in the GTA universe. But by 2008 they were once again in disarray and at the bottom of the pile.

On the Godfather, I always thought the Corleones were based on the Colombo family. Joe Profaci was known as the olive king as he was the largest importer of olive oil and tomato paste in the country through the Mama Mia Olive Oil Company. I forget what the equivalent company in the film is called, Genco or something.
Also in 2 the Rosato Brothers were modelled on the Gallo Brothers who took on a boss and started a war. The eldest Gallo brother Larry was garrotted in the back of Brooklynís Sahara lounge but was saved when a NYC cop happened to be passing and popped in. This roles were switched in 2 when Frank Pentangeli is saved from the Rosato brothers in the same way.
One possible interpretation of that line "Tattaglia is a cheap pimp" could be that a pimp had seized control of the family, not that the family was composed solely of pimps and drug pushers, as far as my understanding the five families strength has always been their diverse range of activities and their ability to invent new rackets constantly rather than concentrate solely on one area.

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#32

Posted 31 May 2009 - 10:00 PM Edited by Mafioso86, 31 May 2009 - 10:11 PM.

QUOTE (vinnygorgeous @ May 31 2009, 13:17)
The family with a current powerful Bronx faction is the Bonannos, who until 2005 were once again at the top of the NY crime hierarchy , and could have easily have been described as the second most powerful family, like the Lupisellas in the GTA universe. But by 2008 they were once again in disarray and at the bottom of the pile. 

Yeah that's what I had thought... that the Bonannos were the Bronx based family and that would make the Lupisellas them. What threw me off was that I thought I had heard the Bonannos were relatively weak and the database in IV said the Lupisellas were strong. I dunno... in the end none of them may be meant to be clear parallels of any of the real life families, but rather amalgamations of different real life traits.

QUOTE (vinnygorgeous @ May 31 2009, 13:17)
One possible interpretation of that line "Tattaglia is a cheap pimp" could be that a pimp had seized control of the family, not that the family was composed solely of pimps and drug pushers, as far as my understanding the five families strength has always been their diverse range of activities and their ability to invent new rackets constantly rather than concentrate solely on one area.


See, the full quote is actually, "Tattaglia's a pimp. He never could've out fought Santino. But I didn't know until this day that it was Barzini all along." I don't think Don Corleone meant it so literally as in Don Tattaglia is actually a pimp... but more that he was just a low life moron as opposed to Corleone or Barzini who were masterminds that had the police and politicians and what not in their pockets. What I think he's actually saying is that they are more like what the McRearys or Albanians were in GTA IV. They weren't a huge and dangerous organization, they were just stupid thugs that were actually being directed by Barzini. Not to say that there is a real life family taking orders from one of the bigger families... but is there one that would fit less of the crimelord/godfather image and more of just a group of petty criminals?

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#33

Posted 01 June 2009 - 11:40 AM Edited by vinnygorgeous, 01 June 2009 - 10:51 PM.

QUOTE (Mafioso86 @ May 31 2009, 23:00)
Not to say that there is a real life family taking orders from one of the bigger families... but is there one that would fit less of the crimelord/godfather image and more of just a group of petty criminals?

I read that some families have been labelled as satellite families before, that is under the thumb of another borgata, for example the DeCavalcante family once was considered to be a glorified Gambino crew, in the Riggi/Gotti era

I am not aware of any families that would fit the image of petty criminals as opposed to traditional mafia. I have heard the FBI say the mob has been reduced to groups of disparate street gangs, but from what I have read it is an exaggeration.

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#34

Posted 02 June 2009 - 07:29 AM

QUOTE (vinnygorgeous @ Jun 1 2009, 11:40)
I am not aware of any families that would fit the image of petty criminals as opposed to traditional mafia. I have heard the FBI say the mob has been reduced to groups of disparate street gangs, but from what I have read it is an exaggeration.

Well I think what has happened is that after the Gotti era of being a media darling and running around saying, "Look at me! I'm the Godfather! Look at me!" which of course resulted in hundreds of indictments... the mob has probably gone back to the more traditional style of Omerta that served them well for over a century. While no doubt they were dealt serious blows following Gotti's idiocy and are far weaker than they once were... I don't buy for a second that they no longer hold any influence over the underworld... they just learned that being silent and keeping in the shadows works much better. I mean there's that scenario that goes something like this...

Random guy: Are you in the mafia?
Wiseguy: The mafia? The mafia's just a myth... there's no such thing as the mafia, you've been watching to many movies.

And that's what works.

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#35

Posted 02 June 2009 - 02:39 PM

Something else to reinforce the Lupisella's as the Genovese Family. On the LCPD Database, Vincent Lupisella claims to suffer from Alzhimers Disease but his lawyers have blocked any state sponsored tests to verify it. Former Genovese Family Boss Vincent Gigante did exactly the same thing for years before his death in 2005. Stringing the Government along with claims he suffered from numerous psychological illnesses such as Alzhimers, Dementia, even Scitzophernia. Mark "Loopy" Lupisella also has some of Gigante's traits, such as a notoriously low IQ(Gigante was supposed to have an IQ of 69)

Link

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#36

Posted 02 June 2009 - 05:37 PM Edited by Money Over Bullshit, 02 June 2009 - 11:25 PM.

QUOTE (Tyla @ Jun 2 2009, 14:39)
Something else to reinforce the Lupisella's as the Genovese Family. On the LCPD Database, Vincent Lupisella claims to suffer from Alzhimers Disease but his lawyers have blocked any state sponsored tests to verify it. Former Genovese Family Boss Vincent Gigante did exactly the same thing for years before his death in 2005. Stringing the Government along with claims he suffered from numerous psychological illnesses such as Alzhimers, Dementia, even Scitzophernia. Mark "Loopy" Lupisella also has some of Gigante's traits, such as a notoriously low IQ(Gigante was supposed to have an IQ of 69)

Link

Thanks man I've added a bit on to my Original Post about that and some other things which I found out subsequent to posting the topic originally.

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#37

Posted 04 July 2009 - 04:11 AM

I hate to bump this topic, but I didn't want to make a whole new topic about one little (probably insignificant) discovery:

There use to be a gang who operated in London called the "Messina Brothers." They were of Sicilian descent. Do you think it is possible that this was the inspiration for Rockstar's choice of names?

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#38

Posted 04 July 2009 - 12:05 PM

Could well be, there's nothing in the game that indicates where the names came from, its likely they have read the same literature as yourself, I don't agree with MOB that Messinas are named after the former Bonanno boss.
Incidentally I read the other day on another website (I'll do a link in a bit) that the Lupisellas are the Lucchese family, their logic was that both originated from The Bronx. They also said that the Lucchese were equal in power to the Gambinos which at one time may have been true but its certainly not anymore, after Casso they are arguably the weakest of the five families but having said that the Gambinos are no longer the biggest/ strongest family so may be the game was based on traditional strengths not contemporary ones

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#39

Posted 25 July 2009 - 09:27 AM

I doubt Gravelli was based on Gotti...If anything he was based on Carlo Gambino in his later years, not only does he bare a resemblance no one seems to pick up but personality-wise Gambino in his later years was said to be a little old man...But i believe that was his public act.

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#40

Posted 25 July 2009 - 09:49 AM

QUOTE (vinnygorgeous @ Jul 4 2009, 12:05)
Could well be, there's nothing in the game that indicates where the names came from, its likely they have read the same literature as yourself, I don't agree with MOB that Messinas are named after the former Bonanno boss.

I was just kind of throwing out all possibilities. I think the most likely thing is that the Family was named after Messina in Sicily.

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#41

Posted 25 July 2009 - 04:08 PM

I really liked the way Rockstar represented the families in GTA IV. They were a lot more realistic in their portrayal and weren't all made up of slick, full-blooded Italians who wore $1,000 suits. In the game they are made up of mostly fat, over-weight guidos who wear slacks and tracksuits and actually look like how I'd expect a real-life mafioso too look.

vinnygorgeous
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#42

Posted 25 July 2009 - 04:18 PM

Here's that link I promised ages ago with a different interpretation of the real-life counterparts, personally I think they are wrong but you can all see that from my many posts in this thread.

wapedia.

aragond
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#43

Posted 27 July 2009 - 10:53 AM Edited by aragond, 27 July 2009 - 11:05 AM.

Wow, some impressive research has been done, including by you, Vinny. Nice job! icon14.gif

One thing I would suggest -- and, yes, it's today's ORLY moment -- is don't expect a 1:1 parallel between the gangs, their origins, and the leaders, 'cuz it's fairly unlikely R* made an exact copy of the RL-NYC Commission, but will have taken pieces from here and pieces from there. So, there'll never be a 100% fit.

One example is using a early-1900s NY mobster boss's name -- Pellegrino Morano -- as inspiration for naming the boss of a New Jersey Alderney family.

Which makes a WHOLE lot more sense than MY suggestion: that they took the name of a freestylin' rapper from a GTA III radio station, Jojo Pellegrino, a theory I was rather fond of ... but I think yours is more likely. smile.gif

( It's worth noting that people here have repeatedly confused the two names, I might add: Not once, nor twice, or even thrice, but four, five, six, seven and eight times!! So, everyone else seems to believe the Pellegrino / Pegorino link, be it the rapper or the mobster. )

And this non-1:1-ness also makes this suggestion quite plausible, imho:
QUOTE (Jacky Fiend @ Jul 4 2009, 14:11)
There use to be a gang who operated in London called the "Messina Brothers." They were of Sicilian descent. Do you think it is possible that this was the inspiration for Rockstar's choice of names?

Quite plausible, especially in light of the London-origins of the games' authors/producers.

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#44

Posted 10 December 2009 - 05:54 PM

I allways thot that Families in GTA IV and real life were solely based by similarities in names & the boroughs they represent as I have noticed that similarities between real and GTA family members was purely random as 2 wot family they r from

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#45

Posted 25 March 2010 - 04:44 PM

This is wrong, The Luchese's (Anceloti's in your case) are not the smallest, they are the second smallest, colombo's are the smallest.

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#46

Posted 25 March 2010 - 05:00 PM

QUOTE (Sanjeem @ Mar 25 2010, 16:44)
This is wrong, The Luchese's (Anceloti's in your case) are not the smallest, they are the second smallest, colombo's are the smallest.

I think there are a few imperfections in this topic.. I created it a long time ago though and I don't feel like editing it.. Maybe another time... Maybe.

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#47

Posted 25 March 2010 - 05:53 PM Edited by Sanjeem, 25 March 2010 - 05:57 PM.

QUOTE (Money Over Bullsh*t @ Mar 25 2010, 17:00)
QUOTE (Sanjeem @ Mar 25 2010, 16:44)
This is wrong, The Luchese's (Anceloti's in your case) are not the smallest, they are the second smallest, colombo's are the smallest.

I think there are a few imperfections in this topic.. I created it a long time ago though and I don't feel like editing it.. Maybe another time... Maybe.

This topic is actually really good, well done. Just yeah, would you say the Pavano's could be the Genovese's? all the rest are listed in other websites as...

Gambetti's / Gambino's
Lupisella's / Luchese's
Bonano / Messina
Colombo / Anceloti (The weakest one with 100 made members and 500+ associates)
Pavano's / On other websites it doesnt say that they are the Genovese's they say there part of a Cammora familly out of Naples.

mabey the Pavano's are the Genovese's. it all seems right apart from the Pavanos.

Look Here : http://gta.wikia.com/Pavano_Family

It said The Pavanos are the second most powerfull Cosa nostra familly in Liberty city out of the 5, meaning mabey they are the Genovese's, as the genovese's are second or as powerfull as The Gambino's. wink.gif

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#48

Posted 25 March 2010 - 06:37 PM

QUOTE (Sanjeem @ Mar 25 2010, 20:53)
Pavano's / On other websites it doesnt say that they are the Genovese's they say there part of a Cammora familly out of Naples.

Actually the Camorra's only existed in New York City during the 80's and the 90's, now they only work in US at Ohio and L.A.
They might still work in Albany, the capital city of New York though, but it's away from NYC.
They do work with the Russian Mafia though, so it can be a simple mistake by R*. But I wouldn't bet that.

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#49

Posted 25 March 2010 - 07:06 PM

QUOTE (Cheat @ Mar 25 2010, 18:37)
QUOTE (Sanjeem @ Mar 25 2010, 20:53)
Pavano's / On other websites it doesnt say that they are the Genovese's they say there part of a Cammora familly out of Naples.

Actually the Camorra's only existed in New York City during the 80's and the 90's, now they only work in US at Ohio and L.A.
They might still work in Albany, the capital city of New York though, but it's away from NYC.
They do work with the Russian Mafia though, so it can be a simple mistake by R*. But I wouldn't bet that.

Exactly. Like i say most of the Commora familly are actually in Italy right now, 5000-6000 members if i can remember right, But yeah like i mentioned, The Pavano's are probably tne Genovese's if you read my link.

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#50

Posted 25 March 2010 - 11:41 PM

I will make some changes soon based on what people have said.. I'm pretty sure that The Gambettis are The Gambinos and the Lupisellas appear to be mostly based on the Genoveses due to the amount of similarities between the two families. All of the families contain elements of each of the 5 families.. This topic is just based on which families are Most Similar to each other.

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#51

Posted 26 March 2010 - 12:24 AM

QUOTE (Money Over Bullsh*t @ Mar 25 2010, 23:41)
I will make some changes soon based on what people have said.. I'm pretty sure that The Gambettis are The Gambinos and the Lupisellas appear to be mostly based on the Genoveses due to the amount of similarities between the two families. All of the families contain elements of each of the 5 families.. This topic is just based on which families are Most Similar to each other.

Actually i think aswell now that the Lupisella's are the Genovese's after all, i did some research it seems logical, that meaning mabey the Pavano's are the Luchese's. It makes more sense now that_guy2057_evilgrin.gif

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#52

Posted 26 March 2010 - 12:33 AM

QUOTE (Sanjeem @ Mar 26 2010, 00:24)
QUOTE (Money Over Bullsh*t @ Mar 25 2010, 23:41)
I will make some changes soon based on what people have said.. I'm pretty sure that The Gambettis are The Gambinos and the Lupisellas appear to be mostly based on the Genoveses due to the amount of similarities between the two families. All of the families contain elements of each of the 5 families.. This topic is just based on which families are Most Similar to each other.

Actually i think aswell now that the Lupisella's are the Genovese's after all, i did some research it seems logical, that meaning mabey the Pavano's are the Luchese's. It makes more sense now that_guy2057_evilgrin.gif

I'm happy to make changes to the OP but I need several reasons why people think it should be changed and not just 1 reason such as similarities in size or from where the families originated... and so far nodody has really given me that so there are currently more reasons to have the match ups the wayb there are now than to change them.

I will however add in what people have said such as the Ancelotti and Colombo families both being the smallest.. which I have already done. There was much debate about this topic when I first posted it and now the same issues are arising again. I'm trying to be as fair as possible... That's all I can do.

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#53

Posted 26 March 2010 - 08:51 PM

I still strongly believe that the Pavanos are the Bonannos, reason basically because of their heroin business

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#54

Posted 26 March 2010 - 09:28 PM

QUOTE (vinnygorgeous @ Mar 26 2010, 20:51)
I still strongly believe that the Pavanos are the Bonannos, reason basically because of their heroin business

Wait ok then Vinnie name The five famillies list and what you think are their counterparts are, write them here, shortly, say why and i will try and relate alien.gif

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#55

Posted 27 March 2010 - 11:59 AM

I refer you to my earlier post on page 2 answer

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#56

Posted 28 March 2010 - 02:35 AM

I've asked this question before, but can you find any Italian American crime Families in Broker or Dukes ? Don't a few families like the Messinas operate in Broker/Dukes ? I've been looking for any Italian wise guys, but can't find any... Or is Little Italy & Algonquin the only places you can find any Italian gangsters ?

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#57

Posted 28 March 2010 - 09:30 AM

I personally think Niko was inspired by richard Kuklinski. Rich was a polish hitman working for the gambinos and he killed over 500 people. He once killed a guy with a crossbow just to see if it would work O_o

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#58

Posted 29 March 2010 - 01:40 AM

QUOTE (solitudeandbored @ Mar 28 2010, 09:30)
I personally think Niko was inspired by richard Kuklinski. Rich was a polish hitman working for the gambinos and he killed over 500 people. He once killed a guy with a crossbow just to see if it would work O_o

I've heard that comparasen being made before.. That guy is stone cold. Niko is more of a hero type though.

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#59

Posted 03 April 2010 - 04:42 AM

Can anyone answer my question.. Are there any Italian Mobsters in Dukes/Broker ? A few families supposedly operate in the two boroughs but I haven't seen any Italian mobsters..

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#60

Posted 03 April 2010 - 04:40 PM

QUOTE (Cash High @ Apr 3 2010, 05:42)
Can anyone answer my question.. Are there any Italian Mobsters in Dukes/Broker ? A few families supposedly operate in the two boroughs but I haven't seen any Italian mobsters..

No there are none to be found. Strange that the city's supposed super gang, the Gambettis has absolutely no visible members in its stronghold Broker. The five families are only found in Little Italy, peculiar but true.




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