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The Rustler Rescue

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jheath
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#1

Posted 23 September 2007 - 06:05 AM

The challenge is to obtain a Rustler airplane in one of your garages before any of the main storyline missions. The only rule is that no button cheats or mods are allowed; use of glitches are more than welcome if they result in successfully obtaining the Rustler.

I've taken this challenge from Flow_w0lF's Master Save File Guide, where it appears as part of a bigger task in the elite challenges section (scroll to the end of his guide.) In Flow_w0lF's guide, he suggests towing the locked Rustler spawning in San Fiero airport to the Doherty garage, where it can be unlocked and saved. This is made challenging by the fact that San Fiero is four-star territory this early in the game, and because there are no obvious land exits from the airport large enough to accomodate the Rustler's wing span. The only other Rustlers that I know of this early in the game are the ones flying overhead, which can be shot down.

Now, it is possible to obtain the Rustler early. I've managed to do so in a post-Green Sabre save file, where San Fiero is unrestricted, but the Rustler is still locked. My technique for doing so can be found in this post here, in zoomchild's excellent 4-star daredevils topic.

So, the challenge is out there. If anyone has already managed this feat (and it's possible I might have missed their post in my searches), please feel free to brag here about how you did it. Any thoughts or suggestions on how to solve the challenge are also more than welcome.

Here are some of my ideas:
  • Shoot a Rustler out of the sky with a minigun (obtainable from restricted Las Venturas). Unfortunately wrecks are notorious for disappearing after a very short distance of pushing.
  • Tow the Rustler out of the airport by dropping off the overpass over the entrance road, head up the hill to the railroad tracks, follow the tracks to the station, and then cut over the the Doherty garage. This is how I obtained the Rustler early in my non-four-star save file; repeating it in a four-star environment would be difficult.
  • Use the tow truck to jump the Rustler over the narrow gap on the north side of the airport (less damage to the plane than dropping off the overpass), and follow some alternate path to Doherty
  • Dump the Rustler into the water, and use the walk-underwater glitch to get a tow truck underwater and somehow tow the Rustler out.

Stefan.
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#2

Posted 01 October 2007 - 11:40 AM

This seems like a fun thing to try.

I tried it today, but I got killed just as I went out of the airport. The towtruck isn't very quick with the plane on the back.

Might try it tomorrow.

jheath
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#3

Posted 03 October 2007 - 06:59 PM

QUOTE (Stefan Matovic Cvetkovic @ Oct 1 2007, 05:40)
This seems like a fun thing to try.

I tried it today, but I got killed just as I went out of the airport. The towtruck isn't very quick with the plane on the back.

Might try it tomorrow.

Good to see someone else take a stab at it.

How did you try to leave the airport? Dropping off the overpass, I'm guessing? If so, did you raise the towing cable all the way once you got the Rustler attached? That lifts the locked front wheels of the Rustler off the ground, significantly improving the towing speed.

One idea I had for dropping off the overpass is to face the plane towards the edge, unhook the truck, and then use the truck to push the plane over the edge. I've found this to be a more reliable way of getting the plane off the overpass upright than towing it over, and it offers the possibility of quickly fetching another Rustler if the first happens to get flipped. I suspect though that this method damages the plane more than towing over does, however. I'm still thinking about jumping the water at the north edge of the airport to see if I can get out damage free.

Another suggestion is to use a minigun to wipe out any traffic and police cars below the bridge before doing the drop. You can also pepper the area with tear gas to take care of foot cops.

Good luck!


The Lie
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#4

Posted 08 October 2007 - 05:27 AM

Wow I tried this a long time ago, took hours, I'm glad there's someone else who's as interested in this challenge as I was. I used a towtruck (tractors don't work, and it wont fit on a packer) and towed it to the west side of the airport near to where the beagle is. I towed it off the edge at full speed, to the left of the ramp. If this went smoothly, the plane would stay attached and everything. Didn't do it @ 4 stars though. Silly me, I used the garage next to the golf course, in the alley. very hard to tow that far, but very fun to take off out of, dodging light posts and stuff, and trying not to stall.

jheath
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#5

Posted 09 October 2007 - 07:04 PM

I'm also thinking that jumping the gap near the Beagle is the way to go, TL.

Most of the time when I do the jump the plane gets unhooked and damaged, but this still seems like a more reliable drop than from the overpass onto the entrance road. I'm trying to see what speed and direction produces the best results. I use the overpass as my route to get to jump point (take a right instead of a left out of the hanger), since I can usually lose my in-airport pursuers there.

Once over the gap and on that concrete platform by the warehouses and basin, there are two exits that I can see:
  • One is the road, which is usually jammed with pedestrians and traffic (lots of cops and cop cars here at four stars). Going up the hill would bring you pretty close to the Doherty garage, and you could turn off the road near the top of the hill onto a nice grassy area if you want to avoid the roads. I haven't even tried this route because the traffic at the entrance is just too dense.
  • The second path is mostly free from police, but like childbirth, it is difficult, painful, and requires a lot of pushing. The railroad tracks are wide enough to accomodate the Rustler, mostly sheltered, and lead directly to the railway station, just across from the Doherty garage. The tow truck can't pull the Rustler up the hill, but with infinite sprint you *can* push the plane up on foot.

The problem with the second route isn't the climb up the hill; it's the part near the top. For some reason, the resistance from the tracks near the crest of the hill is tremendous. The tow truck can't go past this point even without a burden, and the only way to push the plane over this section is to use a zig-zag path. If it weren't for this rough patch of ground, obtaining the Rustler using this path would be relatively easy. There is even a body armor spawn close by.

I've been able to obtain a Rustler on this route in a four-star environment, but only after cheating by increasing the Rustler's durability in the handling.cfg file. Tear gas made police outside of the airport relatively easy to deal with, especially since I was mostly on foot, and hence not being attacked by their cars. Without the extra durability, I haven't been able to get the Rustler past the rough patch; it might be that the damage inflicted by this part of the tracks is prohibitively large, ruling this path out as a way of obtaining the Rustler without cheating.

Stefan.
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#6

Posted 16 December 2007 - 12:49 AM

Oh goodness, I completely forgot about this.

Sorry, but I've been busy lately, and haven't got the time. At least I'm on summer holidays now, so I'll be able to complete it for sure. biggrin.gif

jolly_jay
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#7

Posted 17 December 2007 - 02:10 AM Edited by jolly_jay, 17 December 2007 - 09:46 PM.

Has this been done before? It sounds like a cool challenge....and its a step towards even a better challenge...the hydra (Flow_w0lF's Guide).

I've played around quite a bit in SF with 4*s but i'm gonna have to start all over again (with pilots license /no storyline etc).

Has anybody looked into undrowning the rustler...so u can get into it and fly it underwater into blue hell (similiar to walking under water...but flying instead) I'm don't know extactly how this works...but i have read up awhile ago on something like this. You can possibly push the rustler to the right location under the water....but im not sure if there is a place to do this near SF airport.

EDIT...i can see where i found this...and it looks like jheath started the discussion here. Undrowning works with cars and helicopters.

UPDATE: I thought i would give this ago anyhow. I took a campervan down near hanky panky (given i couldn't find a towtruck and thought i could hopefully push a plane around with a journey) and within 10 minutes being down there...i found my first Rustler. A lot of planes tend to fly along this stretch of water...and quite a few end up in the drink. Tried moving it and yes it did eventually explode as 'GTA Phreak' mentioned in another post somewhere.

I think i will focus on this approach...undrowning a rustler. My idea is undrown it...fly it out to the map limit...fly into blue hell...and then hopefully pop out somewhere in LS. Its early days...hopefully something will give way...and we may have a rustler (and with no wanted stars). Well...maybe wanted stars to store it in Doherty. The only problem i have...is finding the time to keep trying.

user posted image

UPDATE: Realised later that you don't need to fly to blue hell...just fly out of the water...and your fine. I spawned a stunt plane under the water to test this theory...and was able to fly straight out of the water. Just have to work out how to get a plane to the undrowning area (then a rustler). I'm also sure that the rustler that crashed earlier in front of me (in my pic) had the wheels down...which is unussual...i dont know why an AI would have the wheels down before crashing. But if so...that makes it one less hurdle to tackle (oh..unless the AIs are coded to put the landing gear down when close to the ground...i'm guessing).

BTW...im not having much luck with hooking up a tow truck to a plane underwater (but i've only tried the stuntplane so far...given its the only similiar plane i can spawn for the time being). I know GTA_Phreak mentioned how he hooked up planes....but it may be that you can't hook up stunt planes.

GTA Phreak
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#8

Posted 17 December 2007 - 02:07 PM

I never managed to hook up a drowned plane with a towtruck/tractor, only cars:

user posted image

The car is on tow, the Cropduster dropped from the sky. I couldn't hook up the Cropduster.

jolly_jay
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#9

Posted 17 December 2007 - 10:45 PM

QUOTE (GTA Phreak @ Dec 17 2007, 14:07)
I never managed to hook up a drowned plane with a towtruck/tractor, only cars:


Sorry, i must have misread your post....and that explains why i couldn't find the post again.

It is interesting how some cars seem to float like the planes do (with the engine down)....i noticed it when i drowned a ute..and also in your screen shot. They must have a simliar weight distribution to the airplanes.

Have a question....where is the flatest undrowning point?

Last night i was able to move a rustler a long distance on the sea bed by pushing it with the back of a ute. The only problem...i wasn't able to push it up the slope to the undrowning point at hanky panky due to the weight of the plane.

It appears the chrome section mounted on the front of the engine doesn't take damage...so if you push it along using this section of the plane (with the back of a ute tray)...you can move it a long way on a flat seabed without the plane exploding.

The only problem im going to have...is when reaching the undrowning point...where the plane will most likely fall over on its back, get damaged and prevent me from getting into the cockpit.

I'm also thinking of possibly trying to get an undrowned helicopter to hook onto the rustler and lift it out of the water...but im not sure of how much a maverick can lift. I haven't tried...but i was hoping that the skid pads could hook onto the back of the plane somehow...whilst being nose down. Obviously..i can see some other hurdles with this...such as how to prevent the plane from possibly exploding whilst being lifted (continual damage) and then how to get rid of the AI pilot (so he doesn't fly off once out of the water). I know its a huge stab in the dark....but I have to start somewhere.

I probably won't get to try this until sometime next week....but i will do a few trails with the rustler from the abondoned airstrip.

jheath
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#10

Posted 18 December 2007 - 01:05 AM

Nice to see some other people taking a look at this challenge! smile.gif

I spent a lot of time on this problem while back, but never quite succeeded in finding a good method. Since then I haven't spent much time on it, but I have had a few more ideas.

First, some explanation for those not familiar with "undrowning": (Credit goes to GTA Phreak for discovering/relaying all this)

There are many places along the San Andreas coast (mostly in places where land overhangs deep parts of the water) where "undrowning" occurs. When CJ swims to those places, he drops to the sea floor as if he were on dry land; he can breathe again, shoot weapons, and walk around almost anywhere on the seabed. If there are any sunken vehicles in the water, he can push them to an undrowning spot, where the vehicle will also undrown, allowing CJ to drive / fly underwater.

In general, cars and helicopters can be undrowned, but undrowning planes is problematic because those tend to stand nose-down on the sea floor. As soon as you push the plane to the undrowning point, it blows up. With a tow-truck, you can tow drowned vehicles, but this also doesn't work for planes because it can't hook up when the plane is nose-down.

Drowned vehicles have some unusual properties; as long as they are drowned, they appear to be bullet-proof and probably collision-proof (maybe even everything-proof, I haven't tested.) You can manuever your drowned plane around by shotgun if you've got enough ammo.


Now, on to the ideas:

The Wet Wait (Credit again goes to GTA Phreak)

Stick around on the sea-floor long enough, and some of the AI pilots will fly too low and drown. GTA Phreak has seen Rustlers, Crop Dusters, etc end up in the drink. His suggestion is to avoid undrowning the plane, and instead push it to one of the nearby beaches with a gentle slope, such as those around Santa Maria. Once the plane is close to the shore, you can apparently hop in, extend the wheels, and fly off. The only problem with this (as far as I can tell) is that it requires a lot of time and patience.

The Panopticon Slingshot

This totally useless idea came to me early on when I was trying to think of ways to get the locked Rustler to an undrowning point. If you daisy-chain enough tow-trucks together, the end of the chain will tend to whip out when you make a high-speed turn. What do we want to so carelessly fling through the air? The Rustler of course. The Panopticon undrowning point is not too far from the SF airport - conceivably you could throw the Rustler past the little bridge and into the water. (Actual tests end up far short of this, but let's think positive.) What does this get you? Pretty much nothing... even if you could undrown the Rustler or tow it under water, it is still locked, and the only place you can save it is in Doherty. Oh well. sad.gif

---

In general I think that obtaining a Rustler by undrowning, neat as it is in concept, is a no-go. Even if you could somehow obtain the Rustler in the water and get it on to dry land in Los Santos intact, the only place you can save it is Doherty. The only place you can heal it, is also Doherty. Ditto for unlocking it. (The largest plane I've been able to fit in a Los Santos garage is the Crop Duster.) Given how close the Doherty garage is to the airport, it seems to me that the best bet is the simple but brutal one of towing or pushing the plane from the airport to the garage.

On the other hand, investigating underwater techniques is useful for that other awesome plane - the Hydra. This is because I am convinced that you can't obtain the Hydra by shooting it out of the sky... the wreck will simply disappear when you try to push it. Thus, I'm interested in seeing if undrowning might uncover a way to catch that elusive jet.

GTA Phreak
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#11

Posted 18 December 2007 - 01:20 AM

A few ideas and a suitable undrowning spot http://www.gtaforums...=280997&st=115#

In my experience the Rustler (and every other aircraft I've tried) invariably ends up on it's back when undrowned. That doesn't mean that it will instantly explode, - I had an undrowned Rustler slide on it's back all the way down into grey hell without blowing up.

There is another detail which I haven't mentioned: AI aircraft is virtually "indestructible" when in the water!
Even if you shoot and blow them out of the air, - once in the water they're in perfect order.
They appear undamaged and CJ can enter them if they settle on the bottom in a manner so they can be entered (like helicopters).
While drowned in the water they cannot be damaged in any way, minigun or satchels doesn't change that.

BUT!! The game remembers their true state and keeps track of any damage done, so once undrowned they blow immediately if their health is already gone.

Only way to test their health in the water (that I know of) is to take pictures of it with the camera, - if it's blowing up or smoking while or just after taking a picture then it's already destroyed. The camera somehow negates the effect of the water (rotors of AI helicopters start spinning too).

A funny thing happens when you undrown a "destroyed" AI helicopter with the (invisible) AI pilot still in it, - it will take off and keep continously exploding while flying off trailing black smoke lol.gif
No need to be gentle while undrowning it so just move it with the minigun wink.gif

jolly_jay
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#12

Posted 18 December 2007 - 02:58 AM Edited by jolly_jay, 19 December 2007 - 01:57 AM.

The Wet Wait idea is pretty much what i'm aiming for....sticking around on the sea floor long enough. What really spurred me on with this approach...is that being on the seabed for only 10 minutes i came across an AI rustler (in my first attempt). I'm guessing in how the spawning process works with AI planes...but i 'think' that being in deep water...raises the probability of plane crashes. My thought process behind this is that planes possibly spawn within a defined window height above CJ (floor / ceiling). By being deeper down...lowers this window....and raises your probability of AI plane crashing. This is the only explanation i can give to planes crashing whilst you are underwater...because when you think about it...do you ever see planes fly at water level whilst CJ is above water?

anyhow...back to the idea. I've been able to move the plane around...the next thing for me is to get the plane to a plausible undrowning area. This is where trail and error will come in (using the rustler from the abandoned airstrip). Using GTA Phreak's research, i beleive this is workable...given AI planes are already unlocked...and flyable to doherty.....but at the same time...I agree, definitely not plausible 'undrowning' the SF airport rustler (given its locked and always will be until you get it to doherty).

GTA Phreak's research is a huge plus (help)....and points out where my concern is, the plane ending up on its back whilst undrowning. I can't see a way around that....and given the amount of research by GTA Phreak...i dont know if there is a way around it.

In regard to the SF Rustler option.....I do beleive there is a chance of towing the rustler to doherty...but for me, its a little too difficult. 4*s is not the problem...the problem for me is the 4* 'with the rustler' behind me. Although it appears as the most straight forward solution, I just can't do it. I tried it once...but the police just frustrated me too much. I leave this option open for others. smile.gif

Chances are i won't be working on any of this for the remainder of the week (other than forum research)...but i'm sure i will be back into it next week sometime.

If anybody else is out there who's bored whilst waiting for GTA IV...get out there and give it a go. (I'm on PC...so i've got even a longer time to wait.)

Thanks GTA Phreak / jheath for breathing some life into this...although you must be sick of the topic.

UPDATE: I had another attempt last night at this...and took GTA phreaks advice using the Santa Maria beach. I didn't make any progress...given the planes kept unspawning as soon as i touched them. (I'm unsure why) Very odd...because when attempting this near hanky panky the planes never unspawned. But the number of planes that dropped into the water sounds promising. There is no doubt...if you could work out a way to get these out of the water and fly them....you will have your rustler. I was there for maybe 30 minutes (actual time) and came across 3 rustlers, 1 crop duster and 1 stunt plane (and hundreds of police mavericks / news choppers moto_whistle.gif ....hmmm yeah ok i got bored).

Denise even phoned me whilst down there (and i haven't heard from her in ages). Its like...yeah off course...im in the middle of the ocean with choppers crashing down everywhere around me......i will come right on over and pick you up.




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