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Early Side-Missions In Locked-Off Areas

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rubregg
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#31

Posted 13 June 2007 - 10:28 PM

I'm just home from work and really really knackered. So I've got to be brief, but I wanted to Thank everyone involved in the pin and the gift of karma!!! Wow!!! blush.gif


Saget
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#32

Posted 14 June 2007 - 01:15 AM

QUOTE (rubregg @ Jun 9 2007, 21:35)
Wow, thanks for your lovely comments and the good ratings, mates. I'm glad you like it!! smile.gif

@Demarest
hehe, yes I actually *have* thought about text limits and 1 posting vs. multiple postings. but no one could tell me how to link to a place in the middle of a posting, so if I had put it all into one posting, there couldn't be any cross-references. this way I can at least cross-reference to the main chapters.

@Saget
glad you like the music!! ...since I just spotted your Brazil flag - have you ever come across the label Editio Princeps? They're a really small label in Rio de Janeiro, they have excellent music and they're very friendly too. [The song in the Chiliad Challenge video comes from one of their cds - 'Akinetón Retard - Ao Vivo']. Anyway, in case you're interested, their website is http://www.editioprinceps.com. (and no, I'm not affiliated to them)

@quartet1977
I'm happy to include your trucking video. after all it was this video that first inspired me to try trucking level 8 without using the railtracks. smile.gif

I've never heard of that label, I guess mainly because it is from Rio.
But some of the artists look really interesting, I'll check that out this weekend.

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#33

Posted 14 June 2007 - 02:46 PM Edited by rubregg, 14 June 2007 - 03:22 PM.

I'd like to continue shifting ongoing discussions from other places to here on-topic-land. A lot of it was contributed by OrionSR , thanks again! cookie.gif cookie.gif icon14.gif --> some of his videos are linked in the next two paragraphs <-- / Thanks also to imut_knight for your feedback; just so you don't overlook it, you're quoted somewhere in the middle of this lengthy posting... wink.gif ...oh and congrats on the 13.37% !!!! icon14.gif


Enter/Exit strategies:
QUOTE (OrionSR @ PM)
I hardly ever use planes to access restricted territory anymore. But I suspect this is more because I became bored with those routes than anything to do with safety. Usually I enter SF by jumping across the channel at Flint Intersection . It's a super easy jump from LS to SF in almost any reasonably fast vehicle. Then I head across the field to the tracks and have a fairly safe, but bleeding stars, trip into SF. In the recent chain games I've started trying out different 4 wheeled vehicles in order to pad the driving stat a little more. The other easy jump into SF is across the channel from the Panopticon to Fallen Tree . I've even made this jump with a Wayfarer. The trick is not not have too much speed until the bike has good traction coming down the hill. I tend to use this jump more when Mulholland is my base of operations. I'm weird about the unique jumps, and prefer not to save them, so I only use that jump into the SF airport in the videos, or when I'm just messing around. Oh yeah, you can just walk across the Panopticon Bridge without any trouble, except maybe jacking a proper vehicle on the other side.
I haven't had a chance to try these out yet, but I will next time I have a chance. While practicing my mega-hops I went over Panopticon Bridge on top of the railing on a BMX, but that was in a completely open map so I guess normally the barrier won't allow that. Your access to Panopticon Bridge - without triggering the wanted stars - looks like a good way to get at least one snapshot safely. I'm *nowhere* as good as you with snapshots (btw, amazing video, OrionSR!!! "Full Zoom" - this has *got* to be the ultimate snapshot-speed-run!!), but I usually get the two at the airport while I'm up at Panopticon Bridge, so for me that would be 3 completely safe snapshots.


QUOTE (OrionSR @ PM)
I still haven't found a reliable method to access LV with a vehicle . I thought that NRG jump was going to do the trick for me, but now I'm having a problem finding the sweet spot. Or maybe it's just because I'm experimenting with other bikes. But I made it a Freeway once, so I'm encouraged to keep trying.
I *cannot* do that NRG jump reliably either. Maybe around 30-40% of my tries... I've only managed it *once* with another bike, but honestly, I forgot which one it was. Definitely not a Freeway though... For a while I tried getting an NRG from LS to LV as cargo in a boat, but that was really tricky. It tended to just fall out on acceleration.... But maybe I haven't just found the right boat yet - Kusak reported he has done it a couple of times.

Additionally there's imut_knight's suggestion (thanks for your feedback, mate! smile.gif ):
QUOTE (imut_knight @ Jun 13 2007, 03:49)
On some ocassion when I need to bring NRG to complete unique jumps in LV, I always used both NRG + Packer confused.gif
(Why that smiley? ...sounds like a completely valid way into LV...)


QUOTE (OrionSR @ PM)
Boats on the otherhand, I've given up for safety reasons. Most of the time I can make it back safely, but sometimes I get caught with a dead boat and swimming from a helicopter as a cop boat circles, and there's nothing worse than losing a large collection.
Generally I don't use boats too much either, same reason. But the escape routes I'm describing will not have many coastguards along the way and I hardly ever lost my Jetmax using these routes. From SF to LS you'll meet 2 of them, roughly around the last corner before you reach Sta Maria Beach. The complete SW coastline seems to be refreshingly coastguard-free. My route from LV to LS has 2 coastguards at the very start, before you reach the railway bridge between LS and LV. If you chose the route to the stadium/Johnsohn House, that's it. If you go to Willowfield, there'll be 2 more coastguards in LS harbour, just where you take the right turn into the drainage ditch. Well, on very rare occasions, these 2 did finish off my Jetmax, but that was already in the drainage ditch and I was just jumping out anyway. Generally in the Jetmax, just floor it and get out of reach of their bullets as fast as you can and you should be safe along the escape routes I've described.

QUOTE (OrionSR @ PM)
I needed a safer method to return, especially from LV. But then GTA_Phreak told me about riding bikes over the rail of the freeway bridge from LV to LS , and I haven't felt the need to look for anything better. A Sandking with hydraulics raised has no problem making it over the rail, and racing through the oil fields is great fun in that vehicle. But the Sandking is out of the way, and it might take quite a few respawns before I get one with hydraulics. The Dune can also make it over the rail, but it requires stopping with the nose pressed against the rail (heading east), and then pushing over the rail with the accelerator.

I've been getting sloppy recently with my return trips from SF . The helicopter is usually safe enough. For some reason the Hydra doesn't go after it for quite a while unless you exit and re-enter, plenty of time to clear the stars with bribes or switch to a ground vehicle, but not enough time to collect horseshoes. I can usually make the jump back across the Flint Intersection with an NRG, and this has been my preferred method, but recently I've been getting greedy and trying to collect a Bullet, Banger, or Bandito. But the difficult lead into the jump makes it a very awkward jump in a car. I usually end up swimming a short distance up river to the ledge CJ can climb, running up the hill to avoid the cops in the ped zone, and jacking any vehicle handy to make the short dash for the Pay'n'Spray.

When I get bored with that I'll probably head back to the Panopticon again. I keep getting wet when I try to ride the bike along the slim ledge around the invisible wall. However, I suspect it won't be very difficult simply walk across and jack the first vehicle in sight in order to grab the bribes.



various comments by OrionSR:

In the current round (16) of the chain game, there were notes on the parachute glitch and an unrestricted way across SF Bay , several spawning issues at the Emerald Isle [most notably that the PS2 ("version 1 at least") won't spawn vehicles there!] , the way the game actually handles / accumulates those wanted stars , and flying horseshoes , more on the Emerald Isle , more on evaded wanted stars , and trains .


QUOTE (OrionSR @ PM)
In all fairness, I learned about the AT-400, riding over the rain [rail??] from LV, and crossing the Panopticon Bridge from GTA_Phreak , but how deep can one nest the credits?
Thanks for letting me know, I'll work that in eventually.

QUOTE (OrionSR @ PM)
Have you encountered the parachute glitch where it opens but can't be controlled, and CJ always dies unless he lands in water?
oooooh yes. haven't found out any details about it though. it seems rather random to me...

QUOTE (OrionSR @ PM)
I haven't done this in a while, but you[r] Molotov comments reminded me: Put a Satchel Charge on CJ's vehicle and when it comes time to abandon it, detonate the charge to clear the chasing cops.

There's another way into the LS airport.
I've learnt that way into LS airport from your video. Actually I intentionally left it out of my guide because I felt it's more appropriate in yours... wink.gif

QUOTE (OrionSR @ PM)
Am I the only one that gets killed in three hits by the LV Gym Trainer ?
No, you're not. lol.gif Sometimes it happens to me when I'm having a bad start. That's why the gym trainers are always things I do *first* after entering locked-off cities....

QUOTE (OrionSR @ PM)
Ever notice that CJ can take a significant hit and remain on the bike if he pulls a wheelie just before impact?
Yes I have, but certainly worth mentioning here.

QUOTE (OrionSR @ PM)
The stars earned during Land, Air, and Sea are cleared when the lesson is passed.

To collect the mini-gun in the construction site, I parked my bike inside the fence so it can easily be retrieved. The opening is on the east side.

I had Barbara at 43% in one of the saves from my first attempt at 4 star exploration - the one where I took the deaths and arrests because I hadn't learned to survive yet. I'm not sure what happened, but I think she kept incrementing while I was doing... something, somewher. She was completely off the stats page for a while, and when she returned, she was at 43%. I've never managed to repeat this glitch .

Try that car spawning zone on the 4th floor of Emerald Isle in order to spawn a Broadway . It might take a few tries, but it's the most reliable method I've found so far. I have read that the Broadway gets something like a 400% boost to vehicle health when the mission starts, and this is apparently cleared if the car is painted.

The taxi timer will stop if CJ is out of range of passengers. I was using this in a trial run at Taxi in SF. When painting was needed, I'd avoided ped zone until I could get to the pay'n'spray by the auto dealer. Still didn't make it far, but haven't really tried.

Tricky Tag: If Vigilante is completed, starting it again won't increment the attempt stat, so Vigilante provides the most time to stash a vehicle and get out of the neighborhood - just don't chase the targets. Burglary provides plenty of time after sunrise to mess around in Grove Street before CJ needs to get to the lockup, but always increments the attempt stat.

Those are all well woth mentioning, but as I think the most helpful tip for new 4starers is possibly this:

QUOTE (OrionSR @ PM)
I've been recommending that people try to get to the Hippy Shopper and Burger Shot missions before collections. Both GTA_Phreak and myself have commented on the fact that the real breakthrough in understanding how to survive the constant 4 star wanted level came during these missions.

Great tip, absolutely correct. In 4starland I find myself in a completely different "mode" of playing the game, especially when it comes to driving. The courier missions will absolutely help you to understand some basics.


And finally, as for *this topic* itself... wink.gif

@crazyanurag & Demarest :
QUOTE (crazyanurag @ Jun 14 2007, 00:27)
in that case, you might want to have a look over here...
Thanks, great tip and very helpful topic!! [drools with excitement] This will definitely get worked in as soon as I have the time. smile.gif

@Saget :
Yes, I know Brazil is huge -- thought worth a shot, it's the only Brazilian label I know after all... wink.gif

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#34

Posted 15 June 2007 - 12:31 PM

QUOTE (rubregg @ Jun 14 2007, 21:46)
Additionally there's imut_knight's suggestion (thanks for your feedback, mate! smile.gif ):
QUOTE (imut_knight @ Jun 13 2007, 03:49)
On some ocassion when I need to bring NRG to complete unique jumps in LV, I always used both NRG + Packer confused.gif
(Why that smiley? ...sounds like a completely valid way into LV...)

It is a valid way into LV, however, your video with NRG jump a lot easier than swimming or NRG+Packer icon14.gif

rubregg
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#35

Posted 15 June 2007 - 02:57 PM

Announcement:

Thanks to DrSnuggles I can now host my videos in much better quality than on youtube. The download link has been included in the link collection in chapter 0. [ Video details: 512*384 / avi / xvid (2pass vbr) / mp3 ]

Also, but less exciting, I slightly brushed up the guide's formatting. It's mainly a bit of added colour so you can easier find what you're looking for.



QUOTE (imut_knight @ Jun 15 2007, 14:31)
It is a valid way into LV, however, your video with NRG jump a lot easier than swimming or NRG+Packer icon14.gif
Thanks! But well, like I said, I'm not *that* successful with my jump yet.... lol.gif



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#36

Posted 16 June 2007 - 11:23 AM

Rubregg, did you want a vid of the chopper take down thing? Cos i can make one easily for ya.

rubregg
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#37

Posted 16 June 2007 - 11:06 PM

QUOTE (Gray_Eagle @ Jun 16 2007, 13:23)
Rubregg, did you want a vid of the chopper take down thing? Cos i can make one easily for ya.

omg - sorry Gray_Eagle, after all that quoting and summarizing, this one has actually slipped through... lol.gif Yes, I would be really interested in that, haven't had a chance to try it out yet. And if a video is too much bother, a screenshot of CJ aiming at the correct spot of the parking SF Maverick could be just as helpful. Thanks smile.gif

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#38

Posted 17 June 2007 - 01:52 AM

QUOTE (rubregg @ Jun 14 2007, 11:46)
@Saget :
Yes, I know Brazil is huge -- thought worth a shot, it's the only Brazilian label I know after all... wink.gif

Rio de Janeiro isn't THAT far from São Paulo, but each place has its own culture and stuff.

By the way, is that jacket and the underwear some sort of "registered mark" of yours?

rubregg
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#39

Posted 17 June 2007 - 09:18 AM Edited by rubregg, 17 June 2007 - 10:31 AM.

QUOTE (Saget @ Jun 17 2007, 03:52)
By the way, is that jacket and the underwear some sort of "registered mark" of yours?

Haha, no it's not lol.gif ...just some stupid habbit of mine... I'm often trying to make game characters look as silly or inappropriate as possible. For some sick reason I find it funny to go on rampages wearing underpants and snakeskin boots, or something like that. The videos I just tried to make similar to each other so I stuck to the clothing.

Edit:

Mega-Hops

I practiced mega-hopping a bit recently. I don't have a gamepad, so I can't program buttons. But I have the feeling too that successful ones come in bundles. I couldn't find any rule to that so far, I just noticed that sometimes it just won't work repeatedly, whereas at other times it's going alright a couple of times in a row.

I couldn't tell any difference in hopping behaviour of BMX vs. Mountainbike, but to be honest I wasn't paying as much attention to hopping heights as OrionSR.

I tried a lot of surfaces and angles and I couldn't tell any difference there. As for different speeds, for me it seems to work better at slow speeds or standing still. But possibly I just haven't got the hang of the timing yet...

To me it so far looks as if it's all down to how long you press and hold the jump button, and how long after releasing that you have to fire. Maybe I can do a slomo video on some point for a closer look at the animation...


Horseshoes

That's a great list, OrionSR, could prove helpful icon14.gif
While practicing my mega-hops (without wanted level), I could get to 3 of the tricky locations: the Four Dragons, the casino on the Old Strip and the chinese themed mall. From there I tried to get to the one on the billboard, but couldn't do it. That's a really tricky one. I also tried inside Cum-A-Lot but I can't seem to get the last jump high enough...

Also I so far haven't done all 50 in one go, maybe I'll give it another shot in the next round of the chain game. I think last time I had to cut my turn short... And now I know about mega-hops... wink.gif

QUOTE (OrionSR @ Jun 13 2007, 00:02)
I'm starting to get the hang of using a cycle with 4 stars.
I'd like to second that. I'm still not that experienced in good cycling routes yet, but I like losing cops by hopping better and better. Do cycles actually protect CJ from bullets, like other vehicles? They certainly do not take any damage themselves.


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#40

Posted 17 June 2007 - 04:38 PM Edited by OrionSR, 19 June 2007 - 12:46 AM.

Once I was able to jump a PCJ across the channel into LV by using a Packer. I had just returned from LV so Packers were spawning in memory, otherwise, I never see Packers in the area of the jump. Trying to get a Packer and an NRG all the way to Montgomery without either one unspawning seems like more work than is necessary for 1 jump. I assume were taking about the east bound jump along the north side of the Pyramid. I've been using Bullets, Banshees, and Infernuses (Inferni?) for that jump. I usually have an easier time landing that jump with those vehicles than I do with an NRG anyway.

I should probably retract some of the superstitions I suggested about mega-hops. Surface, speed, and coasting don't seem to make any difference. Holding the hop longer increases the height a little for the really high jumps, but usually isn't necessary. Since the mega-hops tend to occur in batches, I've started to get in the habit of testing the mega-hop as I approach the required jump to increase the likelihood that it will work when needed, but most of the time I try to find a safe location where I can take a few shots at it.

I managed to finish another single-save horse run, this time using my own mega-hops and not my programmed button. The major danger with the bikes seem to be running into peds. CJ is very likely to fall sprawled on his back in front of a cop and get instantly busted. I don't think the bicycles offer much protection from bullets. My experience trying to use the BP cop bike for vigilante was that the vehicle offers no additional protection to the rider, so I suspect the same rule applies here. However, I have noticed that CJ takes very few hits while riding the bike, so maybe there's something more going on - interesting observation.

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#41

Posted 21 June 2007 - 09:06 PM

I still haven't done all horseshoes in one go, but I've had a few tries. I did however go all the way, and tried to collect all the 46 non-flying ones by bicycle.... biggrin.gif

I'm not so sure anymore if the mega-hops really occur in bundles. But like I said, I don't have programmed gamepad buttons, so my analysis can't go *that* deep...

It did happen *twice* to me, that after flying to LV in a Shamal and parachuting to the horseshoe on the billboard, no police choppers appeared during my whole stay in LV. More precisely, after getting the horseshoe I dropped down, checked a vehicle on the freeway and went straight for the mountainbike at Creek. From then on only mountainbiking. And no police choppers.

Has that happened to anyone else?


QUOTE (Gray_Eagle)
Wondering whether you'd want to put in how to take down choppers with one sniper bullet??? It seems relevant to me.
QUOTE (Gray_Eagle)
Its tricky to explain but you sort of need to shoot where the spinny bit that spins the rotors meets the roof.

That explanation turned out good enough - I've successfully sniped down my first couple of choppers smile.gif Thanks for the tip, mate icon14.gif

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#42

Posted 21 June 2007 - 09:45 PM Edited by OrionSR, 21 June 2007 - 10:05 PM.

QUOTE (rubregg @ Jun 21 2007, 14:06)
It did happen *twice* to me, that after flying to LV in a Shamal and parachuting to the horseshoe on the billboard, no police choppers appeared during my whole stay in LV. More precisely, after getting the horseshoe I dropped down, checked a vehicle on the freeway and went straight for the mountainbike at Creek. From then on only mountainbiking. And no police choppers.

Has that happened to anyone else?

Yes. You may notice in my Full Zoom video that CJ isn't being harassed by the helicopters while snapping photos from the top of that building. I haven't got the pattern down completely, but if CJ visits a restricted territory a few times, and reloads the save after each attempt, that the helicopters stop appearing. Sometimes they stay gone, other times they return after a long absence.

The same glitch has occurred with the Hydra not showing up. I flew around for an hour or so, and switched aircraft several times, but the hydra refused to spawn. This has only happened twice that I noticed, and I haven't had any luck getting it to repeat in demand.

CJ definitely take hits while riding a bike, but not very many. It seems to offer considerable protection from shotgun blasts. I get the impression that the cop bots are aiming at the vehicle, so the only hits come from the stray shots that miss. I hung out next to a few road blocks in LV just for the heck of it. CJ can clear the Enforcers with a simple bunny-hop. I'm often surprised by the height of the bunny-hops. Many of the walls and even the roof of some houses can be cleared without the extra height of a mega-hop. I wonder if the bicycles offer protection from explosions. Also, I might have to retry that satchel trick with the Mt. Bike. It might be kind of handy to be able to detonate an explosion after a fall, but still be able to retrieve the undamaged transportation.

I'm not having any luck finding the Mt. Bikes and BMXs that are supposed to spawn in the Badlands. I'm wondering if these spawns were removed or don't work correctly in the PC version of San Andreas. I notice that the Hotdog Trucks that spawn in the Badlands on my PS2 don't spawn on PC v1 or v1+v2. Maybe the bicycles have the same problem.

My starting plan is similar to yours, but I've be heading to the Sea Sparrow right after parachuting to the billboard. The idea is to get the riskiest horseshoes first, and too much random crap happens while flying, so I don't bother with the other horseshoes that could easily be collected along the way. However, in case I need to bail from the helicopter, I don't want to have that small knick of health missing after dropping from the billboard, so I take the vehicle from the freeway to the snack machine at the stadium, and collect that horseshoe on the wall while I've got a climbing vehicle handy. Then it's off to the airstrip to collect a bike, armor, and finally the Sea Sparrow. I'm still spending too much time on the bicycle. It would be safer to collect the mega-hop horseshoes and then switch over to a bike, but I'm still having a lot of fun running from the cops on a Mt. Bike, and it's not like I really need the horseshoes or anything.

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#43

Posted 22 June 2007 - 05:33 AM Edited by rubregg, 22 June 2007 - 07:43 AM.

Edits are orange

QUOTE (OrionSR @ Jun 21 2007, 23:45)
I haven't got the pattern down completely, but if CJ visits a restricted territory a few times, and reloads the save after each attempt, that the helicopters stop appearing. Sometimes they stay gone, other times they return after a long absence.
Ah, interesting. This is exactly what I have done. I tried the cycling horseshoe collection a couple of times and reloaded the same savegame. It has happened again. No choppers. Again after going 4star, getting busted & reloading the same save game. Exiting and restarting the game itself fixed it.

QUOTE (OrionSR @ cont.)
The same glitch has occurred with the Hydra not showing up. I flew around for an hour or so, and switched aircraft several times, but the hydra refused to spawn. This has only happened twice that I noticed, and I haven't had any luck getting it to repeat in demand.
wow.gif Now that hasn't happened to me yet.

QUOTE (OrionSR @ cont.)
CJ definitely take hits while riding a bike, but not very many. (...)
I forgot to mention that in my posting. You mean bicycles, not motorbikes, right? I hardly took any hits on a bicycle either, what you wrote about stray bullets could be the explanation. Ok, this is huge. I haven't checked machine gun fire at road blocks yet, but CJ definitely does *not take any damage* from chopper fire if he's on a mountainbike. I went to a copless zone in SW LV and stood still in full-spotlight of the chopper. Got constantly fired at (no swat guys roped down) and stood there for 2 minutes and did not lose any health or armour. Retried on a roof and on the NE cliffs, same thing. Played cat & mouse with 2 foot cops inside the army fuel depot and didn't take any damage from their pistol fire either. This was all on a mountainbike, but I assume the same holds for a BMX.

QUOTE (OrionSR @ cont.)
I'm not having any luck finding the Mt. Bikes and BMXs that are supposed to spawn in the Badlands. I'm wondering if these spawns were removed or don't work correctly in the PC version of San Andreas. I notice that the Hotdog Trucks that spawn in the Badlands on my PS2 don't spawn on PC v1 or v1+v2. Maybe the bicycles have the same problem.
I haven't looked for them yet.

As for my own current horseshoe adventures, I might keep trying to get those 46 by bicycle. Good cycling practice and good opportunities to practice my mega-hops under "proper conditions".

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#44

Posted 23 June 2007 - 12:33 AM Edited by OrionSR, 23 June 2007 - 02:07 AM.

I tried your trick about not taking hits from helicopters on the BMX, and sure enough, no damage was received. Most of the shots seem to be directed lower than CJ - at the bicycle, not at him. So I bunny-hopped in place to draw some higher fire, but still could not get CJ hurt, even if the tracers seemed to hit his body. I'm convinced. 9mm fire on the other hand, I'm sure I've received hits just after picking up the Mt. Bike at Creek, and a test of the BMX against foot cops behind a fence also indicates that 9mm fire can damage CJ while he's riding a bicycle. I'm not having any luck with getting hit by shotgun pellets. The cops holding shotguns prefer to return to their car if CJ remounts the bicycle, and without their car, they just chase him around trying to get in a quick bust and don't fire.

The same principle may apply to motorcycles as well as bicycles, although I was taking about bicycles at the time. CJ doesn't usually take much more than a stray hit while riding motorcycles, I know he can take shotgun hits on a motorcycle, and AK fire can be fairly deadly. But most of the damage seems to be taken by the bikes. Experiments with the BP cop bike indicate that bulletproofing doesn't protect an exposed rider.

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#45

Posted 24 June 2007 - 02:11 AM

rubregg: very thoughtful guide (and thanks for the plug). It's a good collection of the best ideas about it, too colgate.gif .

Orion_SR: I thought you could be helpful here tounge.gif . Good teamwork help!

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#46

Posted 24 June 2007 - 09:36 AM

@glenster
wow.gif
Thanks mate, I'm honoured. This means a lot to me... blush.gif biggrin.gif
Let's face it, I simply *had* to link to your guide. After all, imho, your guides (I've read VC and SA) are true masterpieces in thoroughness, highly inspiring and absolute essentials. icon14.gif icon14.gif
(Very much enjoyed all your comments on the li'l Dodo too...) lol.gif


mega-hop horseshoes
OrionSR has mentioned that the horseshoe on the Old Strip casino can be a bit tricky to reach by mega-hopping, because there's so many cop cars spawning in that area. I personally find it easiest to aim for the casino roof from the north-west, there is a spot behind some walls that offer quite a bit of protection from those cop cars. Here's a screenshot.

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#47

Posted 26 June 2007 - 12:54 AM

yeah nice guide

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#48

Posted 15 August 2007 - 03:35 PM Edited by zmoonchild, 15 August 2007 - 03:51 PM.

First, I want to emphasize that I never use cheats.
I play on PC, and own both v1.0 and v2.0, so the things I’ve listed here will work on both.

I am an avid player for getting 13.37% before doing the 2nd story mission ‘Big Smoke’, basically anything after the 1st mission ‘In the Beginning’.
I have done it several times.

Also, I am aware of the mission exploits that allow you to explore the game without getting a wanted level; however, I’m always looking for a tougher challenge than that.

On average, I can usually go for about 2 hours of straight playing inside of a 4-Star area without getting wasted or busted (god, I really have no life). After that, I like to get back to a Safe House to save the game, just in case the game locks up (which does happen on rare occasions), so I don’t have to start all over again.

Some of the things that I have found interesting:
1. The Chiliad Challenges are usually never more difficult than trying them with no-stars, getting to and from the challenges takes a little practice though, but it’s not that hard.

2. I have found several outdoor locations where I can stand for long periods of time and not have any police appear; sometimes they never appear where I’m located, rather on a roadway close-by, and they can’t figure out how to get to me; other times they just take longer than average to appear; therefore I don’t have to rush when I’m at those locations.

3. Most indoor locations are safe from police: Fast Food places, the larger Casinos, Driving School, etc.
However, exiting an indoor location always creates a somewhat bad situation, there will always be at least 3 to 6 cops with handguns shooting at you when you exit; just be prepared to run.

4. I want to emphasize that the Fast Food places can be opened prior to the mission ‘Big Smoke’ by initiating a date with one of the three available girlfriends: Katie, Michelle, or Barbara. The date will be disastrous, however, the fast food places will remain open after that, and will remain open even after saving the game. It is impossible to have a successful date prior to each girlfriend’s appropriate area being unlocked; strange, considering that you can still acquire them as girlfriends in the first place.

5. Collecting horseshoes that are at higher elevations requires an aircraft of some kind or another. Hydras will sometimes appear immediately after you enter one of those aircraft; they’re extremely close to the aircraft when you enter it, and usually already in the process of already firing their missiles, which can make it very difficult to go very far.

6. The Skimmer seems to not trigger the Hydras to appear as quickly; actually I’ve never seen the Hydra appear for it.
The AT-400 is same; Hydras never seem to appear for it.

7. All other collectables, Oysters, Snapshots, and ground-obtainable Horseshoes are easier to collect, with some practice of course.

8. As far as the Oysters are concerned, 39 of them can be obtained without getting any wanted levels.

9. Collecting the 3 Oysters located north of Sherman Dam presents a unique situation: Police & Media Helicopters will fly overhead toward your location, but will always come down into the water and sink; it always happens. Really funny.

10. When dealing with the Snapshots, there a several of them that can be obtained without getting a wanted level; the total count is somewhere between 8 and 12 (I don’t have an exact number yet).
These are Snapshots that can be taken from a distance, such as from a boat, or a hill overlooking San Fierro. But keep in mind that the only way to obtain a camera prior to the mission ‘Big Smoke’ is to go into San Fierro and get one, which will trigger a 4-Star wanted level.

11. I have been able to take all Snapshots by riding around on an NRG-500 or PCJ-600, and jumping off of the motorcylce and back on real quickly. All Snapshots can be taken from ground locations, even in locations where the invisible barriers are in place.
Also, motorcycles can maneuver around visible barriers and get onto the bridge, where cars can’t.

12. Pay-n-Sprays are your best friends, and it’s always nice to have Michelle as a girlfriend to give you that one extra repair shop.

13. Knowing the locations of food vendors really helps; you don’t have to stop to get food, just run through the red marker. Also vending machines work well too, you just have to be careful about standing still too long, unless they’re located in places where police take a long time to appear.

14. The Tattoo Parlors in Las Ventures and San Fierro are both open from the very beginning of the game (prior to the mission ‘Big Smoke’), whereas the Los Santos Tattoo Parlors are not.

15. Courier Asset Missions can be completed: Burger Shot in Las Ventures and Hippy Shopper in San Fierro, very tricky though, high Bike Skill is recommended.

16. Several aircraft are available from the very beginning of the game and are fully functional, I recommend getting your Pilot’s License early on to get easier access to some of them:

Fixed-Wing aircraft:
Dodo
Shamal
AT-400
Skimmer

Rotary-Wing aircraft:
Maverick
Seasparrow
CargoBob
Leviathan

And, very important, you can fly a Seasparrow back to the Mulholland Safe House and store it on top of the garage, and it will stay there even though it disappears when the garage door is closed. That’s not a typo, I said on top of the garage. You can store any vehicle up there provided that you can get it up there, a Packer works well for those situations, cars drive up the ramp very easily.

Also, you can store a Maverick in the Santa Maria Beach garage, but it sometimes gets stuck in there, and the only way to remove it is to blow it up. Tow Trucks work very well in pushing and pulling Mavericks in to or out of the garage (unless they get stuck), they hook up to them without any problem.

VCHolmes
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#49

Posted 15 August 2007 - 04:27 PM

QUOTE
Collecting horseshoes that are at higher elevations requires an aircraft of some kind or another. Hydras will sometimes appear immediately after you enter one of those aircraft; they’re extremely close to the aircraft when you enter it, and usually already in the process of already firing their missiles, which can make it very difficult to go very far.

Wouldn't that be easier on a jetpack?

I've got to say that its a nice list anyway, you've taken pains.

HolyGrenadeFrenzy
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#50

Posted 15 August 2007 - 04:31 PM Edited by HolyGrenadeFrenzy, 15 August 2007 - 04:43 PM.

My personal favorite for the 4-5 star wanted level is the NRG-500 challenge...I do it pretty regular but the Area 69 is nice to jump through from the west to east side and leave by the fence on a date....your will gain a disasterous date but Helena is the best with her ranting about being a lawyer.

The Bone County Butcher once had a most insane police chase thread for awhile before he got himself banned. Who knows maybe I'll start one after my current project is finished. GTA_Loco is the best on record and he may have some tips. The thing I have noticed is as long as you outmavuever and don't stop allot you can remain in pretty good shape for hours. My personal bests vary from different runs of the game but 2 to 3 hours are not unusual before I decide to try something else. I kept going once on one of my extended Vigilante missions for giggles for over five hours once but then after loosing my vehicle decided I should bring it down a notch......so I bailed on the chase so I could resume my own.

I remember that you don't know who I am and the GTP-Record Book hasn't heard from me in awhile but I will be sure and try to update that in the next month or so.

I use the PS2 version but am using a system cache to collect some vids for System Error's Bulletproof Car Page and hopefully his page will get posted and pinned here when all the vids for vehicle aquistion are in. I plan on using the Xbox game soon to confirm a few things but have been too busy with other things thus far.

The Muholand save sounds interesting and I shall give it a look....Nice find. icon14.gif

Doing Vehicle Missions and other gains before "Big Smoke" is a good idea as before finishing the first mission on any of the other ones is.
-HGF

GTA Phreak
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#51

Posted 15 August 2007 - 04:39 PM

There aren't any jetpacks from the beginning.

Anyways been there, done that. Although there a few bits that's new to me.
Orion_SR has a thread about the topic (with excellent video's too) over at GTPlanet, - check it out:

GTA: San Andreas - 4 Star Survival Guide

HolyGrenadeFrenzy
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#52

Posted 15 August 2007 - 04:48 PM

QUOTE (GTA Phreak @ Aug 15 2007, 11:39)
There aren't any jetpacks from the beginning.

Anyways been there, done that. Although there a few bits that's new to me.
Orion_SR has a thread about the topic (with excellent video's too) over at GTPlanet, - check it out:

GTA: San Andreas - 4 Star Survival Guide

I had spaced my memory of that thread....thanx for reminding me. Orion_SR is very much the assistive enthuesiest for the GTA games and missions. Listening to the advice offered is a good idea now as it was when it was new.

If you catch anyone impersonating him tell them to quit....He doesn't apprieciate it.

pomor
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#53

Posted 15 August 2007 - 06:36 PM

QUOTE (zmoonchild @ Aug 15 2007, 15:35)
And, very important, you can fly a Seasparrow back to the Mulholland Safe House and store it on top of the garage, and it will stay there even though it disappears when the garage door is closed. That's not a typo, I said on top of the garage. You can store any vehicle up there provided that you can get it up there, a Packer works well for those situations, cars drive up the ramp very easily.

That's a news for me. Great news.
I wonder how it will interact, in a long run, with vehicles, that are inside the garage, as they'll be on the same piece of space. Won't it cause them to disapeer more often? It's somewhat hard to test it extensively for me right now, since my garages are bursting with unique cars, and I don't want to risk them too much, as the good test would reqiured puting 3 vehicles inside, and maybe Hydra on the roof, for a significant part of the game.
Sure, I'll test it sooner or later, but whats your experiences in that matter? Did the cars seemed to vanish on you?

zmoonchild
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#54

Posted 15 August 2007 - 09:30 PM Edited by zmoonchild, 16 August 2007 - 09:21 AM.

QUOTE (pomor @ Aug 15 2007, 14:36)
QUOTE (zmoonchild @ Aug 15 2007, 15:35)
And, very important, you can fly a Seasparrow back to the Mulholland Safe House and store it on top of the garage, and it will stay there even though it disappears when the garage door is closed. That's not a typo, I said on top of the garage. You can store any vehicle up there provided that you can get it up there, a Packer works well for those situations, cars drive up the ramp very easily.

That's a news for me. Great news.
I wonder how it will interact, in a long run, with vehicles, that are inside the garage, as they'll be on the same piece of space. Won't it cause them to disapeer more often? It's somewhat hard to test it extensively for me right now, since my garages are bursting with unique cars, and I don't want to risk them too much, as the good test would reqiured puting 3 vehicles inside, and maybe Hydra on the roof, for a significant part of the game.
Sure, I'll test it sooner or later, but whats your experiences in that matter? Did the cars seemed to vanish on you?

I have tested this very thoroughly.
The maximum number of vehicles the garage will hold is 4, no more, no matter how you try to arrange them, the total number is 4, on top and inside; any additional will disappear.

I have never had a problem with any of the 4 vehicles disappearing; they stay there for the entire game.
Also, I have saved BP/EP/FP/DP vehicles there and they have retained their special abilites.

Also, only small aircraft can be stored on top, such as Sparrows and Seasparrows.

The following were tested and simply disappeared when the garage door closed then reopened, they were just too big to stay there:
Hydra
Maverick
Raindance
Hunter

The area on top of the garage is really only big enough for 2 cars.
I'm assuming that other larger aircraft will also disappear.

Sorry, when I said any vehicle, I should have specified that there is a size limit.

Here's a saved game that was saved at the Mulholland Safe house, all you have to do is walk outside and open the garage to see what I'm talking about:
http://gtasnp.com/download/4179
It's v1.0

There's a Seasparrow and a Super GT stored on top. I used a Packer to get the Super GT up there, there's also a separate Super GT and a Comet parked inside the garage.

GTA Phreak
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#55

Posted 15 August 2007 - 10:17 PM

I didn't get that from the start, but tried it out.
The vehicle is actually stored on top of the garage, - making it a 2-storey garage.
It will disappear and reappear in sync with the door like normal garage content, except the vehicle on top isn't obscured by the door.

Great find !!!!

I never bothered with storing helicopters on my early explorations because getting them in an out of garages was more difficult than just picking up the one at the N of the airstrip.

Btw. you can add the Cropduster to the list of available aircraft (from the beginning, both spawns), is a bit slow, big and unmaneuverable against the Hydra's though.
The Hydra's do occasionally chase the Skimmer, - but usually have difficulties spawning / giving chase above the Dam.
Hydra's never chase the AT-400, only the police/news helicopters so all you need to worry about is mid-airs and SAM sites.

HolyGrenadeFrenzy
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#56

Posted 16 August 2007 - 01:44 AM

QUOTE (GTA Phreak @ Aug 15 2007, 17:17)
I didn't get that from the start, but tried it out.
The vehicle is actually stored on top of the garage, - making it a 2-storey garage.
It will disappear and reappear in sync with the door like normal garage content, except the vehicle on top isn't obscured by the door.

Great find !!!!

I never bothered with storing helicopters on my early explorations because getting them in an out of garages was more difficult than just picking up the one at the N of the airstrip.

Btw. you can add the Cropduster to the list of available aircraft (from the beginning, both spawns), is a bit slow, big and unmaneuverable against the Hydra's though.
The Hydra's do occasionally chase the Skimmer, - but usually have difficulties spawning / giving chase above the Dam.
Hydra's never chase the AT-400, only the police/news helicopters so all you need to worry about is mid-airs and SAM sites.

Someone should try this at CJ's Mom's house in Ganton......it does have a flat roof after all.

zmoonchild
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#57

Posted 16 August 2007 - 07:21 AM Edited by zmoonchild, 16 August 2007 - 10:46 AM.

QUOTE (HolyGrenadeFrenzy @ Aug 15 2007, 21:44)
Someone should try this at CJ's Mom's house in Ganton......it does have a flat roof after all.

I've tried The Johnson House and Verdant Bluffs; both garages have flat rooftops.
Sadly, neither one worked. confused.gif

pomor
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#58

Posted 16 August 2007 - 03:39 PM

QUOTE (zmoonchild @ Aug 15 2007, 21:30)
I have tested this very thoroughly.
The maximum number of vehicles the garage will hold is 4, no more, no matter how you try to arrange them, the total number is 4, on top and inside; any additional will disappear.

I have never had a problem with any of the 4 vehicles disappearing; they stay there for the entire game.
Also, I have saved BP/EP/FP/DP vehicles there and they have retained their special abilites.

Also, only small aircraft can be stored on top, such as Sparrows and Seasparrows.

I wish I had known it earlier. Prior to the unlocking a hangar I kept my EP/FP Sea Sparrow
at the Doherty garage, pinned to the corner by the BP/EP/FP/DP Tanker Trailer, so it inconvenient to use it back then.

Returning to the topic, I was thinking about daring the blocked area myself, but as it's just my
second go through SA (the first one being without any walkthroughs, guides, etc), I had put that off.
To the next time. But, after I have finally seen that hidden cut scene before Amphibious Assault
I gone ahead and collected all oysters. These in the blocked off area included. And it was
surprisingly fun. I guess that I thought it would be some sort of frustrating chore...

OrionSR
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#59

Posted 17 August 2007 - 06:16 AM

I enjoy the 4 star challenges as well. I've been at it for quite some time, but have learned a few more tricks from your documentation. You might consider posting some of the more unusual finding in rubregg's pinned 4 star topic - <Early Side-Missions In Locked-Off Areas>. I also have some notes on over a gtplanet.net in my unfinished <4 Star Survival Guide>.

I'm especially interested in your finding on the Mulholland garage, and fast food places. I've been looking for a method to unlocked the fast food places early with a hex editor, but I'm not having any luck. Perhaps your trick will help me track down the difference. Do this trick also add all the icons to the map? I'll have to play around with that garage a little. I think I can use that on my favorite saves. Thanks for the tips.

We've got the list of horseshoes that require aircraft down to 3 by using bicycles and mega-hops. However, one of the jumps is so difficult that I've never been able to pull it off with a wanted level, so may as well call it 4. At first I thought the bicycles in 4 star LV would be impossible. It's difficult, and really easy to get busted, but the bicycles don't take damage so they last forever. There are lots of fences and rails to bunny-hop in LV, so once you've got some good routes running from the cops is a lot of fun. Also, CJ can't take hits from the helicopter while riding a bicycle.

Phreak told me a cool trick a long time ago, but I only tried it out recently. The Broadway gets a huge "health" bonus every time the Pimping mission is started. This can bring a burning Broadway back to more than full health, but can't fix a flat tire. The vigilante vehicles can't get flats during the mission, and targets do spawn in restricted areas, so cop bikes are a great vehicle in areas with lots of roadblocks. Neither of these missions will increment the attempt stat if the mission has already been completed.

Phreak has spoken highly of the Skimmer, but I don't seem to have much luck with it. The Maverick in SF is a little unusual. The Hydra doesn't seem to come after it unless CJ exits and enters again, or spends a long time messing around. I can't quite make it too the LV horseshoes with it before the hydra finally shows up, but the Maverick is too big to fit on top of the Come-A-Lot towers anyway.

Speaking of Oysters, I finally figured out how to cross the entire bay with a boat or aircraft without earning a wanted level. The tight spot is the area around the eastern ship parked in the bay, the one you swim to from the rocks by Pier 69. In a boat, there's a narrow strip on the east and north side of the ship that allows safe passage; round the stern very closely and you should be safe. In an aircraft I try to follow a similar path and snake over the center of the ship. More to the point; sometimes at while collecting the upper dam oysters, the helicopters will spawn underwater and then die when they reach the surface. The bots really have a difficult time understanding the water level that area.

Snapshots - sorry about your turn in the chain game. That's a lot of work even if you've had some practice. You might want to check out my 4 Star snapshot video <Full Zoom>. I managed to get the collection down to only 11:05 by taking unnecessary risks. Perhaps you can pick up or offer a few tricks.

Anyway, I love comparing notes on 4 star adventures, but now I'm going to go play with the Mulholland garage.

zmoonchild
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#60

Posted 17 August 2007 - 03:44 PM Edited by zmoonchild, 19 August 2007 - 12:01 AM.

QUOTE (rubregg @ Jun 7 2007, 16:08)
Keep the Taxi and Toreno Glitches in mind and don't fly too much too early in the game. To avoid these, do not acquire a pilot's licence (20% flying skill) before doing the 'Taxi' mission and the SF mission 'Mike Toreno'; and do 'Taxi' before both 'Firefighter' and 'Paramedic'. Otherwise you might not find any taxi fares and/or Mike Toreno's transmitter signal which could prevent you from 100% completion. More about this in Glenster's Guide, chapter I.12.a.

Fantastic guide, my friend. I am also a 4-Star Dardevil, and OrionSR told me about your link.

Your statement about obtaining your Pilots License early causing a glitch is incorrect.

I read through ‘Glenster's Glimpse into San Andreas’, and it does NOT say that achieving 20% Flying Skill would cause the glitch. It specifically says that “it seemed” that it was the problem, however, Pdescobar figured out what the actual problem was and how to avoid it.

Here it is:
Pdescobar isolated the problem as commonly caused by going to the border of
the map (which could happen while you have C.J. fly to get a Pilot's license).
The map zone information for the save game becomes corrupted that way--when the
Taxi mission needs a pedestrian to be the customer, the game doesn't know what
to do. If you save the game, the glitch appears on new games you start, too.
He used a hex editor to make the map zone information what it should be.


I play on PC with v1.0 and have achieved 100% 8 times without cheats, and 7 of those times I obtained my Pilots license at the very beginning of the game, and I never experienced any problems during the 7 attempts: the Taxi Missions worked fine, and the ‘Mike Toreno’ mission worked like a charm.

In fact, I’ve achieved 100% Flying Skill before even doing the mission ‘Big Smoke’, and it’s never caused any problems.

All you need to do is make sure to stay over the mainland or very close to the shoreline, and not go out into the ocean just as Pdescobar said, and you’ll be fine.




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