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New island?

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mickarrow
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#1

Posted 09 January 2006 - 09:58 PM

Some of you might remember the touristic plaza I made months ago. Well, since then it just grew and grew and kinda got out of hand. There wasn't any planning in it, I just started from the plaza and worked my way around it. That of course didn't look so well. Now, since the northern islands weren't lot-divided yet and just making buildings for months without actually mapping them is very annoying, I had to find a place to put these models.
So I started working on a little piece of land from the northern islands I had secretely claimed for me, in the hope that when the island got split up, I could request the lots I've been working on all along. But it soon outgrew the little area I had foreseen. Therefore, I had to find another solution. I'd make my own island.
I started making sketches of road lay-outs and ended up with the ones you see below. Note that I just quickly textured it with grass, plain asfalt and a sidewalk texture, to give an idea of where is what.

user posted image
user posted image
user posted image

The size of the island is approximately the size of a small illcom.
You can see there are 3 dead-ends in the road lay-out.
- The one in the SW-corner is supposed to have a bridge leading to: a) another island or b) a small airport on a little island of itself.
- The one in the north is leading up the hills to a mansion overlooking the 'valley'.
- The one in the SE-corner is leading to the docks, where there could be a stop for the ferry JasonB was talking about

The atmosphere I try to create within this island is that of a little town. The one you would visit when you're on holidays. That's why I half-surrounded it, to create that town-on-its-own feeling, but left half of it open, so it's not a totally isolated town. There won't be any skyscrapers or large underground parkings.
Some of the buildings I made so far have allready been shown in PPT. You can find them here, here, here and here

So what I'm asking here is:
- Can I make a little island for Myriad?
- biggrin.gif If yes, what do you think of the current lay-out?
- cryani.gif If no, why not?

Suction Testicle Man
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#2

Posted 09 January 2006 - 10:05 PM

I think the landscape itself could do with a little work, speaking as a bystander. I like the tunnel and such, but an island needs to be the shape an island would naturally form. tounge.gif Perhaps you could add a big blue quad to show the sea level, and draw in some proposed objects to show how you plan development? I reckon it would be worth duplicating the flat area again next to the original flat area, so you have a rectangular island. That way you can add a small hill all around the island (in the way a real one would be formed) without isolating the downtown area in what appears to be a pit. wink.gif

<3D

Drizz
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#3

Posted 09 January 2006 - 10:26 PM

I'd certainly download this, cuz I already made the tour of both, Illcom and main, islands we get in 0.3 release and I want mooore... tounge.gif

Though what I'd like is a ghetto island tounge.gif This would be nice. Ghetto or commercial poor area with haitian and cuban gangs included into it. smile.gif )
- Dri'z Up.

Cran.
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#4

Posted 10 January 2006 - 06:09 AM

I love it. But I recon you should extend the hill side all around the island, and make it a little less square. Apart from that, I love it. Maybe you can give it more of a country town feel! biggrin.gif

JasonB
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#5

Posted 10 January 2006 - 06:40 AM

Yes, but with more work. What you've shown of it before was some good, solid work, and the current road layout is good, but you need to make the land more realistic. Like STM said, land doesn't appear like that, modify it and give it a coast and make some excess land on the side or something.

QUOTE
Though what I'd like is a ghetto island  This would be nice. Ghetto or commercial poor area with haitian and cuban gangs included into it. ) - Dri'z Up.

By ghetto I hope you don't mean what they had in Vice City (with little haiti and little havana, I call these places little disgusting) or Los Santos ghettos, because those are very horrid looking and boring areas. I avoid them at all costs. By ghetto I hope you meant GTA3 style projects/ghettos, those I can stand (infact I have a small area like that on my island). Please people, no below poverty line housing. Ugh.

Drizz
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#6

Posted 10 January 2006 - 11:30 PM

Yeah, by ghetto I meant big and dark housing projects, or just poor neighbourhoods (not like in LS where it's mostly 1 or 2 floor houses) in industrail areas. With long alleys between houses and dirty parking lots or basketball courts (for gang rumbles tounge.gif ) .

Ever saw the movie "Banlieue 13"? Here's a ghetto I'd like smile.gif
- Dri'z Up.

caponester
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#7

Posted 11 January 2006 - 04:25 PM

By Ghetto I hope you meant GTA3 Red light district style because hell yes I would love something like that

mickarrow
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#8

Posted 13 January 2006 - 12:00 PM

Okay, suggestions noticed. I'll work on it and show it again when the changes've been made.

I'll have to stop the ghetto suggestions right here though.
QUOTE
The atmosphere I try to create within this island is that of a little town. The one you would visit when you're on holidays.


Hope to be back soon tounge.gif

Pumpkin Zone
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#9

Posted 14 January 2006 - 06:51 AM

Seeing as how the mod is called " Myriad ".. I think you guys should get all the islands you can handle.

Anyway, nice tunnels and landscape. Very nice.

AleXXX
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#10

Posted 14 January 2006 - 06:16 PM

Good work, but...
QUOTE
The one in the SW-corner is supposed to have a bridge leading to: a) another island or b) a small airport on a little island of itself.

I for a long time create southern island; screens you can find in PPT-theme. And I use illcom_c1_r12 lot for the bridge to my island. smile.gif

BenMillard
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#11

Posted 16 January 2006 - 11:13 AM Edited by Cerbera, 16 January 2006 - 11:45 AM.

I don't think a new island is a good idea at all. Now, after several years, the combined work and dedication of dozens of modellers havn't even managed to fill up a half of the illlCOM, which is the smallest island. Creating new islands just means there will be even more undeveloped group in MI as the Northern Islands are added. MI will be a collection of fields with the occassional skyscraper if people keep creating new land instead of using what we already have, and what the Northern islands will be adding.

The Northern islands are huge--it will take many years to fill them up. Whatever you want to make, there will be space for it in the Northern Islands. They already have awesome, realistic terrain with hills and mountains and curvy imaginative road layouts! The existing land is of such high quality and there's so much of it that it makes no sense to reject it.

It's good practise creating little side projects now and then, it keeps the creative juices flowing. However, Myriad Islands will only be a feasible project if people make stuff for the actual MI landscape, rather than spending all their time making land which isn't needed and then try to shoehorn it into MI afterwards.


(EDIT) There are loads of properties on illCOM which seem inactive. Maybe it's time to do a cleanup so that the active modellers can get some space on lots which are already split up and in-game? Vehicle makers, weapon makers and so on could be experimenting with GTASA styling to convert GTAVC MI objects to GTASA style ready for the GTASA MI version. And all the mappers could be helping out with the testing of TonyWob's GTA3/VC/SA Map Editor, which is likely to become the primary mapping tool for GTASA.

Mercie
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#12

Posted 16 January 2006 - 03:34 PM

At that Cerbera, maybe someone should think about advertising Myriad to a larger group of modelers/skinners. This forum amy have a lot, but so many people would rather have small instant releases.

A great help would be a thing of generic objects for people to work with aswell. It helps make a location look more complete and leaves the person happier. Look at the image at the top, imagine no light poles or trees... THat is what I see when I make something... and I'm too lazy to sort through thousands of images to get the right ones for a damned tree tounge.gif

Cheers.

mickarrow
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#13

Posted 16 January 2006 - 06:55 PM

@ Cerbera:
At the time I started with this, almost all illcom was reserved, or at least it did appear that way on the map. The few available lots where too small for what I had (even back then), which was a town centre. Now since illcom is a town on itís own, it would be ridiculous to insert a town centre, letís say, on the coastline.

As for the northern islands, I already explained in my first post. But if you insist, Iíll do a quick recap.
The land I had in mind is the size of a small illcom, that would mean a quarter of the northern islands. Now Iím all for the lot-idea, so why would I alone snatch away such an amount of land for myself? And I donít reject the landscape (lol, beautifully phrased nonetheless), I might even request a lot or two myself when the time is there.

Your argument about the land being Ďnot neededí doesnít really make sense. Why not? If it is because of the two above said points, I explained again. But then you can also question the Ďneedí for Necrosis, Orchid, and GTI. Or the side project Fun World for that matter, which I heard might make a comeback. Is that going to be shoehorned in MI as well?

aad
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#14

Posted 16 January 2006 - 07:26 PM

Maybe it would just be fun to just drop those islands in the ocean make it only accesable with boats, planes so it actualy can be used with some side missions like drop ofs or boat mission those islands just need to get a function and not just like to stamp SA full of islands till there is no ocean left hopefully it will all turn out right hen all the islands are in place since its almost time that respawn is finishing up his work he said march 2006 so he got some time but it wont be long. smile.gif

AleXXX
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#15

Posted 17 January 2006 - 04:02 PM

QUOTE
I don't think a new island is a good idea at all. Now, after several years, the combined work and dedication of dozens of modellers havn't even managed to fill up a half of the illlCOM, which is the smallest island. Creating new islands just means there will be even more undeveloped group in MI as the Northern Islands are added. MI will be a collection of fields with the occassional skyscraper if people keep creating new land instead of using what we already have, and what the Northern islands will be adding.

Partially I agree with you. It is necessary to enter new rule: If you made more than 10 LOTs for BLANKLAND (illcom and illnorth), you can create the new island.

Mark
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#16

Posted 17 January 2006 - 05:40 PM

I think that i've you've contributed to the mod, and you have excellent skills, you should be allowed to. No dumb lot count smile.gif . - GTAuron

GT-1
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#17

Posted 24 January 2006 - 09:35 PM

Maybe someone can clear a few points up for me; JasonB is creating a new island named Port Orchid, Respawn is creating an island named Necrosis, we have illcom which is around 1/4 full, two huge islands (north islands) and Gran Tani Islands. The project is named Myriad Islands, which seems fitting to your plans but how beneficial would it actually be? In my opinion it would be better to take as much of illnorth as you actually need and place the town there.

If you take up half of the island then sobeit, you could still incorporate your own road structure and edit the land mass as necessary. It would fill up illnorth and not just leave it as two large land masses sat with a few smaller islands around it.

Maybe I and Cerbera misunderstand you, I think it would be more appropriate to take as much land from one of the north islands as necessary and edit it how you please, providing you keep to some kind of structure which is currently is. By looking at the screens you have provided I think it could be incorporated into the north islands.

You have the ability to pull it off, Iím not doubting that at all but I feel it would be better to fill up the north islands rather than creating another island. Also if AlexX is modelling and island where is it going to be placed around the current islands and the future projects planned (as mentioned in the first sentence)?

I know i've been out of the loop for a while, but all these new islands seem a little odd considering the amount of space left on illcom/illnorth.

Mark
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#18

Posted 24 January 2006 - 11:46 PM

I completely agree, i guess all these little islands in the product of little or no activity on the northern islands. People want to build, illCOM isn't sufficient, and illRES and illURB aren't up for use yet. - GTAuron

Knife
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#19

Posted 25 January 2006 - 06:51 PM

The idea of no new islands untill north and illcom are full is probably the best. illnorth is, tbh, HUGE. Take 50 lots if you want, there are pleanty to go around (when they are avalible biggrin.gif ).

Even with all of the work that people have been creating over the last few months north probably isn't even an 8th full.


I still think illcom should be officially released (even if its just the baseland) so that will encourage people to work on that again. As illcoms tracks are going to be built into future lots I can't see a real problem with it.

meh.

sAdIsTiCmAcHiNe
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#20

Posted 25 January 2006 - 09:25 PM

ReSpawn and a few others have completely populated thier islands themselves though. Its no problem if you're contributing content in the shape of an island, but more blanks space to fill is not needed.

mickarrow
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#21

Posted 26 January 2006 - 08:53 PM

@ SadMac: It's not meant to be more empty space. I would never have released just an empty island. The pics in the first post were just to show the road lay-out and the basic layout of the island.

@ GT-1 and everyone else:
As for illcom, I explained the problem there.
as for GTI, that seems to be getting developed on the GTI site. dozingoff.gif
As for the northern islands...that seems a bit tricky. Back in the days when I had just a rough sketch of the town plaza ( and a circus) I just got ignored (twice). I guess because of the circus smile.gif (which btw, I still think would be nice for a 'kill-the-clown' mission, but I kinda ditched that idea because of the lack of response) Now with the plaza I continued and blablabla (read first post).
Now since then, even though the islands are not split up, there are allready some claimed areas. I'm thinking of: the top of Black Mesa (illspirit), the crater-centre (GForce), the soccer stadium on east island (Laziofreak), skyscrapers on east island ( Redkiller) and of course the railroad lay-out.
So the only place I think it would roughly fit is in the NW corner of the NE island. That's smaller then the island I was making, but I guess it could be possible, if I make my mapping more compact. Two things about that spot bother me though. One is the fact that it would be 'cornered'. There wouldn't be any room for me to expand to if needed. The second one is the fact that I wouldn't want it to have skyscrapers in the background, which will probably be the case since that area is on a higher platform. Now both points bother me, but not in such a way that they are not overcomeable smile.gif .
I do would like to know what you mean by '...providing you keep to some kind of structure which is currently is. ' Because, if I move everything there, road changes will be needed, as well as some height changes for my tunnels, wich IMO are vital for the atmosphere.
So, all in all, seeing the responses tend more towards an integration into the existing land mass, I guess I'm fine with that. I'll wait for clearance of course before I go ahead with transporting things.

@ Knife: I think we should make some sort of follow-up list with who's-doing-what and who-ditched-what. (I'm not talking about the lot-list, because there have been plenty of buildings shown in PPT that were 'going to be finished when the northern islands got split up'. PPT kinda outgrew the lot list) Right now, there is no overview whatsoever. I think this is one of the main reasons why illcom still isn't finished. People just don't know what's done or will be done.

GT-1
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#22

Posted 27 January 2006 - 12:19 PM

illnorth Render

Above is a quick render of the illnorth islands, through you or anyone creating a new island it leaves the purpose built illnorth islands redundant. I've only marked on LF's stadium because I don't know about the other exact locations you mentioned bar Black Mesa. They are easily big enough to incorporate 2-3 'towns' in my opinion. I don't think there would be much of a problem with changing the road structure slightly to accommodate your needs as people have already done it.

In regards to; '...providing you keep to some kind of structure which is currently there.' I meant there could be changes but if drastic changes are made then it may begin to look a little odd. You should be able to make some changes to the land, though you will have to discuss that with the members who are making the train etc.

If you know people have already used land on illnorth like Gforce, RK etc. then just ask them where they will be putting their buildings and find a place.

BenMillard
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#23

Posted 27 January 2006 - 01:38 PM Edited by Cerbera, 27 January 2006 - 06:46 PM.

QUOTE (GT-1 @ Jan 24 2006, 21:35)
Maybe someone can clear a few points up for me; JasonB is creating a new island named Port Orchid, Respawn is creating an island named Necrosis, we have illcom which is around 1/4 full, two huge islands (north islands) and Gran Tani Islands. The project is named Myriad Islands, which seems fitting to your plans but how beneficial would it actually be? In my opinion it would be better to take as much of illnorth as you actually need and place the town there.

[...]

Maybe I and Cerbera misunderstand you, I think it would be more appropriate to take as much land from one of the north islands as necessary and edit it how you please, providing you keep to some kind of structure which is currently is. By looking at the screens you have provided I think it could be incorporated into the north islands.

[...]

I know i've been out of the loop for a while, but all these new islands seem a little odd considering the amount of space left on illcom/illnorth.
Well said. smile.gif

I've been laying out a 3D draft route for the railway across the Northern Islands recently. Illspirit made some rough pieces of track for me to do this, their lengths are 50 metres, 100 metres and 200 metres. The landscape swallows 200m piece after 200m peice like they are needles. I thought about asking for a 500m piece because it was taking so long to add enough 200m pieces to get across the islands! They really are huge, so taking a big chunk of land in the North is fine. You'll have to wait until the MI community agrees on how it will be split up, though.

As illCOM is mainly empty fields owned by people who have been inactive for months (or even years), I support the idea that we should update the lots list over the next month or two. Then we can re-allocate any land which becomes available to people who are active, like Mick. It might be best for you to start off with building on an illCOM lot which gets reclaimed by the lots update. A bitesize project where you can demonstrate your abilities in terms of speed and quality, as well as gaining more experience in preparation for this ambitious town project.

Many people seriously underestimate how long it takes to fill even a small lot. All modders and modellers are just doing this in our free time, working it in around school/college, work, family and friends. 3D modelling is very difficult and time-consuming, particularly with the complexity of GTASA formats. If you are going to take on a chunk of land as big as this, I reckon it will require you work on it actively for at least two years. Bear in mind that illCOM has been around longer than that and even with dozens of contributers it is still very empty.

I have seen hundreds of modellers bite off more than they can chew--I've even done it myself! When working in a Community Map Project like MI, it is doubly important to finish what you start. We have to rely on each other to complete the parts we take on so that the landscape can be filled up. I really am worried that you don't appreciate how big and long-term a commitment it will require to get that island completed all by yourself.

(EDIT) So, to actually answer the topic title, no there shouldn't be any extra islands. The two enourmous islands illURB and illRES are more than enough land, we'll struggle to fill them without adding yet more land to try and fill.

Knife
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#24

Posted 28 January 2006 - 09:07 AM

So do people think a topic should be made where if you own a lot, you must reply within, say 1-2 months (a bit generous if you ask me) or you will loose any lots that you have on illcom. So that people know all the lot owners can be PM'd and/or e-mailed telling them about the topic.

Then, if some people don't reply their lots are back to being available and people that have made models with no where to go should put them on an illcom lot if they can. Then work on north lots can start... Shifty41s_beerhatsmilie2.gif

I still think illcom baseland should just be properly prelit and come out as the official first MISA release.




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