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The Dedicated Antique Topic

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papanesta
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#1

Posted 29 January 2009 - 06:11 PM

Here you go, Slamman. wink.gif

This topic is for discussing formats that will soon be found in a museum near you.

I'll start with a topic; what are your fondest memories of the old formats (Betamax, VHS, LaserDisc, etc)?

Mine is being with my mum in Safeway when I was round about 12 years old. There was a Terminator/Terminator 2 boxset on VHS, which after persistant whinging from me, my mum bought. However, I wasn't allowed to watch Terminator as mother believed it would be too scary for my young and easily influenced mind. So, I saw Judgment Day a fair few years before I saw Terminator! tounge.gif

Otter
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#2

Posted 29 January 2009 - 06:16 PM

I remember the very first time I ever digitized footage, it was from a laser disc source, and it was Jurassic Park. f*cking hell, it looked like sh*t on a computer monitor! We've certainly come a long way.

Andyzoot
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#3

Posted 29 January 2009 - 06:22 PM

I had pretty much every Disney film from the 90's on VHS...I think they've all gone now sad.gif I think the only videos I have left now is Chicken Run and South Park: Bigger, Longer and Uncut.

I got to see some Laseridiscs for the first time ever a couple months ago. I can't believe how big they are. What's their quality like compared to your average DVD and did they have any kind of special features on them? I'm pretty sure I read somewhere that they had commentaries on them.

Hart
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#4

Posted 29 January 2009 - 06:28 PM

I hate to call VHS dead, but it is. My film collection is about 60-40 in favour of tapes and the rest DVDs.

Like Pandazoot I still have all 90s Disney films on VHS, like Toy Story, The Lion King etc


Otter
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#5

Posted 29 January 2009 - 06:32 PM

Laserdisc is best compared to VHS, only the discs don't degrade with time/use and I think it has slightly better resolution/color space and higher definition sound. Compared to DVD, at least progressive scan DVDs, Laserdiscs can't hold a candle. However, there DID have things like special features, etc. Most movies you either had to flip the disc halfway through, or it came on multiple discs.

TenaciousD.
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#6

Posted 29 January 2009 - 06:33 PM

I got Ferris Bueller, Small Soldiers and Independance Day on VHS a while ago at a charity shop for £1. None of them work.

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Groovy
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#7

Posted 29 January 2009 - 07:48 PM

QUOTE (Otter @ Jan 29 2009, 10:32)
Laserdisc is best compared to VHS, only the discs don't degrade with time/use and I think it has slightly better resolution/color space and higher definition sound.

Compared to DVD, at least progressive scan DVDs, Laserdiscs can't hold a candle.

However, there DID have things like special features, etc. Most movies you either had to flip the disc halfway through, or it came on multiple discs.

The most redonk SE Laser I ever saw was the one for The Frighteners. It had that 4 hour making up that Jackson had made, and if I remember, was a 7 disc set.

Don Garcia aka NjNakedSnake
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#8

Posted 29 January 2009 - 07:49 PM

QUOTE (TenaciousD. @ Jan 29 2009, 18:33)
None of them work.

You get what you pay for.

Garbage.

Indi
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#9

Posted 29 January 2009 - 08:33 PM

It's pretty obvious, never buy anything from a charity shop bored.gif

Hart
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#10

Posted 29 January 2009 - 08:59 PM

QUOTE (Indi. @ Jan 29 2009, 20:33)
It's pretty obvious, never buy anything from a charity shop bored.gif

I bought The Exorcist, The Usual Suspects and Fist of Fury from a charity shop and they all work fine. Dont go to really sh*t charity shops then.

Seddo
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#11

Posted 29 January 2009 - 10:08 PM

QUOTE (Pandazoot @ Jan 29 2009, 18:22)
I had pretty much every Disney film from the 90's on VHS...I think they've all gone now sad.gif I think the only videos I have left now is Chicken Run and South Park: Bigger, Longer and Uncut.

Haha i've still got all mine, got about 3 boxes of the videos stacked on the landing. Although they hardley get touched unless my sisters grab one to watch every blue moon.

I've still got the South Park movie on pirate VHS wow.gif .

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#12

Posted 29 January 2009 - 11:28 PM

Like a lot of members in this topic, I've got a mass VHS collection of most Disney titles. The Fox and the Hound, Lion King and 101 Dalmatins spring to mind, I remember being insanely addicted to all three at one time. I also remember receiving a Fly Away Home video for my ninth birthday, and only watched it the once, on my ninth birthday! I've never seen it since.

When I was around 10 I bought two videos; One was called Gary Linekers Dream 11, which I purchased for 50p from the market. Best VHS purchase I've ever made, the video inspired me to get into football, which is definitely something I don't regret. It also filled me with heaps of knowledge about the true legends of the game, those at a time when I wasn't around to experience myself. The second Video I bought was the Gremlins double pack, which I was surpirsed about since it's an aged 15 rating. That was about £2, and I can remember watching it for the first time. I was extremely freaked out by the 'dinner' scene, as I thought Marla was hurting Billy when she sneakily thrusted her foot into his genital area! By the time I hit the big 1-1 I was extremely aroused by that scene. Yep, puberty sure did rock! tounge.gif

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#13

Posted 30 January 2009 - 12:08 AM

I love my VHS tapes! Black Adder, South Park, Mr Bean to name a few sets and how could i not mention my gloriously bad quality VHS of A Clockwork Orange which i watched again recently.

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#14

Posted 30 January 2009 - 12:25 AM

I watched The Big Lebowski on VHS like a month ago, I'd never seen it before. Somehow, just somehow, VHS could still convey that movie's awesomeness in low-def. I'm amazed.

Slamman
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#15

Posted 30 January 2009 - 07:52 PM

Even though this fueding over technology discussing is something I find no reason for, the main point is getting people familiar with the impact, which is greatly important. I got my computer and Internet to get a editing VHS Hifi deck that I still use (multiples in fact) as well as a needed Sony HiFi SuperBetamax.

The real crowning glory is LaserDisc, we'd have absolutely NO optical disc without David Paul Gregg's pioneering effort, though not alone, he did get the ball rolling and many stepped up to help, not the least of which, Philips, MCA, and Pioneer the Japanese Giant.

JVC brought us Video Home System, and Sony gave us the first home recorder with Betamax in a TV combo no less...1975.

Gene Simmons of KISS was one of the first celebs to own one.

I mention LD recently because I brought mine out of storage and on my analog 32 inch, looks as good as most DVDs! It stands up BECAUSE it is optical media.

Slamman
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#16

Posted 10 February 2009 - 07:34 PM Edited by Slamman, 10 February 2009 - 08:06 PM.

**bump**
Well, this may be my only thread of real interest... Passing along some knowledge to you fools! hahaha

I've been listing Betamax machines on Craig's List and as a result, I got several inquiries and had to pull my old decks out of the storage mothballs and give them another run. One of the tips I'll pass along for all old reel based tapes is to loosen the cassette casing screws and this will allow some breathing room for the tape ends, which normally do touch the sides (often with some sort of non-abrasive coating or shield) I've encounted with VHS and Beta tapes, the heavier they are compared to thin cassettes, the more likely tapes get eaten. Mind you, a longer tape means it's thinner then normal too, but I mean width here.
Audio cassettes are rather tight fitting, but oddly, 8mm shells and tapes have done well over the years, they are highly intricate in nature, as are DATs.


The other grave concern is belts and pulleys. Lubrication breaks down, over and over, mechanicals grow weary and that seems the case with my premium Sony SuperBeta SL-HF750.
I pulled that deck out to get photos and video and play some tapes. I had paid something along the lines of $250 for it off eBay, then days later it stopped playing tapes so I tucked it away for future repair.

WELL, that never happened, so I tried it only hours ago after sitting for ages...
The upshot is the head and tape threading ARE working along with video and audio output, but the tracking and alignment are issues where you hear a ticking that sounds like tape hitting something, one of the pulleys or guides{?}. I lessened the tension of the last pulley where the tape loops and pushed back and away from the spinning drum... the sound died away and I got a good picture again.... So alone, mechanically, it's off, but it seems adjustable at any rate.

The mechanized Linear Skate is totally unique. As JVC had done in the past with VHS, they copied Sony with this SuperBeta loading mech on their own VHS machine, it differed exclusively in that it was an adapter for S-VHS-C, that's Super VHS Compact, used in their camcorders.

Besides ejecting out and up, the tray couls accept small or large cassettes as I recall, without the adapter normally used.

As far as I can tell, I've not seen a Betamax around my local stores [used gear, mind you!] in over 10 years, it would be great if people could keep these machines going, they are rare and built sturdy as all hell.
The last Beta I did buy was from the Goodwill, which I neglected to include in that 10 year gap above, I had to get a good machine off eBay because when I did buy my first Betamax, it was a Sanyo VCR7200 from a local vid production studio.
That last deck was the same model as it turns out, so I am offering both those decks to CL shoppers. When I checked there, my listing was the only one there.

Ottae
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#17

Posted 10 February 2009 - 08:18 PM

I'd heard about Clerks and the View Askew Universe, and I had a look at my sister's old VHS collection and it turned out she's a Kevin Smith fan. She has Clerks, Mallrats, Chasing Amy and Dogma biggrin.gif

Slamman
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#18

Posted 10 February 2009 - 08:41 PM

Of course, Warner was wholeheartedly jumping into the DVD rollout, as was Panasonic with their players. In the life of LaserDisc, the years up to and including 1997 and 1998, video companies, or studios releasing new films to LD format were still a bit hit and miss, as they often had to include a DTS release seperately. The added content and film-maker involvement in the home video side changes from studio and director alike, and in funny cases, Star Wars and other films kept getting revamped in their LD presentation. You see that happening still with DVD, but it's typically when a new sequel comes out, or an anniversary for the original pops up.

As a fan of the medium as well as film, This is where I am coming from, I wanted a true home theater on a budget, and was in awe of anyone who had that experience.
I went to movies and found in theatrical situations, sometimes the sound or the people themselves detracted from the viewing, or the image was not handled well on the big-screen. With HT, you have that control in your hands. The directors and artisans could explain and show things you can't in a theater. It's just a great way to enjoy art.

Another film where the makers were LaserDisc owners and fans is the one re-launching William Shatner's career... in effect... FREE ENTERPRISE.
Watch that LD, or perhaps the DVD for LaserDisc references.

Hart
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#19

Posted 13 February 2009 - 05:38 PM

You know, after watching some old TMNT cartoons on VHS which I found in the drawer, I cant imagine watching it in hi-def. Same with older films, the graininess and not so sharp quality of the picture suits it, makes me feel cosy. I know it sounds stupid, it just does.

Slamman
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#20

Posted 13 February 2009 - 05:54 PM Edited by Slamman, 15 February 2009 - 12:18 AM.

I'll just do a bunch of editing in here or bump it if it falls too far down, but to add something more... I was looking around on eBay as I usually do, random searches for things... a SuperBeta HF750 is on offer for less then $100, but it doesn't power on. I'm truly tempted. In working shape it'd be a $400 machine.
I own one already and it had some issue but actually works again, to a degree. My HF870D Sony has been my workhorse. I dug up two Sanyo VCR7200 machines, they were $600 back in the mid 1980s.
I got one as my first machine then the second from the Goodwill. Typically, they encountered problems just from use, unexpectedly. I dug 'em out to play my archive. I bought more then 50 Beta tapes from eBay! hahaha I have probably 400 VHS cassettes!


I'm actually selling the Sanyos because I have too many of everything...except 8mm camcorders, I use that format extensively...more then any other tape. Also, with regard to music, MiniDisc is unavailable in the stores so eBay is my saviour there!! Or Craig's List.

When I get a main set for widescreen anamorphic, which is 16:9 uncompressed (normal 4:3 presents anamorphic as compressed vertically), then I'll re-evaluate my video quality, but as an aside to the digital arguing, I looked at two DLP projectors in the pawn shop, both were $360 USD and portable design, so there you go, affordable HD viewing ANYWHERE!!

I'll swap edit lines in bold and normal type; I am right now going thru my Beta decks, but Sanyos ARE working, it was tight tape spools that are the culprit. I'll show on YouTube the method I use to make tapes work again. Namely I loosen all cassette shell screws, so you can pull the top and bottom casing apart and let the spools breath a bit. The Next course of action is open the door with a defeat to the safety catch (bottom slot) and pull the door open...then pull the top half up and off the bottom, Loosen the springs on the plastic reel catch mechanisms, remove the catches as well as the springs. All these do is serve as tension locks in the grooves of the bottom spool retainer (tape resides between the top and bottom plastic)
Without the catches on one or both sides, the spool is free to turn manually, and you can adjust them with the cassette closed. You can safely do this because Audio Cassettes don't have catches on the spools and they work fine. I operate many of my decks without the lid on covering the tape's capston and supports. You'll need to monitor the slack of each tape for a while to maintain steady use. If it's tight, a cue and review (FF/Rew with video) could cause tape issues, Better to retract from the drum then FF and REV...using any counter means

Slamman
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#21

Posted 11 March 2009 - 05:42 AM

Continued clean up, I found my huge eBay Beta tape collection at the bottom of a storage locker! I bought about 50 to 60 tapes off eBay and had a collection from the family when I moved out.
Also at the very bottom were my two editing decks, in fact, TWO VHS and one BETA.

I hauled them out and opted to take some new digital pictures to put up online. I am a bit of an old tech nut, so I am bumping this back up for a notice that you might want to see what the best decks made looked like. Most pics that are up are pretty bad, or lack interior views. I have no qualms taking the top off things.

The models of VHS that I still own are the BR-7000U Mass Duplication JVC Hi-Fi Stereo "tank"
Their home equivelant of the Sony HF-1000 high end home deck, they produced their own with similar features, but hardly a similar look... The HR-S10000U!
Their longest model number I believe.
The 10000 JVC is a late model SuperVHS deck with all the perks, even several page TEXTING on screen while recording. Has linear stereo as well as HiFi.
I removed the faux wood panels for storage and access to the main unit. Unlike later SVHS ones, the head and drive are not very rubust and I ran into problems.

Compare with the Sony editing deck I picked up off eBay, in place of the 1000 model SuperBeta, I got their GCS-50. This one is heavy duty, in white, instead of black with an hour meter on the head drum, like the BR 7000 VHS one. You can track how much recording and dubbing has been made since a repair.

Slamman
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#22

Posted 05 May 2009 - 05:51 PM

More clearing of gear over here....

[bump]

I had to discard my first VCR I ever bought, a brand new 1986 Sharp. It was sentimental and I had hoped to repair it but it stopped loading tapes and jammed. Originally I figured the head amp gave out (behind the drum mech)
Over much heavy use, the stereo headphone jack broke and I tried to gain the parts to fix it. Never saw the same model EVER, anywhere else. I paid $300 back then, as I recall. It was the SHARP VC-H64U

Model I bought required a Recoton MTS stereo adapter tuner, via MPX jack I believe it was.

The advent of MTS in the States was a slow adoption and as such, VCRs routinely came with an AUX mode for Simulcasts. This allowed stereo audio from an FM broadcast with the TV tuner picture.

I used this many times and the effect was BETTER then MTS sound. Much more dynamic I have to say. Radio show recording to VHS allowed up to 10 hours EP speed recording, so many, many tapes abandoned SP speed, in my collection, just for that one advantage over Betamax VHS offered. Length.

Before I tossed out my beloved VCR, I had to document with a few pictures, these will go up on Photobucket for those referencing electronics. One of the great advantages for me is archived models presented with data online, no matter what the age. Even if you think there's no interest, there is!

Otter
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#23

Posted 05 May 2009 - 06:02 PM Edited by Otter, 05 May 2009 - 06:12 PM.

If it makes you feel any better, I've got an old toaster oven I'm willing to part with. Makes brilliant toast but the fillaments are not as wide as the earlier Black&Decker models which more often than not resulted in a full 'patina' burning effects while leaving the bread inside relatively moist, if I recall correctly.

I read in an issue of News in Toasting fall '86 that this was the second last oven to be released with the the extra "6th" level of toasting, enabling longer cooking times and crunchier cheese on bagels. Plus the cable is over 4 feet long which is more than most if you appreciate the period!

Slamman
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#24

Posted 05 May 2009 - 06:07 PM

Video toaster? If not, kind of off topic, wouldn't you say?

Otter
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#25

Posted 05 May 2009 - 06:12 PM

Well if we want to be anal about it...

QUOTE
This topic is for discussing formats that will soon be found in a museum near you.


...but obviously you realize I'm just taking the piss out of you.

DemonKing
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#26

Posted 05 May 2009 - 07:33 PM

QUOTE (Otter @ Jan 29 2009, 18:16)
I remember the very first time I ever digitized footage, it was from a laser disc source, and it was Jurassic Park.

f*cking hell, it looked like sh*t on a computer monitor! We've certainly come a long way.

Same here, Although I think It may have been The Lost World.

I still have all the old Laserdiscs around here from my childhood, It was way better than VHS.

Got the original Star Wars trilogy on LD, brilliant still to this day.

Otter
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#27

Posted 05 May 2009 - 07:42 PM

QUOTE (DemonKing @ May 5 2009, 11:33)
QUOTE (Otter @ Jan 29 2009, 18:16)
I remember the very first time I ever digitized footage, it was from a laser disc source, and it was Jurassic Park.

f*cking hell, it looked like sh*t on a computer monitor!  We've certainly come a long way.

Same here, Although I think It may have been The Lost World.

I still have all the old Laserdiscs around here from my childhood, It was way better than VHS.

Got the original Star Wars trilogy on LD, brilliant still to this day.

Have they released Starwars in HD yet? It looked fantastic when I saw it via SkyOne.

I've tried watching LD on my LCD tv - but the quality really shows it's age at that point. Best served on a big ol' CRT like Slammy's.

DemonKing
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#28

Posted 05 May 2009 - 07:47 PM

I don't think it's been released on HD or Blu-ray yet, just HD via sky.

Yeah, although I watched a LD on the Plasma once, and it showed up quite nicely.

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#29

Posted 05 May 2009 - 08:02 PM

You just know that George Lucas is digging up a load of new stuff for the Blu-Ray special features from Lucasfilm's seemingly bottomless pit of concept art, blueprints, documentaries etc...But whenever the original trilogy does get released I'll be first in line to get it. icon14.gif

Otter
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#30

Posted 05 May 2009 - 08:05 PM

It would be great to get the original trilogy released in HD without any of the enhancements. Gritty, 'realistic' effects made the movie a lot of fun, and CGI has come so far since the 90s.




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