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Is Carl Johnson dead?

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Dr._White-Z
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#121

Posted 03 October 2013 - 08:21 PM

I think CJ either died when Ballas attacked Grove Street or escaped and is hiding somewhere.(possibly with a fake id)
Sweet must've stayed and killed Ballas members to his last breath.(Sweet is awesome)

simonp92
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#122

Posted 04 October 2013 - 11:52 AM

I think CJ either died when Ballas attacked Grove Street or escaped and is hiding somewhere.(possibly with a fake id)
Sweet must've stayed and killed Ballas members to his last breath.(Sweet is awesome)

It is possible Ballas never attacked Grove street. Keep in mind that the two eras are not connected, so in the 3D era grove street was possibly never taken over, and in HD era, CJ and Sweet never existed so the events of SA never took place in the San Andreas we know from GTA V.


Dr._White-Z
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#123

Posted 04 October 2013 - 01:34 PM

I know,
but my theory is based off 3D universe characters existing in the HD universe.
I like to think that they exist in the HD universe but it is not very likely since Rockstar likes to have a fresh start when they make a new GTA universe.

lil weasel
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#124

Posted 04 October 2013 - 09:54 PM Edited by lil weasel, 04 October 2013 - 09:56 PM.

There is also the idea that CJ exterminated the other gangs (in this game).

Sweet most likely went back to hard drugs with that skinny crack whore of his.

CJ moved on with his shakedown, slumlord, recording and casino empires.


daggerbomb
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#125

Posted 05 October 2013 - 02:46 PM

There is also the idea that CJ exterminated the other gangs (in this game).

Sweet most likely went back to hard drugs with that skinny crack whore of his.

CJ moved on with his shakedown, slumlord, recording and casino empires.

source or didnt happen ratatataatta


PhilosophicalZebra
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#126

Posted 05 October 2013 - 03:41 PM Edited by PhilosophicalZebra, 05 October 2013 - 03:41 PM.

 

There is also the idea that CJ exterminated the other gangs (in this game).

Sweet most likely went back to hard drugs with that skinny crack whore of his.

CJ moved on with his shakedown, slumlord, recording and casino empires.

source or didnt happen ratatataatta

 

"There is also the idea that CJ exterminated the other gangs (in this game).

Sweet most likely went back to hard drugs with that skinny crack whore of his.

CJ moved on with his shakedown, slumlord, recording and casino empires."

 

There's your source.

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lil weasel
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#127

Posted 05 October 2013 - 04:12 PM

 

There is also the idea that CJ exterminated the other gangs (in this game).

Sweet most likely went back to hard drugs with that skinny crack whore of his.

CJ moved on with his shakedown, slumlord, recording and casino empires.

source or didnt happen ratatataatta

 

Obvious you have not played the game. It is all in the game play and the cut scenes.


TonyMontanaCDL
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#128

Posted 05 October 2013 - 06:44 PM

I think CJ should be dead at least by 1998.

 

Salvatore Leone don't forget sh*t and after CJ screwed him like that, he sent Toni to go kill him and make his bones for the Leone Family. Why you think Toni was hiding for a few years before LCS began? You have to think, CJ screwed Sal out of all that money, he's not the kind of guy to let that sh*t go either....Toni kills him, along with Sweet for revenge to Sal, and then he's just like a son to him. Just my theory.


caseclosedjk
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#129

Posted 06 October 2013 - 12:53 AM

Quick theory based on the above post:

 

Carl left sanandreas to go back to LC after the end of the game. Possibly around 1993 or so, Carl went to Liberty City to expand his empire and possibly gang influence. However, when he arrived, Toni Cipriani was ordered by Salvatore to kill Carl. Toni had to lie low in Vice City for 5 years because carls friends were still in town looking for him. Between that 5 years, the rest of the grove influence in LC were killed off by the leoni family and their allies, and finally, in 1998, Toni returned and LCS began.

 

That is my theory.

 

Now here is a theory that is unlikely, but if the 2 eras are somehow still connected, it could go:

 

Carl left sanandreas to go back to LC after the end of the game. Possibly around 1993 or so, Carl went to Liberty City to expand his empire and possibly gang influence. However, when he arrived, Toni Cipriani was ordered by Salvatore to kill Carl. Toni had to lie low in Vice City for 5 years because carls friends were still in town looking for him. Between that 5 years, the rest of the grove influence in LC were killed off by the leoni family and their allies, and finally, in 1998, Toni returned and LCS began. Within the 20 years after carls death, Sweat was killed by rival gangs, Kendl and ceaser flee to another city, and grove becomes independent without leaders. Sometime in this time, grove street is taken by ballas and many of the old structures were torn down and new homes were built. Carls ex girlfriend denise robinson changed her name back to Clinton, her maiden name (There was talk she was married once, and had 3 kids), and she stayed loyal to the grove street families. Due to losing carl, she became more bitter than she was. She eventually was forced to raise her sisters son after her death. She still lives near grove street to this day due to dedication to her lost love.


Blastoise1994
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#130

Posted 14 October 2013 - 04:07 PM

I haven't read this topic all the way through, but I'd like to give my own little ideas as to what or where the III era protagonists ended up. :p

 

Claude - With no one left to work for and no one left to run from, Claude moves back to San Fierro and eventually becomes an actor in Vinewood. Dies in 2005 doing a stunt jump for a street racing movie.

 

Toni - Still ran the family restaurant, along with the remnants of the Lenone mafia, with his mom up until the day she died. Completely wrecked from the experience of losing his mother, Toni leaves the country and becomes a new man.

 

Tommy - Some time between 1986 and 1992 Tommy cleaned up, cut his losses and "retired", got married, had kids... All somewhere far, far away from Vice City. He started going to schools and giving speeches about how a life of crime only leads to bad things, but was assassinated in 1997.

 

Vic - Died in 1986. His brother, Pete "8-Ball" Vance, still visits his grave from time to time, and murdered both Tommy and Rosenberg, in 1997 and 1999 respectively, blaming them for his brothers' deaths, explaining why he's in jail as of 2001.

 

CJ - Ran the Grove Street Families gang alongside his brother Sweet up until about 2007 when a few rogue gangsters revolted and killed them both, ultimately taking the GSF back to exactly what they were in 1992, a smalltime street gang. All of CJ and Sweet's money and properties were given to Kendl and Cesar, as it was written in his will, and sold off, as Kendl and Cesar, now parents, wanted to keep their kids away from gang life.

 

I didn't do one for Mike, but having never played GTA Advance I figured I wouldn't do him justice. Anyhoo. :p


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#131

Posted 18 October 2013 - 04:25 PM

I think the graffitis just mean that the characters won't return in later games but still, Rockstar can do whatever they want and I don't think the GTA  universe or timeline is meant to make sense anymore as a 1 whole canonical thing or even as different eras/realities.


mnmn1234
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#132

Posted 20 October 2013 - 03:48 PM

i hope not..


MrPeteyMax
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#133

Posted 20 October 2013 - 08:34 PM

Rockstar say:

 

"NOPE SAN ANDREAS ISN'T IN THE SAME UUUUNIVERSE AS GTA IV SO YOU'RE NOT GONNA SEE CJ AGAIN HAHAHAHHA"

 

Then they say

 

"WELL IN GTA IV IT SAYS CJ IS DEAD"

 

So they can't just contradict themselves. CJ's fate is really unknown. He could have died. He might not have. Until Rockstar flat out says "Carl Johnson is/is not dead" I suppose we can't know. Let's just assume he's alive.


FlyeThemoon
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#134

Posted 20 October 2013 - 09:14 PM

:D yup he dead, he hang out on blilboard just outside the Algonquin Safehouse


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#135

Posted 24 October 2013 - 01:13 PM Edited by Deji, 24 October 2013 - 01:14 PM.

Salvatore killing CJ? Maybe. But since CJ's acts are what drove Salvatore to paranoia, I think Sal was just happy to get out of San Andreas as quick as possible, after tying up other loose ends. I find it hard to believe CJ would of relocated after having becoming such a major power in San Andreas, nor would he have died as the result of any petty street war. The idea of the mafia killing off grove street is flawed too.. the mafia don't usually get involved in petty street wars.

If CJ were to be killed by anyone, I'd imagine it'd be some sort of heir to Tenpenny (another corrupt cop would have more chance of getting to CJ and they're more likely to be able to back CJ into a tight corner - not killing him, but starting something with him which results in his death after some time), but GTA storylines aren't really made to give you an idea of a protags roots or how the rest of his life went... the most important part is that the story is stupid and stretched enough to send you on over 80 missions :p

 

Wait for Rockstar to say whether CJ is dead or not? 'Rockstar' have no friggin clue! They are just a company, a major employer. Dan Houser has the most influence over the scripts, but he damn sure doesn't write the important stuff. Look at the list of writers for each game (dunno why there's a white background to most of it.. GTAForums just decided it was cool):..

 

GTA III

Dan Houser

Paul Kurowski
James Worrall

 

GTA VC

Dan Houser

James Worrall

 

GTA SA

Dan Houser

James Worrall

DJ Pooh

 

GTA IV

Dan Houser

Rupert Humphries

(omg where's our usual writing team?!)

 

GTA LCS

Dan Houser

James Worrall

David Bland

(oh, there they are)

 

GTA VCS

Dan Houser

David Bland

(well at least they had a guy who worked with a guy who wrote the original titles...)

 

GTA V

Dan Houser

Rupert Humphries

Micheal Unsworth

 

Why does one "universe" of GTA feature so little of a previous universe? Because aside from a couple easter eggs here and there, Dan Houser is not actually bringing much to the scripts. Most of the connected scripts are written by people who have already been involved in writing the relevant GTA universe. There is a writer (who could just have be pulled in from the sidewalk for all we know) for each major storyline and that affects the whole direction of the GTA cannon and each game's theme. 'Rockstar' aint telling us nothing about the story outside of the games, since they aren't the writers and it's "not in their area of expertise".

 

 

Now remember that a game story is very different from a movie story. Not in what they can do or what they do do, but in how important each thing is. Of course this differs from film to film also, but generally films are better suited to continuity and realism than games. Game storylines are meant to be over the top and dragging. If not, then you might just be enjoying a nice animated movie with very little entertainment on the game side of things.

 

You could take the movie out of a game and still end up with a game (albeit with a confusing and unjustified set of missions). Take the game out of things though and you've got a movie... which you might enjoy so much you might not even pay attention to the lack of game.


Lewis Chappers
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#136

Posted 24 October 2013 - 03:08 PM

African-American's in South-Central tend to have worryingly low life expediencies. Its 50/50 in all fairness. Though, C.J. did want to get out of "the game." Who knows, he might have got out of the thug life? I don't know...


BlackFeather SR
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#137

Posted 27 October 2013 - 02:23 AM

C.J may be alive and in the HD universe

Source: http://kotaku.com/th...ng-u-1444379100

lil weasel
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#138

Posted 27 October 2013 - 07:05 AM

Dan H. has said that Rockstar does not comment on speculation; that they like to read what fans and commentators postulate. So unless Rockstar makes an Official Statement we are free to dream, and keep the rumors rolling :^:.


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#139

Posted 27 October 2013 - 02:26 PM

They ignore my mail (unless it's purchase related) because they hold GTA 5 fans in higher regard than San Andreas fans; multiplayer is a bigger "priority" for them than a San Andreas sequel. They might as well have spit in my face.

 

Patching their plot-holes by resorting to this "universe" nonsense is also quite sad.


lil weasel
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#140

Posted 27 October 2013 - 04:06 PM

"Universe" nonsense wouldn't be necessary IF players would stop insisting on having the GTA stories connect.

Taking each one as an independent story seems difficult for some people.


CarIJohnson
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#141

Posted 01 November 2013 - 06:40 PM

I'm alive guys.


MrPeteyMax
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#142

Posted 01 November 2013 - 06:48 PM

I'm alive guys.

 

Actually, Rockstar say you don't exist.


King Andreas
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#143

Posted 02 November 2013 - 08:10 AM

Having the titles "1", "2", "3", "4", and "5" implies a canon series. If a book author wrote a "part 1, 2", and so forth rife with contradictions, accompanied with a "universe" justification, they'd be deemed "plot-holes" by fans. Why should the GTA series be granted an exception?


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#144

Posted 02 November 2013 - 07:35 PM Edited by PkUnzipper, 02 November 2013 - 08:08 PM.

 

QUOTE (RidingHigh @ Jun 1 2008, 22:56) I think R* stated that all of the past GTA characters are dead, which is why none returned to IV. R* killed Tommy, CJ, Toni, Vic and Claude so they won't have to be asked on the next GTA, "Will Tommy or CJ make a cameo?", they can answer simply, "No. They're dead."
Pretty much what he clearly said. It was already made official thousands of years ago that all the past protagonists will be dead. In fact, the likely occurence of them being dead is very high. It's because they live the life of a criminal so they can be shot down the next day.

 

 

Yep.  And this is also exactly why R* deliberately pissed off the TLAD fanboys by letting Trevor kill off Johnny when you first meet Trevor in the intro mission.

 

And lets be realistic here based on what we're given in the current GTA universe:

 

1. Whatever gang turf wars happened between SA time frame over 25 years ago, it didn't go well for GSF.  So IMO GSF is clearly KIA as an active set of Grove Street.  Because the Ballas now occupy Grove Street.  Besides, all the OGs who founded GSF are either dead (like Big Smoke, Ryder back in SA).  Or crack/base heads like B-Dup. Or MIA/AWOL like Sweet and OG Loc. 

 

2. So the remaining GSF members who survived the Ballas take over of Grove St, would've long since joined the GCF, or moved on from banging a long time ago....

 

3. At the end of SA, CJ was most likely in charge of the GSF instead of Sweet.  This is based on the respect he'd earned from the GSF and Sweet.  So he was most likely killed in action, since the Ballas now own Grove St. But

 

4. If CJ is still alive in present day SA--and really did quit GSF--then he's probably what Lester would say "has gone quiet".  :lol:  

 

Because with all that $$$$$ he was making working with Wu Zi, his properties/assets around the map, the Casino in Las Venturas, and his chop shop business with Ceasar in San Fierro, CJ could easily afford to retire from gang banging TBH.

 

5. But to date, the only explicit acknowledgement R* has made on CJ, was that memorial on the staircase wall in Roman's apt. This memorial also showed up in a couple other places in LC come to think of it.  But anyways, they haven't mentioned anything about CJ in GTA 5.  You also saw what they let Trevor do to Johnny  :/   As well as quite a few chars who Niko dealt with in LC like the UL paper guy.

 

CJ spent all of his time in SA trying to unify the GSF with Seville Familes etc.  And now the GCF are too busy set tripping with each other to take on the Ballas or the Vagos. So it's only rational to assume CJ is very dead.  :/

 

RIP CJ. :cool:


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#145

Posted 04 November 2013 - 06:23 PM

I dont think cj is dead  cos he still lives on los-santos with his brother sweet 


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#146

Posted 17 November 2013 - 12:37 PM

CJ is alive I think.  If you stand by some of the Families homies in CHamberlain Hills and listen to them talk, you'll occasionally here them say  "OG Johnson is gutter than a muthaf*cka" ....OG being Original Gangster, usually a name given to the older gangsters thats been through it all and done much for the hood.  You remember CJ took back the hood at the end of San Andreas, so now i'm sure in this day in time he would be an OG....  They could be talking about Sweet too,  but at least we know one of them is alive,   Sean or Carl Johnson.


GeorgeGTA
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#147

Posted 17 November 2013 - 03:32 PM

Carl Johnson isn't dead. And it won't be.


Grievous
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#148

Posted 17 November 2013 - 10:41 PM

Didn't he turned into bigfoot?


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#149

Posted 21 November 2013 - 10:55 AM Edited by Poohdini, 21 November 2013 - 04:31 PM.

idk but i was mad when i seen ballas took over the grove in gta 5 after all the work i put in in SA with taking back spots lol

 

i remember going spot to spot clearing out gang waves just praying to get that call from sweet to do the last mission....it felt like forever before i finally got that call


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#150

Posted 22 November 2013 - 11:35 AM

Yeah it was terrible the way they wanted to shoe-horn in the gang war mini-game into the main narrative.

 

What would have been better was that the gang wars could influence the story without it being an obligation, so if you took control of plenty of neighborhoods, Grove Street OGs would regularly come to assist you during missions.

But if you didn't participate in gang wars, then the Ballas and Vagos would send for reinforcement and you will have more to enemies to shoot at.

 

Instead, they had us deal with this hour long gun fight in the worst possible time possible as the streets are run by riots!

And yet still it was the last GTA to had such a epic grand finale.





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